Changes to traffic around Custom House Quays in Dublin from next week

_Kaiser_

Saw this online last night and didn't see a mention here so thought I'd stick it up:

First up is the introduction of a permanent right turn ban from Custom House Quay to Talbot Memorial Bridge.

They’re not messing around either, this ban will apply from 10.30 next Monday morning 12 May.

Other traffic changes at the city centre quays include:

Vehicles wishing to access Matt Talbot Memorial Bridge from Eden Quay will have to turn left onto Beresford Place, going round the back of Custom House and then continuing south across the bridge.

Vehicles wishing to access Matt Talbot Memorial Bridge from Butt Bridge (Tara Street/Georges Quay) will have to continue north onto Beresford Place, going round the back of Custom House and then continuing south across the bridge.

Seems like madness to me. The back of the Custom House is already bad enough with Gardiner Street, the LUAS and Busaras all intersecting at that point, but what do I know - this is "Smart Travel" after all!

SilverLiningOK

As you may have seen from the piece, this is to replace the said traffic lane with a contra flow bus lane all the way to the new bridge at Marlborough Street. Appears to make sense to get cross city bus routes over Liffey more smoothly. People choosing/needing to use motor cars may feel inconvenienced in some way but they will eventually find other routes or choose another more efficient mode of transport.

cgcsb

The right turn is not being removed for the lols, it is to accommodate a contra flow bus lane for more efficient access for buses crossing the new bridge.

The number of people accessing Dublin City centre by private car during peak hours has been dropping and with the improvements to the leap card on going, there's less and less of an excuse to drive in. Only a small portion of people need to bring their cars in for trips made during the working day or to transport bulky items, so when others complain about space being allocated to public transport I remind them of that.

LXFlyer

Putting the contra-flow bus lane in on Custom House Quay was critical in my view. Otherwise the bus routes would have had to divert via Talbot Street and Marlborough Street which would have taken longer and missed the important connecting stop at Connolly Station.

This way routes 14, 15, 27 and 151, together with several peak hour routes will all have a more direct route to the south side and retain the busy stop at Connolly Station.

paddyland

It should hopefully also allow for a slightly longer green sequence coming from North Wall Quay westbound, as currently there is a very short green, and traffic backs up.

bigar

paddyland wrote: »

It should hopefully also allow for a slightly longer green sequence coming from North Wall Quay westbound, as currently there is a very short green, and traffic backs up.

As there will be no eastbound traffic turning right anymore, I assume it will be longer. Memorial Road gets green for too long as well in my eyes, so I hope they took a good look at that.

As a cyclist I am happy that the counterflow can be used by bicycles as well. This will greatly reduce my travel time and dangerous crossings I need to take on my daily commute. I also hope they finally will connect the bicycle lane to the main road because now it just abruptly ends with in the middle of the pavement.

robertxxx

cgcsb wrote: »

or to transport bulky items

Yes like children.

StreetLight

Based on past dubious efforts at public transport priority, I have a feeling the effects of trying to improve on bus travel times at the new Hackett Bridge will be negated by yet another set of badly-timed traffic lights.

seamus

Oh this is great. Pity I'm not working in the IFSC any more, but occasionally I'll still need to go westbound on the bike and/or up to O'Connell St, and this run has always been a pain in the ass.

This means that important traffic will be able to get from the Point to O'Connell bridge without having to cross the Liffey and fight with the rest of the traffic.

LXFlyer

seamus wrote: »

Oh this is great. Pity I'm not working in the IFSC any more, but occasionally I'll still need to go westbound on the bike and/or up to O'Connell St, and this run has always been a pain in the ass.

This means that important traffic will be able to get from the Point to O'Connell bridge without having to cross the Liffey and fight with the rest of the traffic.

Well you'll be able to get to Marlborough St. I don't think that the contra-flow bus lane on Eden Quay continues beyond the new bridge.

loyatemu

lxflyer wrote: »

Well you'll be able to get to Marlborough St. I don't think that the contra-flow bus lane on Eden Quay continues beyond the new bridge.

ach - so near and yet so far.

currently cycling from the IFSC or further east to OCS is a pain in the áss: the cycle lane on the north quays stops mid-footpath at Talbot Bridge, you then have to cross over to the southside, where you have to cross 3 lanes of traffic to turn right onto the south quays (or wait at the pedestrian lights); and then cross 3 lanes of traffic to turn right at O'Connell Bridge.

Previously you could shortcut across the O'Casey footbridge and use the contra-flow cycle lane on Rogerson's quay but the council for whatever reason reversed the direction of that lane.

hernie

Did anyone tell Google Maps???

LXFlyer

loyatemu wrote: »

ach - so near and yet so far.

currently cycling from the IFSC or further east to OCS is a pain in the áss: the cycle lane on the north quays stops mid-footpath at Talbot Bridge, you then have to cross over to the southside, where you have to cross 3 lanes of traffic to turn right onto the south quays (or wait at the pedestrian lights); and then cross 3 lanes of traffic to turn right at O'Connell Bridge.

Previously you could shortcut across the O'Casey footbridge and use the contra-flow cycle lane on Rogerson's quay but the council for whatever reason reversed the direction of that lane.

I suspect that the bus lane will be "with flow" west of the new bridge to allow buses turn onto the bridge.


It would make no sense for the contraflow to continue west of the new bridge.

Shedite27

This is badly needed. The problems a the back of Custom House are predominantly caused by busses comin from the o2 up the keys, then switching across to the Ulster Bank building. At rush hour they constantly block people trying to get across the river (southbound) which has a knock on effect all the way up Amiens St, Gardiner St and Eden Quay. Getting these out of the way will hopefully have a knock on effect.

However, most of the busses that cross the river do so to pick up passengers outside Ulster Bank, so those stops will have to be moved too if this is gonna work.

http://www.dublincity.ie/Press/Documents/RT5072WEBSITEDRAWING.pdf

LXFlyer

The buses that will use the new bridge do not operate along the Quays from the O2, but rather from Amiens Street.

There are two new stops on Eden Quay.

StreetLight

The portion of bus lane from O'Connell Bridge to Hackett Bridge is indeed 'with flow'.

LXFlyer

That makes far more sense.

alentejo

Was there a public consultation regarding this whole process?

paddyland

lxflyer wrote: »

The buses that will use the new bridge do not operate along the Quays from the O2, but rather from Amiens Street.

There are two new stops on Eden Quay.

I sincerely hope that it is not intended that the new scheme is only for Dublin Bus local routes. Long distance buses coming from the port tunnel equally need access to the bus priority facilities, and that means a clean run through from the North Wall to the new bridge. It is not all about Dublin Bus.

The point made about the Ulster Bank bus stops is very pertinent, but I guarantee you will find that the dynamics of bus operation involving buses actually having to stop to pick up passengers has been completely ignored by the road engineers, as 'outside their remit.'

Eden Quay is wide enough for bus stops to be relocated there from the southside, on the basis that buses can pull in out of the way, and wait to collect their passengers. Long distance buses cannot simply pull in and go, the nature of their operations means they need to operate to regular departure times. But there is room for that if designed properly. It shouldn't become another Dublin Bus subdepot, however, as Eden Quay once was, with lines of buses sitting parked for hours with no drivers around. That needs to be enforced, for both Dublin Bus and private operators.

But generally speaking, bus priority schemes are designed by road engineers who have no idea of the requirements of bus drivers and bus operators. It remains to be seen how well thought out this scheme will be.

LXFlyer

Eden Quay is not becoming a Dublin Bus terminus again.

The routes that will use it are all cross-city routes. The only potential wait on Eden Quay that will happen is for driver changeovers.

The long distance coaches need the space that George's Quay affords them. There's no indication that any are moving from there.

Patser

No chance they'd throw in a right turn at Beresford Place for quick access to Bus Aras for coaches coming in from the Airport through the tunnel ? Or will all buses from that direction still have to cross to George's Quay and back again to a now busier loop around the Customs House.

paddyland

Patser wrote: »

No chance they'd throw in a right turn at Beresford Place for quick access to Bus Aras for coaches coming in from the Airport through the tunnel ? Or will all buses from that direction still have to cross to George's Quay and back again to a now busier loop around the Customs House.

Whether or not such a turn is provided will tell us whether this was a properly thought through bus priority scheme, designed around the buses that will need to use it, or whether it is just another road-engineering-by-numbers exercise that will afford us a vague notion that we are 'improving public transport.'

LXFlyer

I suspect such a turn won't be included as that would need another phase of lights which would make it worse for general traffic.

The traffic from the bus lane on Custom House Quay will presumably have a green phase at the same time as traffic on Eden Quay.

robertxxx

Traffic gridlock is coming very soon and not just the area at the back of the customs office but southside pearse st area.

monument

robertxxx wrote: »

Traffic gridlock is coming very soon and not just the area at the back of the customs office but southside pearse st area.

It would be coming anyway with Luas BXD, a primary aim of these works and the bridge being in place now is to insulate public transport, walking and cycling from the Luas works (as well as the stalled Metro works).

bigar

Passed Talbot Memorial bridge and could not believe how many drivers ignore the huge "No Right Turn" sign. Those who choose to ignore it cause quite a bit of disruption. A serious accident is not far off.
They should consider placing a guard there during busy times at least.

AlekSmart

bigar wrote: »

Passed Talbot Memorial bridge and could not believe how many drivers ignore the huge "No Right Turn" sign. Those who choose to ignore it cause quite a bit of disruption. A serious accident is not far off.
They should consider placing a guard there during busy times at least.

And,when that accident does occur,it will effectively cripple significant swathes of Dublin City.

Dublin City Council appear to be totally incapable of handling such significant traffic flow alterations in a hands-on manner,preferring instead,to opt for the softly-softly traditional Irish approach.

A Traffic Flow change of this magnitude demands FULLY interactive Garda Traffic Corps presence on at least a 12 hour basis for at least a full week,followed by active CCTV/ANPR Camera Monitoring with confirmatory HI-Visibility warning on all approaches....

As it stands,it is perfectly acceptable for the dozies to mount a defence of ..."Well nobody told ME".....:eek:

Stheno

bigar wrote: »

Passed Talbot Memorial bridge and could not believe how many drivers ignore the huge "No Right Turn" sign. Those who choose to ignore it cause quite a bit of disruption. A serious accident is not far off.
They should consider placing a guard there during busy times at least.

It's actually quite dangerous, as the traffic coming from the port tunnel is now on a much longer green. Yesterday I was coming from the tunnel to turn onto memorial bridge and a taxi on the quay which was supposed to go straight ignored it and pulled out very close to me as they did the turn.

monument

AlekSmart wrote: »

And,when that accident does occur,it will effectively cripple significant swathes of Dublin City.

Dublin City Council appear to be totally incapable of handling such significant traffic flow alterations in a hands-on manner,preferring instead,to opt for the softly-softly traditional Irish approach.

A Traffic Flow change of this magnitude demands FULLY interactive Garda Traffic Corps presence on at least a 12 hour basis for at least a full week,followed by active CCTV/ANPR Camera Monitoring with confirmatory HI-Visibility warning on all approaches....

As it stands,it is perfectly acceptable for the dozies to mount a defence of ..."Well nobody told ME".....:eek:

In fairness to the city council, if the gardai want to police this junction better as you and I think they should directly after the changes, there's nothing stopping them from doing do.

It's not like the council can direct the council and it's not like the gardai would be unaware of these fairly major changes.

Godge

monument wrote: »

In fairness to the city council, if the gardai want to police this junction better as you and I think they should directly after the changes, there's nothing stopping them from doing do.

It's not like the council can direct the council and it's not like the gardai would be unaware of these fairly major changes.

The council could write to the gardai seeking the policing of the junction and publicise the letter - that would cause a problem for the gardai if something happened.

Would take a bit of guts for the council to do that.

mackerski

hernie wrote: »

Did anyone tell Google Maps???

OpenStreetMap is already updated.

bigar

While I am happy that I can now cycle passed Custom House in a much safer manner than on the other side, the connections on both sides are very confusing.
I use the bicycle lane along Custom House Quay which still stops in the middle of the footpath. If I want to proceed and go straight on to the new counter flow, I need to cross the footpath plus the lane of cars turning left. No provisions or lights are placed to accomodate this so I need to risk getting hit by a car speeding to get through the green light (read orange/red) or wait until traffic stops and then take the next green. I waste a lot of time doing this as you can imagine.

On the other end, there are to traffic lights for bicycles on a short piece of lane coming from Bereford Bridge on the right side of the road. It is not certain who they are meant for as I assume all cyclist would be on the left but I took them thinking they would lead somewhere. They only seem to lead me straight on to a footpath.

I also tried going staight on which leads me over the new bridge. Strangly enough there is only a bicycle lane along the bus lane that goes straight on forcing me to go to Hawkins Street. If I want to turn right to go along the quays I need to cross the traffic going straight on, again forcing me into traffic speeding to get through red (this time busses and taxis).

I do not understand why every improvement for cyclists in Dublin seem to be full of silly flaws. Will Dublin City Council ever learn?

Cinephille1888

It is a shame that with a major improvement in traffic priority for transport and cycling, there are still major flaws emerging where they join existing demand.

Traffic management, if any, or the engineers and builders implementing the bridge should have been able to see there would be know on effects... but it wasn't their job. The announcements, and publications of these traffic changes are also a flaw and a gap in judgement from the Council.

Let's hope the new crowd, after orientation, figure out they have to question the permanent govt of the city over these patchwork solutions. Few will have run with such notions, or were voted for with that in mind, but for the city to run smoothly in the future, so does all traffic.

An issue also raised here is allocation of space for private bus operators.

They have limited options in the city as it is, and will have to start moving because of Luas BXD works.

I often take the Matthews bus to Drogheda and it's make shift stops were disturbed by the cellar works. Since the Parnell Luas stop will be near-by, and turning space to Marlborough street, a new space has to be found.

Same can be said for the operators and tour buses that stop at eden quay. Some idle for some time. Many operate late into the night also as private operators fill demand for services the state companies don't.

These operators will only expand over time, with NTA permission, and certainly with post-2016 plans for DB, they want more competition.

So where will they go? And how will they allocate the space?

In regards to the quays the road layout, as discussed, is inadequate.

Is a separate thread needed, or does it exist, for where to locate a 2nd inter-city bus terminal in the city centre.

In terms of demand, less and less sites exist for this. Although, in-keeping with the thread and location I would love to see Hawkins/Apollo/College House towers replaced with a bus terminal and tower block. The space is there, and the screen cinema should be preserved or expanded.