Sibling puppies

Jammydodger960

We've two puppies a brother and a sister. We have them over a month and they got on perfect. Never a problem. But on wed they got their final vaccination and things changed. The girl has become aggressive to the boy. Its a fear thing we think. Can anyone help me out if they've had this experience or know anything about it.

DBB

What age are they?
And can you give some examples of the female's aggression towards her brother?

Jammydodger960

DBB wrote: »

What age are they?
And can you give some examples of the female's aggression towards her brother?

They are 11 weeks old. She attacks him like very viciously biting him. And it's not play fighting. We don't let her get close to him now and when he gets near she growls and barks like mad.

It's only since they got their last injections on wed. We think the girl might of been sore after them and when they were play fighting he really hurt her and that's were the fear has come from.

DBB

They came away from their mum a bit too young tbh.
It's not unheard of for vaccinations to cause odd problems, it's quite possible that she's feeling a little off form after it.
Regardless, you do need to remedy this problem asap. I'd suggest you get at least one crate, keeping her in it when her brother is about, so that you're keeping them together but safely together. Lots of nice things should happen to each pup when the other is about, little pieces of chicken for all non-aggressive behaviour for example.
Had you intended to bring them to puppy socialisation classes? It might be a good idea just to get to one, and/or have an expert (a properly qualified one!) watch them to try to see what's going on. It's hard to advise specifically without seeing them.

Jammydodger960

DBB wrote: »

They came away from their mum a bit too young tbh.
It's not unheard of for vaccinations to cause odd problems, it's quite possible that she's feeling a little off form after it.
Regardless, you do need to remedy this problem asap. I'd suggest you get at least one crate, keeping her in it when her brother is about, so that you're keeping them together but safely together. Lots of nice things should happen to each pup when the other is about, little pieces of chicken for all non-aggressive behaviour for example.
Had you intended to bring them to puppy socialisation classes? It might be a good idea just to get to one, and/or have an expert (a properly qualified one!) watch them to try to see what's going on. It's hard to advise specifically without seeing them.

Yes I have 2 crates and I'm starting the crate training tomorrow. Thank you for your help I'll definatley be taking on all your advice. They are going on the socialization in May and we brought them to a play date on sun.

DBB

Great! Play dates are a great idea, as it should help get them playing again but watered down by the other dog(s). Ditto for socialisation classes.
If the little female gets bolshy with himself, don't be afraid to give her a verbal warning, followed by a short time-out... 30ish seconds in a safe, boring room (personally, I have no issue with the crate being used either). You may have to do this quite a lot at first.
Hopefully this is just a transitory effect of the vax (I'm assuming she's ok and not suffering any ill-effects... Might be no harm to ring the vet to make sure), but do try to jolly things up between them by playing with them and having fun.... Remembering the verbal warning and time-out if need be :-)

Jammydodger960

DBB wrote: »

Great! Play dates are a great idea, as it should help get them playing again but watered down by the other dog(s). Ditto for socialisation classes.
If the little female gets bolshy with himself, don't be afraid to give her a verbal warning, followed by a short time-out... 30ish seconds in a safe, boring room (personally, I have no issue with the crate being used either). You may have to do this quite a lot at first.
Hopefully this is just a transitory effect of the vax (I'm assuming she's ok and not suffering any ill-effects... Might be no harm to ring the vet to make sure), but do try to jolly things up between them by playing with them and having fun.... Remembering the verbal warning and time-out if need be :-)

I'm hoping it is too! And she'll be back to herself. They had a lovely relationship before hand. I'm looking into getting a dog trainer out too. I'll try anything as giving 1 away is not an option.

missmyler

Hopefully it's just the jabs throwing her off a little.

I have seen some Irish dog rescues and "dog experts" on the internet recommend not to get puppies from the same litter as they can get "littermate syndrome". Signs of this are aggressiveness with each other, separation anxiety and not bonding with their owners due to having each other.
Im sure plenty of households have raised sibling pups with positive experiences but am curious to know if others would consider dogs from the same litter to be a potential issue?

Jammydodger960

missmyler wrote: »

Hopefully it's just the jabs throwing her off a little.

I have seen some Irish dog rescues and "dog experts" on the internet recommend not to get puppies from the same litter as they can get "littermate syndrome". Signs of this are aggressiveness with each other, separation anxiety and not bonding with their owners due to having each other.
Im sure plenty of households have raised sibling pups with positive experiences but am curious to know if others would consider dogs from the same litter to be a potential issue?

Yes that's what I'm getting from most people I talk to. I never heard of it til Friday when all the commotion happened! I'm hoping there is a solution to it with training and the likes! In hind sight I should of researched it a bit more. I was more researching house training and socialisation.

DBB

Personally, I think a reasonably experienced owner who is aware of the potential problems will do fine, but one stipulation I would always urge is not to get two pups of the same sex... This all too often leads to what can be serious problems once sexual maturity is reached, particularly between sisters. If you want siblings, by far the best combo is brother and sister. If the owner makes it their business to train the pups as individuals, and makes sure to get them used to some time apart from one another, a brother/sister combo can be very successful!
Just make sure to get at least one of them neutered, I recently spoke with an owner who hadn't realised that a male dog could or would actually procreate with his sister!

Jammydodger960

DBB wrote: »

Personally, I think a reasonably experienced owner who is aware of the potential problems will do fine, but one stipulation I would always urge is not to get two pups of the same sex... This all too often leads to what can be serious problems once sexual maturity is reached, particularly between sisters. If you want siblings, by far the best combo is brother and sister. If the owner makes it their business to train the pups as individuals, and makes sure to get them used to some time apart from one another, a brother/sister combo can be very successful!
Just make sure to get at least one of them neutered, I recently spoke with an owner who hadn't realised that a male dog could or would actually procreate with his sister!

I was the same I didnt know that they would either. But we are getting them neutered. I've been looking into getting a trainer out to the house for a 1 on 1 assessment of the situation!

VonVix

missmyler wrote: »

Hopefully it's just the jabs throwing her off a little.

I have seen some Irish dog rescues and "dog experts" on the internet recommend not to get puppies from the same litter as they can get "littermate syndrome". Signs of this are aggressiveness with each other, separation anxiety and not bonding with their owners due to having each other.
Im sure plenty of households have raised sibling pups with positive experiences but am curious to know if others would consider dogs from the same litter to be a potential issue?

Ah, littermate syndrome, if only I was more aware of it before I got a second dog. Hell, I wish I was aware of a lot of things but at least I know them now lol.

I have two dogs and one of them has gotten separation anxiety from the other. What happened was we got one at 8 weeks (bonded to his human family mostly) and then 4 months down the line we got his brother who was still available. He was introduced to the whole family straight away and instantly was drawn to his brother because they essentially spoke the same language.

The one with the separation anxiety is very difficult to walk on his own, he constantly drags, looks behind him for the other dog, stops in his tracks and if I turn around and walk back towards home he pulls forward because he knows he's going back to where the other dog is.

It's not always about dogs being from the same litter, it's more about the fact they are a puppy and are still learning coping skills. They need to grow as individuals and learn coping skills individually (this means having lots of experiences without the other dog around), because I see my two tend to bounce off each other in terms of how they handle certain situations. If one doesn't like something, the other assumes it is bad without discovering for themselves and just goes with it!