He Wants Adoption, I Want Our Own

LegacyUser

Hi there,

I've been married to my partner for five years. We always talked about having a few kids (not certain on the number, we said we'd have two and then decide after that if we wanted more). He's 31, I'm 30. At the moment we've got a three year old son.

Recently I suggested we try for our second child. My husband was adopted when he was baby/toddler age/ He's now brought up the idea of adoption. He's talked to me a few times before about how lucky he feels to have been adopted into a loving home at a young age, and that he always grew up feeling safe and secure. He mentioned how grateful he was to not have to experience being bounced around foster homes or anything like that. Now he says he'd like to do the same thing for another child.

We never discussed adopting a child before. All we ever said was that we would have a two to four kids. I told him I would think about it, but I'm really not into the idea of it. I know that it sounds terrible and I don't think badly of adoption, but I feel it's just not for me. I want to experience pregnancy again, the newborn stages, and watch our child grow from being the size of a nut inside me to becoming an adult. I feel like we'll be missing out on this by adopting a child, although I know this sounds very selfish. I'm also afraid that I just wouldn't feel like the child was mine, and that I would subconsciously favourite my son over the child we've adopted. I've experienced favouritism in my own family growing up and it affected me deeply, so I wouldn't want to put a child through that.

I'm afraid I'll hurt my hubbys feelings by saying this. I'm not the best at wording things, so it could come out as if I think badly of adoption. I don't want him to feel like I think adopted children have any less of a significant or important parent-child relationship than biological children have with their parents, if you get me? I just don't want to hurt him when explaining my thoughts on it.

Is it bad that I feel like adoption isn't for me? I know that in a relationship I should be thinking about us rather than just myself, and I do want to do this for my husband as I know how he feels about it, but I'm not sure that I can.

Thanks.

Tokyo

OP, I understand that you don't want to hurt anybody's feelings, but this is a pretty big deal in the greater scheme of your relationship, and there's no pussyfooting around the issue - you need to be upfront with him about your feelings towards adopting a child as soon as possible, and I can think of no better way of saying in than how you said it here just now:

I told him I would think about it, but I'm really not into the idea of it. I know that it sounds terrible and I don't think badly of adoption, but I feel it's just not for me. I want to experience pregnancy again, the newborn stages, and watch our child grow from being the size of a nut inside me to becoming an adult. I feel like we'll be missing out on this by adopting a child, although I know this sounds very selfish. I'm also afraid that I just wouldn't feel like the child was mine, and that I would subconsciously favourite my son over the child we've adopted. I've experienced favouritism in my own family growing up and it affected me deeply, so I wouldn't want to put a child through that.

Adopting a child is a huge commitment, and you have rightly pointed out the potential pitfalls that goes along with it. And if you both aren't in it 110% and for the long haul, then it's something that is definitely not for you. Explain to him your reasons for not wanting to adopt - he'll likely be upset for a while, but at least he'll know the truth why, and won't be setting himself up with false hope.

strandroad

Adopting a child is a very drawn out process that costs the parents thousands of euro to even enter, not to mention complete. It would likely have to be a foreign adoption, it's all very complicated. Is your husband aware of that?
Rosita Boland had a good article about it in the Irish Times recently, dig it up and show him.

edit, here it is:
http://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/people/changes-to-adoption-law-have-shattered-my-hopes-of-becoming-a-parent-1.1716740

njs030

It's very unlikely you will get an Irish baby or toddler, does your husband realise this?
As said above it's an extremely costly judgemental process which takes years and years.

Maybe you could compromise and have your own baby but become long term foster parents so children who aren't as lucky as him have a chance?

January

Adoption is not like it was 20/30 years ago in Ireland.

When my partner was adopted, his parents applied in the June, were accepted in the August, my partner was born in the September and he came home to them 4 weeks later in the October. These days it's a very long drawn out procedure that is very very difficult to get accepted to even be on the panel to adopt a child and it costs thousands of euro and can be a lot of stress on a couple. Does your husband realise this?

Don't get me wrong, adoption is an amazing thing but it's not something I'd think of unless I couldn't conceive by myself and even then I'd have to think very long and hard about it.

You need to tell him how you feel, and soon because if you think about it for too long he may get too used to the idea that you are actually going to agree to this.

December2012

I think you should tell him your concerns:-

1. You want the experience of a pregnancy

2. You are worried you won't bond with your adopted child.

And

3. You worry that you may subconsciously favour your biological child over your adoptive child.

I think you should be able to talk out these very real concerns without being dismissive about the concept of adoption.

But bear in mind, you already have experienced pregnancy. Now your husband would like to experience adoption. Can you see how this is already something to compromise on?

CaliforniaDream

idontwantadoption wrote: »

Hi there,

I'm also afraid that I just wouldn't feel like the child was mine, and that I would subconsciously favourite my son over the child we've adopted. I've experienced favouritism in my own family growing up and it affected me deeply, so I wouldn't want to put a child through that.
.

Just a thought on this point. Was anyone in your family adopted? If not then the issue of favouritism is still there and not a valid argument for you to use against adoption. It can just as easily happen with your own biological children as you have experienced yourself.

You need to have a long discussion with your husband and address your concerns. But bear in mind he has a unique view on the matter and he deserves to be heard too. Would the option of another biological child and adopting one be a solution?

lifeandtimes

Hi, this will always be a difficult decision but as you have clearly pointed out and have explained this isn't for you.

Unless you believe your husband can change your mind then i would sit him down and explain.

Tell him you understand his view but you as a woman want to experience pregnancy and child birth again

And to be honest you have to ask yourself,if you did agree to go through with it would it not always be at the back of your mind that you didn't agree from the start and then that would impact your relationship with this child and as you say develop favoritism feelings toward you biological child.

I wish you all the best and that you and your husband both come to a conclusion you are both happy with

Hello Lady!

Perhaps tell him you will look into it together. When he realises how difficult, expensive and in many ways unnecessary it is now he may reconsider. Sounds to me like he has this romanticised idea of saving some poor unwanted child from a life of foster homes. The reality is that unlike 30 years ago women no longer feel the stigma attached to unplanned pregnancy and the number of children available for adoption is comparatively tiny. Add in the fact that you both can physically have biological children of your own and many adoption agencies won't even consider you.

Given his motives of providing a better life for a child long term fostering is more suited to what he wants.

Teyla Emmagan

Hello Lady! wrote: »

Perhaps tell him you will look into it together. When he realises how difficult, expensive and in many ways unnecessary it is now he may reconsider. Sounds to me like he has this romanticised idea of saving some poor unwanted child from a life of foster homes. The reality is that unlike 30 years ago women no longer feel the stigma attached to unplanned pregnancy and the number of children available for adoption is comparatively tiny. Add in the fact that you both can physically have biological children of your own and many adoption agencies won't even consider you.

This is good advice. Realistically it's nearly impossible now to adopt (I think about 4 'Irish' babies were adopted last year, and all by family members). There were only a handful of foreign adoptions. It takes forever, is utterly heartbreaking, costs a fortune, and given you are perfectly able to have kids your even being on the list would negate someone else's chances - someone who can't have their own children. I'm sure your husband has the best intentions in the world, but he obviously doesn't realise what the current situation is like.

Have him start with that Rosita Boland article and then talk to you again afterwards.

FunLover18

Your husband needs to be made aware of the issues raised by previous posters as well as your own.

However with regard to your own issues have you discussed adoption with his parents? Being close to people who have gone through that experience on an emotional level and possibly had the same doubts you had is extremely beneficial and if it was something they were willing to discuss it would be extremely beneficial.

Tigger99

I wouldn't suggest having that discussion with his parents. He mightnt want to discuss it with them, they may be reluctant to be honest considering that you are so close to the situation and your husband may take offence at their concerns. It's just too close to home.

OP I'd strongly consider fostering, the HSE is crying out for foster parents and you could provide - short term or long term - the kind of care and love that he, understandably, wants to give back.

eviltwin

I wouldn't do it unless you are 100% committed to it. Foster kids are coming from very difficult places, they often have emotional issues and so on that make them more of a challenge. They deserve to be placed with people who are totally focused on them and their needs. If your heart isn't totally there then don't feel guilty about it, its not for everyone and you shouldn't put yourself, your family and the foster child through this just to make your husband happy. I think you should talk to him and explain your feelings, you've a lot on your plate with a small child so maybe you could try for your own and revisit the foster parent issue later on when your kids are that bit older.

dipdip

Essentially you are coming at this from opposite ends of the spectrum.

He wants to give something to a child for their benefit.

You want the child to be to your benefit.

Your view represents the majority view.

This is a major, major clash of values. I do not suggest manipulating him with false suggestions of 'looking into it'. An adopted child like your husband would always be second best to you so it is better that the process never starts.

One of you is going to have to make a sacrifice here and it sounds like it is going to be your husband, which is probably for the best.

Prepare for him to be very hurt by your opinion here. It will cut to the heart of who he is.

In fairness to you, he should have brought this up with you before getting married. I would never be able to marry someone who did not share my values where children are concerned.

Tigger99

Eviltwin you are right about being 100% committed for fostering. I was thinking of it as an alternative to adopting, but considering the OP has significant reservations about adopting then I suspect fostering may also not be for her.

Dipdip that's pretty harsh, maybe it wasn't discussed before marriage as the hubbie didn't realise how strongly he felt until a discussion about having a second baby came up. The yours versus their benefit isn't the clear cut. I'd like to foster in the future, I realise that it can place huge demands on a person but I know that it can be hugely rewarding.

Anyway OP, you need to talk to your husband about your reservations.

dipdip

Tigger99 wrote: »

Dipdip that's pretty harsh, maybe it wasn't discussed before marriage as the hubbie didn't realise how strongly he felt until a discussion about having a second baby came up.

Don't misunderstand me - my sympathies lie with the husband here.

Barely There

Hello Lady! wrote: »

Perhaps tell him you will look into it together. When he realises how difficult, expensive and in many ways unnecessary it is now he may reconsider.

Or just be honest and tell him what you've written in your OP.

There's no need to play 'games' around the issue.

Tigger99

Ah I know, but I'm saying that both points are valid, and not as clear cut as her having views that are just for her benefit and his views only benefit others.

ViveLaVie

Tigger99 wrote: »

Ah I know, but I'm saying that both points are valid, and not as clear cut as her having views that are just for her benefit and his views only benefit others.

His views do only benefit others though, realistically.

Hello Lady!

ViveLaVie wrote: »

His views do only benefit others though, realistically.

There is no such thing as a truly altruistic act. He of course benefits if its something that will make him happy.

Virgil°

I think that your husband is being a bit unreasonable to be honest and this is something that should have been clarified very early on in the relationship.

He's clearly wanted to do this for some time but just hasn't told you until now. Don't get me wrong, i don't think hes wrong for wanting to do it but at this stage in the relationship its a VERY big ask and akin to moving the goalposts IMO. As I wouldn't naturally assume anyone wants to adopt unless stated otherwise.

Id just tell him as you've told us here. But be prepared to hurt his feelings.

All the best OP.

dipdip

Hello Lady! wrote: »

There is no such thing as a truly altruistic act.

That's a popular opinion that is used to justify selfishness. That sacrificial acts can have benefits in no way undermines the altruism of the act. It's a convenient way to dismiss something you don't want to do by undermining the person who does want to do it because they might derive some pleasure from it.

FactCheck

dipdip wrote: »

That's a popular opinion that is used to justify selfishness. That sacrificial acts can have benefits in no way undermines the altruism of the act. It's a convenient way to dismiss something you don't want to do by undermining the person who does want to do it because they might derive some pleasure from it.

All this talk of "altruism" and "benefitting others" is an incredibly old-fashioned view of adoption which posits adopted children as helpless burdens on society and adoptive parents as noble saviours. These attitudes help nobody, least of all families actually experiencing adoption. Acting like adopted parents are more noble or better parents than biological parents only serves to make adoption seem less desirable and makes discussing the difficulties of adoption more taboo.

Adoption is not an easy process. Adopting at home or abroad is fraught with difficulties. The adoption "industry" (I use the term advisedly) is notorious for trampling all over the best interests of both adopted children and birth parents (and often also adoptive parents).

Domestic adoption is non-existent in Ireland today. The reason it thrived here for so long was because Magdalen laundries, mother-and-baby homes and Irish society in general bullied and coerced young women into surrendering their children, and the law and the church made going to England too difficult.

Nowadays, we don't shun women who become pregnant. A VERY small number of older children become available for adoption because they have been mistreated, neglected, or abused by their birth families. The law has only recently changed to make it easier to adopt these children and it's impossible to say if you would be able to adopt one. It would take many years, cost an incredible amount of money, and the older child would have a high risk of the many complications that attend an early childhood of abuse and instability. RAD (look it up), anger issues, attachment issues, attacking siblings, acting out inappropriately sexually - could you handle any of that? They won't be solved quickly by "good parenting" - even with years of expensive therapy the child may carry them into adulthood. If you COULDN'T handle that, you cannot handle an older adoption. Even if the HSE were to present you with the mythical unicorn - an older child available for adoption with no health issues - you simply couldn't trust them because the emotional issues may have gone unnoticed.

This post is already long enough but foreign adoption is NOT an easy solution to all this. It is rife with corruption. Could you handle knowing that your baby might have been bought, unbeknownst to you, and against the will of its parents, by corrupt officials? Knowing that your baby could have living family that love it dearly and want to raise it, but cannot purely for economic reasons? And again, undiagnosed or misrepresented health or emotional issues. And that's before you consider the ethical implications of wealthy Westerners removing poor children from their communities to give them a "better life".

If your husband wants to help children like him, he should look to foster caring. Or charities that help single parent families in poverty (that is where "kids like him" end up in 2014. Not adopted. With their birth parents, in a poverty trap). Or reputable charities that help children in the developing world.

If what I've written about RAD and surviving sexual abuse and potentially "buying" a stolen child haven't put you off, then by all means do more research. Don't take my word for it. Both of you look into it.

IMO if you want to help disadvantaged children there are a million better ways. I'm not saying adoptive parents are terrible or adoption is terrible, but unless it is the only way you can hope to be a parent, it is an ethical minefield. Just like in Ireland 30+ years ago, it is not a question of lovely babies with nobody to love and care for them. It is a backdrop of poverty, desperation, and women with no choices.

There are a lot of needy children out there and so many ways to help them - to help a LOT of them, rather than just swooping in and adopting ONE.

Jackal756

I'd say give it a try you already have a biological child of your own and we all know the horror stories we hear about foreign orphanages (obviously adoption in Ireland doesn't really happen anymore) but these kids just want to be loved and cared for
Wouldn't it be nice to give somebody a home and since your both in your 30s there's always time to have a child together later on if you both want that

Addle

You say you might want more than one more child; would you be amenable to the idea of having one more biologically and another by adopting/fostering?

Hello Lady!

When I said tell him you will look into it together I didn't mean it as a means to manipulate him. I meant it as a way for both parties to look into adoption properly and see if it would be viable. It sounds very much like hubby has a misplaced sense of having to repay his fortune by adopting. Its just not practical and IMO it's a bit patronising to think he can save some poor unfortunate child from a life of foster homes. By looking into the whole process he may realise he is very mistaken as to how unrealistic it is to think he can just go out and adopt a baby in some simple adoption process. If upon looking into it and being fully aware of whats involved he still wants to go ahead then that is when frank honesty is required on both parts. By that time OP may well have warmed to the idea after researching and looking into it, but I don't think there is anything to be gained by OP sounding dismissive of the concept until her husband actually realises what is involved.

Also if it is about saving a poor child then why not let a family who cannot have children be the ones to experience that rather than a couple who can have and do have biological children.

I actually think this suggestion of hubby's may ge a sign of some unresolved issues he has about his own adoption.

dipdip

Posting a long argument about why adoption is close to impossible in Ireland actually doesn't do anything to affect the situation that the OP and the husband find themselves in - a massive clash of values. Nobody has implied that adoptive parents are morally superior to biological: rather the desire to adopt has been defended. Bit of a difference there.

If the OP doesn't want to adopt she is hardly likely to foster so not much point waxing lyrical about that either.

The bottom line is they don't want the same things, and that is painful for any couple.

dipdip

Hello Lady! wrote: »

Its just not practical and IMO it's a bit patronising to think he can save some poor unfortunate child from a life of foster homes.

Impractical it may be, and tenacious - but patronising? What an outrageous accusation. People who adopt and foster are patronising now? Wow. Just wow.

Tokyo

Ok folks, this post is taking a turn for the seriously off-topic. If you want a debate about the pros and cons of altruism, please take it elsewhere. Otherwise post somewhere in the realm of the OP's question, and as always, constructive and mature advice.

Regards,
Mike

Hello Lady!

OP the more I think about it the more I feel you need to get him to open up to you about where his reasons for adoption come from. If adoption of a family isn't something thst was previously on the table then it seems a bit out of left field for him to decide its now the way to go for future children. I have quite a few friends who are adopted and I would feel confident in saying that being adopted yourself isn't usually a reason for wanting to adopt. It just seems a strange motivation. I think that his own adoption is perhaps raising unresolved issues for him and this is how he is dealing with it. Could it be that he wonders if his adoptive parents really loved him as their own? In which case him having one biological and one adopted child could put to the test if it is possible to love an adopted child as if he were your biological child. Has he met or tried to contact his biological parents? Could this be a sign that possibly he needs to do so? Or get counselling on the issue?