Worth getting an old xbox with rrod repaired?

Cyclonus

I've still got my first 360 that crapped out on me in my cupboard. For some reason I find it hard to throw out gadgets even if they're broken. Would it be worth my while to get it repaired and sell it on ebay? It's one of the old ones with only a 20GB hard drive, but its a limited edition Halo 3 console which looks pretty cool. I'm not sure how rare they are.

wotzgoingon

Well they are not rare. I wouldn't bother getting it fixed as they can not always be fixed. You could probably spend the same amount fixing it as on a second hand console.

wotzgoingon

I will just add, if you like the look of the Halo console you can buy a standard console(make sure it has HDMI so it will fit) and use the shell off the Halo console on the new second hand console.

Cyclonus

Well, I did buy a new one after the first one broke, but it's one of the smaller model S ones (I think they're called that) so I probably wouldn't be able to do that. Or would I? I've never modded a console before, so please don't laugh too hard at my innocence.

wotzgoingon

Cyclonus wrote: »

Well, I did buy a new one after the first one broke, but it's one of the smaller model S ones (I think they're called that) so I probably wouldn't be able to do that. Or would I? I've never modded a console before, so please don't laugh too hard at my innocence.

No you will not be able to use the new console inside the shell of the old halo console.

Cyclonus

Have to say, you handled that pretty well. No snickering at all.

Brixworkwear

The repair is usually not permanent so if you do fix it and sell it expect a call from whoever you sell it to. they sell broken on ebay.co.uk for between £8 and £30. being that its a halo one you may be able to get the higher price for it.

FJFreelance

Cyclonus wrote: »

I've still got my first 360 that crapped out on me in my cupboard. For some reason I find it hard to throw out gadgets even if they're broken. Would it be worth my while to get it repaired and sell it on ebay? It's one of the old ones with only a 20GB hard drive, but its a limited edition Halo 3 console which looks pretty cool. I'm not sure how rare they are.

A reball done right will fix the xbox for well over a year if done right. Unfortionaltly the guy I know doesnt seem to do them anymore.

jasiosnd1987

FJFreelance wrote: »

A reball done right will fix the xbox for well over a year if done right. Unfortionaltly the guy I know doesnt seem to do them anymore.

only way to fix rrod is to replace gpu for brand new(most cases). Reflow or reballing is temporary fix!

FJFreelance

jasiosnd1987 wrote: »

only way to fix rrod is to replace gpu for brand new(most cases). Reflow or reballing is temporary fix!

Incorrect, reballing is permanent if done correctly. It is also known for GPU or CPUs to die when being reballed because of the heat so they may need to be replaced with a used part. Microsoft don't exactly sell new GPUs and CPUs on there own anyway, it would have to be taken off a board so it will be used no matter what the case. Never powered on is another story but would be more costly for a part like that as it would have to be taken of a new motherboard which defeats the purpose. Why remove a GPU or CPU on a brand new, never powered on board?

Reflow is only temporary as you are only reflowing the lead free solder, allowing a cold solder joint to form again in time.

Please do your research before putting someone down! :P

jasiosnd1987

rubbish!

I had many rrods after reballing!

There's also solder under core that causes the problem. Reflow and reballing will melt it and fix temporarly but only for few months(unless you know way of removing core and replacing solder on it. please share!). Ps3 does not make brand new chips. Xbox does. Not going to fight with person who has no equipment or experience!

FJFreelance

jasiosnd1987 wrote: »

rubbish!

I had many rrods after reballing!

There's also solder under core that causes the problem. Reflow and reballing will melt it and fix temporarly but only for few months(unless you know way of removing core and replacing solder on it. please share!). Ps3 does not make brand new chips. Xbox does. Not going to fight with person who has no equipment or experience!

As I said reballing is permanent if done correctly, the process you mention is reflowing which is not permanent (lasts about 6months). By correctly I mean by removing the GPU / CPU, removing the lead free solder, putting lead solder on the GPU / CPU and resetting it. This is a permenant fix, although I do not have any hands on experience or equipment, I was told by someone in the business who explained it very well to me and trys to reproduce it as close as a manufacturer would. Even better would be to use a solder paste that is used by manufacturers but the bad thing is it needs to be refrigerated at all times so it is not available to get it here, that what I was told. So I do know alot about the correct process to reball a console for a permanent fix :P Dont assume you know all about someone by pre judging them :P

Reballing as taken from wikipedia:

Reballing involves dismantling, heating the chip until it can be removed from the board, typically with a hot-air gun and vacuum pickup tool, removing the device, removing solder remaining on the device and board, putting new solder balls in place, replacing the original device if there was a poor connection, or using a new one, and heating the device or board to solder it in place. The new balls can be placed via several methods, including:

Using a stencil for both the balls and the solder paste or flux,
Using a BGA "preform" with embedded balls corresponding to the device pattern, or
Using semiautomated or fully automated machinery.

" Not going to fight with person who has no equipment or experience!"

Im assuming you are implying that you have experience and the equipment for this. Well might help if you actually knew the process for reballing, hope the above clears this up.

jasiosnd1987

all respect but you're wrong!

What is the Nvidia Graphics Fault?
In 2007/08 Nvidia, the graphics card manufacturer produced a range of graphics chips that were later found to be inherently faulty. Laptops fitted with these faulty chips get very hot in use and after a while start to show distorted display patterns and eventually no display at all. In addition wireless card problems are other manifestations of the fault.
Despite what many laptop repair companies claim, there is no real long term solution to this problem. Reworking or reballing the chip will usually provide a short-term fix but the underlying faulty design of the chip will cause the failure to return sooner or later. How soon depends on how much the laptop is used. The heating up and cooling down of the chip is what leads to the failure so the more the computer is switched on and off the sooner the chip will fail again.
Don't accept a repair by your retailer without asking for a written guarantee of what is going to be done. As pointed out above, reballing and reworking are not permanent fixes and If they say they will change the type of graphics chip be suspicious. It is unlikely that this is possible without a new motherboard fitted and the chance of there being a board compatible with the laptop case is small. The only thing we recommend is to ask for a refund (full or partial) or a brand new laptop. Some retailers like John Lewis, Staples and Costco are very good while others which I can't name for obvious reasons are shockingly bad and you will have to threaten them with The Small Claims Court.

FJFreelance

jasiosnd1987 wrote: »

all respect but you're wrong!

What is the Nvidia Graphics Fault?
In 2007/08 Nvidia, the graphics card manufacturer produced a range of graphics chips that were later found to be inherently faulty. Laptops fitted with these faulty chips get very hot in use and after a while start to show distorted display patterns and eventually no display at all. In addition wireless card problems are other manifestations of the fault.
Despite what many laptop repair companies claim, there is no real long term solution to this problem. Reworking or reballing the chip will usually provide a short-term fix but the underlying faulty design of the chip will cause the failure to return sooner or later. How soon depends on how much the laptop is used. The heating up and cooling down of the chip is what leads to the failure so the more the computer is switched on and off the sooner the chip will fail again.
Don't accept a repair by your retailer without asking for a written guarantee of what is going to be done. As pointed out above, reballing and reworking are not permanent fixes and If they say they will change the type of graphics chip be suspicious. It is unlikely that this is possible without a new motherboard fitted and the chance of there being a board compatible with the laptop case is small. The only thing we recommend is to ask for a refund (full or partial) or a brand new laptop. Some retailers like John Lewis, Staples and Costco are very good while others which I can't name for obvious reasons are shockingly bad and you will have to threaten them with The Small Claims Court.

The case is the same then with the xbox. They rushed the release of the console, not going to an appoved vendor and because of that the chip outputted more heat. I guess they are all just ticking time bombs so will all fail sooner or later. Never really thought of it like that. But they must be doing something right if reballs come with a one year written guarentee in the place I got mine done. So yes I will agree with you that it is not a 100% permanent fix, but a longer lasting one than others. Since its down to bad chip design theres nothing more that can be done besides replacing the failed chip each time. Or getting a slim where they seemed to have done it right.

Myrddin

Reballing is as near as you can get to a permanent fix, in some cases, it's even better than the method used during manufacturing due to the types of solder used. If reballing doesn't last a long long time, then quite simply, it wasn't done correctly..or there are other faults present that are separate issues.

FJFreelance

Myrddin wrote: »

Reballing is as near as you can get to a permanent fix, in some cases, it's even better than the method used during manufacturing due to the types of solder used. If reballing doesn't last a long long time, then quite simply, it wasn't done correctly..or there are other faults present that are separate issues.

Mhhm It lasts as long to be percieved as permanent as the repair would outlast the lifetime of the warrenty or device if done right or if there were no underlying issues as you mentioned.

Celeron Media

Myrddin wrote: »

Reballing is as near as you can get to a permanent fix, in some cases, it's even better than the method used during manufacturing due to the types of solder used. If reballing doesn't last a long long time, then quite simply, it wasn't done correctly..or there are other faults present that are separate issues.

Most of the overheating is from the eDram on the GPU. That's why most reballs don't that last due failing eDram. For consoles that have cold or broken solder joints around the GPU or Southbridge it's because of a law passed a few years removing lead from solder in manufacturing workplaces. The only way to fix it, is by replacing the GPU with a brand new GPU and use lead solder balls.

Myrddin

Celeron Media wrote: »

Most of the overheating is from the eDram on the GPU. That's why most reballs don't that last due failing eDram. For consoles that have cold or broken solder joints around the GPU or Southbridge it's because of a law passed a few years removing lead from solder in manufacturing workplaces. The only way to fix it, is by replacing the GPU with a brand new GPU and use lead solder balls.

Can you actually buy brand new replacement GPU's yeah?

Celeron Media

Myrddin wrote: »

Can you actually buy brand new replacement GPU's yeah?

Yes of course you can, they work perfect.
http://www.aliexpress.com/wholesale?SearchText=xbox+gpu&catId=0&initiative_id=SB_20140710053102

Myrddin

Celeron Media wrote: »

Yes of course you can, they work perfect.
http://www.aliexpress.com/wholesale?SearchText=xbox+gpu&catId=0&initiative_id=SB_20140710053102

Cool...didn't know that. I thought gpu's had to be pulled from donor boards etc.

Celeron Media

You can also pull them from donor boards, but you wouldn't really be certain of the condition or lifespan of that chip either. You can also buy used and reballed chips on eBay but the new replacements are cheap enough. So a new chip, fresh lead solder joints should get a few years of use before failing again.

Myrddin

Celeron Media wrote: »

You can also pull them from donor boards, but you wouldn't really be certain of the condition or lifespan of that chip either. You can also buy used and reballed chips on eBay but the new replacements are cheap enough. So a new chip, fresh lead solder joints should get a few years of use before failing again.

Yeah definitely sounds the way to go. As you say, a donor gpu is a bit of an unknown quantity