Changing Name on Title Deeds

DulchieLaois

My brother and I currently co-own a house in Dublin.

He wants out and I want to get my wife to take over.

I was advised by BOI that, I will need to go through the whole mortgage process.

Is there any other process that I can do that will not involve a lot of money in terms of fees ?

The Mortgage is up to date and not in arrears, however there is negative equity on it though at present.

The prices in the area in which I live are rising.

Thanks

johnnyskeleton

DulchieLaois wrote: »

My brother and I currently co-own a house in Dublin.

He wants out and I want to get my wife to take over.

I was advised by BOI that, I will need to go through the whole mortgage process.

Is there any other process that I can do that will not involve a lot of money

If you want to legally transfer mortgaged property from yourself and your brother to yourself and your wife, you will need to clear the current mortgage. You don't have to get a new mortgage, so no, you don't have to get a new mortgage. But if you don't have the cash lying around a new mortgage is probably the only option.

In terms of the expense, the new mortgage per se isn't that expensive. However, to get a solicitor to do the transfer, and another to independently advise your wife in circumstances where she is taking on a large amount of debt in exchange for a property of less value, is not going to be cheap.

GerardKeating

DulchieLaois wrote: »

My brother and I currently co-own a house in Dublin.

He wants out and I want to get my wife to take over.

I was advised by BOI that, I will need to go through the whole mortgage process.

Is there any other process that I can do that will not involve a lot of money in terms of fees ?

The Mortgage is up to date and not in arrears, however there is negative equity on it though at present.

The prices in the area in which I live are rising.

Thanks

Is your Brother going to pay his share of the negative equity, or is he passing this debt to you?

Wheelnut

There used to be a more informal process called "buying the key of the door" in which the buyer paid something to the seller and then took over his payments. That may be what you have in mind, but as Johnny says: " if you don't have the cash lying around a new mortgage is probably the only option."

DulchieLaois

The brother wants nothing to do with the house (no payment or anything)

It was more a helping hand to get onto the property market a few years ago and it bellied up on him and he just wants out as he lives outside Dublin.

The Brother is passing on the negative equity to me.

My new wife and I dont have too much cash lying around but can make monthly payments of the mortgage as we have been paying it for the last few years

Peregrinus

The brother is passing the negative equity onto your wife.

From her point of view, this may not be a good deal (to put it mildly). She needs independent advice. (It might not be a great idea from your point of view either. If the whole thing goes pear-shaped, you won't have the brother to share the financial pain.)

From the bank's point of view, this may not be a great deal either. Your brother will need their agreement. It may not be forthcoming.

However you look at it, this is more than a clerical entry on the title deeds. It raises signficant issues for all parties, and there isn't going to be a quick and cheap way of doing it.

DulchieLaois

The negative equity in the short term is painful but long term, the property will be our home for the next 7-10 years and at which stage, the property will rise about the value of the mortgage as it is in a good area.

We undertstand, that we are taking over everything, but as you said Peregrinus

"From the bank's point of view, this may not be a great deal either. Your brother will need their agreement. It may not be forthcoming"

We are aware of this but it will then be the case of my brother staying on, a situation that neither of us want as my wife has plans for doing work to the house and my brother staying on in which he doesnt want to invest into the house.

A situation that I dont want for sure as I will have to deal with brother who has his own problems and wife who wants to design her living space but theres no point in investing money if brother gets the financial reward

Valentine1

OP this may not be possible or worth while.

What has to happen here is for your brother to transfer his half of the house to your wife. To do that you will need the agreement of the Bank and they won't agree to that unless the Mortgage is paid off. Given there is negative equity in the property getting a new Mortgage for the full amount required may not be possible.

As regards fees you would expect to pay the same fees you would when buying a house and taking out a mortgage as this is essentially what you are doing. Your brother will need to receive independent advice from another solicitor.

dats_right

This is a classic case of a layman assuming that a complicated legal transaction is really just a case of 'changing the name on the deeds'. The reality here is that the bank are unlikely to agree to the proposed transaction and that will be the end of it.

If the bank do consent it will be on the basis of a new mortgage being taken out by OP and his wife based on current lending criteria, which is very tough. The bank will also generally only lend a maximum of 90% (in reality probably nearer 70%) of property value based on current market valuations.

OP should speak with bank and see if they will agree to proposal otherwise he's just wasting his time.

DulchieLaois

You wouldnt think that this would be bloody complicated.

The way I see it, is if I was to take over the mortgage and get a huge loan to play off the negative equity, then I would have to re-structure the loan over 30 - 35 years again.

Could I not sell the house to my wife and I, and threaten BOI that I will go to another bank for a loan, they will lose out on all of the interest.

Just a thought

Peregrinus

They would be delighted if you went to another bank for a loan, and paid off your loan to them. At the moment your loan is not adequately secured and, as a lender, they don't like inadequately secured loans. Having the loan cleared would lift their spirits hugely.

Look at it this way: when they went into this deal, they were protected by having a charge over an asset that, if liquidated, was expected to yield enough to pay off the loan.

Now, they're not protected in that way. If they enforce their security, there'll be a large shortfall for which their only recourse is to sue you and your brother.

If the ownership of the house is restructured as you propose, their only recourse for the shortfall will be to sue you and your wife. That's probably going to look like a worse deal to them. Two adults in different families probably have access to a larger pool of assets and earnings than two adults in the same family. Plus, repayment default is a bit less likely; if the adults are in different families and one loses his job, becomes too ill to earn, etc, that's less likely to put the other under acute financial stress than if they are both in the same family. So the banks risks are spread better under the current arrangement than under what you propose.

There's nothing in your proposal to attract the bank. If anything, it makes them worse off than they already are, and you can't force them to agree to that.

DulchieLaois

I guess then we will wait unti the value of the house goes up then and I will not be that bad off with the negative equity amount as the amount is an decent area near city center.

It really all depends on what the valuator advises us what the house value is worth as some houses in the area are quoting over the mortgage value.

I need to get the paintbrush out for the summer, so to add some value