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Landlord in receivership. Owes us deposit

  • 10-04-2014 12:29pm
    #1
    Faith and Justice
    Closed Accounts Posts: 167 ✭✭


    Myself and my two house mates have being living in a house the last 12 months. We've paid our rent on time, every time throughout the lease. When we moved in we had to give a €1000 deposit.

    A letter came in the post recently from receivers saying that the property is now in receivership, and all rent has to be paid to them, not the landlord.

    We've fully paid up all our rent to date, and we've phoned the landlord and told him that we are leaving when the lease is up and asked about getting out deposit back. The landlord said he would give us the deposit, but he keeps fobbing us off, and it's obvious he doesn't want to give us our money back.

    We've found a new place to live, but we need the deposit to put down on the new place. Since the lease is up on Sunday coming the 13th of April, we are unsure what to do because we need the deposit.

    We're thinking of remaining in the accommodation until we get our money back .

    Has anyone been in a similar position before?


Comments

  • #2
    runawaybishop
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,512 ✭✭✭runawaybishop


    Faith and Justice wrote: »
    Myself and my two house mates have being living in a house the last 12 months. We've paid our rent on time, every time throughout the lease. When we moved in we had to give a €1000 deposit.

    A letter came in the post recently from receivers saying that the property is now in receivership, and all rent has to be paid to them, not the landlord.

    We've fully paid up all our rent to date, and we've phoned the landlord and told him that we are leaving when the lease is up and asked about getting out deposit back. The landlord said he would give us the deposit, but he keeps fobbing us off, and it's obvious he doesn't want to give us our money back.

    We've found a new place to live, but we need the deposit to put down on the new place. Since the lease is up on Sunday coming the 13th of April, we are unsure what to do because we need the deposit.

    We're thinking of remaining in the accommodation until we get our money back .

    Has anyone been in a similar position before?

    You cant really wait in the place or you'll then be liable for rent. You could contact the PTRB and instigate proceedings against the landlord to get your deposit back, but if he is gone into receivership he probably just doesn't have it.

    I would be curious to know if the receivers are now liable for your deposit, since they take on the property and tenancy and all that encapsulates.


  • #3
    minusthebear
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 71 ✭✭minusthebear


    Yes this is becoming common, a mate is in a similar boat.

    I was going to suggest not paying your last month's rent, but I'd say you have at done that at this stage. With the property now in receivership I'd say it is highly unlikely you will see your deposit. I think it's like when a company goes bust with debts owing, the money is gone. I'm open to correction on this.


  • #4
    Marcusm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,628 ✭✭✭✭Marcusm


    THere are some good links on here to this situation. It's frustrating but the receiver is not generally liable to return the deposit but the original landlord is. If they have limited financial resources, you may find it hard to get it from them. Personally, in the interests of maintaining good order with a tenant, I think receivers should assume a liability to pay the deposit to avoid situations scuh as tenants failing to pay the last month's rent. This si what happened when the complex at which I rent was taken into receivership.

    At best, you can open a case with PRTB.


  • #5
    godtabh
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 23,243 Mod ✭✭✭✭godtabh


    Dont speak to the landlord. He has no input in to this now. Speak to the receiver


  • #6
    The_Morrigan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,368 ✭✭✭The_Morrigan


    godtabh wrote: »
    Dont speak to the landlord. He has no input in to this now. Speak to the receiver

    The landlord is still responsible, especially for the return of the deposit.


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  • #7
    godtabh
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 23,243 Mod ✭✭✭✭godtabh


    The_Morrigan wrote: »
    The landlord is still responsible, especially for the return of the deposit.

    He's not. The receiver his. The landlord had no interest in the property now. That's why the OP was told to pay rent to the reciever. Speak to the receiver.


  • #8
    toughapple
    Closed Accounts Posts: 44 ✭toughapple


    godtabh wrote: »
    He's not. The receiver his. The landlord had no interest in the property now. That's why the OP was told to pay rent to the reciever. Speak to the receiver.

    That happened to a friend of mine and the PRTB were no help. They said the receiver was the agent of the landlord! The only thing to do, I was told is to take furniture from the place when leaving and sell it. The receiver won't have a copy of the inventory.


  • #9
    Marcusm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,628 ✭✭✭✭Marcusm


    godtabh wrote: »
    He's not. The receiver his. The landlord had no interest in the property now. That's why the OP was told to pay rent to the reciever. Speak to the receiver.

    This is rubbish; the landlord remains the owner of the property. However, a lender has, under the terms of a lending agreement, appointed a person (the "receiver') to gather cashflows arising from the property. It is only if/when the property is repossessed (actually taken in possession by a mortgagee) that the landlord fails to have an interest in the property (and even then he has an interest in the surplus, if any, of the sales proceeds of the property).

    A receiver has few obligations and plenty of entitlements. The landlord retains all of his obligations (including repairs etc) but no longer has any entitlement to collect the rent.
    toughapple wrote: »
    That happened to a friend of mine and the PRTB were no help. They said the receiver was the agent of the landlord! The only thing to do, I was told is to take furniture from the place when leaving and sell it. The receiver won't have a copy of the inventory.

    Taking the furniture without any legal basis to do so would be theft. Whether the landlord or receiver makes a complaint to the police is a different matter but it remains theft.


  • #10
    TimeToShine
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,881 ✭✭✭TimeToShine


    This happened to a few friends of mine, as crude as it sounds they got one of their older brothers to tip in with a big van and stripped the place of most furniture and valuables (including a bed!). This was at Christmas and as far as I know nothing ever came of it.


  • #11
    Greenmachine
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,063 ✭✭✭Greenmachine


    Is the only communication you received a letter from the receiver.
    Surely it would not be unreasonable to question the authenticity of such a letter. You may not even have a contract with the receiver so to speak. Stop paying rent. Find a new place to live. It will take months for proceedings to be taken against you. When you have saved the deposit and first month rent for the new place. Contact the utilities companies and settle your bills and leave, without a forwarding address. The receivers interest lies in recovering the debts of the landlord, it would be a waste of their time trying to find you.


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  • #12
    mitosis
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,000 ✭✭✭mitosis


    Hang on. The LL has said he will return the deposit. Why would he be expected to return it before the tenant hands back the keys?


  • #13
    The_Morrigan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,368 ✭✭✭The_Morrigan


    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057118365

    OP read this thread...I explained in great detail how this works for tenants.


  • #14
    The_Morrigan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,368 ✭✭✭The_Morrigan


    We will have no further suggestions of theft on this thread please.


  • #15
    Marcusm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,628 ✭✭✭✭Marcusm


    Greenmachine wrote: »
    Is the only communication you received a letter from the receiver.
    Surely it would not be unreasonable to question the authenticity of such a letter. You may not even have a contract with the receiver so to speak. Stop paying rent. Find a new place to live. It will take months for proceedings to be taken against you. When you have saved the deposit and first month rent for the new place. Contact the utilities companies and settle your bills and leave, without a forwarding address. The receivers interest lies in recovering the debts of the landlord, it would be a waste of their time trying to find you.

    He said that he's recently received the letter and that the lease is up and they're moving out on Sunday 13th April; hardly seems time to put this into action unless they plan on stiffing the current propertyholder and the one they've agreed to rent from.

    They need to establish if the landlord is willing to return the deposit.


  • #16
    Greenmachine
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,063 ✭✭✭Greenmachine


    Marcusm wrote: »
    He said that he's recently received the letter and that the lease is up and they're moving out on Sunday 13th April; hardly seems time to put this into action unless they plan on stiffing the current propertyholder and the one they've agreed to rent from.

    They need to establish if the landlord is willing to return the deposit.


    They are not stiffing the landlord. The landlord by the sounds of it is stiffing them. They won't be moving anywhere if they don't have the deposit for the new place. They should in theory be entitled to part 4 tenancy if they have been there more than 6 months.


  • #17
    Faith and Justice
    Closed Accounts Posts: 167 ✭✭Faith and Justice


    The_Morrigan wrote: »
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057118365

    OP read this thread...I explained in great detail how this works for tenants.

    Is that where you said both the landlord, and the tenant have to adhere to they're previous agreement whether there are receivers involved ir not?


  • #18
    Faith and Justice
    Closed Accounts Posts: 167 ✭✭Faith and Justice


    mitosis wrote: »
    Hang on. The LL has said he will return the deposit. Why would he be expected to return it before the tenant hands back the keys?

    Well we phoned him, and he told us that he'd call the next day, take a look around the property, and give us back our deposit.

    We went looking at a place that day and we have the money for the first months rent. Not the deposit.

    We has the house cleaned top to bottom and we really need the deposit for the next place


  • #19
    Faith and Justice
    Closed Accounts Posts: 167 ✭✭Faith and Justice


    Greenmachine wrote: »
    They are not stiffing the landlord. The landlord by the sounds of it is stiffing them. They won't be moving anywhere if they don't have the deposit for the new place. They should in theory be entitled to part 4 tenancy if they have been there more than 6 months.

    The landlord isn't answering his phone to us. I think he just expects us to leave on Sunday.

    We're going to stay in the house for as long as possible without paying rent until we can save up enough for the deposit.


  • #20
    Thargor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,061 ✭✭✭✭Thargor


    Faith and Justice wrote: »
    The landlord isn't answering his phone to us. I think he just expects us to leave on Sunday.

    We're going to stay in the house for as long as possible without paying rent until we can save up enough for the deposit.
    Only thing you can do. Personally, and this isnt a reccomendation before a mod says so, Id take maximum advantage of this situation and see how many months free rent I could drag out, PTRB etc.


  • #21
    The_Morrigan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,368 ✭✭✭The_Morrigan


    Faith and Justice wrote: »
    The landlord isn't answering his phone to us. I think he just expects us to leave on Sunday.

    We're going to stay in the house for as long as possible without paying rent until we can save up enough for the deposit.

    Expect eviction proceedings from the receiver, noting they can go straight to the courts rather than the PRTB.


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  • #22
    CONM
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 166 ✭✭CONM


    Am I the only person who feels that its completely unreasonable to expect a deposit to be returned before moving out? Surely the deposit should only be returned upon handing back the keys.


  • #23
    Faith and Justice
    Closed Accounts Posts: 167 ✭✭Faith and Justice


    CONM wrote: »
    Am I the only person who feels that its completely unreasonable to expect a deposit to be returned before moving out? Surely the deposit should only be returned upon handing back the keys.

    Well the lease is up today and the landlord hasn't contacted us. We tried phoning him and got no answer.

    Surely if the landlord is in receivership, it's not unreasonable to ask for the deposit before we leave?

    If he's broke and we move out then we're homeless with no money.

    We're going to stay in the house until we get our money back. We'll continue to pay rent if necessary.

    €1000 is a lot of money to walk away from


  • #24
    The_Morrigan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,368 ✭✭✭The_Morrigan


    Faith and Justice wrote: »
    Well the lease is up today and the landlord hasn't contacted us. We tried phoning him and got no answer.

    Surely if the landlord is in receivership, it's not unreasonable to ask for the deposit before we leave?

    If he's broke and we move out then we're homeless with no money.

    We're going to stay in the house until we get our money back. We'll continue to pay rent if necessary.

    €1000 is a lot of money to walk away from

    Have you told the landlord and the receiver that you're not moving out?


  • #25
    Greenmachine
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,063 ✭✭✭Greenmachine


    Faith and Justice wrote: »
    Well the lease is up today and the landlord hasn't contacted us. We tried phoning him and got no answer.

    Surely if the landlord is in receivership, it's not unreasonable to ask for the deposit before we leave?

    If he's broke and we move out then we're homeless with no money.

    We're going to stay in the house until we get our money back. We'll continue to pay rent if necessary.

    €1000 is a lot of money to walk away from

    Was your name on any of the correspondence from the receiver. If not instruct the landlord not to provide your name. :D


  • #26
    omega666
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 605 ✭✭✭omega666


    Just stay in the house for an extra month and don't pay the rent.
    Keep the rent for the deposit in the next place.
    Do not inform the landlord or receiver of this.

    Wait for someone to contact you for the rent payment and tell them you had trouble with
    the bank transfer and it will take a few days.

    By the time they realise you’re not paying the rent it will be at least a few weeks gone.

    Let them you issue/warn you with eviction all they like then as you will be long gone before they get anywhere.

    Clean the house, fix any damage, hand back the keys,leave once the month is up and tell them to keep the deposit.


  • #27
    The_Morrigan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,368 ✭✭✭The_Morrigan


    omega666 wrote: »
    Just stay in the house for an extra month and don't pay the rent.
    Keep the rent for the deposit in the next place.
    Do not inform the landlord or receiver of this.

    Wait for someone to contact you for the rent payment and tell them you had trouble with
    the bank transfer and it will take a few days.

    By the time they realise you’re not paying the rent it will be at least a few weeks gone.

    Let them you issue/warn you with eviction all they like then as you will be long gone before they get anywhere.

    Clean the house, fix any damage, hand back the keys,leave once the month is up and tell them to keep the deposit.


    We won't be having any advice like this on the forum - it is a breach of the forum charter.


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