Evidence of Degree

WhiteWalls

A friend of mine got a good job recently that is relative to his degree. He got a 2.2 in the course and he said to me that when he was asked in the interview if he got a 2.1 he said yes. However they have since not even sought proof that he has a degree, never mind a 2.1. Was sure a company would ask for proof of qualifications?

dpofloinn

So what is the issue? Some places will just take a persons word for it while others require every kind certification to be presented for inspection, maybe someone just forgot to ask for proof or assumed proof has already been given.Nothing entirely unusual about it, its possible that the company may ask for proof of education at a later date

Mrs OBumble

Lying at interview is a really poor idea. If your friend has a conscience, then he'll be worried for the rest of his time there that sooner or later someone will ask for proof. If not then he won't.

And you as a customer now have an idea of the company's approach to quality. Use that information as you will. (But please don't name-and-shame here :-) )

professore

If he / she does a good job, who cares? If it's a sales role, lying is practically a prerequisite.

The Bishop Basher

WhiteWalls wrote: »

A friend of mine got a good job recently that is relative to his degree. He got a 2.2 in the course and he said to me that when he was asked in the interview if he got a 2.1 he said yes. However they have since not even sought proof that he has a degree, never mind a 2.1. Was sure a company would ask for proof of qualifications?

Sounds like a touch of sour grapes because he good a good job tbh.

Absolutely nothing unusual in this. In fact looking for proof would be unusual. I think most people lie in interviews to a certain extent. I wouldn't have the job I have today if I hadn't.

It's dog eat dog when it comes to the job market. If you're not out for yourself you won't succeed.

Ann Landers

WhiteWalls wrote: »

A friend of mine got a good job recently that is relative to his degree. He got a 2.2 in the course and he said to me that when he was asked in the interview if he got a 2.1 he said yes. However they have since not even sought proof that he has a degree, never mind a 2.1. Was sure a company would ask for proof of qualifications?

They might still do!

Swanner wrote: »

Sounds like a touch of sour grapes because he good a good job tbh.

Absolutely nothing unusual in this.

Hardly sour grapes. He might not have got the job if he had been honest about his degree class. But hey, why bother working hard to get a 2:1 when you can just lie about it? A 2:1 applicant might have missed out because of his lie. There's also nothing unusual in companies checking up on your qualifications, especially for graduate jobs. I've been asked for proof a number of times, and have seen on job specs that proof of results will be requested.

blindsider

Swanner wrote: »

Sounds like a touch of sour grapes because he good a good job tbh.

Absolutely nothing unusual in this. In fact looking for proof would be unusual. I think most people lie in interviews to a certain extent. I wouldn't have the job I have today if I hadn't.

It's dog eat dog when it comes to the job market. If you're not out for yourself you won't succeed.

Sour grapes because someone lied and (has sofar) benefited? Hmmm. I think a little concern is warranted here.

There's a big difference between 'embellishment' or exaggeration, and plain lying.

Also, once you start lying......"Oh what a wicked web we weave...."

From a HR POV, this individual has broken the trust that an employer has the right to expect. It's pretty black and white.

Scenario: Our friend is doing well in the job, and goes for a promotion in 2 years time. HR Director says "Congrats - the job's yours. You start Monday - BTW bring a copy of your qualifications with you; we seem to be missing them from your file and we have an ISO9000 audit next week."

Oops!

@OP - people do things we don't approve of - but those are their actions - best to focus on our own.

WhiteWalls

Sour grapes has nothing got to do with it, I wished him the best of luck. I was just wondering is this normal practice

ongarboy

Most larger companies (particularly financial/IFSC) that hire staff and use a third level degree as a minimum benchmark criteria for hiring would insist on you providing your original certified degree so that they take a copy as part of the recruitment/vetting process so yes it's normal practice for some industries.

rockbeast

Fair play to him.

At least he had the degree.

Was blanked by a very good friend before (and still am!) over similar years ago.

He pointed out I needed a degree in X to get a job. *Rockbeast edits CV. Now has qualification. Gets job. Excels in position for 4 years* Friend says I'm a disgrace and hasn't spoken to me since.

lacktose

True at least he did.

SHANAbert

Even if they ask for his results he could edit that too...

TimeToShine

rockbeast wrote: »

Fair play to him.

At least he had the degree.

Was blanked by a very good friend before (and still am!) over similar years ago.

He pointed out I needed a degree in X to get a job. *Rockbeast edits CV. Now has qualification. Gets job. Excels in position for 4 years* Friend says I'm a disgrace and hasn't spoken to me since.

Was he going for the position as well? This is a first hand case of someone putting in more work than a person who lied and getting screwed over. We always hear about the guy who put X down on his CV and got the job but what about the other 4 people who earned X and got screwed out of a position? Perhaps blanking is excessive but he has every right to be pissed IMO.

srsly78

ongarboy wrote: »

Most larger companies (particularly financial/IFSC) that hire staff and use a third level degree as a minimum benchmark criteria for hiring would insist on you providing your original certified degree so that they take a copy as part of the recruitment/vetting process so yes it's normal practice for some industries.

No they don't, a piece of paper is easily forged. Instead they get you to sign a waiver allowing them to background check you - meaning criminal record and academic record. College will not release information without signed consent.

In any serious company these liars will be found out and fired eventually. That said, a lot of smaller companies don't perform any kind of checks at all.

rockbeast

TimeToShine wrote: »

Was he going for the position as well? This is a first hand case of someone putting in more work than a person who lied and getting screwed over. We always hear about the guy who put X down on his CV and got the job but what about the other 4 people who earned X and got screwed out of a position? Perhaps blanking is excessive but he has every right to be pissed IMO.

No, he wasn't going for a position but believed in "Integrity" etc., etc,

In fact, by the end of my time in that company I was hiring others on Msc. basis.

I commend anyone who does what they have to do to get their foot in the door.

TimeToShine

rockbeast wrote: »

No, he wasn't going for a position but believed in "Integrity" etc., etc,

In fact, by the end of my time in that company I was hiring others on Msc. basis.

I commend anyone who does what they have to do to get their foot in the door.

Alright so he's just a bit of a dick then.

How would you feel if you hired a guy who lied to you in the hiring process? Even if he's good at what he does, surely being in a HR role would give you some appreciation for honesty and hard work?

Do you do background checks? What would you do if you found out someone lied on their CV?

rockbeast

TimeToShine wrote: »

Alright so he's just a bit of a dick then.

How would you feel if you hired a guy who lied to you in the hiring process? Even if he's good at what he does, surely being in a HR role would give you some appreciation for honesty and hard work?

Do you do background checks? What would you do if you found out someone lied on their CV?

Never researched a candidate ie online profile etc...

Rarely even checked a reference TBH

That said, I'd be a fairly good judge of character at an interview. All the degrees and masters in the world won't make a blind bit of difference to me in an interview if a person comes across badly in person.

* Rockbeast eventually got a degree in said field and starts a related masters this september...:)

tim3000

I know a guy who cheated in every single set of summer exams he sat in college. Couldn't pass without cheating. Once college ended he got straight into a very very good masters program. Which he would not have got without 4 years of cheating. This imo, is much worse than inflating your grade from a 2.2 to a 2.1.

smcgiff

I think I've only ever been asked to prove I was qualified once.

I know some very large companies that would get a land if they asked their accountants for proof of qual. One guy I know is quite senior and spoofed it.

rockbeast

tim3000 wrote: »

I know a guy who cheated in every single set of summer exams he sat in college. Couldn't pass without cheating. Once college ended he got straight into a very very good masters program. Which he would not have got with 4 years of cheating. This imo, is much worse than inflating your grade from a 2.2 to a 2.1.

Much much worse IMO.

I know I sound like a hypocrite here!:o:o

rockbeast

smcgiff wrote: »

I think I've only ever been asked to prove I was qualified once.

I know some very large companies that would get a land if they asked their accountants for proof of qual. One guy I know is quite senior and spoofed it.

I'm sure there are insurance reasons in a lot of cases.

Ann Landers

srsly78 wrote: »

No they don't, a piece of paper is easily forged.

Transcripts are stamped and signed by the college.

rockbeast

Ann Landers wrote: »

Transcripts are stamped and signed by the college.

You obviously don't watch Suits

Ann Landers

rockbeast wrote: »

You obviously don't watch Suits

That fictitious TV show?

rockbeast

Ann Landers wrote: »

That fictitious TV show?

Hence the wink

PS It's a lot more prevalent than many may like to believe...

Ann Landers

rockbeast wrote: »

Hence the wink

PS It's a lot more prevalent than many may like to believe...

Oh, I'm sure some people get away with it, but in this economic climate, companies can afford to rigorous and fussy.

rockbeast

Ann Landers wrote: »

Oh, I'm sure some people get away with it, but in this economic climate, companies can afford to rigorous and fussy.

Anyhoo, to refer back to the OP, an opinion on BSing yourself up from a 2.2 to a 2.1 is a real first world problem!

WhiteWalls

rockbeast wrote: »

Anyhoo, to refer back to the OP, an opinion on BSing yourself up from a 2.2 to a 2.1 is a real first world problem!

You joking?

smcgiff

rockbeast wrote: »

I'm sure there are insurance reasons in a lot of cases.

As a reason not to ask?

rockbeast

WhiteWalls wrote: »

You joking?

No, why?

It only matters as a qualification to enter a Masters...when you will be asked for proof...

What's the difference between 59% and 60%? feck all...

WhiteWalls

rockbeast wrote: »

No, why?

It only matters as a qualification to enter a Masters...when you will be asked for proof...

What's the difference between 59% and 60%? feck all...

I got into a good masters with a 2.2 and did't lie

rockbeast

WhiteWalls wrote: »

I got into a good masters with a 2.2 and did't lie

Congratulations.

rockbeast

smcgiff wrote: »

As a reason not to ask?

To ask for proof. reason being to have a qualified/certified person in a certain position.

That could be a driver's licence or a doctorate.

tim3000

rockbeast wrote: »

Much much worse IMO.

I know I sound like a hypocrite here!:o:o

Well if you eventually got your degree and got it without cheating then it kinda cancels out the whole I have a fake degree thing I guess

qdawg86

Swanner wrote: »

Sounds like a touch of sour grapes because he good a good job tbh.

Absolutely nothing unusual in this. In fact looking for proof would be unusual. I think most people lie in interviews to a certain extent. I wouldn't have the job I have today if I hadn't.

It's dog eat dog when it comes to the job market. If you're not out for yourself you won't succeed.

:rolleyes:

Or it could be that its something the OP would like to discuss with others.

qdawg86

rockbeast wrote: »

Anyhoo, to refer back to the OP, an opinion on BSing yourself up from a 2.2 to a 2.1 is a real first world problem!

Are we no longer a 1st world country ?

I was asked to provide a transcript for a job I applied for recently.

When I printed it off, I noticed that the Uni now provides a link that will allow you to verify the grades online.

I doubt they would bother to provide this if it was unusual for grades to be queried/checked.

Sugar Free

Interesting contrast. In my two roles since finishing university I have not been asked for proof of anything other than my ability to legally work in Ireland.

Both of these roles were in the pharma industry, one of which was a regulated position regularly subject to audits.

somesoldiers

In my experience they never check qualifications

John Smith, Royal College of Surgeons