Motorway Rant

GoWhest

I do a fair bit of driving on our countries motorways and to be honest, I think the standard of driving is abysmal, and I know that people constantly harp on about speed but on our motorways I really dont think speed is a major issue, its sheer stupidity. Here are my main observations. What do ye think?

• The Texter; People driving along with their phone in front of them doing in excess of 120km/h
• The faulty lights; People who have defective lights on their cars and more worringly people pulling trailers with no lights them at all.
• Last minute brigade; This happens all the time on the M4/M6 change and the M50. Do people forget that they are leaving the motorway and then decide to just cross up to two lanes of traffic? If you know your changing, you should be moving into the left lane at last two miles in advance.
• Right lane hoggers: Its not a 'fast lane'. Its for overtaking. You move into it to overtake something and move back to the left lane when your done.
• Toll plaza; You know its there before you ever leave the house but you insist on pulling up, rummaging through your bag, pocket, wallet, purse and ashtray to find the change while the rest of us wait, or worse you use the express lane when you dont have a tag and bring everything to a complete stop.
• The hard shoulder; You decide to pull out from the hard should completely ignorant to the fact Im coming at you at 120km/h. Some of you are lucky my breaks are good.
• Granny overtakers; it takes them a few miles to overtake a fairly slow moving vehicle.
• Headlights; they drive with their headlights on all the time, blinding those coming towards them and dont dip when flashed.
• The tailgater; they sit so close to you but don't overtake

Sometimes when I see a company car/van draped out in the company logo doing any of the above I often think of doing this

bear1

Where I'd agree with you that motorway driving here is quite a challenge, compared to other countries I've driven in Ireland isn't that bad.

Michael D Not Higgins

Saw this on the way to Cork airport once
http://goo.gl/maps/at7NL
This kind of sign perpetuates the 'slow lane, fast lane' mentality as many people are never taught 'driving lane, overtaking lane'

ProudDUB

Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »

Saw this on the way to Cork airport once
http://goo.gl/maps/at7NL
This kind of sign perpetuates the 'slow lane, fast lane' mentality as many people are never taught 'driving lane, overtaking lane'

And what makes it even funnier (or sadder depending on your pov ) is that the sign is in meters. It is a fairly recent-ish sign, not some relic left over from the 1970's.

The system itself is terribly flawed though, seeing as learner drivers are not allowed have lessons on the motorway. Until that system changes, we are always going to have clueless drivers on our nations motorways.

Ketron

Trucks overtaking each other really gets me! With one going 5km/h faster than the other!

AFAIK its illegal too

Mint Sauce

Ketron wrote: »

Trucks overtaking each other really gets me! With one going 5km/h faster than the other!

AFAIK its illegal too

It is, afaik if its only two lanes. If three lanes they cant go beyond the middle lane.

Foxhole Norman

Ketron wrote: »

Trucks overtaking each other really gets me! With one going 5km/h faster than the other!

AFAIK its illegal too

I found it quite amusing when I saw one Arctic overtaking another while I had the Battlefield 1942 theme song on :pac:

Shamo

Not motorway as such but I had a car in a small stretch of dual lane road (where you'd want to get your overtaking done to get past some slow cars before the single lane returns) stick to the overtaking lane for the duration of it. This is after being undertaken by one car first and then flashed many times by myself yet still staying there.
Couldn't believe the ignorance of the driver.

I've come across a lot of overtaking lane hoggers but from my experience nearly always after one undertake or someone flashes them they move in.

This was on the Waterford > Dungarvin road.

131spanner

The ony real rant I'd have about some motorway users is the "I'm doing 120 so I'll stay in the so called fast lane" mentality. When you're pushing it on a bit and you've got someone hogging the right lane it's hard to resist undertaking!

Sam Kade

Op calm down there will always be stupid drivers on the road, no point giving yourself a heart attack over them. Just make allowances for them.

Sam Kade

131spanner wrote: »

The ony real rant I'd have about some motorway users is the "I'm doing 120 so I'll stay in the so called fast lane" mentality. When you're pushing it on a bit and you've got someone hogging the right lane it's hard to resist undertaking!

Then you have the I've a god given right to overtake everybody brigade no matter what speed they are doing. You could have someone overtaking a car doing 140kmh and some fool up his arse flashing his lights to get out of his way :rolleyes:

_Kaiser_

Ohh let's see...

- +1 on the idiots who take an age to overtake (usually doing less than the limit as well) and then don't move back over afterwards until they have to be flashed
- The ones who weave left and right without indicating
- Or who, when you've already moved out to overtake, decide to pull out in front of you too to overtake the car in front of them, despite sitting behind said car for ages anyway until you moved out
- The high beam brigade particularly in the oncoming lanes.. if you can see my lights, I can see yours!!
- The no/minimal lights brigade in the dark/poor conditions
- The idiots who decide they want to race rather than be overtaken
- Or who come flying up the outside lane.. only to sit just alongside you
- Our wonderful boys n girls in blue who rather than tackling the above muppetry sit parked up on their sidings with the hairdryer out
- Which of course leads to the eejits dropping anchor in front of you at the last minute
- Even though they were already below the limit anyway!

:mad:

Arbiter of Good Taste

Sam Kade wrote: »

Op calm down there will always be stupid drivers on the road, no point giving yourself a heart attack over them. Just make allowances for them.

And that's why he's ranting here. It's allowed you know. Better than having a fit of road rage

131spanner

Sam Kade wrote: »

Then you have the I've a god given right to overtake everybody brigade no matter what speed they are doing. You could have someone overtaking a car doing 140kmh and some fool up his arse flashing his lights to get out of his way :rolleyes:

I was talking about the people who sit in the overtaking lane while not overtaking. If you're overtaking at 120 and I'm behind you looking to go 130 then work away and head back into the left lane when you're good and ready

paddyland

Ketron wrote: »

Trucks overtaking each other really gets me! With one going 5km/h faster than the other!

AFAIK its illegal too

Stop and think for a moment. Lorries are legally restricted to 90kph. Some are doing more than that, some a good bit less. Now let's analyse that for a moment.

If every lorry on the motorway from Dublin to Cork is doing 90kph, then there is no problem. But as soon as that 90kph lorry meets an 85kph lorry, he moves out when it is clear, and rolls past, holding a steady speed, and it only takes 5 to 10 seconds. A good driver behind can gauge this, and adjust his speed imperceptibly, meeting the rear of the overtaking lorry just as it moves in, and little time is lost. A bad driver accelerates up behind the overtaking lorry, then jams on, and sits behind it, with his full beams on, fuming. Guess who has used up more fuel?

Now if the 90kph lorry has to slow down due to a car in the outside lane, he will take much longer to overtake, due to the time it takes him to accelerate up again. What could have been a 5 to 10 second overtake, is now perhaps 30 seconds or more. It is always better to allow a rolling lorry to maintain it's momentum where possible. A good, perceptive driver will make allowances for that.

Now, supposing that 90kph lorry slows down to 85kph, and stays behind. Within three or four minutes, another 90kph lorry will arrive behind. Then another. Now we have four lorries travelling in convoy. Then the convoy of four catches up on an Eddie Stobart lorry, who is doing only 80kph. Now, the rapidity of other lorries catching up doubles, and within half an hour, or say, Mountrath to Cashel, you end up with twelve or fourteen lorries in convoy, plus buses too.

Then you meet the incline at Mitchelstown, and the heavier lorries slow down, and more lorries catch up. In the meantime, you come along in your car, doing the regulation 120kph, and there is a car in front of you, in the outside lane, doing 100kph, because that is his comfortable speed. You are now stuck in a line of cars, in the outside lane, all overtaking a long convoy of fourteen, or sixteen, or eighteen articulated lorries. What happens then, when the convoy of lorries meets grandad in his 1984 Toyota Carina doing 60kph on a busy motorway?

This has now become a hazard situation. Far too many ignorant drivers are inclined to bunch up on the motorway, out of sheer lack of concentration and awareness. It would be great if that bunching were not compounded needlessly. What you do not realise, is that by lorries overtaking each other on the motorway, despite what the law says, this hazard situation is not allowed to develop. The vast majority of lorry drivers are experienced professionals, and understand how to gauge their speeds, and overtake, using the minimum of fuel, delay and obstruction. Very few lorries will upset you by deliberately pulling out in front of you, although of course, it does happen.

The point of the law is to prevent lorries from sitting out in the outside lane of a busy motorway for miles, at 90kph, allowing enormous tailbacks to develop. That, of course would be madness. But it doesn't happen. Left to their own devices, lorry drivers know how a road flows at it's most efficient, and how to roll their loads along with as minimum of fuss as possible. They need to overtake, as they do, one at a time. Not to gain ten minutes at the end of their journey, which would be a pointless gain in the long run. But precisely to prevent the type of long convoys developing as described, which would quickly turn a very safe motorway driving experience into a hazard situation.

The letter of the law doesn't always take into account the greater picture, and while most car drivers don't need to understand the dynamics of the road to that great extent, those who legislate for road law, and those who design the roads, really do need to understand, and that is best done by spending a period of months out there actually driving the lorries and the buses, and engaging with the day-to-day realities of it.

BMJD

I had a dipped beam bulb go on me the other night. Couldn't have been arsed trying to change it in the dark so turned on the fogs to help compensate. Bite me

PS I changed it the next morning.

CiniO

paddyland wrote: »

Stop and think for a moment. Lorries are legally restricted to 90kph. Some are doing more than that, some a good bit less. Now let's analyse that for a moment.

If every lorry on the motorway from Dublin to Cork is doing 90kph, then there is no problem. But as soon as that 90kph lorry meets an 85kph lorry, he moves out when it is clear, and rolls past, holding a steady speed, and it only takes 5 to 10 seconds. A good driver behind can gauge this, and adjust his speed imperceptibly, meeting the rear of the overtaking lorry just as it moves in, and little time is lost. A bad driver accelerates up behind the overtaking lorry, then jams on, and sits behind it, with his full beams on, fuming. Guess who has used up more fuel?

Now if the 90kph lorry has to slow down due to a car in the outside lane, he will take much longer to overtake, due to the time it takes him to accelerate up again. What could have been a 5 to 10 second overtake, is now perhaps 30 seconds or more. It is always better to allow a rolling lorry to maintain it's momentum where possible. A good, perceptive driver will make allowances for that.

Now, supposing that 90kph lorry slows down to 85kph, and stays behind. Within three or four minutes, another 90kph lorry will arrive behind. Then another. Now we have four lorries travelling in convoy. Then the convoy of four catches up on an Eddie Stobart lorry, who is doing only 80kph. Now, the rapidity of other lorries catching up doubles, and within half an hour, or say, Mountrath to Cashel, you end up with twelve or fourteen lorries in convoy, plus buses too.

Then you meet the incline at Mitchelstown, and the heavier lorries slow down, and more lorries catch up. In the meantime, you come along in your car, doing the regulation 120kph, and there is a car in front of you, in the outside lane, doing 100kph, because that is his comfortable speed. You are now stuck in a line of cars, in the outside lane, all overtaking a long convoy of fourteen, or sixteen, or eighteen articulated lorries. What happens then, when the convoy of lorries meets grandad in his 1984 Toyota Carina doing 60kph on a busy motorway?

This has now become a hazard situation. Far too many ignorant drivers are inclined to bunch up on the motorway, out of sheer lack of concentration and awareness. It would be great if that bunching were not compounded needlessly. What you do not realise, is that by lorries overtaking each other on the motorway, despite what the law says, this hazard situation is not allowed to develop. The vast majority of lorry drivers are experienced professionals, and understand how to gauge their speeds, and overtake, using the minimum of fuel, delay and obstruction. Very few lorries will upset you by deliberately pulling out in front of you, although of course, it does happen.

The point of the law is to prevent lorries from sitting out in the outside lane of a busy motorway for miles, at 90kph, allowing enormous tailbacks to develop. That, of course would be madness. But it doesn't happen. Left to their own devices, lorry drivers know how a road flows at it's most efficient, and how to roll their loads along with as minimum of fuss as possible. They need to overtake, as they do, one at a time. Not to gain ten minutes at the end of their journey, which would be a pointless gain in the long run. But precisely to prevent the type of long convoys developing as described, which would quickly turn a very safe motorway driving experience into a hazard situation.

The letter of the law doesn't always take into account the greater picture, and while most car drivers don't need to understand the dynamics of the road to that great extent, those who legislate for road law, and those who design the roads, really do need to understand, and that is best done by spending a period of months out there actually driving the lorries and the buses, and engaging with the day-to-day realities of it.

Nonsense.
There is plenty other countries in EU where lorries are prohibited from overtaking on two lane motorways, and they do obey it (as this is enforced not like in Ireland), yet those dangerous convoys you are talking about doesn't turn into reality.

CiniO

GoWhest wrote: »

[*]The hard shoulder; You decide to pull out from the hard should completely ignorant to the fact Im coming at you at 120km/h. Some of you are lucky my breaks are good.

[*]The tailgater; they sit so close to you but don't overtake

Generally lots of things you listed happen on motorways everywhere (not only in Ireland).

But those two particular points I quoted I've never really seen anywhere else than in Ireland.

Hard shoulder parking on motorway (obviously with necessity to join traffic later) is real plague of Irish motorways.
I'd say majority of drivers doesn't even know it's illegal - madness.
I think I usually see more vehicles parked on motorway hardshoulder between Galway and Ballinasloe (circa 50km) then I can see on 2,000 km motorway journey through EU continent.

Tailgating happens when you drive slower.
When I do 90km/h or 100km/h on motorway, there is endless amount of drivers, who approach from behind at speed, and then slow down to tailgate me without intention to overtake.
They surely were doing greater speed as they approached. They must have slowed down, and then keep behind me - not overtake - even though motorway is clear and there is no one on overtaking lane.
Do these people forget they are on motorway. This doesn't make sense to me completely, and I can't find any reasons why they do it.

paddyland

CiniO wrote: »

Nonsense.

It's a very simple thing to scroll back through months of your posts, to get an idea of the calibre of driving experience you have. That's all I'll say.

CiniO

paddyland wrote: »

It's a very simple thing to scroll back through months of your posts, to get an idea of the calibre of driving experience you have. That's all I'll say.

What does my driving experience have to do with facts we are discussing? Can't see any relevance.

PS - you can go edit your post and correct it, as buses are not prohibited from overtaking on 2 lane motorways.

bear1

CiniO wrote: »

Nonsense.
There is plenty other countries in EU where lorries are prohibited from overtaking on two lane motorways, and they do obey it (as this is enforced not like in Ireland), and those dangerous convoys you are talking about doesn't turn into reality.

There are also plenty of countries where it isn't allowed but they do it anyway.
Certain parts of Germany they do it, From Warsaw to Berlin I've encountered it a few times and also in Italy it's a popular thing to see.
Just adding my opinion from my experiences

markpb

Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »

Saw this on the way to Cork airport once
http://goo.gl/maps/at7NL
This kind of sign perpetuates the 'slow lane, fast lane' mentality as many people are never taught 'driving lane, overtaking lane'

I think, in this one isolated instance, the sign is correct. Assuming the road is going up a steep or long hill, a second climbing lane is provided. The lane on the right is for normal traffic, the lane on the left is intended for slower traffic like trucks. The outcome might be the same (overtaking on the right) but the concept is reversed.

Edit: that's assuming it's a temporary lane and not the end of a dual carriageway. If it's the latter, the sign is retarded and the person who erected it should be beaten with wet fish.

corktina

that isn't how it is signed at all. there is no suggestion at the start of the hill that it is a climber lane. I think it's left over from the days when there was no roundabout there.

CiniO

bear1 wrote: »

There are also plenty of countries where it isn't allowed but they do it anyway.
Certain parts of Germany they do it, From Warsaw to Berlin I've encountered it a few times and also in Italy it's a popular thing to see.
Just adding my opinion from my experiences

Oh of course.
Traffic laws are being broken everywhere.
But just this "no HGVs on most right motorway lane" in Ireland is complete fiction, as probably no single HGV driver would obey it.
I've seen trucks overtaking each other with garda car driving next to them - no reaction.
Somehow in Germany on roads with no trucks overtaking signs, I haven't seen a single truck overtaking anyone.

deandean

NOPE!
According to our road safety.authority, SPEED KILLS and none of your other points matter a toss. so it is illegal to put the boot down to safely overtake in good time, etc etc etc.
So you can cause complete mayhem on the m'way, as long as you are not speeding. and any driver who undertakes, flashes etc can be pulled and fined.

pred racer

paddyland wrote: »

It's a very simple thing to scroll back through months of your posts, to get an idea of the calibre of driving experience you have. That's all I'll say.

The thing is, in this case he's right.
5-10 seconds for 2 trucks to overtake each other............my arse!
5-10 minutes maybe.

How come the inside truck never lifts off for a second? The fella doing the overtaking is obviously going as fast as he can:)

I have spent a lot of time on the motorway in the last few weeks and I have found that once you get out of Dublin (by that I mean out past where both lanes are just full) motorway driving is in general very good compared to a couple of years ago.

A couple of points I do agree with.
People pulling directly out from the hard shoulder......are they mad???
And the donkeys on the other side with their full lights on, what exactly do they think they're going to see

Damien360

paddyland wrote: »

Stop and think for a moment. Lorries are legally restricted to 90kph. Some are doing more than that, some a good bit less. Now let's analyse that for a moment.

If every lorry on the motorway from Dublin to Cork is doing 90kph, then there is no problem. But as soon as that 90kph lorry meets an 85kph lorry, he moves out when it is clear, and rolls past, holding a steady speed, and it only takes 5 to 10 seconds. A good driver behind can gauge this, and adjust his speed imperceptibly, meeting the rear of the overtaking lorry just as it moves in, and little time is lost. A bad driver accelerates up behind the overtaking lorry, then jams on, and sits behind it, with his full beams on, fuming. Guess who has used up more fuel?

Now if the 90kph lorry has to slow down due to a car in the outside lane, he will take much longer to overtake, due to the time it takes him to accelerate up again. What could have been a 5 to 10 second overtake, is now perhaps 30 seconds or more. It is always better to allow a rolling lorry to maintain it's momentum where possible. A good, perceptive driver will make allowances for that.

Now, supposing that 90kph lorry slows down to 85kph, and stays behind. Within three or four minutes, another 90kph lorry will arrive behind. Then another. Now we have four lorries travelling in convoy. Then the convoy of four catches up on an Eddie Stobart lorry, who is doing only 80kph. Now, the rapidity of other lorries catching up doubles, and within half an hour, or say, Mountrath to Cashel, you end up with twelve or fourteen lorries in convoy, plus buses too.

Then you meet the incline at Mitchelstown, and the heavier lorries slow down, and more lorries catch up. In the meantime, you come along in your car, doing the regulation 120kph, and there is a car in front of you, in the outside lane, doing 100kph, because that is his comfortable speed. You are now stuck in a line of cars, in the outside lane, all overtaking a long convoy of fourteen, or sixteen, or eighteen articulated lorries. What happens then, when the convoy of lorries meets grandad in his 1984 Toyota Carina doing 60kph on a busy motorway?

This has now become a hazard situation. Far too many ignorant drivers are inclined to bunch up on the motorway, out of sheer lack of concentration and awareness. It would be great if that bunching were not compounded needlessly. What you do not realise, is that by lorries overtaking each other on the motorway, despite what the law says, this hazard situation is not allowed to develop. The vast majority of lorry drivers are experienced professionals, and understand how to gauge their speeds, and overtake, using the minimum of fuel, delay and obstruction. Very few lorries will upset you by deliberately pulling out in front of you, although of course, it does happen.

The point of the law is to prevent lorries from sitting out in the outside lane of a busy motorway for miles, at 90kph, allowing enormous tailbacks to develop. That, of course would be madness. But it doesn't happen. Left to their own devices, lorry drivers know how a road flows at it's most efficient, and how to roll their loads along with as minimum of fuss as possible. They need to overtake, as they do, one at a time. Not to gain ten minutes at the end of their journey, which would be a pointless gain in the long run. But precisely to prevent the type of long convoys developing as described, which would quickly turn a very safe motorway driving experience into a hazard situation.

The letter of the law doesn't always take into account the greater picture, and while most car drivers don't need to understand the dynamics of the road to that great extent, those who legislate for road law, and those who design the roads, really do need to understand, and that is best done by spending a period of months out there actually driving the lorries and the buses, and engaging with the day-to-day realities of it.

Very good post but you should point out the danger is not created by the convoy itself but by drivers (like me) getting very impatient with the man crawling alongside these lorries. Once he moves aside it causes a spring like action with everyone flooring it to get back speed and time. Impatience will drive up the speed and hence the danger. I have seen it and done the same myself.

I found the Irish, Scottish and English trucks very good but the nordy truckers are dangerous and rude. They will just pull out last minute in front of a speeding car. The scots are particularly careful. Is it their road network with smaller roads to contend with further north, hense more care ?

bear1

CiniO wrote: »

Oh of course.
Traffic laws are being broken everywhere.
But just this "no HGVs on most right motorway lane" in Ireland is complete fiction, as probably no single HGV driver would obey it.
I've seen trucks overtaking each other with garda car driving next to them - no reaction.
Somehow in Germany on roads with no trucks overtaking signs, I haven't seen a single truck overtaking anyone.

In Germany I've mostly noticed it on the Berlin to Dresden route.
They just pull out without even giving a toss for the speed you are doing coming up to them.
As mentioned it takes an absolute age for them to pass the other truck and equally slower to pull back into the lane.

CiniO

bear1 wrote: »

In Germany I've mostly noticed it on the Berlin to Dresden route.
They just pull out without even giving a toss for the speed you are doing coming up to them.
As mentioned it takes an absolute age for them to pass the other truck and equally slower to pull back into the lane.

I might be wrong, but I think in Germany in general it's allowed for trucks to overtake on motorways, except in places signed with "no trucks overtaking sign".

CiniO

Damien360 wrote: »

Very good post but you should point out the danger is not created by the convoy itself but by drivers (like me) getting very impatient with the man crawling alongside these lorries.

Nearly all truck convoys I've seen always have gaps. It's never like every single truck is tailgating each other.
Whenever someone overtakes the convoy at relatively low speed, he should pull back to driving lane every so often to let faster drivers go.

That's how it works in most cases I've seen anyway.

Never had a single problem with truck convoys, so for me what paddyland says doesn't make sense.
I can't see how this could be dangerous.

Zoney

You do get plenty of poor driving even in countries that have had a lot of motorways for a lot longer.

I think the distinctively Irish problem that is reaching epidemic proportions is the broken lights - it's really very dangerous, especially on near-empty motorways at night, suddenly seeing one faint light ahead that could easily be missed. Agree about the trailers as well, even commercial lorries and so on.

born2bwild

Sam Kade wrote: »

Then you have the I've a god given right to overtake everybody brigade no matter what speed they are doing. You could have someone overtaking a car doing 140kmh and some fool up his arse flashing his lights to get out of his way :rolleyes:

It's safe to drive much faster than 140 on a motorway - you should not drive in the overtaking lane - get in and get out.

Sam Kade

born2bwild wrote: »

It's safe to drive much faster than 140 on a motorway - you should not drive in the overtaking lane - get in and get out.

Read what I wrote

paddyland

CiniO wrote: »

Nearly all truck convoys I've seen always have gaps. It's never like every single truck is tailgating each other.
Whenever someone overtakes the convoy at relatively low speed, he should pull back to driving lane every so often to let faster drivers go.

That's how it works in most cases I've seen anyway.

Never had a single problem with truck convoys, so for me what paddyland says doesn't make sense.
I can't see how this could be dangerous.

You've never had a problem, with your minimal experience and awareness, therefore it doesn't exist.

I have twenty-five years of accident free driving behind me. I done have a million and a half miles in that time, in lorries and buses, all over the UK and the continent. How old are you, and how many miles have you driven?

I am simply posting to raise people's awareness. Someone who drives to the shops and back every day, can never possibly attain the kind of experience that a million-plus miles driver has attained. They cannot possibly see or be aware of a tenth of what a professional bus or truck driver is watching out for. And it's not really fair to expect them to. Of course the lorry is holding you up, and it's a bloody nuisance. I'm simply asking you to think a little bit wider about why he might be there in front of you. You don't have to be pleased about it, just aware.

Some car drivers are genuinely interested in furthering their experience, and picking up titbits of information and experience here and there. Unfortunately, what appears to be the vast majority have no interest whatsoever, and the subtleties of road traffic flow, congestion, and their own effect on traffic around them, is of a complete irrelevance.

If you are only driving to the shops every day, then it makes no difference to you anyway. If you drive for a living though, and clock up 400-600kms a day, then it makes a big difference, a bloody big difference.

There are car drivers who have a small bit of awareness of the weight and lack of manouvreability of a heavy vehicle, and make a few small allowances for that. And then there are car drivers who do not give a damn about the heavier vehicle, and will happily obstruct a driver facing eight or nine hours of flat out driving on a speed limiter, without compunction.

You don't have to give a damn about the heavy lorry driver. Nobody is making you. But it'd be nice if you did give an extra inch to the man with the heavy clutch pedal who is sitting in the cab for eight or nine hours. Think of it as holding the door open for the guy coming through behind you, carrying a heavy box. It costs you two seconds, and you gain nothing, but you do it simply because you can, and because hopefully, you still feel some connection to your humanity.

MayoSalmon

I have driven in Morocco and have NO complaints about Irish drivers after this experience!

Sobanek

MayoSalmon wrote: »

I have driven in Morocco and have NO complaints about Irish drivers after this experience!

Fook, I'll be driving in Morocco in two months time :pac:
Any tips?

MayoSalmon

Sobanek wrote: »

Fook, I'll be driving in Morocco in two months time :pac:
Any tips?

Nobody respects the rules of the road so be prepared to see some mad **** going on.

Coastal areas (Agadir) a good bit calmer than big cities like Marrakesh and Casablanca

CiniO

paddyland wrote: »

You've never had a problem, with your minimal experience and awareness, therefore it doesn't exist.

I have twenty-five years of accident free driving behind me. I done have a million and a half miles in that time, in lorries and buses, all over the UK and the continent. How old are you, and how many miles have you driven?

I am simply posting to raise people's awareness. Someone who drives to the shops and back every day, can never possibly attain the kind of experience that a million-plus miles driver has attained. They cannot possibly see or be aware of a tenth of what a professional bus or truck driver is watching out for. And it's not really fair to expect them to. Of course the lorry is holding you up, and it's a bloody nuisance. I'm simply asking you to think a little bit wider about why he might be there in front of you. You don't have to be pleased about it, just aware.

Some car drivers are genuinely interested in furthering their experience, and picking up titbits of information and experience here and there. Unfortunately, what appears to be the vast majority have no interest whatsoever, and the subtleties of road traffic flow, congestion, and their own effect on traffic around them, is of a complete irrelevance.

If you are only driving to the shops every day, then it makes no difference to you anyway. If you drive for a living though, and clock up 400-600kms a day, then it makes a big difference, a bloody big difference.

There are car drivers who have a small bit of awareness of the weight and lack of manouvreability of a heavy vehicle, and make a few small allowances for that. And then there are car drivers who do not give a damn about the heavier vehicle, and will happily obstruct a driver facing eight or nine hours of flat out driving on a speed limiter, without compunction.

You don't have to give a damn about the heavy lorry driver. Nobody is making you. But it'd be nice if you did give an extra inch to the man with the heavy clutch pedal who is sitting in the cab for eight or nine hours. Think of it as holding the door open for the guy coming through behind you. It costs you two seconds, and you gain nothing, but you do it simply because you can, and because hopefully, you still feel some connection to your humanity.

Thanks for writing your short story about hardness of being a truck driver.

Just for your information, I'm 32, driving for last 15 years accident free.
I hold B, C, and D category licence, and drive buses professionally for last 6 years.
I've driven about 600 - 700 thousand km's in my life.
I've travelled across EU continent many times, and I've driven in most EU countries.

Surely I don't have as much experience as you, but I have enough to take part in discussion.

Now returning to previous discussion, as this post you wrote seems like a big complaint how hard is life of a truck driver so I'll skip that.

From what I understood from your previous posts, you are trying to say that trucks are overtaking each other, which is a good thing, because it prevents from truck convoys on motorways to appear. Once they did appear it would be dangerous.

What I was saying, is that trucks overtaking on 2 lane motorways is illegal here (in Ireland)
I understand reasons why they do it, but it's still illegal.
And convoys you are describing, are not dangerous as you say.
Absolutely nothing dangerous about those convoys. I've seen plenty of them and never seen anything which could be dangerous about them.

Of course it's obvious why truck drivers overtake each other. If you are stock behind someone at 88km/h and you can do 91km/h, then you are just wasting your time. If tachograph rules were enforced in Ireland it could be a difference between spending a night at home, or 15 minutes before your depo. But we all know no one is going to stop 15 minutes before a depo in Ireland just because he run out of time on tachograph.

Truck drivers overtake each other, because it's convenient for them. They break the law, which is not enforced anyway - so why not break it.

I personally have nothing against it. When I drive a car, I'd help out any truck drive to overtake, joint the main road, or whatever manouver he needs to do.

But it doesn't change a fact that overtaking on 2 lane motorways in Ireland is illegal and shouldn't be done.
Convoys you are talking about are not dangerous at all, and I'd be happy if the law was actually enforced (no overtaking).

As I said - there are countries out there where it's also illegal to overtake on 2 lane motorways, and it's really enforced.
Somehow truck drivers can live with that, and still do their work.

pablo128

pred racer wrote: »

The thing is, in this case he's right.
5-10 seconds for 2 trucks to overtake each other............my arse!
5-10 minutes maybe.

How come the inside truck never lifts off for a second? The fella doing the overtaking is obviously going as fast as he can:)

I have spent a lot of time on the motorway in the last few weeks and I have found that once you get out of Dublin (by that I mean out past where both lanes are just full) motorway driving is in general very good compared to a couple of years ago.

A couple of points I do agree with.
People pulling directly out from the hard shoulder......are they mad???
And the donkeys on the other side with their full lights on, what exactly do they think they're going to see

Some of them, like me, do lift off, only if there's a bit of a tailback behind the overtaking truck though. If it's only 1 or 2 cars, I keep it on the limiter!

Damien360

pablo128 wrote: »

Some of them, like me, do lift off, only if there's a bit of a tailback behind the overtaking truck though. If it's only 1 or 2 cars, I keep it on the limiter!

On the M1, plenty of truckers back off on the inside to let the overtaking truck pass quicker. On the M8 though, they never back off. I have been stuck behind 2 clowns for over 5 minutes as they "race" each other for a laugh. Mitchelstown to cashel seems to really attract them.