Chapeau to the A4 commissaire today.

michael196

Des Hanlon A4 race stopped today, 20K in, by the Commissaire for riders riding over the continous white line.

Pre race safety asked riders not to cross the white line on the wide N80 and the N78 back to Castlecomer.

Race stopped on the N78 after an oncoming car had to pull out to way of riders on the wrong side of the road.

3 minute stoppage applied.

slap/dash

I dont race, but big up for making rules and manners matter

doozerie

I'd agree that stopping the race was a good thing if one or more of the culprits were disqualified from the race, but to the best of my knowledge that didn't happen at all (I'd be delighted to hear that I'm mistaken in thinking that though). So all it may have achieved was to reinforce the view that you'll get away with riding like an idiot while even those that were working hard to ride within the rules bear the brunt of your action by the nature of the race being changed around them - people who were dropped get to rejoin the group today and some people moved to the front to take spaces that some people had fought hard for.

There were some ridiculous antics in A4 up to that point, with significant numbers of riders spending lots of time on the other side of the double solid white lines. There was plenty of good reason to apply the warning which had been given earlier that people doing exactly that would be disqualified, but as far as I am aware that simply didn't happen at all.

pprendeville

Agree with above, hoping in holding up a race unless culprits were disqualified. Wouldn't it be very easy just to get a phone and make a video from the commissaries car to show the riders why they were disqualified?

Were riders allowed cross a broken white line if there as no oncoming traffic or was it simply no crossing whatever the line? Can't see how you could get to the front otherwise. I suppose normal rules of the road applied?

Beasty

If the race is on a road that is not closed normal road laws apply. No going over solid white lines and if you do go ove a broken one it should be temporarily while overtaking

The big question becomes whether the 2/3 abreast rule should be applied (as race organisers /commissaires have no power to override road traffic laws):eek:

Inquitus

Beasty wrote: »

The big question becomes whether the 2/3 abreast rule should be applied (as race organisers /commissaires have no power to override road traffic laws):eek:

That would kill racing in its entirety

morana

The racing fields are so big its almost impossible to NOT go over the white line. Realistically races will need to be on a one-way circuit to ensure there are no oncoming cars. I know thats difficult but I think its the reality.

VanhireBoys

Fare play to that Commisare .. I done the Loughrea GP a few weeks ago and we were told not to cross the line..

The motorcycle marshal was parked on the right of the road because the surface was potholed - Some numpty with his head down and over the line ran into the parked motorbike ... !

Its for your own safety as we all have family and work commitments and just cant afford to get broken up

Lumen

morana wrote: »

The racing fields are so big its almost impossible to NOT go over the white line. Realistically races will need to be on a one-way circuit to ensure there are no oncoming cars. I know thats difficult but I think its the reality.

Wouldn't that just result in eight abreast?

If staying near the front but not at the front was easy, everyone would do it. Unfortunately spacetime doesn't permit it.

Morrisseeee

Have a look at this and tell me should the Commissaire stop this race ?
7 mins in and in particular 7:34 !!

godtabh

Morrisseeee wrote: »

Have a look at this and tell me should the Commissaire stop this race ?
7 mins in and in particular 7:34 !!

What ****ing idiots. That should be sent to the gardai for their own safety

Beasty

Inquitus wrote: »

That would kill racing in its entirety

To be clear there are absolutely no "arrangements" in place allowimg cyclists to ignore any road law unless roads are closed (and to date attempts to get CI fully engaged to try and get some have failed). Any racing is entirely at the discretion of the local Gardai who may choose to ignore certain breaches. That's exactly the issue being faced by both road racers and triathletes in Fingal.

(sorry but in one of my grumpier moods at this moment in time!)

Inquitus

Beasty wrote: »

To be clear there are absolutely no "arrangements" in place allowimg cyclists to ignore any road law unless roads are closed (and to date attempts to get CI fully engaged to try and get some have failed). Any racing is entirely at the discretion of the local Gardai who may choose to ignore certain breaches. That's exactly the issue being faced by both road racers and triathletes in Fingal.

(sorry but in one of my grumpier moods at this moment in time!)

That may well be the case, but Road Racing has carried on in this Grey area for decades, it may not be ok to the letter of the law, but it's ok in Practice, at least for now, if it ain't broke, don't fix it I guess........

Inquitus

godtabh wrote: »

What ****ing idiots. That should be sent to the gardai for their own safety

Agree 100% that's just high profile idiocy and it being showcased does no cyclist any favours.

De Bhál

Just to add the A3 race in Carrick was stopped last weekend for the riders to be told off. No one in particular picked out but it seemed to have the desired effect.

fat bloke

I was delighted at the start of the race that the commissaires made a point of warning against cycling on the wrong side of the road, promising disqualifications if it was spotted.
I was similarly disappointed for the next 25k to see the bunch spread out across the road at every opportunity. If we'd been on the M50 we'd have been across the three lanes of it and the hard shoulder. Riders will fill the space given regardless. They will very quickly learn to stay within the boundaries if the boundaries are defined. After the 5th or 6th disqualification I bet dollars to cents that'd be the end of it.
Not enforcing the rules just does a disservice to riders who are endeavouring to obey them and ride safely within them. It also does nothing at all to endear Joe Public to road racing. Cars coming the other way were having to stop completely and pull into the ditch, even on relatively wide straight roads.

Slo_Rida

De Bhál wrote: »

Just to add the A3 race in Carrick was stopped last weekend for the riders to be told off. No one in particular picked out but it seemed to have the desired effect.

The A4 Commin same race rolled up beside us and lit on 2 or 3 riders. One was a very young looking guy (in all red I think) and he pulled in while the Comm spoke and pulled immediately back out - for no reason - he was actually face in the wind!! The same 3 guys were out all day, mad!

bikenut74

The biggest offender in that video is the Black umbrella camera bike. At no stage did he drive on the left. It's an age old problem with cycling on the public roads, you just can't squeeze 100 plus riders to one side all of the time. I remember being stopped by the commisaire in the Junior race at the 1992 Des Hanlon (I know, a separate junior race) for exactly the same problem. But riders, motorcyclists, team cars and even commisaires need to respect that the oncoming traffic has the right of way. The only complaints to come from the public at yesterdays Des Hanlon race was being forced off the road by the support vehicles. The vast majority of motorists are happy to pull over and allow a race pass by but there are some who will refuse to even slow down knowing the law is on their side and that's when it gets dangerous. If we keep testing the patience of motorists we could end up being banned from the roads as happened in the UK before.

fixie fox

godtabh wrote: »

What ****ing idiots. That should be sent to the gardai for their own safety

I agree that is highly dangerous and should be penalised. But ... there would be some uproar if the Com stopped THAT race or disqualified one of those riders.

ragazzo

fixie fox wrote: »

I agree that is highly dangerous and should be penalised. But ... there would be some uproar if the Com stopped THAT race or disqualified one of those riders.

The time for uproar has arrived. Small groups of 6/7 riders have even less reason to act the clown than larger groups.

All the ****e talk about taking opportunities and attacking the opposition in order to get the win means nothing in the greater scheme of things.

If two of those riders had been disqualified it would teach the lesson far quicker than picking an easy target in A4/3 to stop and lecture.
Chi ha le palle?

ytareh

Some of the posters here clearly have no concept of what a 'race' entails .What next ?Enforce speed limits!?

Lumen

ytareh wrote: »

Some of the posters here clearly have no concept of what a 'race' entails .What next ?Enforce speed limits!?

Speed limits do not apply to bicycles, regardless of whether they're racing or not.

Raam

I watched that vid and didn't think the transgressions were all that bad.

ragazzo

ytareh wrote: »

Some of the posters here clearly have no concept of what a 'race' entails .What next ?Enforce speed limits!?

Very aware of what a race does and does not entail. Certain things happen in race situations and I fully accept that. Riders need to be aware of life after the race, image, future, safety and the motorbike with a camera youtubing your every move.
Commonsense is something we should all attempt to utilise.

morana

Raam wrote: »

I watched that vid and didn't think the transgressions were all that bad.

Oh I would disagree. Continuous white line on a bend...suicide!!!

@Lumen I dont think it would be 8 abreast just give you more scope to attack from the bunch.Sure what riders like to get the fresh air on their faces....very few!

doozerie

ytareh wrote: »

Some of the posters here clearly have no concept of what a 'race' entails .

What does a 'race' entail then? Playing chicken by riding on a collision course with visible oncoming traffic? Riding into blind bends on the wrong side of the road in the blind hope that nothing is coming the other way? When oncoming cars have the audacity to not veer into the ditch to get out of your way, then throwing yourself back into the bunch in the expectation that space will magically and safely open up for you, and sure if a few people are taken down in the bunch as people scramble to create space then what harm as long as you are safe?

That version of 'racing' sounds a lot like reckless endangerment, but there are A4/A3/A2/A1 points at stake, dammit, so that's okay, right?

ytareh

The video showed a small breakaway group of riders not a huge peloton .The bend wasn't THAT blind .We didn't see it from same angle as rider/s .The car was slowing down and the two lads pulled in well before there was any risk of collision .
Seriously I was a nervous enough rider in my day but if this is what passes for terror on the roads ("The time for uproar has arrived"...)I can't imagine what's going through your heads stuck in the middle of a 150 'man' bunch snaking round some slippery boreen.
Lead car could have been a bit further ahead maybe .Posters suggesting sending video to GARDAI need to get a life big time !

ragazzo

ytareh wrote: »

The video showed a small breakaway group of riders not a huge peloton .The bend wasn't THAT blind .We didn't see it from same angle as rider/s .The car was slowing down and the two lads pulled in well before there was any risk of collision .
Seriously I was a nervous enough rider in my day but if this is what passes for terror on the roads ("The time for uproar has arrived"...)I can't imagine what's going through your heads stuck in the middle of a 150 'man' bunch snaking round some slippery boreen.
Lead car could have been a bit further ahead maybe .Posters suggesting sending video to GARDAI need to get a life big time !

'The time for uproar has arrived' was in reference to the reaction expected when some rider is suspended for his actions. Terror on the road is your own insight.

Back in your day there were different conditions and the general public were probably sport lovers and accepting of the spectacle.

Times are changing, unfortunately.

I have to agree with your last comment. Lots of people need to get a life.

letape

There were the exact same issues when I was racing as a junior (and that's not today or yesterday).

I remember a race going up the beehive climb being stopped after the same warnings being given - so I reckon we'll be having these same discussions in 20 years.

Although on that particular day the commissaire did single out riders he had seen consistently crossing the white line and they were warned that they'd be disqualified if they didn't heed the warnings.

killalanerr

Some super aggressive riding,just saying :rolleyes:

J Madone

Why oh why must this ammunition be put on a public forum? Agree with some of what's said, this chat will only be used against the general body of racing cyclists rather than the offenders, doesnt take much to find all these transgressions on boards. There is a time and a place for these sentiments, this is not the place