Knee injury - which shoes? How much rest?

GLet

Hi all, hoping you can help.

I'm building up to training for a marathon at the end of September. I'm running 3-5 miles 3 times per week. I have a some knee pain after I run. Outside left knee. This has particularly happened after longer or faster runs.

I've been to a physio. He suspects it's my IT band and probably also my abductor (muscle) that's hurting. He thinks the cause is supination. My right foot supinates more than my left. Though it's my left knee that hurts.

He has suggested, having worked on my leg, I get alternative trainers, and get back out running and said I should be good for the marathon with some massage every so often.

I'm using Asics gt2000s. Stability shoes.

I've also visited the reputable running shop I got the shoes from. Their advice was to keep the trainers I have, rest for weeks, and that I'm cutting it very fine for the marathon.

I don't know what to do! Any advice?

G

rom

Not medical advise but running 15 miles a week on a pair of runners is not much that you need to alternate them. Physio advise is get another physio. "He suspects" , "He thinks" etc are all a bad signs. Look for a physio that is also a runner and you will get the proper advise. State where you are located and someone can give the name of someone to visit.

GLet

Hi Rom

Thanks for the advice. I probably put it wrong when I said he 'thinks/suspects'...He seems certain. I'm in Cork. I work on south side, live northside, so it wouldnt matter where really.

G

Peppershaken

I would be looking at seeing a Podiatrist, one who is known in the athletic community and taking your shoes along with you.

GLet

Great Thanks

Peppershaken

bambergbike

I also supinate a bit and was told when I bought running shoes in proper running shoes shop (whether rightly or wrongly, I can't judge) that I should avoid stability shoes like the plague as they provide "stability" by stopping people from over-pronating, which is fine for over-pronators but counter-productive if you are differently instable.

Treadmill analysis led me to pair of Adidas Kandidia tr5 but that result was based on half a dozen factors that are probably of zero relevance to you now - I was gearing up for a mountain race in snow and muck at the time, I'm a forefoot or midfoot striker, they suited my budget, and I was easily persuaded to buy them because I was already happily wearing a pair of Adidas Kanadia tr2 at the time (that I had picked out myself with no guidance in a generic sports shop, and that I am starting to use a lot again now that the snow and muck has receded.)

Apart from shoes, I have been actively working on improving the stability of my feet and ankles (old ankle injuries) and I think it has helped somewhat. I haven't done strengthening exercises as such, but I have been working a bit on my balance (standing barefoot on one leg on fairly softish surfaces, yoga poses like tree, eagle and warrior 3.) Yoga works for me because I enjoy it and am more likely to do it that a set of exercises given to me by a physio. Which might be more effective, but only if I actually followed the instructions.

groovyg

Running 15 miles a week is not a huge amount when you consider you are going to be doing that number of miles for some of your long slow runs when building for the marathon.

When I was training for a marathon a few years ago I developed IT band problems at the end of my training. I thought it would be ok but ended up pulling out at the 4 miles mark on the day.

I had to take about 10 weeks off and the physio had me doing loads of glute and leg strengthing exercises and I wasn't allowed to run so I'm not sure if you should be running if you have this injury. Maybe get a second opinion from another physio otherwise you could be going around in circles.

viperlogic

previously had IT band issues but keep them at bay now with regular rolling, painful but it works

GLet

bambergbike wrote: »

I also supinate a bit and was told when I bought running shoes in proper running shoes shop (whether rightly or wrongly, I can't judge) that I should avoid stability shoes like the plague as they provide "stability" by stopping people from over-pronating, which is fine for over-pronators but counter-productive if you are differently instable.

Treadmill analysis led me to pair of Adidas Kandidia tr5 but that result was based on half a dozen factors that are probably of zero relevance to you now - I was gearing up for a mountain race in snow and muck at the time, I'm a forefoot or midfoot striker, they suited my budget, and I was easily persuaded to buy them because I was already happily wearing a pair of Adidas Kanadia tr2 at the time (that I had picked out myself with no guidance in a generic sports shop, and that I am starting to use a lot again now that the snow and muck has receded.)

Apart from shoes, I have been actively working on improving the stability of my feet and ankles (old ankle injuries) and I think it has helped somewhat. I haven't done strengthening exercises as such, but I have been working a bit on my balance (standing barefoot on one leg on fairly softish surfaces, yoga poses like tree, eagle and warrior 3.) Yoga works for me because I enjoy it and am more likely to do it that a set of exercises given to me by a physio. Which might be more effective, but only if I actually followed the instructions.

Thanks a lot, that's interesting as I have the stability shoes, and looked up another running shop website that said the same, don't use stability shoes...

Slowly I'm finding out that how I run, and balance is important so ya, thanks, and I may do some knee exercises to strengthen muscle. Thanks for the advice.

GLet

groovyg wrote: »

Running 15 miles a week is not a huge amount when you consider you are going to be doing that number of miles for some of your long slow runs when building for the marathon.

When I was training for a marathon a few years ago I developed IT band problems at the end of my training. I thought it would be ok but ended up pulling out at the 4 miles mark on the day.

I had to take about 10 weeks off and the physio had me doing loads of glute and leg strengthing exercises and I wasn't allowed to run so I'm not sure if you should be running if you have this injury. Maybe get a second opinion from another physio otherwise you could be going around in circles.

I agree. What happened to you, is exactly what happened to me 10 years ago.

I'm going to get a second opinion, take time off for now, swim, build some muscle around my knee, look at how I run, and maybe look at trainers too.

Thanks for the advice.

GLet

viperlogic wrote: »

previously had IT band issues but keep them at bay now with regular rolling, painful but it works

Thanks. Are you running a lot? I've never used the rollers. How often would you use them?

GLet

Guys, by the way, anyone heard of people alternating running shoes between stability and neutral?

GLet

bambergbike wrote: »

I also supinate a bit and was told when I bought running shoes in proper running shoes shop (whether rightly or wrongly, I can't judge) that I should avoid stability shoes like the plague as they provide "stability" by stopping people from over-pronating, which is fine for over-pronators but counter-productive if you are differently instable.

Treadmill analysis led me to pair of Adidas Kandidia tr5 but that result was based on half a dozen factors that are probably of zero relevance to you now - I was gearing up for a mountain race in snow and muck at the time, I'm a forefoot or midfoot striker, they suited my budget, and I was easily persuaded to buy them because I was already happily wearing a pair of Adidas Kanadia tr2 at the time (that I had picked out myself with no guidance in a generic sports shop, and that I am starting to use a lot again now that the snow and muck has receded.)

Apart from shoes, I have been actively working on improving the stability of my feet and ankles (old ankle injuries) and I think it has helped somewhat. I haven't done strengthening exercises as such, but I have been working a bit on my balance (standing barefoot on one leg on fairly softish surfaces, yoga poses like tree, eagle and warrior 3.) Yoga works for me because I enjoy it and am more likely to do it that a set of exercises given to me by a physio. Which might be more effective, but only if I actually followed the instructions.

I know you said you were easily persuaded but would you recommend the treadmill analysis?

viperlogic

GLet wrote: »

Thanks. Are you running a lot? I've never used the rollers. How often would you use them?

4-5 times a week. I try and roll at least twice. Do it watching tv. I use the trigger point grid, much better than the normal blue foam rollers.

As above, I do leg exercises also, such as stand one on foot with eyes closed, or on one foot and bend down to pick up something.

Another is to get your bio-mechanics checked, you may have fallen or flat arches that is having an effect all the way up, many with back pain found it was there arches or even one leg slightly longer than the other.

GLet

viperlogic wrote: »

4-5 times a week. I try and roll at least twice. Do it watching tv. I use the trigger point grid, much better than the normal blue foam rollers.

As above, I do leg exercises also, such as stand one on foot with eyes closed, or on one foot and bend down to pick up something.

Another is to get your bio-mechanics checked, you may have fallen or flat arches that is having an effect all the way up, many with back pain found it was there arches or even one leg slightly longer than the other.

Might look into a roller and try the exercises. My arches are high, the right higher than the left, and ive one leg about 1 cm shorter, which seems to be part of the problem.

bambergbike

GLet wrote: »

I know you said you were easily persuaded but would you recommend the treadmill analysis?

I suppose that boils down to two questions:

Do you trust the people?
Do you trust the process?

How much I trust people would depend on whether they come across as competent and unbiased. A good salesman will have an interest in selling me stuff that works for me and retaining me as a future customer.

The process depends for accuracy on people running on the treadmill the same way as they normally run. Not everybody does. The woman who measured me up asked quite suspiciously if I always ran like that or if that was just my "treadmill style."

And some processes are much more thorough than others. The people in my shoe shop were really only filming my heels, not looking at what my gait looks like from the front or the side, or measuring pressure, or looking at my old shoes for wear. The set-up was superficial enough, and if it had generated results that were very different from my prior expectations I would have wanted to be given good reasons why. Which I then might or might not have been convinced by, depending...