Build Regs with Garage Extension

Oraange

All,

Looking at buying a house a 3 bed semi that already has a garage converted. Just wondering if the converted garage counts towards the buildings regs as it was part of the original house structure?
Would like to have a bigger house but not sure to proceed or just buy a bigger one in the first place??

Therefore does converted garage count towards the 40sm if it was part of original house??

Thanks

oraange

DOCARCH

I presume you mean new building control regulations?

I too would love to have answer to this one!!! Going through a similar process at the moment.

Dealing with a house at the moment that had an existing converted Garage (approx. 15m.sq.) and we have planning permission for a 35 m.sq. extension the encompasses the existing converted Garage (i.e. extends out from the existing Garage and a first floor extension over the existing Garage).

The existing Garage was original to the house and was converted in the past as an exempt development.

So...not clear if new building control regulastions apply?

kkelliher

I had a recent application for a garage conversion and extension and they did include the garage in the 40m2 as it is a change of use. Client was hit with contribution for the full area of the extension and garage

Poor Uncle Tom

kkelliher wrote: »

I had a recent application for a garage conversion and extension and they did include the garage in the 40m2 as it is a change of use. Client was hit with contribution for the full area of the extension and garage

I'm sure the contributions are levied under the Planning & Development Regulations, the OP is questioning the inclusion under the Building Control Act, which is not the same, and I too would like to know if it should be included.

kkelliher

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

I'm sure the contributions are levied under the Planning & Development Regulations, the OP is questioning the inclusion under the Building Control Act, which is not the same, and I too would like to know if it should be included.

Sorry to be clear they said it does require planning as it is a change of use so depending on the overall size of the development will depend on its inclusion or not in the building control act. In our case it did as the overall development was over 40m2. The original garage was not part of the original house as it did not have planning for use as part of the living space.

Oraange

Thanks All

So if I'm correct in what is been said, as the garage was not part of original living part of the house it is deemed to be an extension irrespective of when it was done and will be included as part of the size for building regs.

Therefore if garage is say 10sm there is only 30sm to play with?

Is this both for planning and building regs??

Is there any clear guidance on this anywhere? From what I have read elsewhere it just says 40sm extension for building but doesn't really say anything about extensions already done?

Sorry also if the extension/garage conversion has been done already does this make any difference?

Thanks

DOCARCH

Oraange wrote: »

Is there any clear guidance on this anywhere? From what I have read elsewhere it just says 40sm extension for building but doesn't really say anything about extensions already done?

I know exactly where you are coming from on this, the posts above (IMHO) are not really answers to your query (or mine)...I say that with all due respect to the posters.

...and no, there is no clear guidance on this in relation to this and SI 9...all the legislation says is that you are exempt from Si 9 if you extend 40 m.sq. or less.

This is vague and open to many interpretations.

And before somebody suggests asking the Building Control Authority...I have and I am not getting any answers!

@ Orrange, just to be clear, I assume you are talking about an existing house, that had an existing Garage structure (built original to the house) that was in the past converted.

Oraange

DOCARCH wrote: »

I know exactly where you are coming from on this, the posts above (IMHO) are not really answers to your query (or mine)...I say that with all due respect to the posters.

...and no, there is no clear guidance on this in relation to this and SI 9...all the legislation says is that you are exempt from Si 9 if you extend 40 m.sq. or less.

This is vague and open to many interpretations.

And before somebody suggests asking the Building Control Authority...I have and I am not getting any answers!

@ Orrange, just to be clear, I assume you are talking about an existing house, that had an existing Garage structure (built original to the house) that was in the past converted.

Yes the house we are looking at has the garage converted (by a while looking at it, didn't ask how long or if there was planning already), and it has potential to go out the back and on top of garage. But think that would bring over the 40 if the original converted garage was to be included as well. Might have to keep looking!!

Gumbo

DOCARCH wrote: »

I presume you mean new building control regulations?

I too would love to have answer to this one!!! Going through a similar process at the moment.

Dealing with a house at the moment that had an existing converted Garage (approx. 15m.sq.) and we have planning permission for a 35 m.sq. extension the encompasses the existing converted Garage (i.e. extends out from the existing Garage and a first floor extension over the existing Garage).

The existing Garage was original to the house and was converted in the past as an exempt development.

So...not clear if new building control regulastions apply?

Considering you have planning for a 35m2 extension, your CN would only state the info relating to the 35m2 so therefore short CN form and not SI9 if I'm reading your post right.

Planning and BC are separate so once you get through planning for the 35m2 then that's all the info BCA gets.

mickdw

I think possibly the question the op was asking is being over complicated here. I have a feeling they were only referring to the planning situation in relation to planning exemptions.

Oraange

mickdw wrote: »

I think possibly the question the op was asking is being over complicated here. I have a feeling they were only referring to the planning situation in relation to planning exemptions.

No question is in relation to build regs pretty much take it that Planning would be required if u build on top of garage but what about if the regs apply or not?

BryanF

Oraange wrote: »

No question is in relation to build regs pretty much take it that Planning would be required if u build on top of garage but what about if the regs apply or not?

Yes garage converted to habitable accommodation requires planning and the area must be factored into 40msq exemption area. But the planning exemption area of 40msq (under certain conditions) is only an exemption, applying for planning is not the end of the world:) Once you've selected the hour you want, why not involve an architect/ planning consultant for opinion on whether planning is appropriate/ possible.

DOCARCH

BryanF wrote: »

Yes garage converted to habitable accommodation requires planning and the area must be factored into 40msq exemption area. But the planning exemption area of 40msq (under certain conditions) is only an exemption, applying for planning is not the end of the world:) Once you've selected the hour you want, why not involve an architect/ planning consultant for opinion on whether planning is appropriate/ possible.

Lets not take off topic!

An existing Garage (that was original to the house)...say, 15 m.sq...previously converted (i.e. coverted to living accomodation in the past).

You now apply for and get planning permission to extend to the side of the existing converted Garage and over the existing converted Garage, say 35 m.sq....no planning issue, as you have applied for and recieved planning permission for your 35 m.sq. extension...but...does SI 9 apply?

On the face of it and what it says in the legislation, no...but what it says in the legislation is vague...it says, SI 9 is exempt for 'an extension to a dwelling involving a total floor area greater than 40 square metres'.

Now that is quite vague...what does it really mean, or am I reading too much into it???

sydthebeat

DOCARCH wrote: »

Lets not take off topic!

An existing Garage (that was original to the house)...say, 15 m.sq...previously converted (i.e. coverted to living accomodation in the past).

You now apply for and get planning permission to extend to the side of the existing converted Garage and over the existing converted Garage, say 35 m.sq....no planning issue, as you have applied for and recieved planning permission for your 35 m.sq. extension...but...does SI 9 apply?

On the face of it and what it says in the legislation, no...but what it says in the legislation is vague...it says, SI 9 is exempt for 'an extension to a dwelling involving a total floor area greater than 40 square metres'.

Now that is quite vague...what does it really mean, or am I reading too much into it???

If your extension is 35 sq m then i would say no, SI9 doesn't apply. Cant really see any argument to suggest it would.

Anything that happened pre 1st march is void from inclusion surely.

4Sticks

DOCARCH wrote: »

On the face of it and what it says in the legislation, no...but what it says in the legislation is vague...it says, SI 9 is exempt for 'an extension to a dwelling involving a total floor area greater than 40 square metres'.

Now that is quite vague...what does it really mean, or am I reading too much into it???

I think you are. In deciding whether SI 9 applies you look at the building as it exists today - you look at the proposed works and ask

1. do the works require a Fire Safety Certificate
2. if the building is a house then are works extending the building by more than 40m2

If the answer is no in both cases then the 2009 CN applies.

I have been informed by a BCO that if you are in the DCC area then then an attic conversion IS considered an extension.

Oraange

BryanF wrote: »

Yes garage converted to habitable accommodation requires planning and the area must be factored into 40msq exemption area. But the planning exemption area of 40msq (under certain conditions) is only an exemption, applying for planning is not the end of the world:) Once you've selected the hour you want, why not involve an architect/ planning consultant for opinion on whether planning is appropriate/ possible.

Thanks

The garage is already converted, what I want to know is does the already converted garage have to be included in the area size counting towards the 40sm for the build regs?

So if garage is say 10sm does that mean I would have only 30sm additional or upto the 40sm to be able to add as an extension before the build regs would apply?

Thanks

Edit;
Sorry posted after seeing page 1 only!!
Guess I'm asking same as Docarch above

sydthebeat

Oraange wrote: »

Thanks

The garage is already converted, what I want to know is does the already converted garage have to be included in the area size counting towards the 40sm for the build regs?

So if garage is say 10sm does that mean I would have only 30sm additional or upto the 40sm to be able to add as an extension before the build regs would apply?

Thanks

Building regs always apply.

Are you referring to SI9 building control regs? If so, once the conversion happened before 1st March then, in my opinion, your fine

kkelliher

sydthebeat wrote: »

Building regs always apply.

Are you referring to SI9 building control regs? If so, once the conversion happened before 1st March then, in my opinion, your fine

I would agree

I think there are very different questions here.

Yes the garage is part of 40m2 exception so if you wish to extend you have to keep it in mind

Yes its part of the 40m2 when it comes to contributions

No its not part of the new building control as it is not part of the work being carried out under the future commencement notice in the case of the op

descol

Just looking at this thread this morning - as I am trying to determine if a detached vehicle garage requires compliance with the BUILDING REGULATIONS - I have noted in the UK - it seems to suggest that a structure under 15sqm normally does not - anyone got clarification on the situation here in Ireland ?

sydthebeat

descol wrote: »

Just looking at this thread this morning - as I am trying to determine if a detached vehicle garage requires compliance with the BUILDING REGULATIONS - I have noted in the UK - it seems to suggest that a structure under 15sqm normally does not - anyone got clarification on the situation here in Ireland ?

SI 497/1997

Once is under 25sq m, detached, and standard height, it can be exempt.

Have a look at the SI for the exact conditions.

descol

thanks Syd

Sean123456789

Hi Everyone

Respecting certain parameters, you can build a garage of less than 25 sq m without planning permission; and you can build an extension of less than 40 sq m without planning permission. But can you do both? I assume you can, but don't want to go ahead without checking. Any information would be much appreciated

mickdw

Yes you can build detached shed and the house extension without planning but both subject to a number of strict rules in order to be exempt.

Be careful re measuring area of extension and also be aware that the 40 sqm is including any previous extensions even those that have planning.