Commuter racing etiquette

equivariant

So I am getting into this whole commuter racing vibe. Yesterday, given the glorious weather, I decide to take a long cut home on a route that I rarely use. After a couple of miles, this guy in full lycra (like myself) blows past me as I am enjoying the scenery. Well I'm not having that, so I drop down and after much puffing I manage to catch him and get in his draft. I draft him for a few miles and then go past him just as we reach the next town where I am turning off. Is this bad form/does anyone care? What is the etiquette about drafting in commute racing?

(I don't (non commte) race at all - just a mamil commuter)

godtabh

Sounds petty. Why would you bother?

seamus

Yes, that's poor etiquette whether you're racing or just out on a spin. You should take your turn at the front unless you're clearly struggling to keep up. Drafting until your turn off is just rude.

Not really the same thing in the city though since it's just sprinting between lights, but if your commute has long stretches without stopping, I'd definitely encourage taking your place at the front.

shamwari

godtabh wrote: »

Sounds petty. Why would you bother?

Good exercise for a start!

Lumen

godtabh wrote: »

Sounds petty. Why would you bother?

buffalo

godtabh wrote: »

Sounds petty. Why would you bother?

Sounds like somebody lost a commuter race this morning!

lennymc

The problem I have with strangers drafting me is that if I have to stop suddenly, they stand a much bigger chance of crashing into me and damaging my bike or injuring me. Strangers drafting when commuting really annoys the hell out of me. If you want to draft get a race licence.

Not having a go, just my opinion. Anyway, not drafting will make you a much stronger cyclist who wont be afraid of a bit of wind.

equivariant

godtabh wrote: »

Sounds petty. Why would you bother?

Cos I am a petty individual. Could you not tell when you saw the words "commuter racing"?

Chips Lovell

I'd never sit on a stranger's wheel. You've no idea if they're a competent bike handler and, more importantly, they may not realise you're there. If you want to draft or take turns on the front, roll up beside him and ask.

I had some fella suddenly swerve by me and almost hit the back of a car the other night because he was drafting me and I stopped.

equivariant

seamus wrote: »

Yes, that's poor etiquette whether you're racing or just out on a spin. You should take your turn at the front unless you're clearly struggling to keep up. Drafting until your turn off is just rude.

Not really the same thing in the city though since it's just sprinting between lights, but if your commute has long stretches without stopping, I'd definitely encourage taking your place at the front.

Fair enough - the b*****d was just too fast though!

browsing

some people hate commute racing but I think it's a bit of craic. I'd have thought it bad form to draft and then blow past at speed only turn off immediately. (not that it's disrespectful but it just defeats the purpose). I think the whole point is a pissing contest to find out who's the big dog. usually if I'm overtaken (rare occurrence.....) I'll draft for a bit if they can manage a good pace. if they start to slow down past my original pace I go by them and maintain a decent pace. the whole point I think is to pretend you're not giving it socks but actually are, with the key being not to slow down once you go by somebody. if you do that you've lost...! that's how I see it. I think if you go by somebody you have to put them under pressure for a while in order to 'win'?!? it can be a bit of fun anyway but I think some people don't like being drafted or 'raced'

godtabh

buffalo wrote: »

Sounds like somebody lost a commuter race this morning!

Commuters don't get up early enough for me.

Raam

I don't mind if someone drafts. If you sense someone there, etiquette dictates that you gradually up the pace bit by bit until you are absolutely drilling it but you must ensure that it looks like you are not putting in any effort. Either they drop off completely, or you explode in your attempt, in which case you ease over so they can take their turn.

equivariant

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

I'd never sit on a stranger's wheel. You've no idea if they're a competent bike handler and, more importantly, they may not realise you're there. If you want to draft or take turns on the front, roll up beside him and ask.

I had some fella suddenly swerve by me and almost hit the back of a car the other night because he was drafting me and I stopped.

Fair point - I should have asked. In my defence, it was on the hard shoulder of a stretch of open road, so sudden stops were unlikely. But I take your point and I will ask in future situations like that.

On the other hand, if a stranger did ask you to draft, would you say yes?

Dermot Illogical

The correct procedure is to sit 3-4 bike lengths behind and off to the right hand side, so you can't be accused of drafting. Let him hear your freewheel as often as possible. Watch as he wastes huge amount of effort staying ahead and then hit a big gear and shoot past when he looks to have tired. It's important that the speed of the overtake prevents him getting your wheel.

Chips Lovell

equivariant wrote: »

On the other hand, if a stranger did ask you to draft, would you say yes?

Usually I do, yes. As long as I know they're there and they're not interfering with my spin, I don't mind. But I do like to be asked first.

van_beano

equivariant wrote: »

So I am getting into this whole commuter racing vibe. Yesterday, given the glorious weather, I decide to take a long cut home on a route that I rarely use. After a couple of miles, this guy in full lycra (like myself) blows past me as I am enjoying the scenery. Well I'm not having that, so I drop down and after much puffing I manage to catch him and get in his draft. I draft him for a few miles and then go past him just as we reach the next town where I am turning off. Is this bad form/does anyone care? What is the etiquette about drafting in commute racing?

(I don't (non commte) race at all - just a mamil commuter)

I experienced something similar, this fella really put the effort in and overtook me then decided to slow down in front of me and pretty much cycled at the same speed. I drafted him for about 6 miles in a horrid westerly wind against us. His legs gave him close to home and I just went passed him, fresh as a daisy. I wasn't been smart or ignorant or anything but if he felt he could take the front and at a good speed only to slow down in front of me sure it would have been rude of me not to use him as a wind breaker. I go by the etiquette that if I am overtaken by a better cyclist I don't try and overtake at lights etc if I know I can't keep up to their pace, it's good manners.

equivariant

Dermot Illogical wrote: »

The correct procedure is to sit 3-4 bike lengths behind and off to the right hand side, so you can't be accused of drafting. Let him hear your freewheel as often as possible. Watch as he wastes huge amount of effort staying ahead and then hit a big gear and shoot past when he looks to have tired. It's important that the speed of the overtake prevents him getting your wheel.

Perfect - this is the strategy I was looking for:)

Lumen

I don't mind drafting as long as the person takes a turn. When they do I'll decide if I trust their bike handling enough to continue.

If not I'll drop back or nail it. Sometimes this results in utter humiliation as I fail to drop them, at which point I just fake a mechanical. :pac:

On one recent occasion I was being loosely drafted along the south quays at something like 50kph and got pleasantly heckled from behind for not going fast enough. Must have been a Lucan rider.

lennymc

Raam wrote: »

I don't mind if someone drafts. If you sense someone there, etiquette dictates that you gradually up the pace bit by bit until you are absolutely drilling it but you must ensure that it looks like you are not putting in any effort. Either they drop off completely, or you explode in your attempt, in which case you ease over so they can take their turn.

I would agree, unless its in traffic where you may have to stop suddenly.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

On the way home from work last year a dude on his racer was drafting behind me, much too close. A car pulled out in front of us, I seen it and broke hard to avoid running into the side of the car, dude doesn't see this, doesn't break and runs into the back of me and ends up in a heap on the ground. He's angry, I point out to him the car and his anger subsides, after realising this he says sorry and we head off. That situation could have ended quite differently.

Drafting is stupid unless you are out for a spin. Don't do it.

Wishbone Ash

I don't mind it either and consider it a sort of compliment. I don't understand those concerned about taking turns as I'd be going anyway regardless of whether solo or being drafted. It also offers some opportunity for fun when you increase the speed slightly (especially with overly optimistic MTB'ers).

A chap drafted me from Malahide to Sutton Cross recently (into a headwind) and then passed me like some kind of hero as I slowed for an amber light at Sutton Cross. After his headstart I reeled him in on the ascent. :cool:

Bloggsie

Just ask the guy/gal in front can you hang off them for a while if you are struggling on a spin, its just good manners plus it wont scare the sh1te out of the one in front if they turn around and theres a sweaty out of breath person hanging on their back wheel.
When recovered take a shot in front, says thanks & go your seperate ways.

The Novacastrian

I commute daily, what I hate about being close to other commuters back wheels is....the 'Golly', as we used to call it. Some guys cough up the most disgusting stuff and just it spit out - sometimes you get the full load but mostly just the spray. I normally cycle on past saying 'thanks mate, look before you spit!'

Idleater

Lumen wrote: »

Must have been a Lucan rider.

And I was going to say that Lucan people love people like the Op to practice halfwheeling on. Since the racing season has started there's plenty of opportunities to chase down teammates for real but halfwheeling is in limited supply until the beginners spins in September.

kumate_champ07

if youre drafting youre just not fast enough, the only etiquette is to stop at red lights and never acknowledged your opponents.
bonus points for being able to catch your breath at the red lights before they pull up beside you as you sit there looking relaxed

Craig06

I like to see them in the distance, hunt them down. Allow them to sit on and gradually increase the pace until somebody blows. Dropped quite a few people on the long stretches from work to home. It's great fun.

del_boy13

browsing wrote: »

some people hate commute racing but I think it's a bit of craic. I'd have thought it bad form to draft and then blow past at speed only turn off immediately. (not that it's disrespectful but it just defeats the purpose). I think the whole point is a pissing contest to find out who's the big dog. usually if I'm overtaken (rare occurrence.....) I'll draft for a bit if they can manage a good pace. if they start to slow down past my original pace I go by them and maintain a decent pace. the whole point I think is to pretend you're not giving it socks but actually are, with the key being not to slow down once you go by somebody. if you do that you've lost...! that's how I see it. I think if you go by somebody you have to put them under pressure for a while in order to 'win'?!? it can be a bit of fun anyway but I think some people don't like being drafted or 'raced'

I fully agree with the above draft a bit and then get on the front and push on just a little; the whole idea is too make it look easy while you are slowly (or quickly) dying inside.

PS It can make a boring everyday commute a bit more fun

eeeee

God I hate being the subject of these things. I am not even that fast but it happens to me a good bit on the n11 for some reason. I have never raced so don't get the drafting thing, if you are faster you go in front, if they are faster you stay the fúck behind at a decent distance so I don't go into the back of them if they brake. I just get really really annoyed when I can hear someone wheezing up behind me, burst out by me, then slow right down a few 100m's after. Boils my blood! I am not fast enough to be embroiled in 'proper' commuter racing I think though, I am not a high scoring victim!

ETA Although saying that I do enjoy picking people off from the distance and flying by (safely). I would never push out of my rhythm to do it though, and never if they're faster. Does it count as commuter racing if you never see them again?

Darkglasses

For me the commute is a time trial. You can race but you can't draft.

rollingscone

Reminds me about the mtb'er that sailed past me at the start of my spin. I resolved that I was too out of shape to get competitive so I just kept at my previous pace.

Lo and behold after another minute or two I was past him again.

He did a good job of hiding how limited his supply was when he passed first time though.

Beasty

Darkglasses wrote: »

For me the commute is a time trial. You can race but you can't draft.

Except tractors - you can always draft them. Just need to ensure the time is marked with an asterix (unless on Strava where pretty much anything seems to go)

godtabh

gadetra wrote: »

God I hate being the subject of these things. I am not even that fast but it happens to me a good bit on the n11 for some reason. I have never raced so don't get the drafting thing, if you are faster you go in front, if they are faster you stay the fúck behind at a decent distance so I don't go into the back of them if they brake. I just get really really annoyed when I can hear someone wheezing up behind me, burst out by me, then slow right down a few 100m's after. Boils my blood! I am not fast enough to be embroiled in 'proper' commuter racing I think though, I am not a high scoring victim!

ETA Although saying that I do enjoy picking people off from the distance and flying by (safely). I would never push out of my rhythm to do it though, and never if they're faster. Does it count as commuter racing if you never see them again?

Drafting saves energy. Upto 30% I believe

Beasty

godtabh wrote: »

Drafting saves energy. Upto 30% I believe

They reckon that on the track no 2 rider can save 30% or so, but no 3 and further back can save 45%+ through drafting

eeeee

Yeah was down in Sundrive again today and can anecdotally confirm the above facts! (well it felt like it anyway!). Still don't think I'd get that close to someone out on the road though, with the sudden stopping and stuff flying out in front of them. Or maybe I just need to grow a pair :eek:

Beasty

gadetra wrote: »

Yeah was down in Sundrive again today and can anecdotally confirm the above facts! (well it felt like it anyway!). Still don't think I'd get that close to someone out on the road though, with the sudden stopping and stuff flying out in front of them. Or maybe I just need to grow a pair :eek:

If you are confident about the person in front you can get very close on the track. There have been times when I've been comfortable an inch or less behind the back wheel of the rider in front indoors in Manchester. That's when everyone is focussed on line-lapping and I'll never get that close unless I'm rider no 2 (in my experience there are too many variables to risk getting that close if there's more than one rider ahead)

eeeee

Beasty wrote: »

If you are confident about the person in front you can get very close on the track. There have been times when I've been comfortable an inch or less behind the back wheel of the rider in front indoors in Manchester. That's when everyone is focussed on line-lapping and I'll never get that close unless I'm rider no 2 (in my experience there are too many variables to risk getting that close if there's more than one rider ahead)

True, I am only new to it so I am not getting that close. That is :eek: close! I have full faith in everyone else happily as I don't know any better yet! Love it though, got accredited today (and didn't die. Much )

Still don't think I will ever be comfortable with drafting out on the open road. Unlesss the person in front of me is faster I like being out in front where I can see what's ahead of me.

equivariant

Darkglasses wrote: »

For me the commute is a time trial. You can race but you can't draft.

Hmm - I get enough slagging about showing up at work in lycra. I think if I showed up with aero bars and helmet it might be more than I could bear

Bigus

If you pass me I'm perfectly entitled to draft you all the way home

Beasty

... and this is the sort of thing that could happen if you draft too closely

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmQp33tywGE

Harrybelafonte

Beasty wrote: »

... and this is the sort of thing that could happen if you draft too closely

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmQp33tywGE

Don't think a Team Sprint is a fair comparison to be fair.

@Gadetra It wasn't too bad this morning and was the lack of consistent pace was more to do with the wind than inexperienced riders.

eeeee

Harrybelafonte wrote: »

Don't think a Team Sprint is a fair comparison to be fair.

@Gadetra It wasn't too bad this morning and was the lack of consistent pace was more to do with the wind than inexperienced riders.

Oh Hi I didn't know you were there! *waves*
I was the woman in the yellow tights, grey shorts and red bib (6).

I haven't got a lot to compare it to so I will take your word on the pace, although it did seem a bit patchy. The wind was unreal at times! (For me anyway )


Beasty That video :eek: Were they alright?
ETA just seen she broke her knee and leg. Ouch.

Harrybelafonte

"Aravena was operated on for a fractured patella at the city’s Clinica Santa María, reports sportslashlife.com."

godtabh

Beasty wrote: »

... and this is the sort of thing that could happen if you draft too closely

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmQp33tywGE

Harrybelafonte wrote: »

Don't think a Team Sprint is a fair comparison to be fair.

@Gadetra It wasn't too bad this morning and was the lack of consistent pace was more to do with the wind than inexperienced riders.

I was just about to post this.

The issue with drafting when say you arent in a club spin when calls are being made is that the person in front my see an obstruction. You wont.

ericzeking

The other week I was out training, (I do race)...pottering along in zone 2, this dude in full Aldi kit emerged from a side road and chased me down...when he got 10 yards in front he took his hands off the bars and stretched out as if in celebration...or else it was a kind of a yawn stretch cos it was so easy to him...thing was though, he'd clearly blown himself up as I, still in zone 2, started gaining on him again, he took the next turn off though and I cursed that I wasn't able to 'beat' him to the next imaginary winning post......

Rolly eyes smiley...