Unmarked lanes at a crossroads

MOH

Approaching a crossroads where there are effectively two lanes at the junction, but no road markings or other signage, what would you consider the correct usage of lanes?
I would have thought in general that right-turning traffic would use the right lane, and traffic going straight or turning left should keep to the left lane.

As an example, I'm specifically thinking about here, heading SW on the Oscar Traynor road approaching the Malahide Rd.

corktina

I'd agree with that, but not much you can do if someone does otherwise

RangeR

I would take it as, no road markings is one lane. but it would be a **** of a driver to hog the entire lane when they are turning.

cletus

I would use it, and assume others would too, by staying on leftmost side of the lane when turning left, and rightmost when turning right

MOH

Any time I've ever passed through it, everyone seems to treat it as two lanes.
It's more the going straight ahead case I'm curious about.

Saw a learner yesterday going straight through from the left lane forced out of it by a bus going straight through from the right lane, which I would have assumed was turning right.

dr.fuzzenstein

I think normal procedure would be to drive along very slowly and block both lanes whilst making up your mind whether to turn left it right or maybe do a U turn on the junction.

cletus

MOH wrote: »

Any time I've ever passed through it, everyone seems to treat it as two lanes.
It's more the going straight ahead case I'm curious about.

Saw a learner yesterday going straight through from the left lane forced out of it by a bus going straight through from the right lane, which I would have assumed was turning right.

i would think leftmost for going straight ahead too

cruizer101

I would have thought right lane for going straight ahead the logic being this.

For people to go straight or right they require the same right of way shall we say i.e. the whole of the main carriageway need to stop for them to go. Where as for those turning left only the closer lane needs to stop, and people from further away lane can keep going and also go right.

Another way to look at it, if I am going straight and in left lane it is possible I would block people going left when a filter light is on if I can't proceed.

In fairness it isn't very clear but that is the logic I think I'd go with when I approach the junction.

ironclaw

I know this has lanes but for example on the Drummartin Rd here: http://goo.gl/maps/iMoX1

Going into town, the right lane is for right turn only. Left is straight on and left.

Going out of town, right lane is straight on only and left is left turn only.

So there is no convention in my mind but yes I grant you its a coin flip between the two. Generally I go with the flow of traffic because chances are if someone is in the right lane and turning right, you'll probably move left anyway. Same can't be said for the left lane (car turning left) though.

RangeR

ironclaw wrote: »

Generally I go with the flow of traffic because ...

Famous last words. All it takes is the vehicle in front to be in the wrong position and...

The road less travelled and all that.

cruizer101

On second thought, it depends, on what?

The main road, the case I described would be for a minor going onto a major.
If on the major the right turn should have a lane of its own, this is to ensure the major which has the main flow of traffic is kept going.

cletus

cruizer101 wrote: »

I would have thought right lane for going straight ahead the logic being this.

For people to go straight or right they require the same right of way shall we say i.e. the whole of the main carriageway need to stop for them to go. Where as for those turning left only the closer lane needs to stop, and people from further away lane can keep going and also go right.

Another way to look at it, if I am going straight and in left lane it is possible I would block people going left when a filter light is on if I can't proceed.

In fairness it isn't very clear but that is the logic I think I'd go with when I approach the junction.

if you use rightmost for right and straight ahead, you end up waiting behind a guy turning right who is waiting for a break in traffic. At least if you are leftmost, those turning left will not impede you so much

djimi

ironclaw wrote: »

I know this has lanes but for example on the Drummartin Rd here: http://goo.gl/maps/iMoX1

Going into town, the right lane is for right turn only. Left is straight on and left.

Going out of town, right lane is straight on only and left is left turn only.

So there is no convention in my mind but yes I grant you its a coin flip between the two. Generally I go with the flow of traffic because chances are if someone is in the right lane and turning right, you'll probably move left anyway. Same can't be said for the left lane (car turning left) though.

The cars turning left might have to stop. The cars turning right almost certainly will have to stop. Ergo left lane for going left or straight, right hand lane for those waiting to turn right.

Or to put it simply, we drive on the left in this country, so it is the lane that everyone should be in at all times unless they have a compelling reason not to be!

whomitconcerns

i use that junction regularly (3/4 times a week) and for left lane is straight on and left, I actually would have sworn this was marked. I have never seen anyone go right from left lane...what I see is right lane for right turn only and this is in daily usage

markpb

I haven't been on that road in a long time but I seem to recall that each arm of the junction gets green time in turn, meaning that there will never be a case where right turning traffic can't turn right freely.

In any case, isn't the law that left and straight traffic stays left and right turning traffic stays right unless overridden by road markings?

whomitconcerns

markpb wrote: »

I haven't been on that road in a long time but I seem to recall that each arm of the junction gets green time in turn, meaning that there will never be a case where right turning traffic can't turn right freely.

In any case, isn't the law that left and straight traffic stays left and right turning traffic stays right unless overridden by road markings?

There is only the one green light there..so its all go

cruizer101

Looking at the streetview there is 4 lights which would indicate there is a filter and I would guess its for left though its while since I've been at that junction and can't remember

MOH

Thanks for all the replies folks.

In general, I can see the argument that traffic going straight could block traffic turning left under some circumstances, but I think it's more likely that traffic turning right would block traffic going straight, so on the whole I'd lean towards the left lane for going straight.

Most junctions that I can think of that are marked usually have the left lane for both left and straight, and the right lane for going right. Exceptions being if there is no right turn (so obviously right lane is for going straight), there's a left filter (in which case straight/right might share to avoid blocking left turning traffic), or there's a short slip road for left, in which case there might be just one lane for straight/right.

At that particular junction, as far as I know it's always just the one green light , so no one's going to block anyone, but I'd still expect the right-turning traffic to be moving slightly slower, and again, I'd stick with left lane for straight.
(Not sure what the filter is for though).

I dug out the rules of the road book, and oddly there's nothing at all in it that I can find about road position when going straight at a junction. The closest is a two lane entrance to a roundabout where "left" and "straight" go in the left lane. The only thing I did find was in the RSA guidelines for testers, which says that in the absence of markings

an applicant who intends to go straight ahead at a cross-junction should normally be as close as is feasible to the left hand side, or a fault may be recorded for ‘Position at Cross Junctions’

(As an aside, looking at the satellite view again, a bus in the right hand "lane" is almost certainly going to be at least partially across the continuous white line in the centre, another argument for a bus going straight to use the left lane).

Bottom line, I guess that junction really needs some road markings.

ProudDUB

MOH wrote: »

Approaching a crossroads where there are effectively two lanes at the junction, but no road markings or other signage, what would you consider the correct usage of lanes?
I would have thought in general that right-turning traffic would use the right lane, and traffic going straight or turning left should keep to the left lane.

As an example, I'm specifically thinking about here, heading SW on the Oscar Traynor road approaching the Malahide Rd.

If you want to do things by the book, you should be in the left lane (if there are lane markings) or the left side of the road (if there are no road markings) at all times. That is your correct road position. If you don't do it during your test, you'll get dinged for incorrect road positioning. If you are planning on turning right, you move over into the right lane/right side of the road, as you approach the junction. But you shouldn't be driving on the right or in the right lane, if your turn is still some ways away.

Obviously, the day to day realities of what is practical and safe will vary drastically from that, due to bus lanes, parked cars, cyclists, buses, 'left turn only' lanes etc etc. But if you wanna do it by the book, you are supposed to be on the left at all times, unless you are turning right at the next intersection.