15 Euro Sign-on Now The Norm?

jimbo28

Why are are there a lot of race organizers now looking for 15 euro to sign on? What has changed to increase the costs? I know of one or two clubs last year looking for 10 euro sign-on fee for a club league....greedy or covering the costs?

Diarmuid

Most clubs make a loss when they run a race. They will be make a smaller loss now. If you want to be able to race every weekend you should be happy to see the limit increase to €15.

browsing

Diarmuid wrote: »

Most clubs make a loss when they run a race. They will be make a smaller loss now. If you want to be able to race every weekend you should be happy to see the limit increase to €15.

Does anybody know the total prize money for these races (on average)?
It just seems odd they make a loss if they take in perhaps 200 riders' (or in some cases a lot more)s sign on fees, be it 10 or 15.

I haven't won a race yet...... so I'm not familiar how much is washing about. Personnally, I'm more interested in points to move up a category than prize money so I'd prefer to have cheaper races all season but it is nice to receive something in recognition.

15 euro seems quite expensive if you're going to be racing fairly often even though I know we spend a good bit on gels, tyres, jerseys, drink mix etc before we even buy the components! It just it all adds up quite quick.

Raam

Ambulance, food, commissaires, rental of sign-on location, prizes (cash, trophies) is all I can think of for costs. I've run CX races (they have some additional costs above those) but never road races so I might be missing something.

It all adds up pretty quickly.

Then you are relying on the good will of club members to do lead car and marshalling at their own cost.

lennymc

15 quid was agreed at Leinster agm last year. I doubt there is any club making money from organising race meetings so calling them greedy when they give up their time so the likes of you and me can race is a bit rich. If you have never helped organise a race maybe give it a shot to see where the sign on money goes, and see how many people give their time and more free of charge.

jimbo28

I asked the question only, i did not imply that any race organizer was anything!............maybe should have phrased it differently! Personally i dont have a problem with 15 sign on for open races.I am wondering however why the increase is coming now? What has changed between this year and last?

@ lennymc I have often helped out at races but never on the financial side, that said at any monthly club meet i go to, the treasurer will always highlight race costs for the open events held.The club from what i Know has always operated within the takings of the day...............along with peoples goodwill. I wonder is it that goodwill that is reducing and that clubs now need to pay for extra? Chill out there lennymc!

Diarmuid

browsing wrote: »

I haven't won a race yet...... so I'm not familiar how much is washing about. Personnally, I'm more interested in points to move up a category than prize money so I'd prefer to have cheaper races all season but it is nice to receive something in recognition.

15 euro seems quite expensive if you're going to be racing fairly often even though I know we spend a good bit on gels, tyres, jerseys, drink mix etc before we even buy the components! It just it all adds up quite quick.

It costs about €2.5k to put on a full race program. Try breaking even, with €10 entries.

€15 is two hours at the minimum wage. I don't think that's excessive considering what you are getting in return.

If you race every weekend between 1st March and end of July it'll cost you the same as a set of Ultegra shifters and brakes. That's every weekend.
Compare that to Ironman races or even Olympic distance triathlons, where entires are multiples of road races and you'll soon realise how lucky you are.

So if you are going to be racing regularly during the season, I presume that you have set aside one Sunday to help organise a race run by your club?

Diarmuid

jimbo28 wrote: »

I asked the question only, i did not imply that any race organizer was anything!............maybe should have phrased it differently! Personally i dont have a problem with 15 sign on for open races.I am wondering however why the increase is coming now? What has changed between this year and last?

The only thing that has changed are the rules. Previously you could not charge more than €10 per race. That has been increased to €15.

Raam

Perhaps it is a recognition that 10e is bloody cheap and that organisers need a bit more flexibility to assist with covering of costs.

Plastik

I have absolutely no problem with the increase of a €5 per race. Races don't run themselves and stuff like ambulances are not cheap. The costs very, very quickly add up. My own club runs one of the biggest one day races in the Country, a race that gets a lot of press and a race that almost every A1/A2 rider would love to have on their palmares. I have no idea the last time that we broke even running it, never mind anything additional to the club.

browsing

woah, I didn't mean to offend anybody by implying organisers were cackling over profits made or that a lot of work doesn't go into organising a race. I don't mean to offend anyone or imply that any race organisers have sinister intentions.

Diarmuid wrote: »

It costs about €2.5k to put on a full race program. Try breaking evening with €10 entries.

€15 is two hours at the minimum wage. I don't think that's excessive considering what you are getting in return.

If you race every weekend between 1st March and end of July it'll cost you the same as a set of Ultegra shifters and brakes. That's every weekend.
Compare that to Ironman races or even Olympic distance triathlons, where entires are multiples of road races and you'll soon realise how lucky you are.

So if you are going to be racing regularly during the season, I presume that you have set aside one Sunday to help organise a race run by your club?

@ Diarmuid,
you would be correct in assuming that I will be putting aside one Sunday to help organise a race by my club as well as a weekday or two but I don't see how that is relevant. I didn't mean to offend you and I am in no doubt that it does cost a lot to put on a race. My question really relates to prize money as I'm wondering (maybe mistakenly) if it's a lot.
It sounds like you have experience first hand about the financial side of a race, can you tell me how much was set aside as prize money for that race/those races?

Personally, if I do race along that period every weekend, 300 euro is a lot of money to me and I'd much prefer if it was 200.
15 euro isn't an awful lot of money but neither is 20 or 25 but I wouldn't be in favour in raising the maximum amount chargeable to these amounts either.

lennymc

jimbo28 wrote: »

@ lennymc I have often helped out at races but never on the financial side, that said at any monthly club meet i go to, the treasurer will always highlight race costs for the open events held.The club from what i Know has always operated within the takings of the day...............along with peoples goodwill. I wonder is it that goodwill that is reducing and that clubs now need to pay for extra? Chill out there lennymc!

Maybe go through the costs with the finance guy in your club to see where the money goes.

Diarmuid

browsing wrote: »

woah, I didn't mean to offend anybody by implying organisers were cackling over profits made or that a lot of work doesn't go into organising a race. I don't mean to offend anyone or imply that any race organisers have sinister intentions.

Sorry if my post came across like that. It wasn't mean to..

browsing wrote: »

Personally, if I do race along that period every weekend, 300 euro is a lot of money to me and I'd much prefer if it was 200.

Sure €300 is more than €200 but I'm sure most would prefer €0 over €200. My point is: what is sustainable? And at €10, IMHO is not it. €15 is just about there.

My preference would be to keep the cost to a minimum while still having races each weekend. Whatever is required to get us to that point, I'm in favour of that process!

ragazzo

Raam wrote: »

Ambulance, food, commissaires, rental of sign-on location, prizes (cash, trophies) is all I can think of for costs. I've run CX races (they have some additional costs above those) but never road races so I might be missing something.

It all adds up pretty quickly.

Then you are relying on the good will of club members to do lead car and marshalling at their own cost.

Add to that: letter of indemnity, costs associated with photo finish service, up to 4 comms depending on number of races, fuel expenses for motorcycle marshals who may not be club members, race photo service costs etc etc.

Many riders are quite critical of various races and organisers but generally change their tune when they step up to the plate themselves.

I don't particularly want to pay an increased entry fee but I understand the costs involved and the thought process behind it.

Beasty

ragazzo wrote: »

Many riders are quite critical of various races and organisers but generally change their tune when they step up to the plate themselves.

+1
The volunteers in this sport are essentially subsidising the racers through their time and effort (and in some cases incurring expenses they do not seek reimbursement of) - without them races would be a lot fewer in number and more expensive to put on (and I fully recognise that some racers provide a lot of support themselves). I would extend this to all activities put on by clubs, be it sportives, youth spins, training/coaching etc. A lot of people do get their racing served on a plate without proper recognition for those that serve it to them.

wirelessdude01

Beasty wrote: »

+1
The volunteers in this sport are essentially subsidising the racers through their time and effort (and in some cases incurring expenses they do not seek reimbursement of) - without them races would be a lot fewer in number and more expensive to put on (and I fully recognise that some racers provide a lot of support themselves). I would extend this to all activities put on by clubs, be it sportives, youth spins, training/coaching etc. A lot of people do get their racing served on a plate without proper recognition for those that serve it to them.

Volunteers in any sport sport subside it. People don't realise or possibly don't want to recognise it. I know in my own GAA club that for underage training(u6-10) at this time of year it takes place indoors. Parents are asked for a 2e per session contribution to hell defray cost of hall rental and electricity. Most turn their noses up at it and the kids don't reappear under training is outside. The very same parents then thinking nothing of buying muck for the kids which costs far more than 2euro.