Are things kicking off in Venezuela?

Chazz Michael Michaels

This link keeps popping up on my Facebook feed. Any truth to it?

"Tonight, Venezuela is seeing a spasm of violence that’s unlike anything the country has experienced since 1989. Information is fragmented, since an almost complete media black-out is in place, but you don’t need the media to hear your neighbor’s screams.

Caracas, Valencia, Merida and San Cristobal in particular have become virtual war zones: National Guard units and National Police have been shooting tear gas canisters and buckshot sometimes directly at protesters, sometimes into residential buildings and, raiding any place they think student protesters may be hiding. Alongside them, the government backed colectivos (basically paramilitary gangs on motorbikes, a tropical basij) shoot at people with live ammo.

But of course, this is no war zone: in a war zone you have two sides shooting at each other. Tonight one side is doing all the shooting, the other side is doing all the being shot at.

The videos that are starting to come out are simply shocking. It’s as though the denouement we both sides have either feared or looked forward to for so long is finally coming to a head."

There are some videos/images at:

http://caracaschronicles.com/2014/02/19/19f/


I take anything like this with a pinch of salt, but thought I would share to see if there is anything to it.

Fr_Dougal

Venezuela, if you can read this; Ireland is here to help you.

Send over your wimmins and we'll look after them.

wazky

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

Venezuela, if you can read this; Ireland is here to help you.

Send over your wimmins and we'll look after them.

If we could get the Ukraine to do the same we would be sorted.

Fr_Dougal

wazky wrote: »

If we could get the Ukraine to the same we would be sorted.

Good thinking.

Can a mod sticky this so they know we're willing to help?

Specialun

Poor bastards

Its been rockng there last week after they shut down social media..by the looks of it ****s about to get real

anncoates

At least the chances of thousands of European student and crusty backpackers being soundly beaten by riot police has just suddenly increased.

SEPT 23 1989

I am getting the hang of this game now

democratically elected government = bad

protesters= good

FreshKnickers

I can't feckin' see it very well myself. Couple of things in the way. I'll shout over, ask them if they're okay.

Hande hoche!

Wonder what Sean Penn has to say.

Harold Weiss

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

I am getting the hang of this game now

democratically elected government = bad

protesters= good

Only in countries with natural resources that don't bow to the Washington consensus. In Venezuela's case, oil.

SEPT 23 1989

Harold Weiss wrote: »

Only in countries with natural resources that don't bow to the Washington consensus. In Venezuela's case, oil.

I am not anti-American never have been but i am getting really sick of this

Harold Weiss

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

I am not anti-American never have been but i am getting really sick of this

I'm not anti-American either but often get accused of it because like many Americans themselves, I don't subscribe to US government foreign policies. Rest assured my friend, most people don't care about the truth on these issues.

Saudi Arabia executes gay people, abuses women on daily basis but they're best buddies with America because they sell their oil at a cheap price. Say no more.

sin_city

This tactic worked in Libya for the US. The were trying it in Syria but Russia blocked it...Now they are doing it in the Ukraine and in Venezuela.

renegademaster

this "revolution" is not being televised

http://www.bestgore.com/guest-post/fake-photo-propaganda-anti-government-protest-venezuela-exposed/

moxin

Those shooting of people in the videos are horrific.

This video has gone viral, about 2m views. "What's going on in Venezuela in a nutshell"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EFS6cP9auDc

dxhound2005

renegademaster wrote: »

this "revolution" is not being televised


Nothing to do with anything about the argument here. Did you not notice the unsuitable material on that link?

Highflyer13

Things have been kicking off in Venezuela for a long time. With 25000 murders a year the place is an undeclared warzone. Chavez meant well but his socialist policies have left the country in dire straits. Inflation is at 56% and counting and everyday goods such as toilet paper and arepa flour are in short supply. A change of direction is needed but a huge amount of the population (mainly the poor) still are buying into the obviously flawed 'chavismo'.

A very serious situation here with a media blackout by Maduro and its also being kept out of the news by the Ukraine situation.

Harold Weiss

dxhound2005 wrote: »

Nothing to do with anything about the argument here. Did you not notice the unsuitable material on that link?

Thouht he meant The Revolution Will Not Be Televised AKA Chávez: Inside the Coup

renegademaster

sin_city wrote: »

This tactic worked in Libya for the US. The were trying it in Syria but Russia blocked it...Now they are doing it in the Ukraine and in Venezuela.

and they proactively collaberate with their partners in our governments/corporations etc to guarantee our participation in their never-ending illegal war on terror, tax evasion for their corporations, americanisation of our health system/central banking system/our resources including our national pension reserve etc etc.

if we had a half hour of what some countries experience at the hand of our american friends we would have a much more sympathetic and realistic view of what's happening in Venezuela/Ukraine/Iraq/Afghanistan/Egypt/Turkey/ Libya/Syria/Pakistan/Yemen and the rest right now.

even though it's getting more obvious the whole world is in one way or another being forced down the path of a global resistence against the nwo, the majority in Ireland have themselves convinced we're completely immune to it all, somehow we're special and the financial terrorism etc that we experience has nothing to do the exact same control mechanisms playing out around the world.

only question i have left in my mind is how it's all going to end cos one thing is for sure, the few who own everything of signigance on the planet won't give it up without using the full extent of it's global army/police/arms/bombs/nukes and whatever secret $hit they have going on to stay in control of 7,000,000,000+ consumers.

Frank Lee Midere

Harold Weiss wrote: »

I'm not anti-American either but often get accused of it because like many Americans themselves, I don't subscribe to US government foreign policies. Rest assured my friend, most people don't care about the truth on these issues.

Saudi Arabia executes gay people, abuses women on daily basis but they're best buddies with America because they sell their oil at a cheap price. Say no more.

I oppose modern US imperialism too. For the same reason I oppose the Russians bullying the Ukraine.

Harold Weiss

Highflyer13 wrote: »

...A change of direction is needed but a huge amount of the population (mainly the poor) still are buying into the obviously flawed 'chavismo'.

So what do you propose? Back to the old model where < 10% of the population own Venezuela while the other 90% live in squalor?

That's pretty much how most Latin American countries have turned out when doing whatever the US (IMF/World Bank) want.

renegademaster

Highflyer13 wrote: »

Things have been kicking off in Venezuela for a long time. With 25000 murders a year the place is an undeclared warzone. Chavez meant well but his socialist policies have left the country in dire straits. Inflation is at 56% and counting and everyday goods such as toilet paper and arepa flour are in short supply. A change of direction is needed but a huge amount of the population (mainly the poor) still are buying into the obviously flawed 'chavismo'.

in fairness now the yanks did everything they could to make the country fall apart so they could get the upper hand and force change, Chavez did his best by changing up his refined oil products to keep the chance of the yanks influencing the markets he was interested in to a minimum but in the end the all seeing eye gets their man no matter the cost to whole nations/continents/the fcuking planet!!

renegademaster

Frank Lee Midere wrote: »

I oppose modern US imperialism too. For the same reason I oppose the Russians bullying the Ukraine.

your post hurts my head

Frank Lee Midere

Harold Weiss wrote: »

So what do you propose? Back to the old model where < 10% of the population own Venezuela while the other 90% live in squalor?

That's pretty much how most Latin American countries have turned out when doing whatever the US (IMF/World Bank) want.

Whatever they vote for.

Funny this old school Cold War stuff when Russia is aiming itself as a modern ideological conservative force allying itself with conservative reactionary regimes across the world.

That said American identity politics does hide real power and real privilege.

Harold Weiss

Frank Lee Midere wrote: »

I oppose modern US imperialism too. For the same reason I oppose the Russians bullying the Ukraine.

I agree, Ukranians should determine their own future but that's what elections are for and clearly US don't respect the result of those elections.

Russia is also being bullied here by the west, especially the US.
You can see it every day in the newspapers and on the TV.

renegademaster

Harold Weiss wrote: »

I agree, Ukranians should determine their own future but that's what elections are for and clearly US don't respect the result of those elections.

Russia is also being bullied here by the west, especially the US.
You can see it every day in the newspapers and on the TV.

they're bullying the democratically elected government in ukraine and know full well this is impacting on the russians, double the fun for the yanks

Frank Lee Midere

renegademaster wrote: »

your post hurts my head

Why. It was simple English. I oppose Russian imperialism in the Ukraine. That's what's happening when the Russians bully the government into cracking down on the protesters.

The reason why East Ukraine is pro-Russian is because of previous Russian colonialism and colonization.

Lou.m

renegademaster wrote: »

this "revolution" is not being televised

http://www.bestgore.com/guest-post/fake-photo-propaganda-anti-government-protest-venezuela-exposed/

Just to warn people ....or advetise ...there is lots of porn in that link just sayin

renegademaster

Frank Lee Midere wrote: »

Why. It was simple English. I oppose Russian imperialism in the Ukraine. That's what's happening when the Russians bully the government into cracking down on the protesters.

The reason why East Ukraine is pro-Russian is because of previous Russian colonialism and colonization.

really?? this is your take on what's happening over in Ukraine right now??

Frank Lee Midere

Harold Weiss wrote: »

I agree, Ukranians should determine their own future but that's what elections are for and clearly US don't respect the result of those elections.

Russia is also being bullied here by the west, especially the US.
You can see it every day in the newspapers and on the TV.

The Ukrainians are caught between both imperialists then - and neither side is holy.

Agree that we give Russia a hard time - I think modern identity politics is designed to make or justify western superiority towards other countries, including and up to invasions ( Hitchens support for Iraq for instance.). In this case the protestors aren't all incorrect though.

Harold Weiss

Frank Lee Midere wrote: »

Why. It was simple English. I oppose Russian imperialism in the Ukraine. That's what's happening when the Russians bully the government into cracking down on the protesters.

The reason why East Ukraine is pro-Russian is because of previous Russian colonialism and colonization.

But how did they crackdown on the protesters? This has been going on for months and the government showed great restraint. It was only when protesters turned violent did this turn into a bloody mess and I've no doubt US diplomats like Geoffrey Pyatt and Victoria Nuland were behind the violence.

They don't give a **** about Ukranians anymore than they care about the average every day American. Just as they don't care about Venezuelan students or protesters in Libya or anywhere else.

Frank Lee Midere

renegademaster wrote: »

really?? this is your take on what's happening over in Ukraine right now??

Yes the Western Ukraine is pro West, the Eastern Ukraine is pro Russian and , of significant, Russian ethnicity. It's as clear cut as Northern Ireland, and I rarely side with colonials.

dxhound2005

Lou.m wrote: »

Just to warn people ....or advetise ...there is lots of porn in that link just sayin

I posted the same warning and then I realised that I had just repeated the link. I removed it from my post.

Frank Lee Midere

Harold Weiss wrote: »

But how did they crackdown on the protesters? This has been going on for months and the government showed great restraint. It was only when protesters turned violent did this turn into a bloody mess and I've no doubt US diplomats like Geoffrey Pyatt and Victoria Nuland were behind the violence.

They don't give a **** about Ukranians anymore than they care about the average every day American. Just as they don't care about Venezuelan students or protesters in Libya or anywhere else.

Both sides, as in the Cold War, are imperialists. The Ukrainians are caught in the middle.

Harold Weiss

Frank Lee Midere wrote: »

Both sides, as in the Cold War, are imperialists. The Ukrainians are caught in the middle.

I know ... ultimately it's the Ukranians that lose but nobody can say US don't share responsibility for it.

KarlMarks

The Venezuelan story is a particular tragic one. Chavez was a democratically elected leader. His socialist credentials seemed defacto. But it became yet another tinpot government that threw away the ability to bring about fundamental change by being greedy and corrupt. As a socialist, you cannot condone what has happened to the place. It's a place where the natural resources of the land have been thrown away through greed, mismanagement and opportunism. For every positive change in circumstance, there has been tragic and long lasting denials of basic human rights.

Using the Venezuelan story to take a cheap dig at America is a particular lazy way of thinking about what happened there.

Gyalist

Meanwhile, just over the Venezuela border in Guyana, the Guyana government continues to battle the US government over its attempt to impose its American Democracy/LEAD Project NGO on the people of Guyana despite its objections. The Guyana government rightly suspects that these NGOs are in fact Trojan Horses.

Harold Weiss

KarlMarks wrote: »

Using the Venezuelan story to take a cheap dig at America is a particular lazy way of thinking about what happened there.

America has been interfering in Latin America for over 100 years.

John Pilger made an excellent documentary in 2007 called The War On Democracy which exposes US crimes in Latin America carried out by CIA.

They abused human rights in every country of Latin America, ruined generations of people for greed.
No doubt you applaud them for it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oeHzc1h8k7o

KarlMarks

Harold Weiss wrote: »

America has been interfering in Latin America for over 100 years.

John Pilger made an excellent documentary in 2007 called The War On Democracy which exposes US crimes in Latin America carried out by CIA.

They abused human rights in every country of Latin America, ruined generations of people for greed.
No doubt you applaud them for it.

I'm aware of US involvement in South America. I don't applaud it. I actively condone it.

What I'm saying is that summarily involving the US in every single argument that involves conflict somewhere in the world is the type of utterly tired and morally inept form of thinking that brings nothing new to the debate.

How about this discussion involved how the democratically elected Government under Chavez turned into such an appalling vista of lost hope and new oppression for the workers of Venezuela? What went wrong at a macro and micro level, and what does this mean for modern Socialism in South America?

mbur

A couple of brilliant posts to yer youtube vid above

"Sounds more like an American coup. They use the media, raise false flags, and then use proxy politicians to privatize oil reserves. Worse things happen in other Latin American countries but it is only oil rich Venezuela, which has suffered an attempted coup before, gets this kind of attention. Don't fall for it, it has CIA written all over."

"You probably don't know that the Government in Venezuela was democratically elected. The US is famous all over the world for supporting real criminal dictatorships imposed upon the people. The only difference is that those Governments blindly obey whatever the USA says. Since a new crop of leaders in South America are no longer obeying the US corporations and government then the CIA wants to overthrow them. We have seen this movie many times before. The US sends in its Marines like they’ve done in Nicaragua, Haiti, Santo Domingo, etc., or they do it by proxy like in Guatemala 1974, or in practically all South and Central American countries. One of the most brutal and savage examples was in Chile, September 11, 1973 where Kissinger and the CIA directly orquestrated a coup against another democratically elected President (Allende). The uninformed US public might not know about the US involvement in all the coups in Latin America but the people who have had to suffer them certainly know about them. A common saying in Latin Americans: “Why is the US the only country where there has been no Coup D’état? Because there is no US Embassy in Washington!"

KarlMarks

mbur wrote: »

A couple of brilliant posts to yer youtube vid above

"Sounds more like an American coup. They use the media, raise false flags, and then use proxy politicians to privatize oil reserves. Worse things happen in other Latin American countries but it is only oil rich Venezuela, which has suffered an attempted coup before, gets this kind of attention. Don't fall for it, it has CIA written all over."

"You probably don't know that the Government in Venezuela was democratically elected. The US is famous all over the world for supporting real criminal dictatorships imposed upon the people. The only difference is that those Governments blindly obey whatever the USA says. Since a new crop of leaders in South America are no longer obeying the US corporations and government then the CIA wants to overthrow them. We have seen this movie many times before. The US sends in its Marines like they’ve done in Nicaragua, Haiti, Santo Domingo, etc., or they do it by proxy like in Guatemala 1974, or in practically all South and Central American countries. One of the most brutal and savage examples was in Chile, September 11, 1973 where Kissinger and the CIA directly orquestrated a coup against another democratically elected President (Allende). The uninformed US public might not know about the US involvement in all the coups in Latin America but the people who have had to suffer them certainly know about them. A common saying in Latin Americans: “Why is the US the only country where there has been no Coup D’état? Because there is no US Embassy in Washington!"

Using youtube comments as a formation of your position isn't really a position at all.

Stavros Murphy

KarlMarks wrote: »

I'm aware of US involvement in South America. I don't applaud it. I actively condone it.

What I'm saying is that summarily involving the US in every single argument that involves conflict somewhere in the world is the type of utterly tired and morally inept form of thinking that brings nothing new to the debate.

How about this discussion involved how the democratically elected Government under Chavez turned into such an appalling vista of lost hope and new oppression for the workers of Venezuela? What went wrong at a macro and micro level, and what does this mean for modern Socialism in South America?

Freudian slip there old bean.

KarlMarks

Stavros Murphy wrote: »

Freudian slip there old bean.

I don't hold much credence to the Freudian dogma at the best of times. But in this case, .

Lou.m

Venezuela Crisis explained in 90 seconds - BBC NEWS

Demonstrators are demanding better security, an end to goods shortages and protected freedom of speech...apparently as always it is difficult to get a true clear picture.

Stavros Murphy

KarlMarks wrote: »

I don't hold much credence to the Freudian dogma at the best of times. But in this case, .

You actively condone it? Ok, if that's what you meant. If not, go educate yourself. Using words you don't understand to express your views can tend to be self-defeating.

sin_city

Lou.m wrote: »

Venezuela Crisis explained in 90 seconds - BBC NEWS

Ah BBC news, at least we know there will be no bias

Smidge

moxin wrote: »

Those shooting of people in the videos are horrific.

This video has gone viral, about 2m views. "What's going on in Venezuela in a nutshell"


Eh, you might want to get rid of that link.

Good fu5k :eek:

renegademaster

Harold Weiss wrote: »

America has been interfering in Latin America for over 100 years.

John Pilger made an excellent documentary in 2007 called The War On Democracy which exposes US crimes in Latin America carried out by CIA.

They abused human rights in every country of Latin America, ruined generations of people for greed.
No doubt you applaud them for it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oeHzc1h8k7o

wikileaks 1,000,000 kissinger files show plety of american interfeerence in south america

Nonoperational

anncoates wrote: »

At least the chances of thousands of European student and crusty backpackers being soundly beaten by riot police has just suddenly increased.

For some reason this stands out as a particularly ****ty post... Congrats.

renegademaster

dxhound2005 wrote: »

renegademaster wrote: »

this "revolution" is not being televised


Nothing to do with anything about the argument here. Did you not notice the unsuitable material on that link?

Lou.m wrote: »

Just to warn people ....or advetise ...there is lots of porn in that link just sayin

dxhound2005 wrote: »

I posted the same warning and then I realised that I had just repeated the link. I removed it from my post.

well spotted, tbh i never even looked at the rest of the site, all i was interested in was the story i linked to on their site from a google search, even after going back to see what you were all on about i didn't bother clicking any of the links on the page i posted so what's the harm

Smidge

renegademaster wrote: »

dxhound2005 wrote: »

well spotted, tbh i never even looked at the rest of the site, all i was interested in was the story i linked to on their site from a google search, even after going back to see what you were all on about i didn't bother clicking any of the links on the page i posted so what's the harm

In fairness you didnt have to click on anything!
I opened the link and was nearly blinded by a vagina.