Kickboxer (46) loses fight for life after 'gangland-style' shooting overnight

Red Pepper

This newspaper heading from the Indo (online) really annoys me.

Why mention the word "kickboxer"? Why not "Father of 4 children" or "46 year old man". What has "kickboxer" got to do with it? Was he kickboxing at the time?

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/kickboxer-46-loses-fight-for-life-after-ganglandstyle-shooting-overnight-30008823.html

"The victim was named locally as 46-year-old James Talbot, who is believed to have been involved in the sport of kickboxing, and in boxing as a younger man."

What!? Now it's boxers. Was his boxing as a youth contributory? Do boxers generally get involved in gang crime? Do they deserve to be shot more?
Did our boxers not do us proud at the Olympics?

Chips Lovell

If someone is well known for something, it's generally mentioned in reporting. For example, when the rugby player in Limerick was murdered, a lot of the reporting described him as "Garryowen rugby player".

It isn't meant to infer that boxing or rugby makes you more likely to be murdered

Notus

Red Pepper wrote: »

This newspaper heading from the Indo (online) really annoys me.

Why mention the word "kickboxer"? Why not "Father of 4 children" or "46 year old man". What has "kickboxer" got to do with it? Was he kickboxing at the time?

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/kickboxer-46-loses-fight-for-life-after-ganglandstyle-shooting-overnight-30008823.html

"The victim was named locally as 46-year-old James Talbot, who is believed to have been involved in the sport of kickboxing, and in boxing as a younger man."

What!? Now it's boxers. Was his boxing as a youth contributory? Do boxers generally get involved in gang crime? Do they deserve to be shot more?
Did our boxers not do us proud at the Olympics?

Guess who didn't get a valentines card this morning :P

Valetta

Red Pepper wrote: »

This newspaper heading from the Indo (online) really annoys me.

Why mention the word "kickboxer"? Why not "Father of 4 children" or "46 year old man". What has "kickboxer" got to do with it? Was he kickboxing at the time?

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/kickboxer-46-loses-fight-for-life-after-ganglandstyle-shooting-overnight-30008823.html

"The victim was named locally as 46-year-old James Talbot, who is believed to have been involved in the sport of kickboxing, and in boxing as a younger man."



What!? Now it's boxers. Was his boxing as a youth contributory? Do boxers generally get involved in gang crime? Do they deserve to be shot more?
Did our boxers not do us proud at the Olympics?

It's perfectly normal to mention someones occupation when reporting deaths.

"35 year old lorry driver killed...."

"19 year old apprentice plumber shot...."

"41 year old hairdresser murdered..."

Not real examples, but you get my drift.

Methinks you are looking for a conspiracy theory that isn't there.

Dave H

The man was murdered and the injustice you see is that he was referred to a kickboxer?

Red Pepper

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

If someone is well known for something, it's generally mentioned in reporting. For example, when the rugby player in Limerick was murdered, a lot of the reporting described him as "Garryowen rugby player".

It isn't meant to infer that boxing or rugby makes you more likely to be murdered

well known for it??

"who is believed to have been involved in the sport of kickboxing"

It is irrelevant in my opinion.

Chips Lovell

You obviously want to be offended by this, so I guess there's no point trying to explain it again.

anncoates

Good of the Indo to let us know the Gardai are "treating the case as murder" seeing as they kicked down his door and shot him dead.

Red Pepper

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

You obviously want to be offended by this, so I guess there's no point trying to explain it again.

Don't be so pompous. If you know your rugby, you will know that Garryowen is a very well-to-do club. There was a message in that reference as there is a message in the kickboxing reference. If you don't see it, fair enough.

Chips Lovell

So now there's a hidden meaning in all references to sporting involvement? Boxing - bad, Rugby - good. What about GAA?

Should the papers not mention that Kenny Egan is a former boxer when he runs in the local elections next year?

Red Pepper

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

So now there's a hidden meaning in all references to sporting involvement? Boxing - bad, Rugby - good. What about GAA?

Should the papers not mention that Kenny Egan is a former boxer when he runs in the local elections next year?

You are missing the point. What does 'kickboxer' add or imply to the murder story?

mikom

Red Pepper wrote: »

You are missing the point. What does 'kickboxer' add or imply to the murder story?

Van Dammed if I know.

SEPT 23 1989

Red Pepper wrote: »

You are missing the point. What does 'kickboxer' add or imply to the murder story?

he was a man of violence?

Red Pepper

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

So now there's a hidden meaning in all references to sporting involvement? Boxing - bad, Rugby - good. What about GAA?

Should the papers not mention that Kenny Egan is a former boxer when he runs in the local elections next year?

Let me break it down for Vlad who seems to have impaled himself in the head.

Kickboxer implies...this guy is only a scumbag, nothing to see here for our Indo readers.
Garryowen implies...not your usual Stab City scumbag here...this guy could be well be an Indo reader or a professional person. Keep reading, we cannot allow this.
Boxer Kenny Egan (not murdered)...implies Olympic medallist...you all know him and love him...acceptable

Birroc

OP is right but it is the Irish Independent so I am surprised he is only seeing this now. It is sloppy/lazy media and the quality of media in Ireland has been deteriorating for some years now.

Valetta

Red Pepper wrote: »

Let me break it down for Vlad who seems to have impaled himself in the head.

Kickboxer implies...this guy is only a scumbag, nothing to see here for our Indo readers.
Garryowen implies...not your usual Stab City scumbag here...this guy could be well be an Indo reader or a professional person. Keep reading, we cannot allow this.
Boxer Kenny Egan (not murdered)...implies Olympic medallist...you all know him and love him...acceptable

That says an awful lot about your perceptions and is quite frankly insulting large groups of people without any justification.

Ste-

Never saw the headline about Kenny Egan not being murdered for being a boxer.

daRobot

Red Pepper wrote: »

Let me break it down for Vlad who seems to have impaled himself in the head.

Kickboxer implies...this guy is only a scumbag, nothing to see here for our Indo readers.
Garryowen implies...not your usual Stab City scumbag here...this guy could be well be an Indo reader or a professional person. Keep reading, we cannot allow this.
Boxer Kenny Egan (not murdered)...implies Olympic medallist...you all know him and love him...acceptable

Totally agree. It's a not so subtle "he's not like you or I, dear cultured Indo reader"

For what it's worth, I've done Kickboxing in the past, and it wouldn't offend me whatsoever however they'd like to try and present it. The Indo is a rag, and will look to be sensationalist wherever they can.

Chips Lovell

Help us out here OP. Could you provide us with a list of which sports imply you're a scumbag and which imply you're a nice middle class person?

I wouldn't want to go taking up the wrong thing, lest people start thinking I'm some kind of lowlife.

Birroc

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

Help us out here OP. Could you provide us with a list of which sports imply you're a scumbag and which imply you're a nice middle class person?

I wouldn't want to go taking up the wrong thing, lest people start thinking I'm some kind of lowlife.

I think the Indo is doing that for you. They foster the association/perception with headlines like this. I agree that it should just read 'Man shot dead etc...'

Riskymove

daRobot wrote: »

"he's not like you or I, dear cultured Indo reader"

cultured Indo readers???:pac:

Valetta

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/former-boxer-dies-after-gangland-style-shooting-1.1691042

Headline from The Irish Times.

Are they a rag as well?

scopper

Wait, you associate kickboxing with scumbags? That's your own prejudice there my friend. All reports include some information about the subject of the story. Likely they rang around and found out he was known for being a boxer. That's it.

Dr Turk Turkelton

So if I'm reading this thread right-Kenny Egan was murdered because he is a boxer?
Am I getting close as I'm very confused.

Holsten

Crazy stuff.

It's almost impossible to stop this too. If someone wants to smash your door in and gun you down there isn't much you can do. Sitting ducks.

pickarooney

Dr Turk Turkelton wrote: »

So if I'm reading this thread right-Kenny Egan was murdered because he is a boxer?
Am I getting close as I'm very confused.

Yeah, John Hamm is lined up to play him in the biopic.

TheShizz

anncoates wrote: »

Good of the Indo to let us know the Gardai are "treating the case as murder" seeing as they kicked down his door and shot him dead.

They're supposed to include every possible bit of information into the story, regardless how obvious it may seem.

feargale

Red Pepper wrote: »

This newspaper heading from the Indo (online) really annoys me.
Why mention the word "kickboxer"? Why not "Father of 4 children" or "46 year old man". What has "kickboxer" got to do with it? Was he kickboxing at the time?
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/kickboxer-46-loses-fight-for-life-after-ganglandstyle-shooting-overnight-30008823.html
"The victim was named locally as 46-year-old James Talbot, who is believed to have been involved in the sport of kickboxing, and in boxing as a younger man."
What!? Now it's boxers. Was his boxing as a youth contributory? Do boxers generally get involved in gang crime? Do they deserve to be shot more?
Did our boxers not do us proud at the Olympics?

Agreed. They shouldn't mention shooting either. It could give clay pigeon shooters a bad name. Ditto Lucan. Ditto "man." That could cause gender prejudice. "46 year old"? No. That's ageist. Proposed headline : " Human Being Terminated."

Donkey Oaty

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

Help us out here OP. Could you provide us with a list of which sports imply you're a scumbag and which imply you're a nice middle class person?

I wouldn't want to go taking up the wrong thing, lest people start thinking I'm some kind of lowlife.

Quick guide for you Vlad:

Posh sports: billiards, archery, fox hunting.

Scumbag sports: pool, darts, cock-fighting.

Scumbags sometimes have an "obsession" with their activities, while the good guys are "keen" and "enthusiastic" or "dedicated" about theirs.

Also, the baddies sometimes go on drug and alcohol-fuelled binges - which is a bad thing, and completely different to "enjoying partying with friends into the night" (I think they said that about Katy French).

Arthur Beesley

No smoke without fire.

MadsL

Holsten wrote: »

Crazy stuff.

It's almost impossible to stop this too. If someone wants to smash your door in and gun you down there isn't much you can do. Sitting ducks.

Must.not.....say.....have.bigger.gun.yourself....agggghhhhh

I'm trying AH, I'm trying....

masti123

heard he had connections with the D22 mob in clondalkin, true?

The only thing different about this story is the lack of the usual "Gardai warned him his life was in Danger" spiel, like it's a handy text service.

goose2005

Donkey Oaty wrote: »

Quick guide for you Vlad:

Posh sports: billiards, archery, fox hunting.

Scumbag sports: pool, darts, cock-fighting.

Scumbags sometimes have an "obsession" with their activities, while the good guys are "keen" and "enthusiastic" or "dedicated" about theirs.

Also, the baddies sometimes go on drug and alcohol-fuelled binges - which is a bad thing, and completely different to "enjoying partying with friends into the night" (I think they said that about Katy French).

ANd Peter O'Toole and Brendan Behan were "hellraisers" rather than drunks

bockeys jollocks

masti123 wrote: »

heard he had connections with the D22 mob in clondalkin, true?

Just rumor. Nobody gets targeted and shot dead in their own home unless they have píssed off the underworld or some drug dealer.

The problem is when innocent folk witness such an act and are murdered also.

As for the kickboxing bit, I tend to agree with the OP, it adds an element of "this hardy, angry, bouncer type" was shot dead.

We'll then he must have had connections to the underworld then........


/sarcasm.

Arthur Beesley

Was he 'known to the Gardai' as the saying goes?

rwg

Poor kenny, was planning on elections and all, what exactly happened t him

redarmy

Arthur Beesley wrote: »

Was he 'known to the Gardai' as the saying goes?

yes

whirlpool

They may have added "kickboxer" to the headline to help you decide whether or not you care about the incident.

Or they may have just added it innocently because they thought that adding one of the victim's hobbies to the headline would give it a bit of colour.

wil

MadsL wrote: »

Must.not.....say.....have.bigger.gun.yourself....agggghhhhh

I'm trying AH, I'm trying....

You got to try harder and think it through.
.
It really doesn't matter what size the prick or gun involved.
A little one doesn't make you a little bit ...dead.
The problem is the intention, followed by the action to produce the result.
To protect yourself with a big gun you have to be sitting there in fear all day every day and night. Fort/prison, how can you tell?
If nobody has guns, nobody gets shot. Maybe that's what someone should aim for.

Dr Turk Turkelton

rwg wrote: »

Poor kenny, was planning on elections and all, what exactly happened t him

I think op somehow found out he boxed someone so he murdered him.

YFlyer

Irish Times wrote that he was a 'former professional boxer' while the Indo wrote 'who is believed to have been involved in the sport of kickboxing, and in boxing as a younger man.' :rolleyes:

redarmy

:eek:

Cantremember

Sometimes things are said so that if you read between the lines and join up the dots watch out for the nod and the wink and get my drift you might sort of pick up on the hint and get the message, like, ya know.

bockeys jollocks

Seems like this news story has gone cold.

goose2005

Indo today called him a "cage fighter". Doubtless the Sindo will call him a Roman gladiator in the morning

pickarooney

'who is believed to have been involved in the sport of kickboxing, and in boxing as a younger man.'

This wording really just amounts to 'we couldn't give enough of a **** to even pretend like we'd researched enough to list even one interesting fact about him'.

tdv123

I wonder when Kevin Myers gets shot will the headline read "loved by all sections of the community journalist murdered by evil devil thugs".

Míshásta

Well, I'm still learning.

Know very little about kick-boxing, but because of this thread I can now form the opinion that it's a sport indulged in by the less salubrious classes.

Thank you OP for adding to my prejudices.

But Darts? ah c'mon. I've played darts myself in my younger days.

You calling ME a scumbag?

Just step outside...........