Going from Dairy to Beef - Nitrates

19driver83

Currently dairying. Plan to move over to Beef in year or 2.

Are you limited by nitrates as to how many animals you can hold?

Currently milking 55 cows + replacements on 70owned acres & 15 rented.

Was planning on building a slatted shed for 75 finishing cattle but no point in going that big if I'm limited by nitrates.

Panch18

You'll have no problems with that number of cattle

But why in earth are you building a new sheds for them?? Surely where you have your dairy cows at the moment is more than sufficient for cattle??

onyerbikepat

You must be the only one driving against the traffic.

bob charles

19driver83 wrote: »

Currently dairying. Plan to move over to Beef in year or 2.

Are you limited by nitrates as to how many animals you can hold?

Currently milking 55 cows + replacements on 70owned acres & 15 rented.

Was planning on building a slatted shed for 75 finishing cattle but no point in going that big if I'm limited by nitrates.

you abide by the same limits as dairy. Up to now if you have land to export to if you go over the limits all is well and good. This is to change very soon :mad::mad:

Gman1987

Why do you want to change from dairy to beef finishing? Make sure to look at profit monitors for both beef and dairy before making a final decision. Maybe try finish 10 bullocks and see do you make a profit before getting rid of the cows

farmerjack

Do not change from dairying to beef finishing! Finishing beef is the surest way to lose money out there. Only the most efficient are just about breaking even.

sheebadog

I really. No,I REALLY admire a man that knows his own mind.

Greengrass1

farmerjack wrote: »

Do not change from dairying to beef finishing! Finishing beef is the surest way to lose money out there. Only the most efficient are just about breaking even.

You dont know this mans story. He asked a question that is all no need to tell him his business.
Maybe he has no help to look after the cows

alps

bob charles wrote: »

you abide by the same limits as dairy. Up to now if you have land to export to if you go over the limits all is well and good. This is to change very soon :mad::mad:

Don't like the look of your mad mad quotes......what news have you over changes in the exporting of slurry..?
Currently exporting(a lot) ..absolutely no ground to rent in the area...but no issue exporting slurry...genuinely exporting..

bob charles

alps wrote: »

Don't like the look of your mad mad quotes......what news have you over changes in the exporting of slurry..?
Currently exporting(a lot) ..absolutely no ground to rent in the area...but no issue exporting slurry...genuinely exporting..

:mad::mad: inform dept/council before your going exporting/spreading, notify when spread. what quantities, what fields - anything you can think of really :mad:

It was a little paragraph at the bottom of the new changes to the Nitrates directive. It was so broad it could be anything, but the wording was scary for anyone that exports lots of slurry.

19driver83

Thanks for the replies.
Currently my dad is farming but very close to retirement. I have looked at different options over the past few years but I don't think dairying is for me. I am self employed engineer and doing reasonably well.
Plus The farm would need a lot of investment to continue milking. I plan to get rid of cows and beef seems to be the best option.

As we only have straw bedding at present I want to build a shed similar to the slatted shed example on the Teagasc site and add an extra bay to it plus have a crush behind.

Timmaay

Dare I suggest a robot?

Gman1987

Timmaay wrote: »

Dare I suggest a robot?

http://www.donedeal.ie/milkingparlours-for-sale/fullwood-milking-robots-for-sale/6396575

Might be a more viable option to beef anyways

19driver83

Looked at robots and priced them....way too expensive plus a yearly fee.
Robots only mean that you don't have to milk at a certain time of the day.
U still need to be at home everyday, milking is only a fraction of the work load involved in dairying.

Dickie10

let the man do his thing lads, personally I can see the beef sector becoming in better shape in a couple of years, all these guys going out of sucklers beef will mean a serious deficit of beef animals in the country thus the price will go up. id be very wary of dairying being the new boom we know what happened the last boom, I belive an awful lot of men will get badly burned, could I suggest sheep ? perhaps 60 or 70 to start? mixed with some beef or sucklers, when one goes through a rough spell the other will pull you through, plus very little input to sheep bar labor of course.

Panch18

The poster seems to have a good job so nothing at all wrong wih cattle. Could make 200-250 an acre fairly easy. On 70 acres he'd make 15k. Nice pocket money to go with a good job. And very little work if you stay away from sucklers

To the poster, I wouldn't be in a massive rush to put up a slatted shed. Cattle love straw beds and thrive a lot better on it IMO. If you have access to straw then I wouldn't change. You wouldn't need to need them half as much as cows

Farmer Pudsey

alps wrote: »

Don't like the look of your mad mad quotes......what news have you over changes in the exporting of slurry..?
Currently exporting(a lot) ..absolutely no ground to rent in the area...but no issue exporting slurry...genuinely exporting..

Bob is right about Nitrates. There is a big squeeze coming down the line re same. Heard a rumour that the Dept/Co-co are going to start checking those that take it in. P will be the killer for some of these lads. They also intent to look at the reason that lads that are lowly stocked need to take in slurry and why they need to buy Artifical Fertlizer as well. As in the UK if you export slurry you need a gps system on the delivery system.this allow them to see where the slurry is going. Farmers taking it in will not want the hassle of the Dept calling.

Dickie10 wrote: »

let the man do his thing lads, personally I can see the beef sector becoming in better shape in a couple of years, all these guys going out of sucklers beef will mean a serious deficit of beef animals in the country thus the price will go up. id be very wary of dairying being the new boom we know what happened the last boom, I belive an awful lot of men will get badly burned, could I suggest sheep ? perhaps 60 or 70 to start? mixed with some beef or sucklers, when one goes through a rough spell the other will pull you through, plus very little input to sheep bar labor of course.

Why do you think that there will be deficit if we get a reduction in sucklers. The dairy herd is supposed to expand by 50% by 2020. the Progney off this will replace any loss in suckler production and it may well be greater than the loss in sucklers. It will take 3-5ish years to see a reduction even if the dairy herd will not supply extra stock.

Beef prices are influenced more by world markets than by local supply. If the US get to supply cattle into Europe (if it willing to supply hormone free beef) it will have a negative effect on price. By the way I am not totally negative on beef but I think that sucklers are a dead duck.

Dickie10

and who would buy these dairy x bulls and try to finish them? I think people will soon realise your better off with a 700 euro continental yearling and finish at 27/28 mths than looking at dairy x bulls/bullocks for 36 mths. personally I don't think sucklers cost as much to keep as guys try to paint,
I keep 20 cows and finish there progeny, there limosouin x with Hereford and limosoiun x cows, very easy kept and good weanlings in the autumn which you don't have to shell out money for. whats the difference in paying 550-600 euro for 8 mth old weanlings and feeing a cow which I keep for about 500 a year. you def wouldn't get good weanlings at 8 mths for 500 euro. plus it saves having to spend a huge amount of money to fill a shed each autumn, if you produce 20 of your own each year.

I think lads that try to overstock in sucklers or have hard calving bulls can run into trouble all right espically on marginal ground luckily I don't have any of the above problems.

Panch18

Dickie10 wrote: »

and who would buy these dairy x bulls and try to finish them? I think people will soon realise your better off with a 700 euro continental yearling and finish at 27/28 mths than looking at dairy x bulls/bullocks for 36 mths. personally I don't think sucklers cost as much to keep as guys try to paint,
I keep 20 cows and finish there progeny, there limosouin x with Hereford and limosoiun x cows, very easy kept and good weanlings in the autumn which you don't have to shell out money for. whats the difference in paying 550-600 euro for 8 mth old weanlings and feeing a cow which I keep for about 500 a year. you def wouldn't get good weanlings at 8 mths for 500 euro. plus it saves having to spend a huge amount of money to fill a shed each autumn, if you produce 20 of your own each year.

I think lads that try to overstock in sucklers or have hard calving bulls can run into trouble all right espically on marginal ground luckily I don't have any of the above problems.

The difference is huge between keeping a cow for 500 a year and buying a weanling for 550-600

The reason being that you will have a suckler and follower stocked at what every cow needing 1.5 acres. How many weanlings would you hold on that are? A lot more than 1