Should PED's be legal in mma?

El Guapo!

I have to say, this is one of the dumbest things I have ever heard.
Anthony Johnson only just got re-signed and he comes out with this clanger.

"In every sport people are using something," he told host Ricky Bones. "I mean, as long as nobody dies, nobody pulls a Chris Benoit, you know what I'm saying? I think everything is going to be fine. If it's something that can absolutely help you, I don't see what the problem is. Until that moment you go crazy on the person -- whoever it may be -- you can't absolutely blame the... I don't know. I guess it's just an iffy situation."

"If you abuse it, of course you are going to get popped for it and do stupid stuff. But if you use it the right way and you just do what you are supposed to do, then it shouldn't be a problem. But with the way the world is right now, hell you can... Everything is all messed up right now. I don't know man. I think if you can do it, do it. I don't have nothing against it. You know what I'm saying? As long as you don't kill nobody."

"They got to be taking something. You got to take something, even if it's legal or illegal. With as much training as we do, you have to take something. I mean, it doesn't have to be illegal, but you have to do something, because you just can't say ‘I'm going to to home and go to sleep' and just wake up in the morning and feel better. It doesn't work like that."

"The one thing that he didn't say is that you got guys like A-Rod and all them. They making millions per game. We making a couple thousand. They look at us and be like, ‘Man that's pocket change for me.' Hell, I'm probably about to say something stupid but I'm about to say, either pay us like them (MLB) and then we won't have to use it, or let us use it so we can get to that level. One or the other... Let us do something."

But it got me thinking.....a few people (including Joe Rogan) have came out and said they wouldn't have a problem with PED's being legal in the sport, so what's your stance on it?
I'd be totally against it for a number of reasons but I'd love to hear other peoples opinions on it.

darced

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El Guapo!

darced wrote: »

I'd have to say yes at the ufc level because they are all at it anyway so the playing field is level,the guys doing it on regional shows here should not be doing it because the advantage is too much.

But just because "they are all at it" doesn't mean it should be made legal in order to level the playing field. Surely the best way of levelling the playing field would be to introduce more stringent testing and harsher penalties for being caught. That way it'd discourage people from doing it.

The Pheasant2

Why can't they just test everyone? Would the logistics of that be so insurmountable?

dave1982

I like to see fighters perform at their absolute best so it don't bother me if they use PED's.Vitor is a prime example of it he's a animal now.


Flip side could it lead to deaths in Octagon?


I have a lot more of a issue against likes of GSP greasing up than Vitor on PED's

darced

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darced

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osl

The Pheasant2 wrote: »

Why can't they just test everyone? Would the logistics of that be so insurmountable?

Yeah they would be. Testing everyone is fine, but you would need to test everyone every week in order for it to be effective. They would need to be blood tests at that. Urine tests are a nonsense. That would be incredibly expensive. Testing fighters at an event doesn't help a huge amount. It only catches careless fighters who screwed up cycling off the drugs in the run up to their fights. They are most beneficial for recovery and being able to train longer and harder. The work is done by fight night.

It's a losing battle. Drug testing in sports is mostly for show. The majority of sports could care less about catching guys for fear of the damage it would do to their sport. I feel sorry for the guys who do end up getting caught. They end up being the fall guys, when the vast majority of guys around them are using as well.

Wouldn't be averse to legalising them. They are essentially legal in a lot of sports given the lax testing, no need to maintain the facade.

p to the e

I think legalising PEDs within MMA would do damage in terms of it being taken seriously as a legitimate sport. You know the kind, the Joe Duffy brigade who think of it nothing more than 'Human Cock Fighting'. Well I think doing something like this would make it a freak show in many peoples' eyes, including my own.

osl

p to the e wrote: »

I think legalising PEDs within MMA would do damage in terms of it being taken seriously as a legitimate sport. You know the kind, the Joe Duffy brigade who think of it nothing more than 'Human Cock Fighting'. Well I think doing something like this would make it a freak show in many peoples' eyes, including my own.

Yeah agree, would need the olympics or similar to take the first step

JohnMc1

Its a slippery slope. Yes Zuffa should pay their fighters more so they wouldn't have work days jobs and try and find time to train as well. Most MMA fighters take PEDs for recovery. The problem with PEDs is that some guys will always want an edge. If ___ amount of steroids or ___ of TRT,etc are legal you can bet someone will want to do more to have an edge.

riffmongous

osl wrote: »

Yeah they would be. Testing everyone is fine, but you would need to test everyone every week in order for it to be effective. They would need to be blood tests at that. Urine tests are a nonsense. That would be incredibly expensive. Testing fighters at an event doesn't help a huge amount. It only catches careless fighters who screwed up cycling off the drugs in the run up to their fights. They are most beneficial for recovery and being able to train longer and harder. The work is done by fight night.

It's a losing battle. Drug testing in sports is mostly for show. The majority of sports could care less about catching guys for fear of the damage it would do to their sport. I feel sorry for the guys who do end up getting caught. They end up being the fall guys, when the vast majority of guys around them are using as well.

Wouldn't be averse to legalising them. They are essentially legal in a lot of sports given the lax testing, no need to maintain the facade.

What would be the cost though (I don't mean specifically)? Is it truly insurmountable or just expensive enough to make a dent in the UFCs profit margin? Since most fighters train at certain gyms could a person be put at each gym to collect weekly blood samples? (just a suggestion)

osl

riffmongous wrote: »

What would be the cost though (I don't mean specifically)? Is it truly insurmountable or just expensive enough to make a dent in the UFCs profit margin? Since most fighters train at certain gyms could a person be put at each gym to collect weekly blood samples? (just a suggestion)

To be honest I haven't much idea of the logistics, but I doubt that would make much of a difference to the cost. CIR tests (which vada uses) cost approx $1000 a go, and from what I know blood testing costs more. GSP was willing to pay the $16000 (a discount from the actual price of $20000) it would have cost for both he and Hendricks to go through the Vada testing in the run up to their fight. I presume he was given a refund on the Hendricks tests:).

Compare that to the current format. Keith Kizer has been quoted before as saying that it costs $4000 to test all 20 guys on a standard ufc card. They don't even test everyone at the events unless they are abroad, so the cost per event is even less. So you're talking about a monumental difference. Add in the damage it would do to UFC if they had a similar experience to cycling or baseball with positive tests, and it's easy to see why they (and plenty of other sports) have no real interest in serious drug testing.

riffmongous

That's a hell of a lot of money per test, does anyone have any idea why it's so expensive? If there was more testing would it get cheaper perhaps?

Mellor

riffmongous wrote: »

That's a hell of a lot of money per test, does anyone have any idea why it's so expensive? If there was more testing would it get cheaper perhaps?

It's a pretty complicated process tbh.
It's not simply testing a vial of blood for "steroid". The most common steroid is testosterone in various forms, which is naturally occurring in the body/blood. Tests have to determine if its natural or exogenous. Then many of the other steroids and pro-hormones are quickly metabolised into other substances. Which complicates it further.

RoboRat

Should they be legal, no IMO.

I understand what its like - I am a 36 year old who has suffered some very bad injuries and the thoughts of being able to take something that could make me train would be amazing, but its against my principals.

I work long an hard hours and I train because I love the sport. There are many days that I literally have to drag myself to the mat but that's life and its a part of getting older.

I really can't see how they can wipe it out though. The testers are playing catch up all the time and they can only test for what they know about and there are a lot of grey areas. Look at cycling for example, guys will piss clean yet pull an unbelievable stage win out of the bag and everybody knows its assisted, they just haven't figured out what or what was done because the guys developing and administering are always ahead.

If you legalise it, there will be some that will push the boat out further so they have the competitive advantage.

I think that the penalties need to be stiffer so that it's not worth the risk.

siochain

it would send the wrong message to young fighters

RainMaker

I think it has to be a No!

I just don't think it actually levels the playing field as such - there will always be the occasional fighter who just doesn't want to use them... do you force that fighter to take them in that case?

Supposing that fighter makes it up to #3 or 4 in his division, but just cant get a win against the top guys - is it just because he's not taking anything or he's just not good enough? I think it just muddies the water when you have a user Vs a non-user - if the user wins is it just because of the PEDs?

Take the upcoming Weidmann V Belfort match...

If Vitor wins, I can guarantee some people will not recognize him as the valid champion due to TRT/PED issues in the past

RainMaker

RainMaker wrote: »

I think it has to be a No!

I just don't think it actually levels the playing field as such - there will always be the occasional fighter who just doesn't want to use them... do you force that fighter to take them in that case?

Supposing that fighter makes it up to #3 or 4 in his division, but just cant get a win against the top guys - is it just because he's not taking anything or he's just not good enough? I think it just muddies the water when you have a user Vs a non-user - if the user wins is it just because of the PEDs?

Take the upcoming Weidmann V Belfort match...

If Vitor wins, I can guarantee some people will not recognize him as the valid champion due to TRT/PED issues in the past

I wouldn't worry about that. :pac:

RainMaker

Article on ESPN about TRT in MMA:

http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/10500652/therapeutic-use-exemptions-testosterone-mma-outpace-other-sports-lines-finds

Dave 101

Looks like trt will now be banned across the board, but it'll do nothing to stop them using steroids, can't understand why vitor pulled out of title fight tho he should be all clear by may???