legal, accused of tampering gas meter

Annette83

Hey all. Looking for advice. Last week I received a letter from bord gas saying a meter they took from my house in December was tampered with.and if I don't pay 248 euro within 28 days my supply would be disconnected. Now I knew I didn't tamper so I fought it. Should wasn't pleasant. After all I ringing them for months with complaint of a faulty meter. She told me Friday she got her team to check list second time and it was clearly tampered with and to pay up. I rang the regulator two explain my situation and got advice. Following that I went back to the first lady in bord gais to make a complaint. They came back to me within hours and apologized. Said it was very clear the meter was faulty from beginning and the reads showed it was never tampered with. What should I do. I did go through 6 days of hell. Is an apology just enough. Any bit of guidance is very much appreciated. Thanks all

Pat Mustard

It sounds like the problem has now been resolved.

Kristopherus

Op, are you looking for advice or an excuse to go looking for compo from Bord Gais?

The_Pretender

Have you tried seeing if they'd give you a discount on gas after the hassle they put you through? Or threaten to move suppliers if they don't make it up to you.

I can't really see much point going down the legal route, it's not like they cut off your gas for 6 days. I'm not saying you're overreacting to what happened, I'd say it was stressful to have that to deal with, I'd be peeved if all they had to say was "sorry" but honestly I couldn't see you getting much more than an apology unless they voluntarily decided to do something like give you 10% off your gas for a couple of months.

Annette83

Ya but I'm furious.I said the same Monday. Let it go. But she wouldn't listen to me at all, wouldn't work with me.told of Friday there was no one senior I could speak to, but then Monday too of she will pass on my complaint to her manager. Then said Friday she got her engineers to double check it and Monday then said she would get they to double check. She contradicted herself. And when I told her Friday the only thing I ever did to that meter was press the reset button and she said I quote " don't be silly Annette, this is much more than a reset button being pressed. , "

Zillah

Kristopherus wrote: »

Op, are you looking for advice or an excuse to go looking for compo from Bord Gais?

Six days of stress and wasted time through the error and false accusations of another, compounded by threats of cutting off the service, is not nothing.

I have no idea if compensation would be a likely prospect, but if it is, I think he deserves it. Sounds like a very unpleasant experience.

Annette83

I don't want compo.I'm not that type of person.they didn't cut it off. It's just how I was treatdd. She did apologise, I'm just wondering do ye think it's enough. I'm honestly not the type to go looking for trouble.

Annette83

I don't want compo.I'm not that type of person.they didn't cut it off. It's just how I was treatdd. She did apologise, I'm just wondering do ye think it's enough. I'm honestly not the type to go looking for trouble.

Annette83

Thanks. I was just freaking over whether it would affect credit history, my husband works for a hospital where he needs full garda clearance. We were worried would any else supply to us if this we cut off. Also my son had his entrance exam Saturday and I was all over the place. Like I said I'm not looking for a pay out but just an apology afterwards. Not a word from the manager either. Just annoyed

234

Annette83 wrote: »

Thanks. I was just freaking over whether it would affect credit history, my husband works for a hospital where he needs full garda clearance. We were worried would any else supply to us if this we cut off. Also my son had his entrance exam Saturday and I was all over the place. Like I said I'm not looking for a pay out but just an apology afterwards. Not a word from the manager either. Just annoyed

This isn't really a legal issue.

Two things:

Most suppliers would apply some kind of gratuity to your account if they messed up like this.

Credit history has nothing to do with Garda clearance.

Bepolite

Annette83 wrote: »

I don't want compo.I'm not that type of person.they didn't cut it off. It's just how I was treatdd. She did apologise, I'm just wondering do ye think it's enough. I'm honestly not the type to go looking for trouble.

What type of person? The type of person that has been wronged and doesn't think an apology is enough, as you have stated. What is the third option here?

Annette83

Not the credit part for my husband but the accusation that we were stealing gas. Wouldn't look great for him.just got a bit worried.was curious to see people's views on this. That's all.

Annette83

Didn't mean it like that at all.just that I usually take the quiet road. I am not looking to claim anything. Was just wondering about people's views on this.was hoping if someone had experienced someone. I haven't dealt with any situation like this before. This really maddened me. Wasn't sure if I was letting it get to me too much.

Wheelnut

Annette83 wrote: »

... I received a letter from bord gas saying a meter they took from my house in December was tampered with...

If they put it in writing is it libel?

If it's not libel because they did not "publish" it, there is a written record on their files. Should this not be erased?

Annette83

I don't understand wheel nut.can you explain please lol.

the world wonders

I had a similar experience where a well-known computer company (Dell) sent a debt collection agency after me in error after I used a money off voucher to buy a computer from them. I would insist on a written apology; you don't want this issue coming back again.

Annette83

Thanks you so much. She did say today she will send me a letter with a full apology and explaining to the fault was there.

Wheelnut

Annette83 wrote: »

I don't understand wheel nut.can you explain please lol.

I'm asking an opinion from the legal guys on here.

Libel is a written false allegation and is actionable under law. However I think it needs to be published for an offence to be committed. We generally think of publishing in terms of newspapers or the internet but this is obviously not the case here. However, there is probably a chain of reports and recommendations from the technicians to the legal department to administration that lead to that letter being sent out. Maybe notes have been put on your payment file. I don't know if this amounts to "publishing" for which you could take court action, but I think that at the very least you should have those files erased.

Bepolite

Wheelnut wrote: »

If they put it in writing is it libel?

If it's not libel because they did not "publish" it, there is a written record on their files. Should this not be erased?

Libel and slander have now come under the heading of defamation by virtue of the 2009 Act. There's not a chance this wasn't communicated to a third party and therefore it's been published, whether the publication is defensible under privilege would be a case for the OP's solicitor if they really want to go down that line.

If I was to offer an opinion on that it's likely they'd get a few quid in nuisance change but that should not be construed as legal advice. Frankly if I'd been accused of tampering with something I hadn't I wouldn't hesitate in claiming compensation. Hitting businesses in the pocket is the only thing they understand.

The only way you'll know for sure is to phone round a few solicitors. If one takes it on no foal no fee you know it's probably got legs.

Shame it wasn't RTE OP :P

sawdoubters

you look like a honest bloke

Annette83

Thanks guys.I'm just keen to see the letter. I appreciate all the feed back.

Annette83

Thank you guys. Much appreciated. I will erase the thread. But just to clarify the have accepted for blame and should rang yesterday to say she will send letter explaining and apologising.she pain it will state fault was there's.
But thanks a mill for the feedback. I do appreciate it.

dees99

Bepolite wrote: »

Libel and slander have now come under the heading of defamation by virtue of the 2009 Act. There's not a chance this wasn't communicated to a third party and therefore it's been published, whether the publication is defensible under privilege would be a case for the OP's solicitor if they really want to go down that line.

If I was to offer an opinion on that it's likely they'd get a few quid in nuisance change but that should not be construed as legal advice. Frankly if I'd been accused of tampering with something I hadn't I wouldn't hesitate in claiming compensation. Hitting businesses in the pocket is the only thing they understand.

The only way you'll know for sure is to phone round a few solicitors. If one takes it on no foal no fee you know it's probably got legs.

Shame it wasn't RTE OP :P

By third party, the law doesn't mean the customer support agents boss obviously. Or a higher manager etc.

You got a letter saying sorry. Its over now!

dees99

And why didn't you come to boards when you first got the letter? Why did you wait until its all over? Were you waiting to see just how much damage Board Gais did to themselves first? Is that why you keep going on about stress and dragging your husbands job into it?

Your definitely looking for a claim id say..

Bepolite

dees99 wrote: »

By third party, the law doesn't mean the customer support agents boss obviously. Or a higher manager etc.

You got a letter saying sorry. Its over now!

You're wrong there - it means anyone. This can include a secretary opening a letter not addressed to them. That will satisfy the publishing requirement. As I stated a defence may be available.

ScouseMouse

Bepolite wrote: »

You're wrong there - it means anyone. This can include a secretary opening a letter not addressed to them. That will satisfy the publishing requirement. As I stated a defence may be available.

What if the false allegations were posted to union reps, independant advisors and the like, who were brought in by the gas company to try (in vain), to back up the allegations?

Bepolite

superscouse wrote: »

What if the false allegations were posted to union reps, independant advisors and the like, who were brought in by the gas company to try (in vain), to back up the allegations?

Anyone Once it goes to a third party it's published, its a very easy standard to meet. There are various defenses of qualified privilege though which are going to be fairly easy to meet I would imagine. There is also a letter of apology which would go someway to off-setting any damage.

I'm discussing this from a purely academic point of view, of course.

dees99

So if a call center agent asks her team leader to review a customers issue he/she is dealing with, then they can be sue'd? That sounds ridiculous

Bepolite

dees99 wrote: »

So if a call center agent asks her team leader to review a customers issue he/she is dealing with, then they can be sue'd? That sounds ridiculous

Which is why there is a defence.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

endacl

Annette83 wrote: »

Ya but I'm furious.I said the same Monday. Let it go. But she wouldn't listen to me at all, wouldn't work with me.told of Friday there was no one senior I could speak to, but then Monday too of she will pass on my complaint to her manager. Then said Friday she got her engineers to double check it and Monday then said she would get they to double check. She contradicted herself. And when I told her Friday the only thing I ever did to that meter was press the reset button and she said I quote " don't be silly Annette, this is much more than a reset button being pressed. , "

Welcome to 'customer service'. Six days of hell? Six days of 'pain in the hole' at most.

LisaN27

Hi,

It seems they are targeting a number of innocent people, there's a post on another site too with the same problem. I got the letter end of January and likewise rang to see what was going on. The attitude of that woman who represenents them is awful and I've basically been told pay up or we cut you off!! I've logged a formal complaint as advised by the CER and I've contacted Pat Rabbitte as he is the Energy Minister to assist me in resolving this matter. I have until 28 Feb to pay up or my gas will be cut off, its a disgrace that they can wrongly accuse people and threaten them like this with no repurcussions on their side.

I wonder how many other people are in the same situation!

Annette83

Thanks guys. I did go to the cer also but not much good. Will go through the complaints procedure.i received a letter of an apology but it was crap.that's my biggest issue is her attitude and the way she spoke to me. Dunno if an more will come of it. I'm just gonna complain to the cert and see what they make of it.

Wheelnut

@Lisa and Annette: I hope this doesn't sound too sexist, but I think you are doing a female thing by personalising the matter and it will weaken your case. Never mind "that woman" and her attitude, it's the company that wronged you and it's the company that you are after. If you refer to the phone call in your complaint, don't even mention that the person on the phone was a woman, stick specifically to the way you were treated and why you took exception. The facts are what will decide this case.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

Annette83

Hi fred.no garda weren't involved thank god..Why?

Annette83

Thanks for the advice wheelnut. Will definitely agree and take on board. First time using this and ye have all been great

Annette83

Hi fred.no garda weren't involved thank god..Why?

squirrelohara

The only thing Annette is good for is.........catching fish.

Fred Swanson

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sam34

Annette83 wrote: »

Is an apology just enough?

Annette83 wrote: »

I don't want compo.I'm not that type of person.they didn't cut it off. It's just how I was treatdd. She did apologise, I'm just wondering do ye think it's enough. I'm honestly not the type to go looking for trouble.

Annette83 wrote: »

Like I said I'm not looking for a pay out but just an apology afterwards.

you got your apology, which is what you claim you wanted. if you don't want compo, why are you asking if the apology "is enough"?

No Pants

Annette83 wrote: »

I did go to the cer also but not much good.

Probably was confused that you weren't asking for a price hike.

Hello84

Got a pay.as you go meter a few weeks ago and the slip left said a pay as you go meter was installed in a meter exchange and today a letter arrives from board gas saying something about unlawful tampering with a meter, meaning an old one, and saying we've to pay €250 and we done nothing?!

Pat Mustard

If what you are saying is correct, ring them up and query them on what they are are talking about.

However, if anybody (other than an authorised party) has tampered with the meter in any way whatsoever, it would be better to speak to a solicitor instead.

Hello84

Pat Mustard wrote: »

If what you are saying is correct, ring them up and query them on what they are are talking about.

However, if anybody (other than an authorised party) has tampered with the meter in any way whatsoever, it would be better to speak to a solicitor instead.

Thanks for replying. My partner rang yesterday and spoke to who sent the letter and they didn't want to know. They said if you don't pay you'll be disconnected or pass it onto the landlord. I will drop letter to the letting agency later as it's only addressed to occupants anf to be honest it has to be who was here before us that done this but unfortunately wasn't copped that the old meter was tampered with until we got the new prepay meter in and the old one was taken away for testing. I have nothing to hide but I feel like we'll get the blame. Don't know if the letting agency will get anywhere with bord gais

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

Pat Mustard

Hello84 wrote: »

Thanks for replying. My partner rang yesterday and spoke to who sent the letter and they didn't want to know. They said if you don't pay you'll be disconnected or pass it onto the landlord. I will drop letter to the letting agency later as it's only addressed to occupants anf to be honest it has to be who was here before us that done this but unfortunately wasn't copped that the old meter was tampered with until we got the new prepay meter in and the old one was taken away for testing. I have nothing to hide but I feel like we'll get the blame. Don't know if the letting agency will get anywhere with bord gais

Make a written note of all of the details of the conversation. Keep a copy of all correspondence and send a copy to the landlord and his agent.

If you get a summons, go to a solicitor.

Gatling

Chances are while you might not have done anything wrong.
You unknowingly benefited from the tampering

SpaceTime

Would it not be rather unreasonable to expect an ordinary member of the public to be expert enough in gas plumbing to recognise a tampered meter?

Pat Mustard

Relevant legislation re interference with meters, etc.

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2012/en/act/pub/0003/sec0005.html