Are AP posts becoming available in your school?

Peter Flynt

Are Assistant Principal posts becoming available in your school on the basis of the alleviation of the moratorium in the Haddington Road Agreement?

Are you tempted to apply for one?

Two interesting points here:

1 - Circular 0042/2010 allows for seniority to account for 20% of the grading towards deciding who gets an AP post

http://www.asti.ie/uploads/media/cl0042_2010.pdf

2 - B (Special Duties) posts are no longer being replaced so a B post holder appointed to the position means schools will lose that post. Will management be more inclined to offer positions to non post holders?

I'm enquiring from the managers/potential applicants who post here.

TheDriver

I would have nothing to do with a post interview to be honest and prefer it to be held by outsiders who know nothing about the candidates because it always becomes personal for those who didn't get it. Hence to answer 2 above, it wouldn't bother me if the B was lost once the best person for the AP would get it.
On basis on 1) seniority in TUI sector accounts for a small portion anyways and is something I like to be honest. People in sec school sector feel very strongly about seniority but I suppose its a bigger discussion about entitlement pros and cons.....

teacherhead

We advertised two today.

The seniority will be difficult.in this case as the first post will have 30 marks for seniority and the second 20. The introduction of quartiles makes ot a more level playing field.

I expect that whoever is best for the job will get it. In the VEC sector we always had competitive interviews, no waiting list, so an open interview is nothing to fear.

Peter Flynt

Thanks for the replys. . . I'm thinking of applying for one of two AP posts although I don't expect to be offered the job.

The P stated referred to the circular above today and whilst I could probably give a decent account of myself my "juniority" [I'll be in the fourth quartile I'd say] will probably cost me.

TheDriver

The worst that could happen is u don't get it but if your not in you cant win....
i got interviews over people lot more experienced than me. No regrets peter.....

seavill

teacherhead wrote: »

We advertised two today.

The seniority will be difficult.in this case as the first post will have 30 marks for seniority and the second 20. The introduction of quartiles makes ot a more level playing field.

I expect that whoever is best for the job will get it. In the VEC sector we always had competitive interviews, no waiting list, so an open interview is nothing to fear.

is that 30 marks out of 100 or what?

Peter Flynt

TheDriver wrote: »

The worst that could happen is u don't get it but if your not in you cant win....
i got interviews over people lot more experienced than me. No regrets peter.....

Don't get me wrong. . . I'd be in it to win. I'd also be in it as I think I would be the best candidate for the position (year head).

I wouldn't have any problems losing though.

teacherhead

seavill wrote: »

is that 30 marks out of 100 or what?

Yeah.

I'll pull out the circular tomorrow. From memory the first post will have 5 with 30 for service and 17.5 x 4 for the others

seavill

That's a fair chunk of marks can't believe that.
But as someone said that's prob a whole other thread if it's own

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teacherhead

seavill wrote: »

That's a fair chunk of marks can't believe that.
But as someone said that's prob a whole other thread if it's own

that's the old scheme. The new one is 20 so in our case the second post will be filled using 5x20.

even with high marks for seniority there is still 70 going elsewhere or 80 in the new system.

the 20 marks is assigned to the longest serving teacher. This service is then divided into 4 quartiles where everyone is slotted in.

Peter Flynt

teacherhead wrote: »

that's the old scheme. The new one is 20 so in our case the second post will be filled using 5x20.

even with high marks for seniority there is still 70 going elsewhere or 80 in the new system.

the 20 marks is assigned to the longest serving teacher. This service is then divided into 4 quartiles where everyone is slotted in.

Here are the criteria - each 20 marks

There will be five criteria for selection each carrying a weighting of 20 marks

• Seniority
• Knowledge, Understanding and Capacity to meet the needs of the job
• Capacity to contribute to the overall development of the school
• Interpersonal and Communication Skills
• Capacity to contribute to the overall Organisation and Management of the school



A senior teacher could have a lead of 15 marks over a junior teacher . . . which is not insurmountable.

Would "seniority" ending up carrying more "weight" . . . I mean - It's 20 marks by definition. . . but would that be the reality.

clunked

Lets face it the real problem for teachers is the abolishing of new appointments for Posts of Responsibility. I can imagine a situation in many schools where teachers are fulfilling extra responsibilities that formerly were done by teachers on 'B' posts but are now done voluntarily so as to carry favour when an 'A' post comes up. Suits managements and of course the Dept.

TheDriver

Peter Flynt wrote: »

Here are the criteria - each 20 marks

There will be five criteria for selection each carrying a weighting of 20 marks

• Seniority
• Knowledge, Understanding and Capacity to meet the needs of the job
• Capacity to contribute to the overall development of the school
• Interpersonal and Communication Skills
• Capacity to contribute to the overall Organisation and Management of the school



A senior teacher could have a lead of 15 marks over a junior teacher . . . which is not insurmountable.

Would "seniority" ending up carrying more "weight" . . . I mean - It's 20 marks by definition. . . but would that be the reality.

I wouldn't think so, its cornered into the 20% category so can't be put into others. Now experience could be construed into other categories in the capacity to undertake things etc but basically its all to play for. only issue comes when 2 excellent candidates are neck and neck and seniority splits them but that's a rare scenario and its up to you in the interview(s) to ensure you are ahead.........
Best of luck with it.

teacherhead

clunked wrote: »

Lets face it the real problem for teachers is the abolishing of new appointments for Posts of Responsibility. I can imagine a situation in many schools where teachers are fulfilling extra responsibilities that formerly were done by teachers on 'B' posts but are now done voluntarily so as to carry favour when an 'A' post comes up. Suits managements and of course the Dept.

we had a lady going back a few years ago wad all on fir doing extra work as a retirement was on the horizon a post came, she didn't get it, toys thrown out of the pram big time. Here we are again... 2 posts this time, in today asking did i need a hand with anything.

on the other side of this then we have a few teachers who do bits and pieces, proper voluntary give it up whenever you like arrangement, aren't even applying for these posts - and id say they'd be good at them if they were appointed but they don't want that at this stage.

you cant generalise too much really. it is the case that some people want to feather their own nest while others just seem keen to help out if they see a need.

***i don't want to get sucked into an argument about voluntary work im just showing two examples im familiar with***

spurious

Some of the best A Posts (Assistant principals) I worked with were like the swan's legs - working away unseen. It was only when they retired and were not replaced that the general staff (and I must admit, myself) realised all they were doing, far and above what their assigned responsibilities were. There are always little things and areas that don't necessarily fall under the heading Year Head or Head of X or whatever.

Peter Flynt

So due to be interviewed and as the most junior person I don't really have much of a chance.

I'd say the candidates have more or less been endorsed at this stage

Nevertheless. . any management who post here know what sort of questions I may be asked.

The role is a Year Head one

teacherhead

Peter Flynt wrote: »

So due to be interviewed and as the most junior person I don't really have much of a chance.

I'd say the candidates have more or less been endorsed at this stage

Nevertheless. . any management who post here know what sort of questions I may be asked.

The role is a Year Head one

only a year head? Handy one so. That would be part of an a post in our place.

i would expect that an assistant principal could see the picture beyond their classroom and nit have a blinkered vision of things.

also, as a yr head you have to be prepared to advocate for the student when all around will be baying for blood. Its not always as simple as following the policy or implementing the rule, flexibility and realism are needed.

answer the question - why do you want this job? If it doesn't come easy you should get thinking and writing down stuff.

even if you don't get the job, i found preparing for interviews always made me look closely at what i value and what i believe in. I think if you have confidence in both and express it there is no amount of spin will out shine it.

its all to play for, i got my apost ahead of several others who were there longer. Go for it. Prepare for it. Don't rock in scratching your arse and humming and hawing. Know what you want the board to know about you.