best milk replacer

farmingmad10

What is the best milk replacer for good calf performance. What do everyone find is best for them?

Henwin

volac heiferlac is the one I use as i find it best

farmingmad10

Yeah I've heard thats supposed to be good. Do you find the calves grow alot better? I using golden maverick here. It's 23% crude protein

bbam

Its important when looking and pricing to work out the cost per feed in each product..
While there may only be €4-5 in the difference, there can be 20-30 feeds in the difference which is substantial..

Most recently we used Supercream by FreshAcres, calves did well and the cost per feed is very competitive.

farmingmad10

bbam wrote: »

Its important when looking and pricing to work out the cost per feed in each product..
While there may only be €4-5 in the difference, there can be 20-30 feeds in the difference which is substantial..

Most recently we used Supercream by FreshAcres, calves did well and the cost per feed is very competitive.

I guess what your saying is value feeds in terms of the cost per unit of protein cost per unit of energy?

farmerjack

farmingmad10 wrote: »

I guess what your saying is value feeds in terms of the cost per unit of protein cost per unit of energy?

Priced here on a cost per litre mixed, went with heiferlac in the end

carstenlfc

I believe, looking at the cost of the milk replacer, it should be seen together with the intake and cost of the calf concentrate fed at the same time. Remember, pre-weaning period, is a lot about getting the calf ready for post-weaning. Post weaning is for heifer calves, about high growth rate on a TMR. High intake of TMR is a lot about rument development pre-weaning.

blackdog1

I wouldn't rate any of the volac stuff or Dairygold own brand. I've used them before and not a fan. Vitalac Blue is good but about 60 euro a 25kg bag its 15% skim but i'm using Elvor ( best selling milk powder in France, students put me onto it) 25% skim and yeast and lard in it.. serious stuff. Get it for 55 euro a 25 kg bag (27.5 c a litre). Shine is supposed to be good too but never tried it.

alps

Switched from heiferlac this year to a 25% skim from Trouw, and will certainly stick with the skim inclusion next year. Calves certainly more content, much better condition cover.Must checkout blackdogs Elvor, sounds interesting.

Base price

alps wrote: »

Switched from heiferlac this year to a 25% skim from Trouw, and will certainly stick with the skim inclusion next year. Calves certainly more content, much better condition cover.Must checkout blackdogs Elvor, sounds interesting.

What sized bag and how many grms per/lt.

Base price

blackdog1 wrote: »

I wouldn't rate any of the volac stuff or Dairygold own brand. I've used them before and not a fan. Vitalac Blue is good but about 60 euro a 25kg bag its 15% skim but i'm using Elvor ( best selling milk powder in France, students put me onto it) 25% skim and yeast and lard in it.. serious stuff. Get it for 55 euro a 25 kg bag (27.5 c a litre). Shine is supposed to be good too but never tried it.

Who are the agents for Elvor in Ireland.

blackdog1

alps wrote:

Switched from heiferlac this year to a 25% skim from Trouw, and will certainly stick with the skim inclusion next year. Calves certainly more content, much better condition cover.Must checkout blackdogs Elvor, sounds interesting.

Calves are more content because skim takes 4-6 hours to digest and whey takes 2. Alot of powder is sold without skim as it's cheaper. There's 4 different elvor products out there 2 sold by liffey Mills and 2 sold by wholesaler in Kanturk I use. Great products slight variations in specs.

Base price

blackdog1 wrote: »

Calves are more content because skim takes 4-6 hours to digest and whey takes 2. Alot of powder is sold without skim as it's cheaper. There's 4 different elvor products out there 2 sold by liffey Mills and 2 sold by wholesaler in Kanturk I use. Great products slight variations in specs.

IMO if you're really interested in rearing stock to their potential you will use and pay for at least a 25% skim product.
The general cmr available in Ireland is pure ****e. The majority of it is whey based and uses wheat (derivative) proteins..

blackdog1

Base price wrote:

IMO if you're really interested in rearing stock to their potential you will use and pay for at least a 25% skim product. The general cmr available in Ireland is pure ****e. The majority of it is whey based and uses wheat (derivative) proteins..

I use a 25% from carechem supplies in Kanturk but people must remember that it's no good using a great milk replacer if your not using a good starter ration or clean straw, water etc. Your not going to get unreal results unless all those are right. In France my students tell me they are feeding calves maize and they have great results with it.

Sam Kade

blackdog1 wrote: »

I use a 25% from carechem supplies in Kanturk but people must remember that it's no good using a great milk replacer if your not using a good starter ration or clean straw, water etc. Your not going to get unreal results unless all those are right. In France my students tell me they are feeding calves maize and they have great results with it.

Fodder beet is some feed for calves also gets them onto solid food quicker.

Mooooo

blackdog1 wrote: »

I use a 25% from carechem supplies in Kanturk but people must remember that it's no good using a great milk replacer if your not using a good starter ration or clean straw, water etc. Your not going to get unreal results unless all those are right. In France my students tell me they are feeding calves maize and they have great results with it.

Shir dawg mentioned he gives maize grain to calves I'm sure. Was at a farm in England recently. 10k hols, calves on 1.15kg of Milk replacer by 2 weeks old and heifers calve from 21 to 25 months I think depending on when born. Single pens with gap between each pen till 2 weeks and groups of 2 till weaning then. Labour intensive but calves were massive.

yewtree

Mooooo wrote: »

Shir dawg mentioned he gives maize grain to calves I'm sure. Was at a farm in England recently. 10k hols, calves on 1.15kg of Milk replacer by 2 weeks old and heifers calve from 21 to 25 months I think depending on when born. Single pens with gap between each pen till 2 weeks and groups of 2 till weaning then. Labour intensive but calves were massive.

What wights were they calving at? Average daily weight gain from birth?
Sounds like they are doing great job with them

Mooooo

yewtree wrote: »

What wights were they calving at? Average daily weight gain from birth?
Sounds like they are doing great job with them

Don't have those to hand, twas the whole farm we were seeing so was walking past thru the calf shed. Cows were all very big, and youd be a while trying to pick out the heifers. His wife did the calf rearing and said its her attention to detail is excellent, would spot cows becoming sick faster then the rest he said.
Gone from 200 to 600 in 3 years, bought in a good share from Europe including a few Danish reds which he is very happy with. Cows indoors until they go back in calf and then puts to grass, indoor herd on 3 times a day with outdoor on twice a day, the 3 time a day being requested by staff. Trying to make better use of grass but finds it difficult not to hit the yield and he's paid by litres not solids. He had a bunch of cows peaked at 75L

stanflt

Mooooo wrote: »

Shir dawg mentioned he gives maize grain to calves I'm sure. Was at a farm in England recently. 10k hols, calves on 1.15kg of Milk replacer by 2 weeks old and heifers calve from 21 to 25 months I think depending on when born. Single pens with gap between each pen till 2 weeks and groups of 2 till weaning then. Labour intensive but calves were massive.

You don't have to go to England to see that

I use shine once a day

yewtree

Mooooo wrote: »

Don't have those to hand, twas the whole farm we were seeing so was walking past thru the calf shed. Cows were all very big, and youd be a while trying to pick out the heifers. His wife did the calf rearing and said its her attention to detail is excellent, would spot cows becoming sick faster then the rest he said.
Gone from 200 to 600 in 3 years, bought in a good share from Europe including a few Danish reds which he is very happy with. Cows indoors until they go back in calf and then puts to grass, indoor herd on 3 times a day with outdoor on twice a day, the 3 time a day being requested by staff. Trying to make better use of grass but finds it difficult not to hit the yield and he's paid by litres not solids. He had a bunch of cows peaked at 75L

Sounds like an inttesting system, cows doing 75 litres probably not the cow for a grass based system. I heard some of the bigger farms in US crossing with danish reds

Mooooo

stanflt wrote: »

You don't have to go to England to see that

I use shine once a day

Agree a lot of lads doing it here too, twas a tour with the group, it was different systems we were seeing really. it justs shows tho driving the youngstock on is half the battle

johnnyw20

I used gain easy mix this year and couldn't fault it. €45 a bag

Mooooo

yewtree wrote: »

Sounds like an inttesting system, cows doing 75 litres probably not the cow for a grass based system. I heard some of the bigger farms in US crossing with danish reds

No not really. he is pushing the calving back to july partly in the hope of having more stock out in spring but then in summer there will be a good few dry. Other reason is he'll get more for milk in the autumn with the way contracts work. he is part tesco, liquid and everthing outside of that is muller manufacturing price. not exactly sure how to explain it but they can expand their tesco contract by supplying more year on year, contract being based on previous years supply but they will be fined for going over it in that year, basically instead of buying litres they supply more take the fine but new increased supply is the new base for following year. he hoped to build up the tesco contract so that if manufacturing collapses again he could drop output and maintain the tesco price while dropping the manufacturing price

blackdog1

johnnyw20 wrote: »

I used gain easy mix this year and couldn't fault it. €45 a bag

Thats over €56 a bag for a 25kg. to much for just a whey powder in my opinion. i can get a 12% skim with a gut protector for €53 25kg or €42.50 a 20kg bag.

Stan whats in Shine once a day? skim %? fat %? yeast? heard it good stuff and what price?

alps

I'd be concerned with the fibre figure in the shine....cant remember what it was but discounted be a of this

Reggie.

stanflt wrote: »

You don't have to go to England to see that

I use shine once a day

And you use plenty of it ðŸ‘

Water John

Reggie, you can't give this stuff to the baby.

Reggie.

Water John wrote: »

Reggie, you can't give this stuff to the baby.

Wanna bet. The way he's feeding atm I'm considering contacting JFC for a calf teat feeder for the end if the cot

lakill Farm

Reggie. wrote: »

Wanna bet. The way he's feeding atm I'm considering contacting JFC for a calf teat feeder for the end if the cot

Watch for grass tetany

ganmo

Water John wrote: »

Reggie, you can't give this stuff to the baby.

Perfect stuff for them bodybuilders

Mooooo

ganmo wrote: »

Perfect stuff for them bodybuilders

Used to work in a dairy plant in summers in the store, any burst bags of whey protein or anything at all really one or 2 lads working there who farmed part time used to pull in the car and take it away with them for calves

Buford T. Justice XIX

Mooooo wrote: »

Used to work in a dairy plant in summers in the store, any burst bags of whey protein or anything at all really one or 2 lads working there who farmed part time used to pull in the car and take it away with them for calves

The bulk bags of powder from the beginning and end of the drying cycle used be sold off cheap as well until one lad had the idea of testing different samples to see at what stage could the powder be diverted off to 'waste' and the following stage bagged to be used if added at low rates to milk replacer and the rest bagged as normal.

It near halved the 'waste' powder sold cheap and the lower grade powder, not suitable for human consumption, was now a more valuable animal feed.

And a lot of recent upgrades would have reduced the lower grades and waste powders even more.

Iirc, the waste powders used be added to beef rations so they still had some value but I imagine that was stopped a long time ago.

ganmo

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

The bulk bags of powder from the beginning and end of the drying cycle used be sold off cheap as well until one lad had the idea of testing different samples to see at what stage could the powder be diverted off to 'waste' and the following stage bagged to be used if added at low rates to milk replacer and the rest bagged as normal.

It near halved the 'waste' powder sold cheap and the lower grade powder, not suitable for human consumption, was now a more valuable animal feed.

And a lot of recent upgrades would have reduced the lower grades and waste powders even more.

Iirc, the waste powders used be added to beef rations so they still had some value but I imagine that was stopped a long time ago.

Waste milk is now used in pig feed.