combining saorview and upc analogue signals

Zebbedee

A by-product of upc broadband is that there is a feed of 17 analogue channels available. While not in HD, there is Discovery and Nickelodion and 1 or 2 others that arn't on freesat either.
Is it possible to safely combine this analogue signal with the saorview signal and retune all the channels together or is it going to turn my aerial in the attic live with the small upc voltage?

The Cush

Zebbedee wrote: »

Is it possible to safely combine this analogue signal with the saorview signal and retune all the channels together or is it going to turn my aerial in the attic live with the small upc voltage?

Shouldn't be a problem but Saorview Mux1 from Three Rock and UPC analogue Channel4 share the same frequency, UHF Ch.30, so you may lose one or both.

SpaceTime

You shouldn't really connect anything else to the UPC network though. There's a risk of feeding RF interference back down the line and screwing up someone's broadband.

Bear in mind that the UPC cable will also have a load of channels with EuroDOCSIS data on them which may wipe out your Saorview.

I'm not sure what frequencies they use, and they may even vary from area to area.

EuroDOCSIS can be anywhere from 85 MHz to 860 MHz so, it encompasses all of UHF TV frequencies 470–862 MHz

Antenna

The Cush wrote: »

Shouldn't be a problem but Saorview Mux1 from Three Rock and UPC analogue Channel4 share the same frequency, UHF Ch.30, so you may lose one or both.

If the OP receives (or can receive) from another transmitter which is above UHF channel 37 - such as Kippure, it would be possible to use the diplexer mentioned in this thread:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=71037030


The diplexer will filter one input from the other input
It was originally the case that DTT from 3Rock was on a higher channel that could be so combined, but it moved to a low UHF channel which would clash as you point out with analogue cable.

Zebbedee

Thanks to all who replied.
Sounds a bit complicated for the sake of a couple of SD channels that are packed with ads anyway.
I'll just ditch the upc analogue channels as I don't need them and reconnect my saorview feed. Not that the saorview channels don't have more than their share of ads!

dublinman1990

Hi folks.

I just want to ask you are the UPC channels FTA when combined with Saorview?

I have two saorview boxes (Triax TSC 114 and Laurus XR7085).

The triax has perfect reception although the laurus box has nearly perfect reception (Signal: 100% Quality 85%) as it only has a co-axial cable plugged in at the back. The co-axial cable is plugged into the laurus box with a single F-Connector in the kitchen.

Is their any sort of strong reliable splitter to buy which it can detect upc analogue?

The TV set is a 20" standard size TV manufactured by BEKO.

I get Saorview channels off Three Rock at CH.30 & CH.33.

Thanks.

Pastor Toastman

You must actually have a UPC connection to your house then?

And you are really supposed to have a valid subscription too if you connect to cable TV.

watty

SpaceTime wrote: »

You shouldn't really connect anything else to the UPC network though. There's a risk of feeding RF interference back down the line and screwing up someone's broadband.

Bear in mind that the UPC cable will also have a load of channels with EuroDOCSIS data on them which may wipe out your Saorview.

I'm not sure what frequencies they use, and they may even vary from area to area.

EuroDOCSIS can be anywhere from 85 MHz to 860 MHz so, it encompasses all of UHF TV frequencies 470–862 MHz

There is a bigger risk of radiating between 5 MHz and 862MHz. Your Broadband uplink leaking on TV aerial would wipe out bits of Shortwave. The UPS downstream will interfere with FM radio, Air traffic, Marine, Amateur Radio, DAB, Mobile VHF two way, More Amateur, Tetra, PMR446, and DTT.

You need proper combiners and isolation amp followed by attenuator on the TV aerial also filter unit on the UPC Analogue.

Also it's Theft of Service if you don't have an appropriate UPC subscription.

dublinman1990

Pastor Toastman wrote: »

You must actually have a UPC connection to your house then?

And you are really supposed to have a valid subscription too if you connect to cable TV.

I would say that I am meant to have a valid subscription because I didn't contact UPC at any point including now to reconnect it but yes my home was connected to UPC up until October 2008. Back than the last subscription was 20 channels only (old Cablelink) in two rooms in the house (living room & kitchen) with no phone or broadband.

My mam and I decided to stop paying UPC (NTL) after her mum passed away as she couldn't afford the subscription. My uncle bought an internal aerial for my mam and I to go onto the 4 analogue channels up until March 2012 when I got the Laurus Saorview approved box. I bought the triax box thereafter in Mid-October 2012 and got it installed in late November 2012 from a TV installer in Rathmines.

As I said before the two boxes are working well on separate TV's.

There was also a wired connection which was from UPC which went over the roof of my mum's house connecting to my kitchen. I asked the independent installer to disconnect the UPC connection as it was unaffordable.

I would say the sensible thing to do was to contact UPC if I had a brain about stopping that connection If I wanted to or it could have been cancelled a few years ago because to my knowledge we weren't receiving any bills from UPC about the cable from autumn 2008.

Pastor Toastman

Anyone that's entitled to view UPC analogue & is also using a separate Saorview receiver with its own indoor aerial, would simply connect the UPC cable to the TV's aerial-in socket. No need for combiners.

dublinman1990

Pastor Toastman wrote: »

Anyone that's entitled to view UPC analogue & is also using a separate Saorview receiver with its own indoor aerial, would simply connect the UPC cable to the TV's aerial-in socket. No need for combiners.

I understand that.

But are those analogue channels pay TV or Free to air?

Do I need to pay a reconnection fee? How much is the re-connection fee?

I also stated in my post that I had one NTL cable removed by the independent installer with my permission. It only consisted of one long cable which came from my kitchen over the roof of my mum's property to the front part of the house. There was no broadband or phone service provided with it. No other cables were affected when it was taken out.

That cable was installed in 2006/2007 when NTL were in operation.

The question is though was I allowed to do this or not? If not, what are the consequences of that happening.

The F-connectors in the kitchen have been reduced from two to one to only use for Saorview but I may need to change it overtime to a RF cable as the connection is really hit and miss like not getting recordings or digital aertel properly.

Pastor Toastman

Cable TV is not FTA, even if the channels are not encrypted.

dublinman1990 wrote: »

The F-connectors in the kitchen have been reduced from two to one to only use for Saorview but I may need to change it overtime to a RF cable as the connection is really hit and miss like not getting recordings or digital aertel properly.

Not sure exactly what you mean here, if an aerial installer set all this up, it shouldn't be "hit & miss".

dublinman1990

Pastor Toastman wrote: »

Cable TV is not FTA, even if the channels are not encrypted.

Not sure exactly what you mean here, if an aerial installer set all this up, it shouldn't be "hit & miss".

That is fine about Cable TV not being FTA.

The only issue now concerns is what type of suitable cable is plugged in for Saorview.

The F-connectors plugs were set up specifically for cablelink/NTL a few years back. I had to use a coaxial cable to the get cable TV as it wasn't an initial setup for Saorview.

Is their any F-connector spec'd Radio frequency cables available in Ireland so I can get perfect Saorview reception or do I need to change the F-connector as I have it up to an aerial for Saorview.

From my experience a coaxial cable plugged into Saorview equipment won't have full access to Saorview features like digital teletext or accessing tv/installation menus to even work properly.

Pastor Toastman

I'm not sure what your understanding of "coaxial cable". It's simply a signal cable where the 2 conductors are co-axial, 1 inside the other, with the outer forming a screen.

Teletext & menus has nothing to do with the type of cable.

The Cush

dublinman1990 wrote: »

From my experience a coaxial cable plugged into Saorview equipment won't have full access to Saorview features like digital teletext or accessing tv/installation menus to even work properly.

If you're having Saorview reception, Aertel or recording problems then the issue is most likely a signal issue and the indoor aerial, where it's located and how it's split to the 2 TV points.

Reusing the internal cabling for Saorview isn't a problem.

The internal cabling can carry both Saorview and the UPC analogue and digital channels.

Are the UPC analogue channels being carried around the house at the moment or has the UPC feed been disconnected from the internal cabling? If the analogue channels are there UPC will not be coming after you for a subscription as there is no longer offer an analogue subscription package, even though they're still carried for the 50,000 or so legacy analogue subscribers. If the channels are there it is possible to split the cable at the TV point to Saorview STB and analogue TV.

Are you planning to resubscribe to UPC, if so, Digital with STB is the only option now - http://www.upc.ie/bundles/tv-broadband-phone/?CMP=paid_search_UPC_Brand_Exact&gclid=COyhr9vR5b0CFe6WtAodHDQAnQ&gclsrc=aw.ds

dublinman1990

The Cush wrote: »

If you're having Saorview reception, Aertel or recording problems then the issue is most likely a signal issue and the indoor aerial, where it's located and how it's split to the 2 TV points.

Reusing the internal cabling for Saorview isn't a problem.

The internal cabling can carry both Saorview and the UPC analogue and digital channels.

Are the UPC analogue channels being carried around the house at the moment or has the UPC feed been disconnected from the internal cabling? If the analogue channels are there UPC will not be coming after you for a subscription as there is no longer offer an analogue subscription package, even though they're still carried for the 50,000 or so legacy analogue subscribers. If the channels are there it is possible to split the cable at the TV point to Saorview STB and analogue TV.

That is actually great news.

The aerial cable that I have is outdoor now which is used for both Saorview boxes. The aerial is connecting into two rooms from the side of my house below the roof.

It is pointed at a south west angle towards Three Rock. The problem is that the internal cabling offered me a weaker connection for Saorview.

The original connection for UPC did stretch to the front of my house but it was disconnected at that point. I should have done a DIY job by getting a ladder and reconnecting it myself.

How long will UPC analogue in Ireland last for when I do have the internal cabling reconnected?

The Cush

dublinman1990 wrote: »

The aerial cable that I have is outdoor now which is used for both Saorview boxes. The aerial is connecting into two rooms from the side of my house below the roof.

It is pointed at a south west angle towards Three Rock. The problem is that the internal cabling offered me a weaker connection for Saorview.

The original connection for UPC did stretch to the front of my house but it was disconnected at that point. I should have done a DIY job by getting a ladder and reconnecting it myself.

How long will UPC analogue in Ireland last for when I do have the internal cabling reconnected?

How is the feed from the aerial split to the 2 TVs? The aerial feed may require a distribution amp to give the signal a boost for the 2 TV points.

If the UPC cable has been disconnected at the UPC tap outside the house you are not allowed to reconnect it.

Without a subscription UPC can disconnect your connection at any time.

dublinman1990

The Cush wrote: »

How is the feed from the aerial split to the 2 TVs? The aerial feed may require a distribution amp to give the signal a boost for the 2 TV points.

If the UPC cable has been disconnected at the UPC tap outside the house you are not allowed to reconnect it.

Without a subscription UPC can disconnect your connection at any time.

There are two cables from the outdoor aerial that gives me the Saorview channels. One cable is in through the living room and the other is through the kitchen. The connection in the living room is already perfect for Saorview so it wouldn't need an distribution amp.

Maybe I should have said that I should ring an installer from UPC to get the cabling back.

How much do I pay for UPC channels via analouge per month?

Do I need to pay a reconnection fee to get back the UPC analogue?

The Cush

dublinman1990 wrote: »

There are two cables from the outdoor aerial that gives me the Saorview channels. One cable is in through the living room and the other is through the kitchen. The connection in the living room is already perfect for Saorview so it wouldn't need an distribution amp?

Ok, are the 2 cables wired directly into the aerial or is there some sort of splitter arrangement on the aerial mast?

dublinman1990 wrote: »

How much do I pay for UPC channels via analouge per month?

Do I need to pay a reconnection fee to get back the UPC analogue?

As I said above the analogue package is no longer available for new subscribers, digital only - http://www.boards.ie/ttfthread/2057121487