Landlord renovating property

O0oo0O

Hey folks,

Just a question for people in the know. I recently moved into a house with a couple of others. It's a house share, although we're renting direct of the landlord and have all signed individual 'license agreements' with him.

All seemed to be going well, apart from a couple of things:

The other morning, just before 8:00 am he and a couple of workers started drilling and hammering up in our attic (they seem to have access through the house next door, which he must also own). The walls are paper thin so everyone was woken up by the noise. A couple of us texted him and the noise seemed to die down for about an hour, but it then started again. The work kept going until the late evening.

No notice or warning was given about the work. I texted asking for an explanation but didn't receive a reply. The same happened again the next day.

Neither me nor any of the other housemates were told that there would be renovations going on in the house before we moved in and I think most of us would have considered taking another house if we had been told that.

Also, this does not appear to be essential 'repair' work – they seem to be building a wall or something.

So basically I am just wondering whether a landlord has the right to suddenly start renovating your house while you are living there without notice?

miss no stars

Ring and find out what's going on. If he has access to your attic from next door then there isn't a proper fire break between the houses. I would want that sorted rapidly! If that is what he's doing then be reasonable - it has to be done. Just ask him to give you a heads up in future if he is going to be doing work on a common area.

djimi

Youre entitled to peaceful enjoyment of the property; being suddently woken up at 8am by someone doing buildng construction on it certainly does not fall in line with that...

If the work is essential (or even non-essential) then so be it, but its not too much to expect a heads up that there will be some interruptions.

miss no stars

djimi wrote: »

Youre entitled to peaceful enjoyment of the property; being suddently woken up at 8am by someone doing buildng construction on it certainly does not fall in line with that...

If the work is essential (or even non-essential) then so be it, but its not too much to expect a heads up that there will be some interruptions.

They each rented rooms separately, they didn't rent the house.

Being woken by building at 8am isn't nice and the LL - if for no reason other than to be polite - should have given warning, so the best plan is ring LL, ask nicely what was going on and ask for a bit of warning should something similar come up in the future.

It's also surely possible for the OP to look in the attic and see what's goin on, rather than wringing hands worrying that the whole house will be affected.

murphym7

You could read it that the LL has entered your house without your knowledge or consent. Whatever about the noise, that’s what would annoy me the most about this.
That is supposing there is access to and from the attic from inside the house however, which I presume there is. And also as said above, it looks like there is no fire break between the two properties, another thing to be really annoyed about.

miss no stars

murphym7 wrote: »

You could read it that the LL has entered your house without your knowledge or consent. Whatever about the noise, that’s what would annoy me the most about this.
That is supposing there is access to and from the attic from inside the house however, which I presume there is. And also as said above, it looks like there is no fire break between the two properties, another thing to be really annoyed about.

I was under the impression that when the bedrooms are individually leased with access to the common areas then the landlord can drop in to the common areas basically at will.

The property hasn't been rented in its entirety, going by the OP, although I might have picked that up incorrectly.

It's not very nice what the landlord did, though, but I'd be more concerned to find out if there is a fire break between houses.

murphym7

I have never lived in a rented house like the case of the OP’s but I certainly would not be happy if the LL could enter the house anytime they like just because we all have a separate agreement in place. That would make me very uncomfortable.

the_syco

O0oo0O wrote: »

It's a house share, although we're renting direct of the landlord and have all signed individual 'license agreements' with him.

Less of a house share, and more of a case of friends entering into several rent-a-room leases.

O0oo0O wrote: »

The other morning, just before 8:00 am he and a couple of workers started drilling and hammering up in our attic (they seem to have access through the house next door, which he must also own).

<snip>

So basically I am just wondering whether a landlord has the right to suddenly start renovating your house while you are living there without notice?

As you're in a rent-a-room, I'm unsure if he has to. My query would be if you have access to the attic, and if the landlord is converting the attic into multiple rooms to be accessed from the property next door?

Grandpa Hassan

Before you beat up your LL, bear in mind that he might be building a fire break

runawaybishop

Stop texting and pick up the phone and ring him.

miss no stars

runawaybishop wrote: »

Stop texting and pick up the phone and ring him.

And if you can, go look in the attic before ringing him so you at least know whether you have a firewall. If he was running flooring across both attics without proper fire breaks I'd want to know that before calling so I could ask him to please reinstate the required fire breaks and ask why he felt it was okay to seriously compromise the safety of the building and not even tell you.

It's also possible that he doesn't own next door, but the occupants are new and noticed that the firewall wasn't there and so they were jointly doing something in the attic.

Then again it's equally possible that he's trying to make an apartment in the attic that crosses over both properties. In which case I'd be very concerned.

O0oo0O

They're accessing the attic from next door. I imagine they are building a firebreak – one of my housemates asked him what they were doing when woken up that morning and he vaguely said something about building a wall – so I will check this for sure when I ring him tomorrow.

the_syco wrote: »

Less of a house share, and more of a case of friends entering into several rent-a-room leases.

As you're in a rent-a-room, I'm unsure if he has to.

Yeah, that's the thing I'm unsure of – on the license there is a clause stating that LL and anyone authorised by him have the right to enter the premises freely at any time and for any purpose without obtaining tenants' permission. However on another clause it says something to the effect that LL or his workers are allowed in to inspect or repair the premises upon receipt of notice in writing (which we didn't get).

There are about 20 clauses for the tenant to abide by but only three for the LL –  the second LL clause being "not to use or allow any person or persons authorised....to use the premises for any noisy, noisome or offensive pusrpose, nor for any purpose which ...may cause any nuisance or inconvenience [to the tenant]".

On the other point, the LL and workers aren't entering the house itself without knocking/ringing. However they are pretty much always wandering around the front and back gardens (they seem to have loads of building supplies stored out back – pipes, bricks etc). It's making us all a bit uncomfortable making our breakfast/lunch etc in the kitchen and looking out the window to see some strangers wander around the back, hammering & moving about random bits of timber etc for most of the day, especially when we don't even know what for....

They also knock on the door really early (about 7:30) to pick up tools from a storage room inside, so one of my house mates has been woken at that time for several days now to let them in.

I do plan on ringing him, but I would like to know where I stand with all this stuff before I do so.

Thanks once again for the insights!

runawaybishop

O0oo0O wrote: »

They're accessing the attic from next door. I imagine they are building a firebreak – one of my housemates asked him what they were doing when woken up that morning and he vaguely said something about building a wall – so I will check this for sure when I ring him tomorrow.



Yeah, that's the thing I'm unsure of – on the license there is a clause stating that LL and anyone authorised by him have the right to enter the premises freely at any time and for any purpose without obtaining tenants' permission. However on another clause it says something to the effect that LL or his workers are allowed in to inspect or repair the premises upon receipt of notice in writing (which we didn't get).

There are about 20 clauses for the tenant to abide by but only three for the LL –  the second LL clause being "not to use or allow any person or persons authorised....to use the premises for any noisy, noisome or offensive pusrpose, nor for any purpose which ...may cause any nuisance or inconvenience [to the tenant]".

On the other point, the LL and workers aren't entering the house itself without knocking/ringing. However they are pretty much always wandering around the front and back gardens (they seem to have loads of building supplies stored out back – pipes, bricks etc). It's making us all a bit uncomfortable making our breakfast/lunch etc in the kitchen and looking out the window to see some strangers wander around the back, hammering & moving about random bits of timber etc for most of the day, especially when we don't even know what for....

They also knock on the door really early (about 7:30) to pick up tools from a storage room inside, so one of my house mates has been woken at that time for several days now to let them in.

I do plan on ringing him, but I would like to know where I stand with all this stuff before I do so.

Thanks once again for the insights!

Move out imo. Sh1te like this doesn't bode well for the rest of your tenancy.

Ray Palmer

miss no stars wrote: »

Ring and find out what's going on. If he has access to your attic from next door then there isn't a proper fire break between the houses. I would want that sorted rapidly! .

Not true. A huge portion of Victorian and Georgian houses do not have wall between attics. They do not have to be retro fitted with one either.

At the very least he should have warned you about noise.

miss no stars

Ray Palmer wrote: »

Not true. A huge portion of Victorian and Georgian houses do not have wall between attics. They do not have to be retro fitted with one either.

At the very least he should have warned you about noise.

Doesn't mean you can't fit them and its true to say that I would want a firewall where I was living...

the_syco

O0oo0O wrote: »

Yeah, that's the thing I'm unsure of – on the license there is a clause stating that LL and anyone authorised by him have the right to enter the premises freely at any time and for any purpose without obtaining tenants' permission. However on another clause it says something to the effect that LL or his workers are allowed in to inspect or repair the premises upon receipt of notice in writing (which we didn't get).

Without seeing the lease, I'm guessing this may mean they don't need permission to enter the house, but need permission to enter your rooms. It'd need clarifying, though.

O0oo0O wrote: »

On the other point, the LL and workers aren't entering the house itself without knocking/ringing. However they are pretty much always wandering around the front and back gardens (they seem to have loads of building supplies stored out back – pipes, bricks etc). It's making us all a bit uncomfortable making our breakfast/lunch etc in the kitchen and looking out the window to see some strangers wander around the back, hammering & moving about random bits of timber etc for most of the day, especially when we don't even know what for....

With the attic problems and the above, I wonder if the LL bought a block of houses, and is doing them up bit by bit? Are you near a college or FAS centre by any chance?

O0oo0O wrote: »

They also knock on the door really early (about 7:30) to pick up tools from a storage room inside, so one of my house mates has been woken at that time for several days now to let them in.

For this reason, I'd consider moving, as I'd wonder if someone cleared the room out after you let them in, would the LL try to hold you liable for letting them in?

Grandpa Hassan

runawaybishop wrote: »

Move out imo. Sh1te like this doesn't bode well for the rest of your tenancy.

What? The fact that he is building a firebreak to make the place safer?

(assuming he is, of course)

runawaybishop

Grandpa Hassan wrote: »

What? The fact that he is building a firebreak to make the place safer?

(assuming he is, of course)

No, the fact that already the landlord is taking the mickey.

djimi

Grandpa Hassan wrote: »

What? The fact that he is building a firebreak to make the place safer?

(assuming he is, of course)

The issue here is not what he is doing, but more so that he didnt bother to have the common courtesy to inform the tenants to expect someone banging away in their attic at 8am.

Mrs OBumble

Having builders working at 8am is not uncommon, and not a bad thing.

Would you rather they did 9-6, so were still there when you came home in the evening instead?

Not being told in advance is A Bad Thing - but is hardly "taking the mickey".

runawaybishop

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Having builders working at 8am is not uncommon, and not a bad thing.

Would you rather they did 9-6, so were still there when you came home in the evening instead?

Not being told in advance is A Bad Thing - but is hardly "taking the mickey".

I wouldn't be happy with someone rocking up to the door at 7:30am to collect tools and then banging away constructing a wall at 8am without even informing the tenants. They are also in and around the back garden etc which isn't exactly peaceful enjoyment for the tenant. The lack of communication from the LL so early in a tenancy would concern me a lot.

edit: i do not think it is common to have builders working in your own house without your information at 8am btw.

djimi

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Not being told in advance is A Bad Thing - but is hardly "taking the mickey".

Each to their own, but I would consider being woken up at 8am by construction work that I wasnt informed about to be taking the piss.