European Court of Human Rights vindicates abuse victim

Hitchens

Louise O'Keefe gets justice at last after 30 long years, but not from our courts.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/landmark-victory-after-30-years-for-abuse-victim-louise-okeeffe-29957162.html

vicwatson

And about time too, this, and Governments before this one, fought her all the way through The High Court, The Supreme Court even tried to block her taking the case to Strasbourg :mad::mad::mad:

GusherING

Interesting court decision. I agree the State should be responsbile for child protection and other duties it should have in our education system. However, the RC Church and others have long held otherwise.

But if the Courts are now saying the State should be held legally responsible for the acts of school staff instead of the Boards of Management and Religious Patrons who have controlled them for most of the last 200 years, then surely it is about time we ended religious patronage of schools.

The religious orders cannot have it both ways. Particularly when they turned a blind eye towards child sex abuse like in the O'Keeffe case.

Nemeses

That is a fk -ing long time for justice.
Should have been sorted in our courts... Long ago!

suicide_circus

yeah dont really see how any school in the eu can be anything other than 100% state run and controlled now

My name is URL

GusherING wrote: »

But if the Courts are now saying the State should be held legally responsible for the acts of school staff instead of the Boards of Management and Religious Patrons who have controlled them for most of the last 200 years, then surely it is about time we ended religious patronage of schools.

It's time we did that anyway.. regardless of this case or the precedent it sets.

vicwatson

The state (Mary Hanafin Dept of Education) wrote to 135 people after The Supreme Court decision who were taking similar cases and were told by the state to withdraw the cases of the state would pursue them for costs to the full rigours of the law - a lot dropped their cases - let hope they take those cases back up now !!

When are we going to wise up to Irish Politics at all? This state is rotten to the core and every politician past and present should hang their heads in shame.

This state has been bullying it's people since inception. FACT

fryup

vicwatson wrote: »

And about time too, this, and Governments before this one, fought her all the way through The High Court, The Supreme Court even tried to block her taking the case to Strasbourg :mad::mad::mad:

absolutely disgraceful, who the hell do they think they are to do that

was the abuser named and shamed?? or did he get off with a slap on the hand??

jellyboy

Let this be More than the usual religious bashing threads
( well deserved )

There's two very important elements to this story

The huge courage and bravery of a person who has been abused who refused to accept"no"as a remedy to the pain and deep malignant shame that abuse brings
This woman has single handed ( with solicitors) brought hope and light to all those who have been abused in their search for justice and healing


The second point is our government have allowed this abuse through stealth and underhand tactics to continue
There is no point hiding behind civil servants or points of law
This boils down to morals,values and doing the right thing to people who were and are placed in the care of the state

To those that would suggest that this is about money and would bankrupt the state if all those who were abused were to sue .. It's not .. To be listened and to be heard is at the cornerstone of most of court cases

conorhal

fryup wrote: »

absolutely disgraceful, who the hell do they think they are to do that

was the abuser named and shamed?? or did he get off with a slap on the hand??

No. As far as I know the individual was jailed for the abuse and the victim recieved a substantial payout from the school.
She got the justice she deserved, so why she's entitled to double dip her compensation claim is a mystery.

My name is URL

conorhal wrote: »

No. As far as I know the individual was jailed for the abuse and the victim recieved a substantial payout from the school.
She got the justice she deserved, so why she's entitled to double dip her compensation claim is a mystery.

She always argued that the state bore some of the responsibility. That's what she has being fighting for here and in the European courts, and they have confirmed that the state does bear some of the responsibility.

Simplifying it as a 'compensation claim' is extremely scummy

Manach

Given that this case was known about for years, and this was an attempt by the state to evade its obligation under the tort of proper care and protection of its ultimate salaried employees it is a bit disingenuous for progressives to be suddenly using this as a convenient RCC bashing article to further their agenda.

J_E

Manach wrote: »

it is a bit disingenuous for progressives to be suddenly using this as a convenient RCC bashing article to further their agenda.

You make it sound like we're a nasty organisation. Sort of like RCC-affiliated institutes

WilyCoyote

vicwatson wrote: »

The state (Mary Hanafin Dept of Education) wrote to 135 people after The Supreme Court decision who were taking similar cases and were told by the state to withdraw the cases of the state would pursue them for costs to the full rigours of the law - a lot dropped their cases - let hope they take those cases back up now !!

When are we going to wise up to Irish Politics at all? This state is rotten to the core and every politician past and present should hang their heads in shame.

This state has been bullying it's people since inception. FACT

Lets see how Hanafin tries to wriggle out of this. The old "I was only doing my job" wears a bit thin after a while.

vicwatson

WilyCoyote wrote: »

Lets see how Hanafin tries to wriggle out of this. The old "I was only doing my job" wears a bit thin after a while.

No wonder she recently opted out of putting herself forward as an MEP.

She has some cheek.

vicwatson

fryup wrote: »

absolutely disgraceful, who the hell do they think they are to do that

was the abuser named and shamed?? or did he get off with a slap on the hand??

He was named, cant imagine he was shamed, and effectively he got off with a slap on the wrist as he got 3 years for a number of abuses....can't imagine he served 3 years though - prob more like 1.5 years (isn't that how it works in this country?)

From the Indo today "(Leo) Hickey was jailed for three years in 1998 after being convicted of indecently assaulting a number of girls in the 1970s"

vicwatson

My name is URL wrote: »

She always argued that the state bore some of the responsibility. That's what she has being fighting for here and in the European courts, and they have confirmed that the state does bear some of the responsibility.

Simplifying it as a 'compensation claim' is extremely scummy

I agree, she was awarded 30k + costs, big deal, she should have got 300 k for the amount of ****e she's had to go through

tigger123

vicwatson wrote: »

He was named, cant imagine he was shamed, and effectively he got off with a slap on the wrist as he got 3 years for a number of abuses....can't imagine he served 3 years though - prob more like 1.5 years (isn't that how it works in this country?)

From the Indo today "(Leo) Hickey was jailed for three years in 1998 after being convicted of indecently assaulting a number of girls in the 1970s"

I wonder how long he actually served.

vicwatson

tigger123 wrote: »

I wonder how long he actually served.

Well this is good ole Ireland so there is NO WAY that 3 years sentence meant he served 3 years - not a hope in hell.

jimgoose

Each and every time this sort of thing turns up, the state backs corrupt, bullying, abusive institutions to the hilt and attacks it's own defenceless citizens using our money. And every time one of these misfortunate people presents a case in the European courts, the state loses. You wouldn't see the likes of it in Zimbabwe, and it is about time a few of these illiterate, gibbering fascists were hanged. :mad:

sopretty

I am delighted for this woman. It also means that the state now has to accept responsibility for properly implementing procedures to ensure this doesn't (hopefully) happen again.
It always takes one person with absolute bravery to trail-blaze our state into changing legislation or changing attitudes.

vicwatson

Don't forget priest Ó that was given a complaint in 1971.

He told the Department of Ed of the complaint 3 years later in Jan 1974, the Gardai weren't advised.

Priest Ó is as much to blame, perhaps, like the other cases, he could have prevented more abuse of children had he done the right thing when the initial compliant was made.

Leo Hickey resigned in September 1973, priest Ó advised the Department of Ed in January 1974 only.

Hickey then went to another school and continued working until retirement in 1995.

This system is an absolute joke.

I'd like to know how Peter Charleton (ad hoc judge Ireland) voted ?

EDIT - He was a dissenting opinion surprise surprise

applehunter

This compensation culture makes me uneasy.

Must admit when I heard the quote "a win for the children of Ireland" I threw my eyes in the air.

efb

applehunter wrote: »

This compensation culture makes me uneasy.

Must admit when I heard the quote "a win for the children of Ireland" I threw my eyes in the air.

The culture of cover up and abuse of our nation's most vulnerable makes me even more uneasy

Lyaiera

applehunter wrote: »

This compensation culture makes me uneasy.

Must admit when I heard the quote "a win for the children of Ireland" I threw my eyes in the air.

You mean the whole basis of civil law? Ok. :rolleyes:

applehunter

:rolleyes: thats the one

littlesthobo

My name is URL wrote: »

She always argued that the state bore some of the responsibility. That's what she has being fighting for here and in the European courts, and they have confirmed that the state does bear some of the responsibility.

Simplifying it as a 'compensation claim' is extremely scummy

The state didnt abuse her , her principal did and it was dealt with by the courts. He also paid her compensation. As a result of that ruling now we are all victims because as taxpayers we will be paying for it. The state has a role to play in child protection but abusers should be the ones to pay for their crimes.

Just to add I dont believe that compensation was her motivation.

Edit: Just saw he only got 3 years. Thats the bigger injustice, absolute disgrace

wp_rathead

littlesthobo wrote: »

The state didnt abuse her , her principal did and it was dealt with by the courts. He also paid her compensation. As a result of that ruling now we are all victims because as taxpayers we will be paying for it. The state has a role to play in child protection but abusers should be the ones to pay for their crimes.

Just to add I dont believe that compensation was her motivation.

ya we are all victims just like Ms O'Keeffe

littlesthobo

wprathead wrote: »

ya we are all victims just like Ms O'Keeffe

Spare me the sarcasm, Money wont make it all better. time, money and effort would be better spent ensuring that our child protection procedures are up to scratch and keeping abusers locked up.

My name is URL

applehunter wrote: »

Must admit when I heard the quote "a win for the children of Ireland" I threw my eyes in the air.

Hopefully you caught them with a nice half-volley with a follow through to the nutsack

steddyeddy

This has opened the floodgates. We have had countless cases where gaurds covered up abuse in the country. Lost files and blackmailing of abuse victims in some cases. I know for a fact that cases like these will be brought forward and I hope they get every penny they deserve.

PopePalpatine

vicwatson wrote: »

The state (Mary Hanafin Dept of Education) wrote to 135 people after The Supreme Court decision who were taking similar cases and were told by the state to withdraw the cases of the state would pursue them for costs to the full rigours of the law - a lot dropped their cases - let hope they take those cases back up now !!

Given Hanafin's heavy links to pro-life groups along with her father Des, I'm not surprised she'd stoop this low.

Hitchens

Kenny and Gilmore craw thumping like billyo today.........hypocrites :mad:

steddyeddy

Hitchens wrote: »

Kenny and Gilmore craw thumping like billyo today.........hypocrites :mad:

There's money at stake that's why. They don't give a damn about the people of this state. Only saving money.

mikom

Your government does not care about you.
Kenny could not even remember where the abuse happened today when speaking on radio.

jimgoose

vicwatson wrote: »

The state (Mary Hanafin Dept of Education) wrote to 135 people after The Supreme Court decision who were taking similar cases and were told by the state to withdraw the cases of the state would pursue them for costs to the full rigours of the law...

How dare the illiterate barnyard animal do such a thing in my name, with my money. For shame! :mad:

padd b1975

PopePalpatine wrote: »

Given Hanafin's heavy links to pro-life groups along with her father Des, I'm not surprised she'd stoop this low.

Can't see the connection myself.


Oh wait.....

You're thanks whoring, carry on so.

Czarcasm

padd b1975 wrote: »

Can't see the connection myself.


Oh wait.....

You're thanks whoring, carry on so.

PopePalpatine's point was that the apple doesn't fall far from the tree, and in this case, said apple is rotten to the core.

My name is URL

jimgoose wrote: »

How dare the illiterate barnyard animal do such a thing in my name, with my money. For shame! :mad:

The current lot sent a team of solicitors over to fight against this woman. It's disgusting that they'd come out and apologise now, blatantly just because the court ruled against them despite their best efforts and the millions spent on trying to shut her up.

steddyeddy

My name is URL wrote: »

The current lot sent a team of solicitors over to fight against this woman. It's disgusting that they'd come out and apologise now, blatantly just because the court ruled against them despite their best efforts and the millions spent on trying to shut her up.

Well they have plenty of time to apologise for the treatment of the rest of the victims of abuse at the hands of the gaurds and the state in the last few decades.

Stavros Murphy

applehunter wrote: »

This compensation culture makes me uneasy.

Must admit when I heard the quote "a win for the children of Ireland" I threw my eyes in the air.

This post makes me worry for mankind.

Eutow

My name is URL wrote: »

The current lot sent a team of solicitors over to fight against this woman. It's disgusting that they'd come out and apologise now, blatantly just because the court ruled against them despite their best efforts and the millions spent on trying to shut her up.

I wonder what these cretins would have done if this woman lost her case. Their apology is worthless simply because they don't mean it and are trying to save face because they lost in court.

Bunch of spineless, untrustworthy scumbags. Hopefully every other person abused comes forward and shames this government, past governments, and every agency that covered these abuses up. Only then will those in power be forced to put in safe guards to stop these type of abuses from happening again.

oppenheimer1

padd b1975 wrote: »

Can't see the connection myself.


Oh wait.....

You're thanks whoring, carry on so.

If he had mentioned Iona institute he'd have had the thanks whore's full house.