Thinnest Floor Insulation Available

tedimc

Hi all,

Just wondering if anyone has come across or used insulation which is suitable for flooring (underneath screed) but takes up much less space than the usual types of insulation.

I'm refurbing at the moment and am going to replace timber joist with beam and block in some of the rooms. Other rooms already have concrete beams in place with a screed on top.

I wanted to put in UFH as well, but was hoping not to have to raise the floor level throughout the whole house to match the existing beams, screed, insulation & more screed.

Alternatively, would I lose much heat by insulating under the floors as opposed to above? The house has a basement and was alternatively considering getting the foam sprayed along the floor underneath.

I’ve seem foil backed bubble wrap before, but doubt it is much use thermally?

Any feedback is welcome.

BryanF

you would want to have careful U-value and thermal bridge calc's on this one. with UFH and what you have described requires a level of attention to detail that im not picking up from the options you describe.

PROJECT K

Hi Tedimc, as per previous post ensure thermal continuity as much as possible. Thinnest high performance insulation is vacuum panel such as OptimR by kingspan - 7mw/m2.K or almost three times more efficient than the next best rigid foam option (by same manufacturer).

Expensive, but worth a look if you are really stuck for space!

Regards
PK

tedimc

Thanks guys for the response. Had a look at OptimR - looks like just what I need. Has any idea of the cost per sheet, or how much it costs relative to the regular Kingspan Floor Insulation. Also, would be glad to hear of any other alternatives people have used.

To aid anyone else, see the different U-Values below:

Insulation Thickness

---

KS OptimR U-Value

---

KS Thermafloor TF70 U-Value
20mm

---

.20

---

X
30mm

---

.16

---

X
40mm

---

.13

---

.25
50mm

---

.11

---

.22-.25
60mm

---

.09

---

.20-.25
70mm

---

.08

---

.19-.23
80mm

---

.08

---

.17-.21
100mm

---

n/a

---

.15-.17

PROJECT K

generally priced as a 'scheme' - i.e. specific layout designed for your house. Bear in mind you cant cut or pierce VIPs for obvious reasons!

The floor layout is designed with the max. amount of VIPs possible then infill boards (typically rigid foam) are used to fill in the voids (this has negligible impact thermally despite being less efficient as its typically a small % Area)

For the equivalent performance (not thickness) expect to pay x3 - x5 times! :eek:

Best not think of it in that way though, think about % of total refurb work then assess if its worth the investment, once off opportunity the floor!

regards
PK

BryanF

tedimc wrote: »

100mm...... .15-.17

you apprecaite you need less than 0.15w/m2k for UFH and all edges/ internal remaining walls need to be clearly detailed

BarneyMc

Does anyone know of any other 'thin but high performing' floor insulation products?

declan52

You can use a liquid screed that's only 50mm which gives you a little bit extra to play with on thickness esp suitable for ufh. Heats up quicker than 100mm screed if that's a concern for you.

gctest50

BarneyMc wrote: »

Does anyone know of any other 'thin but high performing' floor insulation products?

Aerogel


.

gctest50

Read forum charter thanks

tedimc

Still looking into my options around this. Has anyone seen or used this type of product?

http://www.insulationexpress.co.uk/Floor-Insulation/ACTIS-TRISO-SOLS-Multifoil-Insulation-.htm

Only 7mm thick and works out about 14GBP per meter squared. No specification of U values, but might look at this approach. Seen foil backed bubble wrap used before - this looks like a far better job.

sydthebeat

You can't use that under a screed.

gctest50

sydthebeat wrote: »

You can't use that under a screed.

Hmmmm

Applications
Insulation of floors with hot water underfloor heating systems
Can also be used below the screed on a standard floor


http://www.insulationexpress.co.uk/Floor-Insulation/ACTIS-TRISO-SOLS-Multifoil-Insulation-.htm

BryanF

gctest50 wrote: »

Hmmmm

Show us the Certification.

sydthebeat

gctest50 wrote: »

Hmmmm

Think about it, how does a product that's solely based on infrared reflection work if its covered in concrete.

These products gained certification for use in roofs as a vapour barrier primarily with the requirement to have an exposed air space to both sides.

It would work, to a degree under a suspended timber floor

jonniebgood1

tedimc wrote: »

Still looking into my options around this. Has anyone seen or used this type of product?

http://www.insulationexpress.co.uk/Floor-Insulation/ACTIS-TRISO-SOLS-Multifoil-Insulation-.htm

Only 7mm thick and works out about 14GBP per meter squared. No specification of U values, but might look at this approach. Seen foil backed bubble wrap used before - this looks like a far better job.

Insulation... with no mention of U-Value.

I think that would set alarm bells ringing in my head.

air

Do the Kingspan vacuum panels have a perlite core? I wonder what the warranty on the vacuum seal is?

PROJECT K

compressed silica i believe - they claim 7mW as an aged value, there are some products/manufacturers that claim <5mW but i would be very wary of these!

air

PROJECT K wrote: »

compressed silica i believe - they claim 7mW as an aged value, there are some products/manufacturers that claim <5mW but i would be very wary of these!

Thanks, is that an aerogel of some sort I wonder?

PROJECT K

Aerogel is made from a synthetic silica gel impregnated into a fabric - VIPs are generally made from an evacuated fumed silica (basically compressed sand!).

Sandman777

BryanF wrote: »

you apprecaite you need less than 0.15w/m2k for UFH and all edges/ internal remaining walls need to be clearly detailed

Bryan

Looking for some advice on my floor insulation!

Will have UF heating so ive allowed for 125/130mm insulation under 75mm floor screed!
I have a quinlite block as first course on all walls for cold bridging!

Also airtight tape between slab and rising walls!

2 questions:

Should i lay the insulation in 2 layers..ie 80mm + 50mm or just 130mm? Does this make much difference either way?

Suppliers say min 25mm perimeter strip? Is this enough combined with quinlite block or should i go thicker? Dont want to waste money if would make little difference!

Thanks
S