Public access to lands & forests - spoiling the environment

Woodville56

Apologies in advance for the rant but it's been bugging me this past while as an outdoors type person , frequenting lake shorelines, local woodlands, paths and laneways. The issue is one of litter and detritus everywhere !
For all the right reasons , Coillte, some land owners and local community groups have worked together developing walkways through woodlands, bogland and along lake shores etc. Great idea and much appreciated and welcomed by those of us who enjoy a ramble in the countryside ! But as I walk, I sometimes wonder if these developments are really such a good idea ? The reason I say this is the amount of litter discarded along the way and the disregard with which some users of these amenities treat them.
Along lake shores where I regularly go birding, thankfully, stiles and small gates have been erected by local angling clubs and community groups for easy access, but on the shoreline : discarded food wrappers, plastics, tangled fishing line, glass bottles, even on a couple of occasions, fishing hooks and fishing lures. I'm surprised that the local farmers who own these lands and allow access are putting up with this abuse of their property, not to mention the injury risk to their animals and wildlife. I'm not a farmer nor would I support any move to prohibit access to such areas, but can you blame landowners who are reticent about allowing public access , apart from the insurance issues etc ?
In the woodland walkways, bog paths etc same thing, rubbish of all sorts, plastics, even bags of it dumped ! I also came across the remains of a barbecue party in a local forest - beer cans, plastics , even the disposable barbecue !! Fire risk how are ya !! Coillte notified but the rubbish remains to this day !
I once challenged youngsters whom I watched discard plastic juice containers as they walked along a woodland path - pick it up yourself if u want , I was told !

If Coillte and local community groups work to open up our woodlands to public access, they should also combine to maintain the areas free of rubbish and litter, sadly necessary ecause of the actions of some who abuse the efforts of those who make these walkways possible.
Not alone the rubbish that spoils these lovely areas but also the habits of some of the (ab) users of the spaces , like those who allow their dogs of the lead to run wild, the trail bikers who disturb the peace of the place etc , all those who, despite notices posted prohibiting these activities , disregard the code of conduct of the place thus spoiling the enjoyment of the woodland for those who go for the pure enjoyment of it !
Often makes me wonder if all this public access is such a great thing ?? Is the price that nature and the environment pays for this open access worth it ?? Are we selling out on nature for the gratification and amusement of some who have no regard or appreciation of wild places and who leave much more than foot prints ??
Here ends the rant , for now !!

dodderangler

Well said mate.
Land I hunt regularly is destroyed by people dumping in the lane and on the land itself. I don't want to sound a racist but I know the people who are doing it. Not personally hit there's no doubt in anyone's kind including the landowner on who is doing it.
As for the fishing being a angler myself blessington lake is destroyed with litter and as you said fishing equipment. I always pick up disgarded line and put a lighter to it.
Bottles and cans of Bavaria and Dutch gold left along the shore line and in the water. On a few occasion seeing little scrotes launching their empty bottles in the water but words isn't going to stop them doing it when I'm on my own.
Garda won't do anything bout it either.

baaba maal

dodderangler wrote: »

Well said mate.
Land I hunt regularly is destroyed by people dumping in the lane and on the land itself. I don't want to sound a racist but I know the people who are doing it. Not personally hit there's no doubt in anyone's kind including the landowner on who is doing it.
As for the fishing being a angler myself blessington lake is destroyed with litter and as you said fishing equipment. I always pick up disgarded line and put a lighter to it.
Bottles and cans of Bavaria and Dutch gold left along the shore line and in the water. On a few occasion seeing little scrotes launching their empty bottles in the water but words isn't going to stop them doing it when I'm on my own.
Garda won't do anything bout it either.

I work for a county council and I'm not trying to be PC, but people who dump illegally come from every background- ethnicity has nothing to do with it. The bogs of Ireland were used for largescale dumping long before the newer immigrant populations arrived. The curious thing about this dumping is that it was pretty much socially acceptable. Sure it was "only auld waste land and what harm?" etc. It is a massive problem and one that won't be solved just by enforcement or just by education, but could be reduced with an increase of both. The "wild" bits are particularly vulnerable as by definition they're not frequented that much.

Maudi

Id be out a lot in coillte managed forests ..I could bring you out now and show you detritus left by machine drivers..cans of oil..plastic oil/petrol drums..bale wrap..heavy duty bags..lunch rubbish etc..

Woodville56

baaba maal wrote: »

I people who dump illegally come from every background- ethnicity has nothing to do with it. The bogs of Ireland were used for largescale dumping long before the newer immigrant populations arrived. The curious thing about this dumping is that it was pretty much socially acceptable. Sure it was "only auld waste land and what harm quote]


Agree totally with you, one bogland area where I walk occasionally ( which is also listed as a national trail way looped walk) has an array of discarded household appliances, farm machinery and even motor car parts dumped in the ditches and grass verges ! It's definitely not an ethnic specific problem, although the import beer and lager cans and bottles littering some scenic and "wilder" areas would seem to indicate a multi ethnic hand in the spoiling of our countryside.
I dunno how increased public awareness of the unacceptability of littering can be promoted but if it's now deemed "uncool" to smoke in public places , maybe a similar ethic can be fostered by local authorities and community groups in an effort to reduce littering. It would also involve public vigilance and active discouragement and reporting of illegal dumping and littering but, as Dodderangler outlines in his posting, it's often neither safe nor heeded in taking on the polluters ! The "Adopt a Road" promotion by some local authorities seems to help in reducing litter build up but adopting the "wilder places" would be problematic I reckon !
It's such a pity though that amenity areas made accessible through the hard work of community / local authority and other organisational agencies cannot be maintained to a decent standard of cleanliness, it reflects so poorly on us in the eyes of foreign visitors who value the "wilder places" . The trick is , how do we encourage the same values among our own people of all ethnic persuasions ?

Alun

Maudi wrote: »

Id be out a lot in coillte managed forests ..I could bring you out now and show you detritus left by machine drivers..cans of oil..plastic oil/petrol drums..bale wrap..heavy duty bags..lunch rubbish etc..

Report it to Coillte then. It's mostly subcontractors who do all the work, but it's ultimately Coillte's responsibility to ensure they leave the place in an acceptable state after they've gone.

Desmo

Woodville56 wrote: »

baaba maal wrote: »

I people who dump illegally come from every background- ethnicity has nothing to do with it. The bogs of Ireland were used for largescale dumping long before the newer immigrant populations arrived. The curious thing about this dumping is that it was pretty much socially acceptable. Sure it was "only auld waste land and what harm quote]


Agree totally with you, one bogland area where I walk occasionally ( which is also listed as a national trail way looped walk) has an array of discarded household appliances, farm machinery and even motor car parts dumped in the ditches and grass verges ! It's definitely not an ethnic specific problem, although the import beer and lager cans and bottles littering some scenic and "wilder" areas would seem to indicate a multi ethnic hand in the spoiling of our countryside.
I dunno how increased public awareness of the unacceptability of littering can be promoted but if it's now deemed "uncool" to smoke in public places , maybe a similar ethic can be fostered by local authorities and community groups in an effort to reduce littering. It would also involve public vigilance and active discouragement and reporting of illegal dumping and littering but, as Dodderangler outlines in his posting, it's often neither safe nor heeded in taking on the polluters ! The "Adopt a Road" promotion by some local authorities seems to help in reducing litter build up but adopting the "wilder places" would be problematic I reckon !
It's such a pity though that amenity areas made accessible through the hard work of community / local authority and other organisational agencies cannot be maintained to a decent standard of cleanliness, it reflects so poorly on us in the eyes of foreign visitors who value the "wilder places" . The trick is , how do we encourage the same values among our own people of all ethnic persuasions ?

I drink imported lager and a lot of teenagers drink Dutch gold because it is cheap. Any cases of people dumping, that I am aware of, where someone has been prosecuted, have been plain ole Irish. Some of the most littered places I have seen in Ireland (systematic dumping of household rubbish) were near Lough Sheelin in Cavan. I reckon its plain ole manky natives.

Woodville56

As an addendum to my posting at the start of this thread, I observed the following today - Was out birding at a lakeside public amenity area , maintained by the local authority . The area has picnic tables and a couple of wire waste bins in concrete holders. While at the site, a car arrived ( 07 reg Merc) driven by a lady. She proceeded to fill one of the waste bins with bagged rubbish taken from the boot of her car then drove away ! I've regularly noticed bins in public/ amenity areas packed with black bags of (presumably) rubbish, but never witnessed the actual dumping in such a blatant manner. I suppose it could have been worse - she could have dropped her rubbish into a ditch or in a forest or bog , at least by putting it in a bin, it won't become litter as I think the Co Council workers empty the bins regularly.
Dunno if it's against the law to drop rubbish in this manner? She certainly didn't appear to be in any way shy about it !

Alun

It certainly is against the law. I'd have taken her reg and reported her.

Half-cocked

Came across a load of illegally dumped rubbish on the seashore a while back. On the off chance the perps were stupid enough to have dumped something with their identities on it I had a good rummage - no luck. What amazed me was the sort of rubbish - packaging for a 48" plasma TV, an X-box, a laptop plus various expensive kids toys. Obviously the waste from Christmas. But if some one can afford all that stuff surely they can afford to get rid of the waste (plus most of it was recyclable), instead of driving miles to a deserted stretch of shore to dump it.

I've since been told that its possible to note the serial numbers on the boxes as the dumpers might register the stuff for guarantee but I don't know if the authorities would/can follow up on that?

baaba maal

Woodville56 wrote: »

As an addendum to my posting at the start of this thread, I observed the following today - Was out birding at a lakeside public amenity area , maintained by the local authority . The area has picnic tables and a couple of wire waste bins in concrete holders. While at the site, a car arrived ( 07 reg Merc) driven by a lady. She proceeded to fill one of the waste bins with bagged rubbish taken from the boot of her car then drove away ! I've regularly noticed bins in public/ amenity areas packed with black bags of (presumably) rubbish, but never witnessed the actual dumping in such a blatant manner. I suppose it could have been worse - she could have dropped her rubbish into a ditch or in a forest or bog , at least by putting it in a bin, it won't become litter as I think the Co Council workers empty the bins regularly.
Dunno if it's against the law to drop rubbish in this manner? She certainly didn't appear to be in any way shy about it !

Yeah, depositing domestic waste in a public place is legally different from putting litter into a street bin. So filling a street bin with household rubbish is not allowed. For future reference you should have the email/phone for the litter warden in your local authority area so if you see similar you can let them know- always take the vehicle reg (discreetly!) and don't move the rubbish if possible- the litter warden may need to take a photo in situ.

Woodville56

baaba maal wrote: »

For future reference you should have the email/phone for the litter warden in your local authority area so if you see similar you can let them know- always take the vehicle reg (discreetly!) and don't move the rubbish if possible- the litter warden may need to take a photo in situ.

Got the Reg No of the vehicle ok and looked up the Local Authority Environment/ Waste Management site - it specifies that anyone reporting littering etc must do so by email to a dedicated email address or by phone to a Litter Warden's office where they would be required to supply their name etc before they would act on any complaint. It also states that the complainant may be required to give evidence in the event if a prosecution. ! Much as I deplore litter and those who engage in spoiling the countryside, I dunno if I want to end up in court giving evidence etc. !

thyme

Maudi wrote: »

Id be out a lot in coillte managed forests ..I could bring you out now and show you detritus left by machine drivers..cans of oil..plastic oil/petrol drums..bale wrap..heavy duty bags..lunch rubbish etc..

Yeah same here, and they even drive across the oil drums full or empty seen it here a few times. The bent and broken bars and chains from the machine head, the soft drinks cans, yogurt tubs,crisps packets, and a hell of a lot more all through the forest.

Alun wrote: »

Report it to Coillte then. It's mostly subcontractors who do all the work, but it's ultimately Coillte's responsibility to ensure they leave the place in an acceptable state after they've gone.

I think it would be a wast of time, because Coillte's men are in and out of the forests as soon as the cutting starts, and it doesn't bother them.
There main aim is to get the timber cut and gone, and on to the next one, same thing.

baaba maal

Woodville56 wrote: »

Got the Reg No of the vehicle ok and looked up the Local Authority Environment/ Waste Management site - it specifies that anyone reporting littering etc must do so by email to a dedicated email address or by phone to a Litter Warden's office where they would be required to supply their name etc before they would act on any complaint. It also states that the complainant may be required to give evidence in the event if a prosecution. ! Much as I deplore litter and those who engage in spoiling the countryside, I dunno if I want to end up in court giving evidence etc. !

Unfortunately, the witness is required to give evidence if required- however, it is extremely rare for the witness to be called as the litter warden can usually provide the necessary evidence linking the offender to the waste (don't want to go into detail on that!). Normally, the offender is embarrassed to be caught and just wants the case to be dealt with asap. I have complained about people throwing waste from cars on a couple of occasions and was never required to give any further evidence.

Birdnuts

Half-cocked wrote: »

Came across a load of illegally dumped rubbish on the seashore a while back. On the off chance the perps were stupid enough to have dumped something with their identities on it I had a good rummage - no luck. What amazed me was the sort of rubbish - packaging for a 48" plasma TV, an X-box, a laptop plus various expensive kids toys. Obviously the waste from Christmas. But if some one can afford all that stuff surely they can afford to get rid of the waste (plus most of it was recyclable), instead of driving miles to a deserted stretch of shore to dump it.

?

Never understood that type of retarded mentality. These people drive miles out of their way to spread their filth on popular beauty spots like beaches and mountains when it would be so much easier and little expense to dispose of it properly at one of the many recycling centres around the country. Such people should be financially crucified by the courts IMO with automatic loss of offending vehicle. You would see the problem disappear overnight!!

magicbastarder

there's no 'affording' when it comes to dumping TVs - if you buy a new TV, you're entitled to bring the old one to the retailer for recycling. and waste centres will accept WEEE waste with no charge.

magicbastarder

baaba maal wrote: »

I have complained about people throwing waste from cars on a couple of occasions and was never required to give any further evidence.

i remember a cyclist on the cyclist forum saying they had done this on multiple occasions (i think dozens of occasions, but i don't have the link to hand) and not once did the person accused risk going to court - because it's a statutory fine if you pay up straight away, but going to court can cost a lot more.

recedite

Woodville56 wrote: »

Much as I deplore litter and those who engage in spoiling the countryside, I dunno if I want to end up in court giving evidence etc. !

Do it!!!