move to PT hours or take dole

Azothpoker

Question re my current job,

Ive been there for about 22 months, and my contract is due to expire.

I had originally assumed that it would be renewed but since September business has dropped.

The company has offered me PT hours, basically chopping me from 40hours to 20 hours and move from salary to hourly wage @€;13 or so PH. Slight reduction in duties, but I get the impression the clause "required to do non-duties tasks for the good of the business" will still be present in my contract.

They still want me to come into the office to work, but work less hours per day. even though I could probably work from home via email. So in reality its the exact same job but 1/2 the wage.

I am happy to go PT as it affords me the chance to move on and explore other options without the pressure of having 0 income.


But it was brought to my attention that I may be better of taking the dole, something which ive never done, mostly out of principle. As my contract is over I assume I would be entitled to the dole when it ends.

Work want me to do 20 hours 4 days a week @13 ph. which will be more than the dole, but with expenses and living costs coming from that wage.
Would I be better of leaving at the end of the contract? I understand the dole is €180 or so but with no expenses. however I live with my girlfriend (working, salary 30k plus health benefits) and our rent is 850 PM, which to my knowledge wont be covered by housing allowance.

I think I can negotiate my hours with work, maybe reduce the number of days.

Any suggestions or advice as to what I need to worry about?

Guffy

Main thing is the gap in your cv if you quit.

Take the pt contract. If u can bring the hours down to 3 days and under 20 hours you can also sign on. Don't know how this works but it is there.

If you don't pack in the job you won't be idle allowing boredom and depression set in. Keep the job and look for something else

Penny Tration

You won't get rent allowance if you're living with your girlfriend, so tbh you'd probably be better off taking the reduced hours.

If you could negotiate to do it over three days, you could apply for ccasual jobseeker's allowance.

Azothpoker

green_screen wrote: »

You won't get rent allowance if you're living with your girlfriend, so tbh you'd probably be better off taking the reduced hours.

If you could negotiate to do it over three days, you could apply for ccasual jobseeker's allowance.

This would be means tested up to €180 would it? If I can get 3 days then its likely id still be doing 20 hours which would be more than the 180, so there would be no extra cash coming in.

Guffy

Azothpoker wrote: »

This would be means tested up to €180 would it? If I can get 3 days then its likely id still be doing 20 hours which would be more than the 180, so there would be no extra cash coming in.

Its 188 and you will get a supplement, might not be much but one none the less. I think, just taking a stab at it, you get 2 days, ie days 4 and 5. Even 19.5 hours is fine. Try to organise that u will work through lunch one day or hang on a half hour qt end of day.


actually maybe scratch that. I think there is a list on welfare.ie somewhere but I do know my sister's friend was coming out with more than me doing this when I was working full time in retail a few years ago.

rubberdungeon

Would you be claiming Jobseekers benefit or allowance?

There's some information on the Jobseekers Benefit here, scroll down through it and theres info about part time workers.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/social_welfare/social_welfare_payments/social_welfare_payments_and_work/jobseekers_benefit_and_work.html

the_syco

Azothpoker wrote: »

Work want me to do 20 hours 4 days a week @13 ph. which will be more than the dole, but with expenses and living costs coming from that wage.

Be wary of work trying to get unpaid work out of you. Do only the hours, unless you have it in writing you'll be paid for any overtime. Also, if you get it down to work 3 days, you should be able to get something from your social as your hours have been cut, although as the other contract was finished, I'm unsure if it's still applicable or not.

Aint Eazy Being Cheezy

Echoing the above, stay in the job. It's not good for mind and body to sit around doing nothing all week.

If you work a three day week you still have two days to find another full-time job.

Visit citizens information to find out your social welfare entitlements.

Mrs OBumble

Azothpoker wrote: »

This would be means tested up to €180 would it? If I can get 3 days then its likely id still be doing 20 hours which would be more than the 180, so there would be no extra cash coming in.

It's based on days worked, not hours or amount of money earnt.

Work four days a week, and you get nothing. Work three days a week, and you can sign for two days.

IMHO: Keep the contract - work is better than none. Look for either another p/t job in your off days, or something else totall. If you're on the dole, you're needing to be looking for full time work all the time. But if you're working part time, there's a bit more flex in your life.

Azothpoker

Ill negotiate with them that itll be no more than 3 days pw. And really push the remote work option. dont want to be paying out transport etc from that wage.

Wompa1

Azothpoker wrote: »

Ill negotiate with them that itll be no more than 3 days pw. And really push the remote work option. dont want to be paying out transport etc from that wage.

Why not say you'll work 4 days remote or 3 days coming into the Office. Hedge your bets. 3 day with the expense of going into the Office but having the dole cover those costs and then some vs Working 4 days without those costs

Azothpoker

put on the table that I would work 3 days a week and they refused. They want me to come in 2 days a week, and do 2 days at home. and don't want to budge.

The net take home is also less than I first worked out.

So they aren't exactly helping me.

My take home pay would be only slightly over the dole payout, which is nullified buy travel expenses. Can't see the benefit of taking a part time position for more effort and less pay then the dole.

Since there are no associated benefits with this position, and what looks like no progression Im going to have to turn it down.

Guffy

Azothpoker wrote: »

put on the table that I would work 3 days a week and they refused. They want me to come in 2 days a week, and do 2 days at home. and don't want to budge.

The net take home is also less than I first worked out.

So they aren't exactly helping me.

My take home pay would be only slightly over the dole payout, which is nullified buy travel expenses. Can't see the benefit of taking a part time position for more effort and less pay then the dole.

Since there are no associated benefits with this position, and what looks like no progression Im going to have to turn it down.

Wat if u don't get another job straight away? Gap in cv not good

sligoface

A gap in your CV (which you don't even have yet) is not the boogeyman many make it out to be, everyone knows what the job market is like and that temp contracts end. I'd be much more concerned about how you will afford to live off the dole if you take that option. I lost my job in November, I split the rent on a 500 p/m house, and it can be tough to make ends meet at times, fwiw.

What will your take home pay be exactly? If it was 4 full days, your take home pay would be considerably more than the dole. But if they want 20 hours over 4 days that is only five hrs per day. What reason have they given for not allowing you to do the 20 over 3 days?

I agree with you that it sounds like they are going to try and get full time work out of a part time worker and basically, you are being screwed because they are making you spread your 20 hours over 4 days. Part time work is usually only good if you can keep it to three days and work long shifts, otherwise you work that fourth day for nothing or very little considering you would be signing for two days if you only worked 3, but when you work 4 you get nothing. For some reason they consider a person on 4 days as the same as a full time worker and gives them no assistance, and they don't care if those days are a full 8 hours or not. By contrast, a few years ago I used to work two 12 hour shifts at the weekend in a hotel and signed for the other 3 days, totalling close to 350 per week when both incomes were added.

I'm guessing you are in an urban area by your rent. If so, and you have in-demand skills, you might not be out of work long, but using that same logic, it would be quicker for you to get out of this place that is reducing your hours and into another job as well.

Either way it looks like you are going to have a rather large reduction in your income and your rent is high (esp. considering you can't get RA). It will be a big adjustment in this regard and you will have to monitor your spending so much more which is difficult in the beginning.

I hate to say it because I know you are getting shafted, but even if you are only 40-50 euro better off by working, that 40-50 euro might be sorely needed because you won't have much left over after rent. But if your rent was cheaper I would definitely agree, it's not worth it to work that schedule and you're work is bound to suffer due to not only the reduced hours, but the resentment you will be feeling as you are working for barely more than the dole, bc the company that reduced your hours couldn't even cut you a break and let you do them over 3 days so you could get something from the dole to make up the difference.

It really depends on if you think you would be on the dole for long, as I don't think you could afford to live off of it for long with rent that high. But also we don't know exactly what the difference would be between your take home pay and the dole.

And just as an aside, being on the dole while your live-in OH works can strain a relationship if it ends up being a long term thing, as the working person can get resentful, worry about what would happen if they also became unemployed, feel under pressure, etc. Likewise the non working person can get down on themselves, esp. in the current job market where you can be sending out CVs all the time and not even getting responses because the amount of vacancies is dwarfed by the amount of applicants, where sometimes there isn't even anything that you feel you could chance your arm applying for, and on top of that you get all kinds of labels placed on you for drawing the dole, even if it isn't your fault or it's just for a short time and are genuinely seeking work and you've paid plenty of tax when you were employed. While everyone knows about the recession, people still scoff if the man in a relationship is not working and the woman is. It's not fun when you are out together and people ask what you do. I've been both the working and non-working partner at times in different relationships so speaking from experience. Anyway, it might not be an issue for yourselves at all but just something to be aware of before voluntarily joining the dole queue.

Basically, if you want to turn it down you would have to be able to either:
A) make ends meet off 188 a week, which will be tough long term if you stay in the current flat, unless you have a good bit of savings, or your GF takes on more of the expenses or
Be able to get a new job fairly quickly.

The most important factors to think about are, what is the difference going to be between the dole and your take home pay with reduced hours, ie: will that extra bit mean the difference between making ends meet or not, and how long you think it will take to find a new job based on your location and current demand for your skills.

kryptonmight

I haven't read all the replies but I *think I would just take the part time hours and use the extra time you have to work on other things/look for other jobs. It is irritating that they won't let you do the 3 day thing but it seems like they won't budge on that. Will they even let you adjust your part-time hours now, so maybe you don't have to be in for 9am or whatever your current start time is?

I think if it were me, I'd just be doing as little as possible in the job while looking for something else. I have this nagging feeling that they might try and get you to do more than your 20 hours per week but of course not pay you anything extra.

I was unemployed for about 3 months last year. I applied for jobseekers benefit straight away but I had to wait about 3-4 weeks before I got an appointment at the social welfare office. I don't know where you live OP but it may be a longer wait. There's a thread somewhere else here on boards where people detail their waiting time for appointments at their local office and how long they had to wait to get their payments etc. It was my first time claiming here and I was PAYE and had enough contributions so I could get jobseekers benefit rather than jobseekers allowance. The latter is means tested as far as I know so it can take longer to get. I think the former is more straight forward to get but I'm not sure what your own situation is here OP and if you qualify for it.

I looked into rent allowance as well but didn't bother applying for it in the end. My rent is over their limit and while they said they might pay it temporarily (3 months max), there was going to be a lot of hassle involved in trying to claim it. From what I remember they wanted pay slips, work references, a copy of my lease (I don't have one anymore as the one I had expired) and I think some other stuff as well but I don't remember what it was. I figured I would get work sooner rather than later so didn't pursue it. In the end I was out of work for 3 months or so and got something but I was rapidly running out of cash. You'll need to consider whether you have enough cash to tie you over even if you get job seekers. I remember seeing in the dole office, signs encouraging people to take part-time work if they can.