Sean O'Rourke V Pat Kenny

newcavanman

Im guessing this thread will only be interesting to a particular group of people, ie, those who previously listened to PK when he was on rte. Since PK moved to Newstalk I find that now there is a choice, for when one of those topics that bore the arse of me comes on.
I have to confess, I have been surprised at how good SOR has been. When Pat moved to NT I was listening to NT straight thru, Yates ,followed by Pat. As usual, there are some topics im not interested in,so you, flick over to SOR, and hey presto, a better than even chance there will be something interesting on the opposition. Doesnt seem to matter which side you are listening to, if they have some crap on, you will likely find something better on the other side, and the ad breaks dont clash.
My main problem seems to be, the chance that I will miss Paddy O'Gorman, as there is no set pattern as to what time he will be on.
Anyway just wondering what those who listen to serious stuff from 10-12 on weekdays, think of the current situation?

iwantmydinner

newcavanman wrote: »

Im guessing this thread will only be interesting to a particular group of people, ie, those who previously listened to PK when he was on rte. Since PK moved to Newstalk I find that now there is a choice, for when one of those topics that bore the arse of me comes on.
I have to confess, I have been surprised at how good SOR has been. When Pat moved to NT I was listening to NT straight thru, Yates ,followed by Pat. As usual, there are some topics im not interested in,so you, flick over to SOR, and hey presto, a better than even chance there will be something interesting on the opposition. Doesnt seem to matter which side you are listening to, if they have some crap on, you will likely find something better on the other side, and the ad breaks dont clash.
My main problem seems to be, the chance that I will miss Paddy O'Gorman, as there is no set pattern as to what time he will be on.
Anyway just wondering what those who listen to serious stuff from 10-12 on weekdays, think of the current situation?

Much the same as yourself, chop and change. I also think PK sounds more energetic or something, the move seems to have worked well for him. Was always a fan of SOR so knew he'd work in the slot. His light touch on the fluffier topics has surprised me though, he's much more comfortable with them than PK was in the RTE setting!

constitutionus

me three.

been a winner all around for myself as theres now a decent choice should one program be a bit naff. particularly love the fact i dont have to put up with MLOD anymore (and paddy to a lesser degree, i get a laugh out of how shocked he is at stuff thats been blindingly obvious to the rest of the country for years)

on the down side pat, whilst i agree has more energy and drive than ive heard from him in years (which i put down to not having to deal with RTE anymore), does seem to be dealing with ALOT more trivial stuff. i want the hard hitting current affairs he's brilliant at yet im getting alot more fluff peices.

still as said thats when i can switch to sean. TBH though im really not doing it as much as i thought i would. personally, besides the odd over the top confrontational reaction to some guests, seans been playing a blinder IMO.

Itll be very interesting to see how the ratings pan out once pats got his first 6mths under his belt. i just hope that if it IS bad for sean its not taken as being akin to the turbridy/ryan situation as i think the guys doing as well as could be expected from somone having to jump into such a large breech.

either way im hoping this lasts as its worked out great for the listeners.

mike65

Old habits die hard so I hardly think to listen to SOR, RTE don't help themselves with the desert between 9 and 10, so the radio ends up on NT (if not on BBC radio 4) which means PK has the advantage.

constitutionus

i think thats a big weakness for RTE.

Invariably what ivan and chris are going on about between 9 and 10 is inane bollocks too, but at least if feels like theres some form of continuity.

theres a jarring shift between morning ireland and the murray show.

i stick with newstalk myself too so its probably a testement to sean if he gets people to switch

iwantmydinner

I can't be doing with the JM show at all. I always check what's on NT breakfast after MI but 9 times out of 10 it's pure cack. It turns into a lottery of whatever catches my attention after that. That 9 hour really needs tackling.

newcavanman

constitutionus wrote: »

me three.

been a winner all around for myself as theres now a decent choice should one program be a bit naff. particularly love the fact i dont have to put up with MLOD anymore (and paddy to a lesser degree, i get a laugh out of how shocked he is at stuff thats been blindingly obvious to the rest of the country for years)

on the down side pat, whilst i agree has more energy and drive than ive heard from him in years (which i put down to not having to deal with RTE anymore), does seem to be dealing with ALOT more trivial stuff. i want the hard hitting current affairs he's brilliant at yet im getting alot more fluff peices.

still as said thats when i can switch to sean. TBH though im really not doing it as much as i thought i would. personally, besides the odd over the top confrontational reaction to some guests, seans been playing a blinder IMO.

Itll be very interesting to see how the ratings pan out once pats got his first 6mths under his belt. i just hope that if it IS bad for sean its not taken as being akin to the turbridy/ryan situation as i think the guys doing as well as could be expected from somone having to jump into such a large breech.

either way im hoping this lasts as its worked out great for the listeners.

Have to agree with you 100% MLOD must be the greatest waste of space, with the posible exception of John Murray , that RTE has ever produced

Mr Pseudonym

I must say, guys, you are a lot more positive than I am. I was convinced that Newstalk would invigorate the slot, bringing originality and a fresh approach. I thought that, in response, RTE would completely renew its schedule, get rid of John Murray's show, and maybe replace Kenny with two presenters or split the show in two: current affairs/politics and culture/arts. Instead, nothing has changed at RTE, and Newstalk has almost entirely replicated Kenny's magazine-format RTE show, complete with Friday panel and resident reporter. As Mick Heaney said in his Irish Times column, the change has resulted in less diversity on Irish radio: if that type of broadcasting doesn't entertain, one has no talk-show alternatives.

Also, I would be greatly surprised if Kenny surpasses 180/200k listeners; I think the best he can hope for is to bring about a quarter of his previous audience.

iwantmydinner

Mr Pseudonym wrote: »

I must say, guys, you are a lot more positive than I am. I was convinced that Newstalk would invigorate the slot, bringing originality and a fresh approach. I thought that, in response, RTE would completely renew its schedule, get rid of John Murray's show, and maybe replace Kenny with two presenters or split the show in two: current affairs/politics and culture/arts. Instead, nothing has changed at RTE, and Newstalk has almost entirely replicated Kenny's magazine-format RTE show, complete with Friday panel and resident reporter. As Mick Heaney said in his Irish Times column, the change has resulted in less diversity on Irish radio: if that type of broadcasting doesn't entertain, one has no talk-show alternatives.

Also, I would be greatly surprised if Kenny surpasses 180/200k listeners; I think the best he can hope for is to bring about a quarter of his previous audience.

How would you change PK's NT slot?

Mr Pseudonym

Well, I’m not in media, and I hadn’t really considered what they would do. I just assumed it would be different from what it was previously. But, since you’ve set me a challenge, here goes...

I think it should attempt to be less studio-based. Whenever there’s a significant public event, the Pat Kenny Show is there! I would have done a PK road show for the first few weeks, having the show held somewhere different every few days.

There is huge appetite for Liveline-type content (second most listened-to show in the country, despite not being in a traditionally prominent slot). Kenny could have had a Frontline of the radio, with more listener interaction and perhaps with a studio audience (*I'm aware that Newstalk only has one studio, and it's tiny).

It strikes me that the listenership of 10-12/12:30 slot is not your politics-hungry Prime Time watcher. Coming after John Murray, I'd say a large amount of them like listening to the radio, and PK/SOR is the best that's on. Therefore, they are less interested in heavy interviews. Therefore, more attempts at appealing to them.

I haven't given it much thought, and it's not the show I would listen to, but if I were trying to maximise my listenership, I would try to differentiate the show in some way.

iwantmydinner

Mr Pseudonym wrote: »

Well, I’m not in media, and I hadn’t really considered what they would do. I just assumed it would be different from what it was previously. But, since you’ve set me a challenge, here goes...

I think it should attempt to be less studio-based. Whenever there’s a significant public event, the Pat Kenny Show is there. I would have done a PK road show for the first few weeks, having the show held somewhere different every few days.

There is huge appetite for Liveline-type content (second most listened-to show in the country, despite not being in a traditionally prominent slot). Kenny could have had a Frontline of the radio, with more listener interaction and perhaps with a studio audience (*I'm aware that Newstalk only has one studio, and it's tiny).

It strikes me that the listenership of 10-12/12:30 slot is not your politics-hungry Prime Time watcher. Coming after John Murray, I'd say a large amount of them like listening to the radio, and PK/SOR is the best that's on. Therefore, they are less interested in heavy interviews. Therefore, more attempts at appealing to them.

I haven't given it much thought, and it's not the show I would listen to, but if I were trying to maximise my listenership, I would try to differentiate the show in some way.

I don't agree, but see where you're coming from.

NT tried the Liveline thing with Tom Dunne, it painfully failed. The JNLRs were woeful and getting worse. If people like Liveline they just listen to Liveline!

Getting out and about more is an idea alright, although it's a costly operation. PK is Denis O'Brien's shiny new toy and will probably throw loads of money at making it/him work, so there could be more scope for that. They'd certainly get the audiences.

Having worked (and been quite successful) in radio before making a career change, I know from experience that listeners don't really want you to try to reinvent the wheel. NT wanted to get Radio 1 listeners over to their side. Those listeners want the PK they know and can predict. If I was station editor, I'd basically be doing exactly what they are doing!

Mr Pseudonym

iwantmydinner wrote: »

I don't agree, but see where you're coming from.

NT tried the Liveline thing with Tom Dunne, it painfully failed. The JNLRs were woeful and getting worse. If people like Liveline they just listen to Liveline!

Getting out and about more is an idea alright, although it's a costly operation. PK is Denis O'Brien's shiny new toy and will probably throw loads of money at making it/him work, so there could be more scope for that. They'd certainly get the audiences.

Having worked (and been quite successful) in radio before making a career change, I know from experience that listeners don't really want you to try to reinvent the wheel. NT wanted to get Radio 1 listeners over to their side. Those listeners want the PK they know and can predict. If I was station editor, I'd basically be doing exactly what they are doing!

Maybe we'll restart this discussion after JNLRs come out in a few days, because I don't think Newstalk will have brought over many listeners, and therefore think they ought to have reinvented the wheel.

I'll concede your point if the JNLRs are very favourable.

Evan DietrichSmith

newcavanman wrote: »

Im guessing this thread will only be interesting to a particular group of people, ie, those who previously listened to PK when he was on rte. Since PK moved to Newstalk I find that now there is a choice, for when one of those topics that bore the arse of me comes on.
I have to confess, I have been surprised at how good SOR has been. When Pat moved to NT I was listening to NT straight thru, Yates ,followed by Pat. As usual, there are some topics im not interested in,so you, flick over to SOR, and hey presto, a better than even chance there will be something interesting on the opposition. Doesnt seem to matter which side you are listening to, if they have some crap on, you will likely find something better on the other side, and the ad breaks dont clash.
My main problem seems to be, the chance that I will miss Paddy O'Gorman, as there is no set pattern as to what time he will be on.
Anyway just wondering what those who listen to serious stuff from 10-12 on weekdays, think of the current situation?

I stayed with SOR after testing out PK on NT for a while.

There is something incongruous with Kenny in Newstalk,something I really can't fully explain.

Suffice to say the nearest I can get to it is if Louis Suarez signed for Bray Wanderers and lined out for them.

The pieces and the teamwork just don't fit, for me.

That's the best I can do as of now.

CountyHurler

constitutionus wrote: »

me three.been a winner all around for myself as theres now a decent choice should one program be a bit naff.

It truly is a golden age for 10am-12.30pm radio... Love the extra half hour on NT as well. Switch back and forth between the two, probably starting off with Sean O'Rourke cos RTE usually gets the top guest for the first half hour.

Now lets see if they can do anything with the 9am-10am slot before it. If I have to listen to one more John Murray "comedy" item, Jesus H Christ..

Loafing Oaf

Mr Pseudonym wrote: »

I must say, guys, you are a lot more positive than I am. I was convinced that Newstalk would invigorate the slot, bringing originality and a fresh approach. I thought that, in response, RTE would completely renew its schedule, get rid of John Murray's show, and maybe replace Kenny with two presenters or split the show in two: current affairs/politics and culture/arts. Instead, nothing has changed at RTE, and Newstalk has almost entirely replicated Kenny's magazine-format RTE show, complete with Friday panel and resident reporter. As Mick Heaney said in his Irish Times column, the change has resulted in less diversity on Irish radio: if that type of broadcasting doesn't entertain, one has no talk-show alternatives.

Also, I would be greatly surprised if Kenny surpasses 180/200k listeners; I think the best he can hope for is to bring about a quarter of his previous audience.

Well I told them at the time they should move whoever was replacing PK back to 9 and then bring back Tubridy for 11-1 but for some inexplicable reason they wouldn't listen to some random guy on boards.ie.!

Generally agree that both shows are sticking too closely to the old Today with PK formula and Pat is struggling a bit to fill the two and a half hours (hence the Fionn Davenport history via Wikipedia slot) but in general I appreciate the choice of serious content that time of the morning.

Btw great to read genuinely constructive and thoughtful criticism on a forum, all Internet discussions should be like this one. If this thread was on politics.ie most posts would be asserting with total certainty that both PK and SOR are mouthpieces of FF/FG/Lab/MI5/the military-industrial complex/the Illuminati...

dixiefly

iwantmydinner wrote: »

I can't be doing with the JM show at all. I always check what's on NT breakfast after MI but 9 times out of 10 it's pure cack. It turns into a lottery of whatever catches my attention after that. That 9 hour really needs tackling.

newcavanman wrote: »

Have to agree with you 100% MLOD must be the greatest waste of space, with the posible exception of John Murray , that RTE has ever produced

Sorry but what is MLOD?

Loafing Oaf

dixiefly wrote: »

Sorry but what is MLOD?

Marie-Louise O'Donnell. If you're not familiar with her 'work', well, count your lucky stars...

dixiefly

I am usually working but sometimes driving or off etc and I have found myself gravitating towards Sean O'Rourke.maybe it is a natural tendency to stick with RTE but I only switch to PK now if there is a particular hot topic that I think that Kenny should get stuck into.

I find the John Murray show ok myself. The pieces are easy enough listening and you can listen to a few topics that you wouldn't normally go near. On top of that I just cringe any time I listen to Ivan Yates as he is a reconstituted bankrupt businessman/ politician. Of course everyone is entitled to a second chance but I find it difficult to listen to him give his opinions etc. I just can't help thinking that he is a bit of a hypocrite and that there must be many journalists that are not getting a fair whack when semi celibrities jump the queue into these positions.

Maybe if I listened to JM every day my opinion would change. As a total out of the box suggestion how would a combined show presented by both Murray and SOR FROM 9:00am to 11:30am work with Ronan Collins following on at 11:30 until 1:00pm? JM could do the lighter stuff with SOR doing the harder stuff with the balance dictated by the relevance of the days news. Also Ronan Collins show should be a bit longer.

dixiefly

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

Marie-Louise O'Donnell. If you're not familiar with her 'work', well, count your lucky stars...

Thanks, don't think I will research that.

Evan DietrichSmith

dixiefly wrote: »

I am usually working but sometimes driving or off etc and I have found myself gravitating towards Sean O'Rourke.maybe it is a natural tendency to stick with RTE but I only switch to PK now if there is a particular hot topic that I think that Kenny should get stuck into.

I find the John Murray show ok myself. The pieces are easy enough listening and you can listen to a few topics that you wouldn't normally go near. On top of that I just cringe any time I listen to Ivan Yates as he is a reconstituted bankrupt businessman/ politician. Of course everyone is entitled to a second chance but I find it difficult to listen to him give his opinions etc. I just can't help thinking that he is a bit of a hypocrite and that there must be many journalists that are not getting a fair whack when semi celibrities jump the queue into these positions.

Maybe if I listened to JM every day my opinion would change. As a total out of the box suggestion how would a combined show presented by both Murray and SOR FROM 9:00am to 11:30am work with Ronan Collins following on at 11:30 until 1:00pm? JM could do the lighter stuff with SOR doing the harder stuff with the balance dictated by the relevance of the days news. Also Ronan Collins show should be a bit longer.

:eek:.

Ronan Collins show a bit longer!!!

Please say you have drink taken!!!

iwantmydinner

Jaysus, tis less Ronan Collins we need, not more.

Like, 100% less.

newcavanman

dixiefly wrote: »

Thanks, don't think I will research that.[/quote
I think she was a lecturer in DCU, then she started doing occassional pieces on PK, now I she is a senator as well. .
Love to know how she fits it all in

dixiefly

Evan DietrichSmith wrote: »

:eek:.

Ronan Collins show a bit longer!!!

Please say you have drink taken!!!

Sadly no.

Ronan Collins has quite a loyal listenership and the people that do listen are not catered for on 2fm. Maybe the big fans are over 50 yrs but that is a very important portion of the listenership on RTE radio.

In my opinion, news and talk programmes between 7am and 12:0pm is a little too much especially as there are also two
talk programmes in the afternoon.

leggo

For what I want PK and SOR for, both as a collective supply the goods. I like Pat broadening his wings with more general stuff (historical pieces etc) while SOR continues to get the higher profile guests and tends to grill them well, his long tenure on News serving him well by getting right to the cutting questions with no fluff. They both offer something similar but different, like if they cover the same subject I'll instantly know which one I want to hear (depending on the topic), so I'm happy with how it's worked out.

Rabelais

I've no time for Collins as a presenter; he's just dialling the show in at this stage. The 12.30 to 1 slot is a bit of a weak point. Newstalk need to get Pat Kenny in for the final half hour, as the current Lunchtime segment does very little right in my opinion.

That said, I know plenty of people, including the aul lad, who listen to Collin's daily. It's the type of music and request show that needs to move to 2FM. Might get that demographic over to 2FM, as the whippersnappers and hipsters certainly aren't listening to it.