Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on [email protected] for help. Thanks :)
Private profiles - please note that profiles marked as private will soon be public. This will facilitate moderation so mods can view users' warning histories. All of your posts across the site will appear on your profile page (including PI, RI). Groups posts will remain private except to users who have access to the same Groups as you. Thread here
Some important site news, please read here. Thanks!

Levafas Diamond

  • 12-01-2014 10:37am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 102 ✭✭ jmurf100


    Dosed all the cattle there on thursday with the recommended dose of levafas diamond for rumen fluke. They are scuttering everywhere since but not off food (was expecting they would). I have read here on boards that they should be dosed again in 3 days. Do they need this second dose and if so is it the same amount again?


«1

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 2,262 Farrell


    jmurf100 wrote: »
    Dosed all the cattle there on thursday with the recommended dose of levafas diamond for rumen fluke. They are scuttering everywhere since but not off food (was expecting they would). I have read here on boards that they should be dosed again in 3 days. Do they need this second dose and if so is it the same amount again?

    I only did the once, don't see any draw-back. Didn't realize about the second dose


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,269 ✭✭✭ J.O. Farmer


    3 days sounds very quick I would check that out before I do it. If you are dosing again it will be the same rate. Personally I would have thought 3 weeks would be plenty soon and probably closer to twice that.
    Does it give any recommendations on the box or bottle. If you have to dose in 3 days pharma companies won't be slow about pointing it out as more dosing=more sales.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,314 ✭✭✭ epfff


    3 days sounds very quick I would check that out before I do it. If you are dosing again it will be the same rate. Personally I would have thought 3 weeks would be plenty soon and probably closer to twice that.
    Does it give any recommendations on the box or bottle. If you have to dose in 3 days pharma companies won't be slow about pointing it out as more dosing=more sales.

    I only ever do it once

    Are you thinking of zanil


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,274 ✭✭✭ Bodacious


    jmurf100 wrote: »
    Dosed all the cattle there on thursday with the recommended dose of levafas diamond for rumen fluke. They are scuttering everywhere since but not off food (was expecting they would). I have read here on boards that they should be dosed again in 3 days. Do they need this second dose and if so is it the same amount again?



    I wouldn't dose again ..they be fine,, I dosed heifers before with it and gave them a little bit more than the 25ml per 100kg and it ran the guts out of them and they wouldn't eat but they were fine after it


    good dose but hard on cattle and never overdose thinking you are doing a good thing


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,282 Deepsouthwest


    Bodacious wrote: »
    I wouldn't dose again ..they be fine,, I dosed heifers before with it and gave them a little bit more than the 25ml per 100kg and it ran the guts out of them and they wouldn't eat but they were fine after it


    good dose but hard on cattle and never overdose thinking you are doing a good thing
    The fact that they're scuttery after the last dose is supposedly a sign that they needed it. I definitely wouldn't go again after 3 days, sounds v severe. Wait 2/3 wks, then do a dung sample and you'll know for sure what they will need, if anything


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 6 ✭✭✭ rlaois


    I do the same, dose - then take a few dung samples after 3 weeks. Doing it this way a few years and works fine.

    I definitely wouldn't go twice in such a short space of time with levafas.


  • Registered Users Posts: 451 ✭✭ mikeoh


    Bullocks I killed had rumen fluke last year i did remaining batch once with LD and they killed out clear ..........vet warned me to give less than the recommended dose as its very severe and only give it the once


  • Registered Users Posts: 102 ✭✭ jmurf100


    Ya I think I'll leave them and see how they go, thanks for all the replies! It must have been the Zanil that needs 2 doses?


  • Registered Users Posts: 828 ✭✭✭ TUBBY


    I find it good but severe too. As far as scoury after goes, I don't think that cause they had a burden. It is more a reaction to the active.

    Three days way too fast to dose again with a full dose. They would not have the full first dose gone out of the system by then so you are effectively overdosing.

    Would only do once myself and keep eye for ill thrift in any.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,643 biddy2013


    I read the leaflet online. Didn't see any mention of redosing at 3 days on it


  • Advertisement
  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 8,752 Mod ✭✭✭✭ greysides


    Two extracts from an article in the Australian Veterinary Journal:

    When a combination product of oxyclozanide and levamisole was used, oxyclozanide at 18.7 mg/kg reduced parasite numbers in the small intestine, abomasum and rumen-reticulum by 61 to 96.1%, 50.0 to 92.6% and 56.5 to 98.1%, respectively. When 2 doses were given 3 days apart, oxyclozanide was 99.9%, 100% and 100% effective, respectively, in the above organs, and produced improvement in clinically affected calves.

    Further tests based on reduction of faecal egg counts, 10 to 14 days after treatment were conducted with oxyclozanide against mature paramphistomes in 207 cattle. Oxyclozanide as a single dose or 2 doses 3 days apart at 12.8 to 18.7 mg/kg was 93.6 to 97.5% effective in reducing egg counts.


    Note the basis of the percentages. The first tests were based on treatment and slaughter, the second on faecal analysis.

    The aim of argument, or of discussion, should not be victory, but progress. Joseph Joubert



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,269 ✭✭✭ J.O. Farmer


    greysides wrote: »
    Two extracts from an article in the Australian Veterinary Journal:

    When a combination product of oxyclozanide and levamisole was used, oxyclozanide at 18.7 mg/kg reduced pparasite numbers in the small intestine, abomasum and rumen-reticulum by 61 to 96.1%, 50.0 to 92.6% and 56.5 to 98.1%, respectively. When 2 doses were given 3 days apart, oxyclozanide was 99.9%, 100% and 100% effective, respectively, in the above organs, and produced improvement in clinically affected calves.

    Further tests based on reduction of faecal egg counts, 10 to 14 days after treatment were conducted with oxyclozanide against mature paramphistomes in 207 cattle. Oxyclozanide as a single dose or 2 doses 3 days apart at 12.8 to 18.7 mg/kg was 93.6 to 97.5% effective in reducing egg counts.


    Note the basis of the percentages. The first tests were based on treatment and slaughter, the second on faecal analysis.

    Based on the first set of results it would appear to me that the sensitivity of the parasites present seemed to vary hugely. I can see why a second dose might be recommended at the lower end but I think where over 90% kill was achieved it is difficult to justify. The problem I see is determining the level of sensitivity.

    In the second study it appears at least 2 concentrations were used and the reduction in FEC was similar but they also appear to have used 1 or 2 doses. Was there any notable difference in the dosing regimes although again with over 90% reduction it seems difficult to justify the second dose.
    Personally based on the data presented here I would probably dose once first and then if I felt that it wasn't working on my farm I would perhaps try dosing 3 days apart. However the concern I would have is the requirement for 2 doses may indicate a developing resistance problem which may get worse.
    That's my thoughts on it what do others think. Greysides you found the data what's your thoughts on it. I'm sure you have some.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 8,752 Mod ✭✭✭✭ greysides


    Based on the first set of results it would appear to me that the sensitivity of the parasites present seemed to vary hugely......The problem I see is determining the level of sensitivity.

    The 'sensitivity' is just the natural variation inherent in a biological system, hence the reason that a lot of statistics and statistical terms are used in reports.
    In the second study it appears at least 2 concentrations were used and the reduction in FEC was similar but they also appear to have used 1 or 2 doses. Was there any notable difference in the dosing regimes although again with over 90% reduction it seems difficult to justify the second dose.



    In France where this parasite is a normal pathogen.....the French use Zanil at a double dose (i.e 20 mg/Kg instead of 10 mg/Kg) when bringing the cows in Dec and a clean-up dose 2 months later, or, wait till Feb and then give one double dose.

    So the people with more experience in this take it seriously. I think the high dosage is due to the parasite not being readily affected by the chemical.


    Personally based on the data presented here I would probably dose once first and then if I felt that it wasn't working on my farm I would perhaps try dosing 3 days apart.

    That would seem a reasonable approach buttttt.....

    One thing to remember is that the first part of the report dealt with reduction in numbers (calves treated, slaughtered and parasites physically counted) of the parasite in three places (two of which are clinically important). The adults in the rumen are considered as non-pathogenic, it is the immatures in the gut that cause the problems. The second report dealt with a reduction in faecal egg counts.... and, of course, eggs are only laid by mature, non-pathogenic adults.

    So the information to go by is the first part.

    Immature Rumen-fluke are very polite, they will wait in situ in the gut until places become available in the rumen and then they will move up. This could be the reason that drugs effective against adults give some relief.... the immatures move away from where they are causing problems to the rumen where they don't.

    Personally, I wouldn't have thought Rumen Fluke would be a problem this year.............. if ever there was a year when they wouldn't ....... :)

    The aim of argument, or of discussion, should not be victory, but progress. Joseph Joubert



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,269 ✭✭✭ J.O. Farmer


    Thank you greysides for your insight. I would have to agree with you on everything. You clearly have good knowledge in relation to biological systems and I can learn a lot from your insight.
    greysides wrote: »
    The 'sensitivity' is just the natural variation inherent in a biological system, hence the reason that a lot of statistics and statistical terms are used in reports.


    I know what you're saying. I haven't read the report and I just thought the huge variation was between samples from different areas and therefore different strains of the same species. However I can see how this variation be within the assay. I have a good bit of experience doing this type of thing with bacteria but less with things like fluke.
    The sensitivity I was referring to was on an individual farm for the particular strain found there.


    In France where this parasite is a normal pathogen.....the French use Zanil at a double dose (i.e 20 mg/Kg instead of 10 mg/Kg) when bringing the cows in Dec and a clean-up dose 2 months later, or, wait till Feb and then give one double dose.

    So the people with more experience in this take it seriously. I think the high dosage is due to the parasite not being readily affected by the chemical.


    This would worry me in that if it is already not readily affected then full resistance may follow.


    That would seem a reasonable approach buttttt.....

    One thing to remember is that the first part of the report dealt with reduction in numbers (calves treated, slaughtered and parasites physically counted) of the parasite in three places (two of which are clinically important). The adults in the rumen are considered as non-pathogenic, it is the immatures in the gut that cause the problems. The second report dealt with a reduction in faecal egg counts.... and, of course, eggs are only laid by mature, non-pathogenic adults.

    So the information to go by is the first part.

    I agree with you on that.

    Immature Rumen-fluke are very polite, they will wait in situ in the gut until places become available in the rumen and then they will move up. This could be the reason that drugs effective against adults give some relief.... the immatures move away from where they are causing problems to the rumen where they don't.

    Personally, I wouldn't have thought Rumen Fluke would be a problem this year.............. if ever there was a year when they wouldn't ....... :)

    All that makes perfect sense.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 8,752 Mod ✭✭✭✭ greysides


    J.O.

    Here's a link to the article, if you have assess to a library you may be able to read the full article.

    There may be other drugs that are effective against them that we don't have access to in this country.

    Albendazole has some activity against immatures but I've never seen it mentioned in Irish literature.


    http://journals.usamvcluj.ro/index.php/zootehnie/article/download/2228/2141
    Quote:
    "Rombendazol, has a medium efficacy, the literature showing the fact that the active
    substance has no action on the parasite mature forms."

    The aim of argument, or of discussion, should not be victory, but progress. Joseph Joubert



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,274 ✭✭✭ Bodacious


    I dosed my outwintered bulling heifers on Nov 9th with levafas diamond and ivermectin (turbomec) injection for worm, lice ,ticks etc. Im moving them tomorrow and was going to allsure bolus them as wont get my hands on them again for a while.. they coughin slightly and definitely licking themselves.... I was going to go turbomec injection again (as I have it) and either Zanil or levafas diamond again...are they the same active ingredient?


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,269 ✭✭✭ J.O. Farmer


    Bodacious wrote: »
    I dosed my outwintered bulling heifers on Nov 9th with levafas diamond and ivermectin (turbomec) injection for worm, lice ,ticks etc. Im moving them tomorrow and was going to allsure bolus them as wont get my hands on them again for a while.. they coughin slightly and definitely licking themselves.... I was going to go turbomec injection again (as I have it) and either Zanil or levafas diamond again...are they the same active ingredient?

    Yes zanil and levafas have the same active ingredient but levafas has levamisole as well to treat worms.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,274 ✭✭✭ Bodacious


    Yes zanil and levafas have the same active ingredient but levafas has levamisole as well to treat worms.



    Might use up the zanil as ivermectin should get the worms too


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,066 restive


    Is there any problem with dosing levitas diamond at the same time as normectin.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 8,752 Mod ✭✭✭✭ greysides


    Not that I'm aware of...... other than the element of overkill.

    The aim of argument, or of discussion, should not be victory, but progress. Joseph Joubert



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 9,656 ✭✭✭ patsy_mccabe


    Guys, with the benefit of hindsight, just how good is Levafas Diamond? I see most places online are sold out, so it must be used a lot.

    I know it's good for Stomach Fluke, just how good is it for Liver Fluke and worms? Last year my dung samples from BEEP showed Stomach Fluke eggs, so my vet recommended waiting till Christmas and dosing then with Levafas Diamond. They all got 2 treatments too for lice with Ectospec.

    Problem is I got a bad outbreak of Hoose Pneumonia in 2 young cows and a 2 year old heifer in September this year. I lost the heifer and both cows made it after a lot of expensive treatments. I blamed my change of not using an ivermectin pouron at housing on the cows. It's at least 15 years here since we had a case of pneumonia.

    This winter vet said to use Dectomax as Doromectin based so maybe better to give a worm cleanout. I'm wondering then if the Levafas diamond will cover then for the Liverfluke and Stomach fluke. (Stomach Fluke only showed up on the BEEP samples this year.)

    " And on the riverbank forgotten the river's name."



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 8,752 Mod ✭✭✭✭ greysides


    It's hard to see how a dose given the previous winter could have an effect on Hoose 9 months later. There was a lot of Hoose this autumn.

    If you've used a lot of ivomec type wormers at grass over the years, it's possible older animals haven't developed immunity to Hoose through lack of exposure and annual boostering.

    The aim of argument, or of discussion, should not be victory, but progress. Joseph Joubert



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,656 ✭✭✭ patsy_mccabe


    Ya, I've been thinking that too. Resistance build up to Ivermectin. Vet said the same. All 3 animals were born here and I would have used Noromectin maybe 3 times on them the first year.

    It was some shock to find all 3 heavy breathing and lying down together.

    Is Levafas Diamond good for Liverfluke and worms? Kinda asking this for va young relative aswell as he has to dose for stomach fluke.

    " And on the riverbank forgotten the river's name."



  • Registered Users Posts: 849 ✭✭✭ Easten


    afaik Levafas is used for stomach fluke. It's a good dose but be warned it's fairly severe on cows and don't over dose.



  • Registered Users Posts: 499 ✭✭ ABitofsense


    It is very severe on cows! They will destroy the place. I weighed and dosed to be sure they got the right amount. Vet said if they are badly needed for a dose to possibly split the dosing to reduce any risk to the animal.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,656 ✭✭✭ patsy_mccabe


    Well here's the Spec Sheet from HPRA.ie

    It does say

    "For the treatment and control of both gastro-intestinal and pulmonary nematode infections and adult liver fluke infections in cattle and sheep. Levafas Diamond Fluke and Worm Drench should be used in cases of parasitic gastroenteritis and lungworm caused by those organisms sensitive to treatment with Levamisole hydrochloride. Levamisole is effective against mature and developing immature stages of a wide range of important nematode species and is highly effective against the following:"

    Levafas Diamond Fluke and Worm Drench (hpra.ie)

    Licence_VPA22664-024-001_15012020105014.pdf (hpra.ie)

    " And on the riverbank forgotten the river's name."



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,863 ✭✭✭ Lime Tree Farm


    we have been dosing Tramazole (levamisole) and think they too have become resistant. Lots of yearling Autumn coughing this year_ Gave them Ivomec Super inj - the change of product helped stop the cough.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,926 ✭✭✭ orm0nd


    Tramazole is Albendazole base

    Vet was telling me hoose is a huge problem this year and showing long after it's expected cut off date

    We had to dose the last housed weanlings here as a good few were showing symptoms and 2 had a touch of a draw. Used dectamox as we had it to hand and wanted to break the white dose cycle.


    Hopefully we'll get away with a fluke dose and cover for lice in a few weeks.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,307 ✭✭✭ Hard Knocks


    Strangely did same here & for neighbour, we used Albex in early August, but neighbour in late August. No issue here but Neighbour had a bad time with lungworm, Had to dose his stock with Ivomec super before housing & curafluke after



  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 849 ✭✭✭ Easten


    Didn't know it did liver fluke too, that's handy to know



Advertisement