LSRs and pace

Toblerone1978

Folks

Apologies if this was already covered elsewhere in the forum but I'd be hoping someone could me some advise on the weekend LSRs.

I have a handful of marathons done to date, nothing major. The plan at the moment is to the Vienna marathon in mid-April. I'm currently following a plan for it and the intention is to stick to it fairly tight - this would be a first for me, normally I just run to train (not smart, I know now!).

I'm just wondering that come March and when I'm doing my LSRs at the weekend, could I fit a race in these? E.g. if the plan says run 18 miles LSR, would it be counterproductive if I ran a 10k race proper (trying to get a PB) and then run the remaining 12 miles immediately afterwards as a LSR proper (keeping within the HR% guidance). What about a 10 mile race?

Come March, I figure I would like to shake things up and start racing a bit more. Or is the 'S' of LSR too important a component to be meddling in?

Just in case anyone was to advise the alternative of racing one wkd day and doing the LSR another won't suit me, time wise, etc.


Thanks.

ThePiedPiper

OP,

If I' was you, I'd be very careful about trying to have a flat out 10k race in the middle of a LSR. In the end, you'll either compromise the race, the important training session, or the equally important sessions the following week.

However, that's not to suggest that you shouldn't race in the marathon build-up. The best way to go about it would be to do long runs on two consecutive weekends, then the following week, do your race. You may get away with doing a Saturday race, and a Sunday long run, but don't expect to get a lot of quality out of the long run in that case, and certainly don't stick too stubbornly to the plan if your body is telling you to stop.

Racing is a great way to improve your conditioning. In the 12 weeks coming up to my Autumn marathon last year, I raced 2 half marathons, a 5 miler, a 6k cross-country and a 5k, all at full tilt. But, in none of those weekends did I do an additional long run of more than 10 miles. In July, I did a 16 mile LSR and 3,000m race on consecutive days and I was in bits for a couple of weeks.

Listen to your body. Race hard, train smart.

BeepBeep67

Sound advice from RFR, have you considered moving your long run to midweek?

rom

What is your marathon goal time? I will be doing similar to yourself with 5 weeks out running ballycotton as a race with miles around it as a long run but mallow 3 weeks out to be run a PMP. A 10M or 1/2 seems about right to be doing this type of session with but a 10k seems a bit short.

Toblerone1978

Folks, many thanks for the sound advice, I will take this on board and just leave the races out of my LSRs (or replace them the odd time with a race). I saw some relevant advice on the thread "long run" so it's a good learning curve for me.

Unfortunately due to work restraint, I just wouldn't be able to do LSR mid-week.

rom, my current marathon PB is 3.11 so I'm hoping to go one better and go under 3.10. I love to do a sub-3 but it's not for April, maybe the DCM later in the year (although I don't know if I simply have the capability to do a sub-3 either).

Cheers folks.

physiopad

Hi Toblerone. I am also planning to do Vienna. Will be my second Marathon. Have you done it before by any chance?

Toblerone1978

physiopad wrote: »

Hi Toblerone. I am also planning to do Vienna. Will be my second Marathon. Have you done it before by any chance?

Good stuff physiopad. I haven't done it before but I decided to do it after reading a boardsie's race report. I heard it reasonably flat. I think I also heard that there is one very slight incline over 15km and that you get back that over 5km. I haven't confirmed that yet though it would be a nice boost towards an end of a race!

I still have to book this as I was going to do the Paris marthon (booked and all!) but I had to pull out due to work commitments. I'll book my place in the next few days.

Have you heard anything about this yourself?

TFBubendorfer

physiopad wrote: »

Hi Toblerone. I am also planning to do Vienna. Will be my second Marathon. Have you done it before by any chance?

I've done it and I'm happy to answer any questions you might have.
Like the OP said, it is indeed very flat.

viperlogic

I love races as can't beat that buzz and also something near term to look forward to during the marathon training plan. As most races (5K to 10M) are typically on Sundays, I move my LSR to a Friday on those weeks and juggle around a few other sessions.

Toblerone1978

TFBubendorfer wrote: »

I've done it and I'm happy to answer any questions you might have.
Like the OP said, it is indeed very flat.

Hey TFBubendorfer. Just wondering if the marathon normally has pacers, I don't see any reference to them on the website. I would have thought that a race of this size would.


Any tips on a hotel. Myself and the OH are going there on the Saturday and plan to stay there until Tuesday to take in the sites. So a hotel good for marathon and tourist purposes would be ideal!!


That's all my questions for now... cheers!

TFBubendorfer

Toblerone1978 wrote: »

Hey TFBubendorfer. Just wondering if the marathon normally has pacers, I don't see any reference to them on the website. I would have thought that a race of this side would.

Any tips on a hotel. Myself and the OH are going there on the Saturday and plan to stay there until Tuesday to take in the sites. So a hotel good for marathon and tourist purposes would be ideal!!!

There were no pacers in 2011, and if nothing is mentioned on the website I would not expect them this year either.

No ideas about hotels - we rented apartment for a week as we combined the trip with a family holiday. It's very easy to get around in Vienna as public transport is excellent, so location is no big deal.

Toblerone1978

Following on the threads above, I have another question. Next weekend will be three weeks from Vienna marathon (mid April) and I'd wouldn't mind doing a race. I'm tapering after that so I'm not worried about the quality of my mid-week runs the following week, it be more about maintenance for me there on in.

What distance race would you recommend three weeks before a marathon? What's available is a 10k, 10 mile or half-marathon. While I'll be going into the race unrest and untapered, I still be trying to give it my all (I may not be the fastest but my competitive urge gets the better of me). I was thinking of then doing an extra run before + after to bring the total to 21 miles.

TFBubendorfer

I would be careful 3 weeks out from a marathon. Definitely don't do a half marathon, and I would advice against doing extra miles on the day. I did that one, raced a 5k all out and then ran another 15 miles at good pace and it did myself more harm than good as I was fatigued for at least 2 weeks afterwards.

If you insist on racing, do a 5k or 10k, but don't combine then with a long run.