Crying it out/independent sleep

yellow hen

I hate the title crying it out but not sure what else to call this.

Our little boy has gotten into a bad habit of waking around 1am and staying awake until 3am. He has been sick on and off with chest infections so we had been lifting him into our bed to prop him up and ease the pressure on his chest. Last night though, he was just up messing and playing and cried when I put him back into his cot. He also could wake several times a night needing us to put his dodie in before he falls asleep again. So on the advice of others we're going to try get him to fall asleep independently.

I really don't want to go down the road of having him screaming crying so has anyone any advice on how to approach tonight? At the moment we're planning to go in and just stroke his cheek and shush him initially but maybe leave then and wait 5 mins before going in again. Should we try not using the dodie or is keeping him in his cot enough initially?

liliq

The No cry sleep solution, or dr Jay Gordon's methods might be helpful, they're both gentle methods

share bear

We started sleep training our five month old 2 weeks ago.

The first week was spent just getting his bedtime routine quite regimented ( we did bath, massage, bottle) and putting him down asleep like we had been doing since he was born.

Then when we started the 'crying it out phase' which was putting him down while he was sleepy after his bottle and a cuddle and leaving the room. We left him for about 5 min before going in and soothing him without picking him up. This went on for about 20 min until he put himself to sleep, we did this when he woke up in the night as well which wasn't much in comparison to what he used to.

It got easier every night and a few nights ago we had our first full nights sleep in 5 months. We also started putting him to bed earlier than we had been which I think helped.

we haven't touched the daytime naps though yet as I want yo give it a full 2 weeks. Our only problem were having now is that our little one is waking up wet or like this morning saturated right through the grow bag and were not sure if we should be waking him up to change him at some point in the night or change nappy brand?

share bear

Forgot to mention we are still using his do do. We've decided to tackle that when he's a bit older.

yellow hen

Thanks.

He actually goes down to bed fine... Although we do have to put his dodie in several times. I just want to get a nights sleep without getting up several times to out a dodie in or worse, being up for several hours at a time. We'll try tonight.... My fear is that i'll be so tired that i'll cave and just bring him into our bed though

Ms2011

I did the going in after 2,4,6,8 minutes to comfort. I rarely got to 8 minutes. I'd always try to resetle him in the cot & would only pick him up if he got really distressed.

cyning

I'd second the no cry sleep solution. It's gentle, crying it out or controlled crying just wasn't for me. We were co sleeping all the time too. Like everything pick and choose what works for you... I'm still doing 1 dody run here that yoke is getting fired out the window in the new year! But originally she was waking hourly so massive improvement. C is older than your little boy too though. I personally thought getting her in the habit of sleeping before tackling the dody was probably easiest.

bp

It does take a couple of nights for this to work. We did 'crying it out' at a young age and at about 7/8 months took the soother away. Night one will be very tough but you have to be strict (on yourselves).

The soother thing is a tough call, especially if they cannot put it back in themselves.

Go with first time in soothing words and run cheek until calm, then leave. Wait x minutes and back in, just rub the cheek this time. Then double the original increment (e.g. 5, 10, 15, 20 - up to max 20). But night one and two will be hard so do what works for you.

Good luck - oh and ps are they warm enough at night? Maybe put a circular over babba, mine sleeps better when warm

yellow hen

God I'm dreading this. Ill report back tomorrow! I'm not sure if we'll go without the dodie tonight but we'll see how we go!

Bp, he's in a grobag and I also have a heater with thermostat on in his room.
Thanks for advice everyone!

jigglypuffstuff

yellow hen wrote: »

I really don't want to go down the road of having him screaming crying so has anyone any advice on how to approach tonight? At the moment we're planning to go in and just stroke his cheek and shush him initially but maybe leave then and wait 5 mins before going in again. Should we try not using the dodie or is keeping him in his cot enough initially?

Unfortunatley that is often the road that needs to be taken. Children are funny and its best to let toddlers/preschoolers cry in certain scenarios. Whats important to remember is that infants usually cry only due to needs, whereas toddlers/preschoolers cry for wants. And as im sure you know life is not always about getting what we want

As a person who's just sleep trained my partners child successfully let me refer you to Skinners theory of operant conditioning which helped me to a great extent.

Skinner coined the term operant conditioning; it means roughly changing of behavior by the use of reinforcement which is given after the desired response. Skinner identified three types of responses or operant that can follow behavior.
• Neutral operants: responses from the environment that neither increase nor decrease the probability of a behavior being repeated.

• Reinforcers: Responses from the environment that increase the probability of a behavior being repeated. Reinforcers can be either positive or negative.

• Punishers: Response from the environment that decrease the likelihood of a behavior being repeated. Punishment weakens behavior.

Basically if you are looking to sleep train the child a good idea from my experience is put him into his bed/cot give him a kiss/hug/story or whatever the usual is and then leave the room. There is no point to stroke the child to sleep, as this only forms a sleep association (which I can see with my partners child as she no longer lies with him..he now plays with his own hair). You do not want to form a sleep association as it will only make it harder.

Now lets take an example..if the child cries and you go to the room, this gives the child the desired response, thus increasing the chances of a repeat in the behaviour, if you are in the room before you put the child to bed and the child cries and you leave the room, this creates a type of ''punishment''. the child will learn that when they are going to bed they should not cry as you will leave thus this decreases the chances of a repeat in the behaviour

Now im going to end on this note..this was the approach taken for a 20 month old who is very stubborn. Put down to bed, once the tears started leave the room, until the child puts themself to sleep, if the wake in the middle of the night, try and gauge if its genuine as in you would know if the child is sick etc. After 5 days the crying went from 1hr to 10 mins and after about 3 weeks no crying or maybe just close the door and by the time we went to the bottom of the stairs it had stopped,

Now the child not only sleeps a full 12hrs per night but is also happy to wait until his mother comes and gets him in the morning, so theres no need to for her to jump up the minute he's awake, she can get another hour if she needs it, he will happily play with his toys in his room. Also we stopped his daily nap as that was interfering

Best of luck!

Oh and he was waking 2-3 times per night too before i started the process!

yellow hen

Thanks for the replies. Pone I appreciate the time you took to write that reply and your advice is sound but on a 9 month old I don't think I'd have the heart to just leave him crying. Maybe it will come to that eventually but for now I'm going to try avoid that scenario. We done on training your partners child.

So to update on last night. He went down to bed as usual on his own at 7:30 and woke briefly for his dodie at 1am. He then slept through until 4:25 (he usually wakes before this). He cried out to be lifted and I went in to give him dodie back. We was v unsettled so we tried to wait 3 mins and then 5 mins but by then he was properly crying which isn't like him (but then he's never been ignored that long before). Eventually I gave in, much to my husbands annoyance, and u lifted him to comfort him. He eventually settled in my arms so I popped him back in cot but the minute he hit the sheet he cried again so I figure there was nothing wrong other than he wanted out! After another go of putting the dodie in, he fell asleep on his own. We'll try again tonight anyway.

bp

It is really hard, especially when you baby is crying. I learned what the different cries meant and there are some that cannot be ignored because they really really need someone. You will figure the cries out pretty quickly! Good luck tonight, routine and consistency is key.

Rachineire

I know that I couldn't have had the strength to sit and listen to my baby cry the first night when we started controlled crying. My husband did it. He said it was like torture. But it paid off and the baby sleeps great now. No harm to little guy either he was bright and cheerful and well rested the next morning. So it does pay off....just sucks getting there.

yellow hen wrote: »

Thanks for the replies. Pone I appreciate the time you took to write that reply and your advice is sound but on a 9 month old I don't think I'd have the heart to just leave him crying. Maybe it will come to that eventually but for now I'm going to try avoid that scenario. We done on training your partners child.

So to update on last night. He went down to bed as usual on his own at 7:30 and woke briefly for his dodie at 1am. He then slept through until 4:25 (he usually wakes before this). He cried out to be lifted and I went in to give him dodie back. We was v unsettled so we tried to wait 3 mins and then 5 mins but by then he was properly crying which isn't like him (but then he's never been ignored that long before). Eventually I gave in, much to my husbands annoyance, and u lifted him to comfort him. He eventually settled in my arms so I popped him back in cot but the minute he hit the sheet he cried again so I figure there was nothing wrong other than he wanted out! After another go of putting the dodie in, he fell asleep on his own. We'll try again tonight anyway.

jigglypuffstuff

Thanks for the replies. Pone I appreciate the time you took to write that reply and your advice is sound but on a 9 month old I don't think I'd have the heart to just leave him crying. Maybe it will come to that eventually but for now I'm going to try avoid that scenario. We done on training your partners child.

No problem..that was exactly the reason i put 20 month old in bold. I too would agree 9 months is too young for that method. Best of luck with whatever method you choose!

Mink

I did the super nanny method - controlled timed crying - when he was a year old. He had been previously self soothing to sleep so didn't have to do much at all, the intervals are shorter 2 mins, 4 mins etc.

It's very specific, I followed the instructions exactly and it got him right back into the self soothing habit again. I made absolutely sure he was fully tired for bed, fed, changed, not teething, not ill etc.

silly

I too did the Super Nanny version - i think the key to it is also - no communication - if the child has stood up in the cot, just pick him up, lay him back down (even a little cuddle is ok) but no talking. Put him down and leave. Rinse, lather, repeat

yellow hen

silly wrote: »

I too did the Super Nanny version - i think the key to it is also - no communication - if the child has stood up in the cot, just pick him up, lay him back down (even a little cuddle is ok) but no talking. Put him down and leave. Rinse, lather, repeat

Can you make calming sounds or is it strictly no noise? Same saga last night and I gave in again and picked him up. To be fair after he's picked up and calmed he often pops off to sleep but I would rather I didn't even have to do that (that sounds v lazy but it's not practical to be up soothing him multiple times per night)

bp

Could you maybe go out for a walk tonight while this is happening so you don't pick him up? Then again is he in such a state that he really needs you? It is a tough call - maybe when you pick him up cuddles until he is calm but not asleep, back in cot and walk out for the first cry, then just cheek rub etc. just don't let him fall asleep on you