Speeding Fine

brannid3

I received a speeding fine this week for an offence I committed in late September, upon payment they said that I was too late and a summons had been issued. The date on the charge says late September but I genuinely only received the fine sheet this week.Well over the amount of time in which payment should be made.

Has anyone heard of anyone in similar circumstances? The Garda I was speaking to about this when I tried to pay the fine obviously thought I was trying to spoof him but sure it's left to the courts now.

PeteK*

You mean it has been more than 56 days? Up to 28 days it's €80 then then next 28 days it would be €120.
If you go to court it will be 4 points and a fine (that could even be less than €120 or €800max).

If this is the case, you can appeal to the Super wherever you were done for speeding.. they can let it go to court or sort it for you.

brannid3

My fine was delivered to my house on day 60 or so. I didn't have the opportunity to pay either fine as my time to pay had already expired. The Gardaí probably hear this excuse a lot though but it is the truth. I have contacted the family Solicitor who is going to write to the relevant super.

I asked the Garda had he heard of this before and he said never in his life, which I found odd. I'm perfectly happy taking the fine of 80 and points but it's frustrating that it has come to this.

brannid3

Here lies the problem, date of notice on the letter was 28/09/13 and the postman handed it to me on the 29/11/2013

Bohrio

brannid3 wrote: »

My fine was delivered to my house on day 60 or so. I didn't have the opportunity to pay either fine as my time to pay had already expired. The Gardaí probably hear this excuse a lot though but it is the truth. I have contacted the family Solicitor who is going to write to the relevant super.

I asked the Garda had he heard of this before and he said never in his life, which I found odd. I'm perfectly happy taking the fine of 80 and points but it's frustrating that it has come to this.

I am not saying you should do this but 9 years ago I was driving my housemates fine and I got a ticket for doing 83 on the M1 (there were works being carried out so the speed limit was 60). I was never stopped so I never knew I was caught.

The ticket went to my housemates attention, she was away in India and came back 45 days later, by the time she opened the letter it was too late. We rang the gardai station and they said that they couldnt do anything and that it had to go to court. The ticket was for 80 euro and 2 points.

We went to court, she explained the situation to the judge, the judge looked at me and said, "so, were driving the car", I said yes, then he asked "do you have the money with you?", I said again yes, and lastly said "well give the 80 euro to those gardai over there, and you Srs (referring to the gardai) if you ever waste my time with issues like this again I will have to have a talk with your superintendent as you are wasting my time!"... never seen a gardai looked down to the floor ever again... it was an interesting experience! They never took the points of my license.

I know court is a lottery but it did work on my favor this time... not saying you should do the same though

Here lies the problem, date of notice on the letter was 28/09/13 and the postman handed it to me on the 29/11/2013

This is why I believe these type of notification should be delivered through registered post. However, this could also work in your favor, much as you can't prove you received it too late they can't prove the opposite either, maybe someone else can give you better advice

brannid3

Bohrio, that's a great story. I got hit by one of the boxes though in a village far from my town. I wonder if a Garda from the village will turn up. It's a trek he/she may not bother I hope!

shame and humiliation of me trying to defend myself by saying the fine got lost in the post, then turned up!

Bigcheeze

brannid3 wrote: »

Here lies the problem, date of notice on the letter was 28/09/13 and the postman handed it to me on the 29/11/2013

does the envelope have a postmark date on it ?

brannid3

Bigcheeze wrote: »

does the envelope have a postmark date on it ?

Not that I recall, but I have saved the envelope so will check when get out of work. Thanks for that, I only thought of checking their notice.:cool:

magentis

was it registered post?

timmy4u2

brannid3 wrote: »

My fine was delivered to my house on day 60 or so. I didn't have the opportunity to pay either fine as my time to pay had already expired. The Gardaí probably hear this excuse a lot though but it is the truth. I have contacted the family Solicitor who is going to write to the relevant super.

I asked the Garda had he heard of this before and he said never in his life, which I found odd. I'm perfectly happy taking the fine of 80 and points but it's frustrating that it has come to this.

Did you not see the big smirk on his face when he said that?
The Garda's name should be on the summons. Have a chat with him. They are human.
Supose if it means a lot you could look for correspondence registers etc.
My opinion.

RandomAccess

Will see how long mines takes to arrive, nabbed Saturday morning on a three lane dual carriageway with a 60 limit. Would rather sensible limits.

The baaastarrrdssss etc..

timmy4u2

RandomAccess wrote: »

Will see how long mines takes to arrive, nabbed Saturday morning on a three lane dual carriageway with a 60 limit. Would rather sensible limits.

The baaastarrrdssss etc..

Opt for court and delay. The speed limits are going to be changed 'soon' some up some down. Perhaps your stretch will get a higher limit then again at the rate of progress here it might be a long wait

RandomAccess

timmy4u2 wrote: »

Opt for court and delay. The speed limits are going to be changed 'soon' some up some down. Perhaps your stretch will get a higher limit then again at the rate of progress here it might be a long wait

It wouldn't be worth doing that in my case, the risk is too high. Also, I don't believe that the speed limit adjustments are going to be an improvement, I believe they may get worse.

I would be embarrassed to be pulling people at that spot if I was a guard though, would have to be ordered to do it.

slimjimmc

timmy4u2 wrote: »

Opt for court and delay. The speed limits are going to be changed 'soon' some up some down. Perhaps your stretch will get a higher limit then again at the rate of progress here it might be a long wait

How would that help? The only speed limit relevant to the case is the one that was in force at the time of the offence.

timmy4u2

RandomAccess wrote: »

It wouldn't be worth doing that in my case, the risk is too high. Also, I don't believe that the speed limit adjustments are going to be an improvement, I believe they may get worse.

I would be embarrassed to be pulling people at that spot if I was a guard though, would have to be ordered to do it.

I wouldnt risk it on the time frame, or on the Premis that the judge would find it difficult to impose a penalty after the speed limit was elevated. it was a light hearted quip. Although it was expressly said that dual carriageways with 60km speed limits would be upgraded speedwise.

timmy4u2

slimjimmc wrote: »

How would that help? The only speed limit relevant to the case is the one that was in force at the time of the offence.

see above:)

GG66

See how it goes with your solicitor ... and if it doesn't work out just go to court. Tell the judge you didn't receive the letter until it was too late to pay. The Govt won't pay to register the letters so there is no proof that you did .. say you have no problem paying the fine if you knew about it

Alternatively you could lie and say you never received the letter, there is no proof that you did except that your solicitor has now written to the super

brannid3

GG66 wrote: »

See how it goes with your solicitor ... and if it doesn't work out just go to court. Tell the judge you didn't receive the letter until it was too late to pay. The Govt won't pay to register the letters so there is no proof that you did .. say you have no problem paying the fine if you knew about it

Alternatively you could lie and say you never received the letter, there is no proof that you did except that your solicitor has now written to the super

Looks like I'll be doing both. Sol writing to them today and I'm pleading not guilty (for non payment of fine). Quite peeved!

keithclancy

brannid3 wrote: »

Here lies the problem, date of notice on the letter was 28/09/13 and the postman handed it to me on the 29/11/2013

Whats the date of the postmark on the envelope ?

brannid3

keithclancy wrote: »

Whats the date of the postmark on the envelope ?

No date on outside envelope. The date on the fine is end of September. I said this to them and they say it doesn't matter, that I'll be summoned because I never paid it. I'm thinking, human error, no one stuck it in the post box or was misplaced for a time in the station..

keithclancy

brannid3 wrote: »

No date on outside envelope. The date on the fine is end of September. I said this to them and they say it doesn't matter, that I'll be summoned because I never paid it. I'm thinking, human error, no one stuck it in the post box or was misplaced for a time in the station..

Shame .. would have at least let you know when An Post received it.

Make sure you keep the envelope anyway, just in case the Judge asks to see it, he may think the same thing.

xabi

Same thing happened me last year, I went to court and it was struck out.

brannid3

keithclancy wrote: »

Shame .. would have at least let you know when An Post received it.

Make sure you keep the envelope anyway, just in case the Judge asks to see it, he may think the same thing.

Thanks, good advise. I have the envelope and it just has the Thurles Fee address on the outside. Only date that's on inside is from 2 months back.

brannid3

xabi wrote: »

Same thing happened me last year, I went to court and it was struck out.

Oh wow! If I'm summoned I'd love that luck!

My worry now is that I'll be summoned, plead not guilty, have a pee'd off Judge, found guilty, lose my temper in court over their c***k up...arg why didn't someone send it sooner! I probably wouldn't have paid the 120 either having not been given the opportunity to pay 80 out of pure stubbornness. Everyone makes mistakes and I feel I shouldn't be dragged through this crap when it's not mine and the idea that I have to defend myself and will probably presumed to be lying is horrible!

PeteK*

http://www.limerickleader.ie/news/community/limerick-judge-calls-for-speeding-fines-loophole-to-be-stopped-1-5731701

A LIMERICK judge has highlighted an anomaly in how fines for motoring offences are served on alleged offenders but “for some reason no one is doing anything about it”.

Judge Eugene O’Kelly was speaking after a Galway man told Limerick Court that he didn’t receive a speeding fine and only received a court summons by registered post. The case was struck out.

Generally when an offence such as speeding is detected, a fixed charge penalty notice is despatched to the alleged offender by ordinary post.

However, it is common knowledge that if a person is prepared to state under oath that they didn’t receive the original notice the prosecution will be struck out. While of course there are going to be a small percentage of genuine errors with regard to postal addresses and delivery of the notices, the amount of times that a judge hears “I didn’t get it” would imply An Post’s service is hit and miss, which is obviously not the case.

Up until recently, the approach taken by Judge Eugene O’Kelly at Limerick Court was to ask the accused person if they had received the speeding fine would they have paid it? If they answered yes the judge gave them an opportunity to pay a set donation to the court poor box. When that was paid he struck out the case and the person would avoid getting four points penalty points received on conviction. However, on Monday, November 25, Judge O’Kelly said there had been an objection to speeding prosecutions being handled in this manner. At the start of court he said if a defendant is pleading not guilty it goes to the end of the list.

“Explain why you are contesting it, for example, if you did not receive the notice. If it turns out untruthfully the state can pursue you further for perjury,” said Judge O’Kelly. Later in the court sitting after he dismissed the case against the Galway man the judge commented on the anomaly that fines arrive by normal post but that summonses arrive by registered post or are hand-delivered by a garda.

“Presumably it is to avoid expense,” said Judge O’Kelly.

He added that “a very simple amendment to the law” would solve the problem but “for some reason no one is doing anything about it”. The Leader sent a query to the Department of Justice asking are there any plans for fixed fine penalty notices to be delivered by registered post. They sent a response from Minister Shatter to a Dail question.

“I am informed that a number of legislative changes are contained in the Road Traffic Act, 2010 which strengthen the provisions relating the service of fixed charge notices for road traffic offences and I understand that the measures necessary to bring them into effect are being examined by the relevant stakeholders at present,” said the Minister.

RandomAccess

Three weeks and still no sign of the notice. Going to be away for next few weeks over Christmas so won't be sure exactly how long it takes to arrive, if it does during that time.