E39 BMW's - Advice/Opinions

OREGATO

Hi all,

Looking to change cars at the moment.

Not sure why but I always liked the styling of the E39's, I think it's probably a bit bigger than what I need right now but I think I'd like to dabble in another BMW for now (had an E46 318Ci previously)

Given their price which is around the €2k mark, they seem to be a great car and I know a few members on here have them.

Just a few questions:

1. M Sport or SE - I really like the look of the m sports, are they worth the premium over the SE model? Apart from the exterior styling and the climate control, are there any other differences?

2. Manual or Automatic - Part of me says manual but another strange part is kind of prodding me towards the lazy option of an automatic, what are peoples preferences? Do you get board of the automatic really quickly? Is the manual a much nicer drive?

3. 520i or 530D - I'm thinking more in the lines of 520i due to the tax but in saying that, am I right in thinking that there is only €300 quid difference? Out of the two? I presume the 2.2 petrol engine is a much nicer drive? Any comments on both?

4. Reliability and MPG - What type of MPG will I get from a 520i Vs. a 530D? Are both reliable? What do I look out for when viewing one? Any common problems or links to buyers guides?

5. Any other helpful info or alternative cars I should look at? I went to view a VRS which is stunning but for some reason, I'm leaning towards the BMW's.

Any help would be great

Thanks in advance

dgt

E39? Go for it

Can't comment on the diesel but on the petril side:

30mpg is normally what I get driving it handy (arse end if nowhere to big open roads to city driving)
I've SE spec, those electric memory seats are addictive
Manual is perfect for the smaller engines but auto is a must with the bigger engines. Unless you like wet roads and roundabouts
Apart from a minor brake failure (owner negligence!) its been good so far reliability wise
I might look into lpg-ing it

The V8 is a different leauge altogether and if you aren't doing many miles go for one :cool:

maceocc2

+1 on the V8 in the E39.

I've an E38 with the M62 4.4L, it's awesome, it always astonishes me how fast it gets up speed, considering the car weights 2,000 kg's

Edit.....Just to add the MPG I get....... 18mpg city driving, 25mpg motorway. But the Smiles per Gallon is through the bleedin' roof

furtzy

They are dirt cheap at the moment. Had a 03 520i SE up until recently. I would prefer the M sport though. They don't look as dated. I was only getting an average of 27mpg and as bad as 22 in city traffic. Manual is fine for the 520. They are reliable enough but look out for any cooling issues and any oil leaks. A simple sump gasket change is an major job . Mine got to the stage where the maintenance costs got too high and nearly a grand a year to tax so bear that in mind when buying. They are completely unsellable at the momen,t believe me, so haggle hard and you'll get a very good one for close to €1k

bmwguy

Tax difference is approx €500 between a 520 and a 530, €950 for the 2.2 and over €1400 for a 3.0. I have a 2.5 which is €1080 per year. My mpg is currently averaging 27 (auto transmission) in mixed driving, it was 37 on a motorway spin from Dublin to Galway. Sports model still looks fresh and better than most newer cars. I paid €2500 for a sport 2004 e39, it was in great condition.

OREGATO

Cheers guys, very informative posts.

I've been reading up on them and there seem to be a few common faults including ABS modules, bushings, burning oil and headgasket issues.

I want to spend as little as possible on one, so with that in mind, should I simply walk away from the idea of getting one?

Is there anything else to look out for that could be a problem?

I really do like them, but wouldn't be keen on spending close to what I pay for one on maintenance a year.

The tax doesn't bother me too much as I'm willing to pay that for a nice driving experience.

furtzy

If you want one then now is the time to buy as they are so so cheap. But they are not cheap to run hence the reason I don't have one anymore! :P

OREGATO

Thanks furtzy.

What type of issues could you expect and rough prices on fixes? I don't mind spending money to fix the car, with my budget in mind, I've setaside money outside of purchase and tax that will go towards maintenance etc but I don't want to spend a fortune if you get me.

I'm coming from Honda's and Mazdas (Integra Type R DC5, Accord Euro R CL7 and Mx5 1.8) and none of them have ever let me down. I don't think for a second that I'll have the same luck with a BMW but just want to get a fair idea of what to expect before pulling the trigger.

Alanstrainor

The cars you will be looking at will be at least 10 years old, so they either will have had a good bit of recent work or will need good bit doing.

My experience is purely with the 2.5 petrol 325ci. In terms of things to look out for they will be very similar. The cooling systems go on these, that means water pumps, expansion tanks, hoses radiators etc. And 10 years/100,000 miles is the time for these things to be changed. Also suspension components will have to be looked at and replaced.

Great cars and great engines, so long as you're not expecting perfection for 2,000 quid then you'll be grand. Being handy with a spanner is good too, although theres so much online about these cars, that if you can turn a screwdriver you can replace a water pump!

As for M versus SE, the M will look a lot better, typically have nicer wheels and have firmer suspension. Sport seats and interior upgrades are to be expected also. And that pretty much covers it. I'd be saying pay a premium for a well minded M over an SE, not that an SE is a bad thing. I would aim for a 2.5 over the 2.2, decent power upgrade for little tax.

Idbatterim

fantastic cars, try get an m sport with leather, the 525 petrol is the optimal IMO, for tax and fuel reasons. What kind of mileage you doing? A well specced m sport with leather, could cost twice the price of an average SE... Overall they are very reliable cars...

furtzy

I spent around 600 getting the suspension sorted i.e. Wishbone bushes, arms etc. Luckily the dealer had inspected and sorted any cooling issues which can be fairly costly and this car's Achilles heel. The sump gasket was leaking pretty badly at the end and is an engine lift job to access and a quote of 400 to sort. Gave up on it at this stage and got rid for 1500. It was costing 80 a week On fuel and 238 On tax every 3 month's so enough was enough. To be honest I don't miss it!

OREGATO

Thanks for the replies guys.

I guess I'm still torn, I really like the look of the m sports and have heard great things about them but the issues with them aren't cheap and seem common enough.

In terms of MPG, a few different figures have been stated ranging from 28 to 33 for mixed driving. I'd assume this is around average? If so, I don't really mind and think it was the figure I had in mind for a car of this size any way.

In terms of performance, what are they like? I know it won't set my world on fire but I'd hope that it would be able to move and overtake safely to some degree.

For instance, I'm currently in the OH's A3 2.0 TDi which has a stated 140 BHP, now, for me in every day terms, the power/torque in this car is more than adequate, it'll move off the line quick enough, getting up to and cruising at 140/150 KM/H is effortless and overtaking is fine.

I assume the 520i will be fine for cruising at motorway speeds, but what are they like off the line? Also, for the likes of overtaking, are they slow? As in, will I be overtaking a truck and be side by side for few seconds uttering 'come on to fcuk' under my breath?

furtzy

The 2.2 520i is more than adequate for overtaking etc. Not the quickest at the lights but then again who cares. The 525i would be the better option though for the same economy but a little more tax and definitely get the M Sport

As posted before...any E39 you get is going to be at least 10 years old and have 10 year old car issues some of which can be very expensive some not. If you are set on one then take your time and get a good one as theres a lot of lemons out there especially ones that have had cooling issues...the second hand E39 market is a minefield believe me!

I think they are better left to mechanically minded sorts at this stage

Idbatterim

you may encounter some wear and tear issues, but these fantastic cars are going for absolute peanuts and are fantastic value for money. Have it checked out by a bmw specialist prior to purchase... I have had my 2003 325ci for 2.5 years and the only thing that has gone is the starter motor!

OREGATO

furtzy wrote: »

The 2.2 520i is more than adequate for overtaking etc. Not the quickest at the lights but then again who cares. The 525i would be the better option though for the same economy but a little more tax and definitely get the M Sport

As posted before...any E39 you get is going to be at least 10 years old and have 10 year old car issues some of which can be very expensive some not. If you are set on one then take your time and get a good one as theres a lot of lemons out there especially ones that have had cooling issues...the second hand E39 market is a minefield believe me!

I think they are better left to mechanically minded sorts at this stage

I guess the thing is, that power or speed is relative to the person.

Coming from a string of Jap Type R's etc, I know that a 520i will not be comparable, but I still have horrid thoughts of the 318Ci I had and the sluggishness of the thing, I just don't want to buy a car that will be the same.

I'd agree that there are a lot of lemons or ones that need work out there, hope I'll be able to pick up something well maintained and looked after.

Idbatterim

what year was the 318ci? pre 2002 im guessing? they were bloody underpowered, only 118bhp, the ones from 02 on had 143 which was adequate. Do you have a preference for auto or manual? how many miles a year do you do?

IMO, the 520 in manual would be ok. Otherwise the 525 in manual or auto would be fine...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_5_Series_(E39)

Petrol engines
Model Power Torque 0–100 km/h Years
520i110 kW (150 PS; 148 bhp) @ 5900 190 N·m (140 ft·lbf) @ 3500 10.2/11.5 (MT/AT)1996–2000
520i125 kW (170 PS; 168 bhp) @ 6250 210 N·m (150 ft·lbf) @ 3500 9.1/10.2 (MT/AT) 2000–2003
523i125 kW (170 PS; 168 bhp) @ 5500 245 N·m (181 ft·lbf) @ 3500 8.5/9.7 (MT/AT) 1995–2000
525i141 kW (192 PS; 189 bhp) @ 6000 245 N·m (181 ft·lbf) @ 3500 8.1/8.9 (MT/AT) 2000–2003
528i142 kW (193 PS; 190 bhp) @ 5500 280 N·m (210 ft·lbf) @ 3500 7.5/8.8 (MT/AT) 1995–2000
528i SE 142 kW (193 PS; 190 bhp) @ 5500 280 N·m (210 ft·lbf) @ 3500 7.1 (MT) 1998
530i170 kW (231 PS; 228 bhp) @ 5900 300 N·m (220 ft·lbf) @ 3500 7.1/7.5 (MT/AT) 2000–2003
535i 180 kW (245 PS; 241 bhp) @ 5800 345 N·m (254 ft·lbf) @ 3800 6.9/7.6 (MT/AT) 1996–2003
540i 210 kW (286 PS; 282 bhp) @ 5400 440 N·m (320 ft·lbf) @ 3600 6.0/6.3 (MT/AT) 1996–1998
540i 217 kW (295 PS; 291 bhp) @ 5400 460 N·m (340 ft·lbf) @ 3600 5.4/5.6[dubious – discuss] (MT/AT) 1999–2003
M5 294 kW (400 PS; 394 bhp) @ 6600 500 N·m (370 ft·lbf) @ 3800 4.8 (MT) 1998–2003


318i/Ci M43TUB19 1998–2001 1895 I4, 8v 118 PS (87 kW; 116 bhp)180 N·m (133 ft·lbf) 10.4 s
318i/Ci/ti N42B20 2002–2003 1995 I4, 16v143 PS (105 kW; 141 bhp) 200 N·m (148 ft·lbf)9.3 s
N46B20 2004–2005 318Ci 2005–2007 150 PS (110 kW; 148 bhp) 9.2 s

OREGATO

My old 318 was a 01 so it was the older 4 cylinder (I shudder each time I think of that car)

Mileage would roughly be as follows (I know I don't need to spell it out but it's good to help me think about it )

Work (average of 3 days a week, other days will be cycling) - 90 KM per week
Pleasure (the odd drive to the shops or for the hell of it) - 50 KM per week
Long trips (to the GF's country home) - 130 KM per week
Contingency - 30 KM per week

Total: 15,600 KM per year MAX
That's under the assumption that we take my car each weekend (highly unlikely) as well as a 1,560 KM contingency for the year.

For the auto Vs. manual debate, I'd say I'd definitely end up getting an auto for a car like this. I heard the manual can be a sloppy gear change and TBH, I think I'd prefer an auto for this car's purpose.

Greyfoot

If its an e39 you after it has to be 530d if you can justify the tax, get yourself one with fsh and no injector or turbo problems. I`ve never owned one but I`ve driven a lot of different beemers, and to be honest the 520i and 525i is underpowered due to bigger, heavier chassis.
If you are looking for a "fun" bmw go for a 3series 2.5l and over, otherwise stick to 3.0d+ automatic 5series.

Just my 2c.

Leonard Hofstadter

Greyfoot wrote: »

If its an e39 you after it has to be 530d if you can justify the tax, get yourself one with fsh and no injector or turbo problems. I`ve never owned one but I`ve driven a lot of different beemers, and to be honest the 520i and 525i is underpowered due to bigger, heavier chassis.
If you are looking for a "fun" bmw go for a 3series 2.5l and over, otherwise stick to 3.0d+ automatic 5series.

Just my 2c.

530ds are not that fast with an automatic gearbox. I'd get a 530i or a 525i if tax is a concern. I'm told the 530d is a lot faster with a manual box, but I can't see what the big deal about them is with an auto, other than being the first diesel that you could realistically buy over a petrol equivalent and not feel short changed.

I'd have the 525i as it's just as fast (only 1 less bhp, and I don't believe in this diesel torque malarkey - that's what the gearbox is for) but a lot cheaper to tax. Plus it won't have the swirl flap problems, and there's no turbo to worry about. Alternatively, if I wasn't bothered about the tax, then the 530i makes more sense, a silky smooth six cylinder petrol and 40 extra bhp makes it a lot faster (and nicer to drive) than the 530d, diesel torque or not.

Idbatterim

saw the below earlier...

http://cars.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/bmw-e39-530i/5724569

new number plates and change to white angel eyes and you have a stunning car...

http://cars.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/imola-red-e39-m-sport/6050819

Id disagree about the diesel, generally the 530d will be more expensive and more to wrong them (also exta E414 a year to tax)... At these prices, Id be taking the straight 6 petrol all day long...

hoganj

First post on here so be gentle ...
Last month I changed my 2004 Seat Leon 1.6 for a 2002 manual 530i m-sport. I'm still in awe of the power of the car everytime I start it up. On the motorway the power is relentless. Approx 25-34 mpg is what i've noticed on a mix of long and short journeys. I do notice the large size and weight difference of the car compared to the Seat, but its a completely different experience. I've not driven it but I think the 525i would still have plenty of power to make it an enjoyable drive if tax is an issue (I live in the UK). In Ireland you may not have the choice of cars as you would here so you may have to compromise. From what I've read on the subject the 525 and 530 petrols are the very solid reliable engines. I'm sure the others are too but I've seen a lot of recommendations for those two. Idbatterim's first link looked very nice indeed, similar price to my car. To get the most enjoyment out of it though I would stick with a manual. Looks are subjective but to my eye (remember I've just bought one) they (m-sport in black) are nicer looking than the majority of cars you see on the roads today.

Costs in the first month for me have been (in GBP):
Battery £135
Parking distance sensors £50
New badge £30
Fog bulbs inc. fitting (these are a pain) £35
3M Water vapour barrier sealant delivery from US (look it up as its a common issue on E39's) £45

Tyres are half worn but as I have staggered Alpina rims on the approx cost is £150-£200 each
Official BMW part prices are extortionate. Eg 1 new parking sensor is £135, on ebay a second hand one or chinese knock off is about £20. There is tons of info on the internet about how to repair things yourself so well worth it if you know your way around a screwdriver.

In summary my experience so far is yes they are expensive to run, im prepared to pay the costs for the moment, in 2-3 years time could be a different story. Don't buy to sell in a year as big engined cars are not easy shifters so to speak.

furtzy

I've been using the fuel logger app on the phone for a couple of years now so heres the real world figures of my E39 ownership!!

Period of ownership 753 days

Best Fuel Consumption 34.71 mpg
Average Fuel consumption 27.9mpg
Worst Fuel Consumption 22.85 mpg

Total mileage 14297 miles
Total Fuel 2389.53 litres
Total fuel costs €3759.95

Rear bush replacment €147
Full service Inspection II €390
Rear control arm €270
Rear control arm other side €175
Front shocks and shock top replacement and alignment €624
Rear door seals €80
Front wishbone bushes €244
Tyres €180

Together with €1742 in tax

This was on a mint condition car with 80k miles and a full BMW service history so it was no lemon when I bought it. These were just typical wear and tear items on a 10 year old car

At the end it needed a sump gasket replaced and had a suspected air leak


So you can see why it had to go