Driving with no Insurance

pampers1

I am due in court for driving without insurance back in february. At the time we were selling our car and had bought a new one 1 week later. I hadnt intended to drive it, but had an emergency that particular day. My question is, has anyone been in court for this and what was the penalty etc. this is my first offence and it was a genuine emegency. Will I just explain this to the judge and hope for the best?

Pat Mustard

pampers1 wrote: »

Will I just explain this to the judge and hope for the best?

If it was driving without a seatbelt or driving while holding a mobile phone or speeding, I'd say go for it, but a charge of driving without insurance is not one to take so lightly.

Don't do it, OP. Get a local solicitor who practises in the district court, who knows the judge's form.

pampers1

Really? A solicitor?? I couldnt afford a solicitor unfortuneately. Has anyone been in this situation before? Thanks a mil for the reply.

Rightwing

pampers1 wrote: »

Really? A solicitor?? I couldnt afford a solicitor unfortuneately. Has anyone been in this situation before? Thanks a mil for the reply.

Plead your case, that's all you can. Probably won't believe you, and put you off the road for 2 years and a small fine.

Grab All Association

Lets hope this guy isn't presiding when your due in court

Judge John Coughlan imposed the penalties at Tallaght District Court.

The men involved are aged 24, 29 and 59.

The 59-year-old is a publican named Frank Kelly, with an address at the Grove, Kingswood Heights, Tallaght, pleaded guilty to having no insurance at a location in Tallaght on February 12, 2013.

A garda told Judge Coughlan that he stopped Kelly – and that Kelly later failed to produce his insurance certificate at Tallaght Garda Station.

Kelly's solicitor, Jeremiah Breen, asked the judge not to impose a custodial sentence. He said Kelly was a publican and would lose his business if sent to jail.

Judge Coughlan fined Kelly €500, banned him from driving for 40 years and sentenced him to five months jail, suspended for two years.

The 29-year-old was a serial uninsured driver the court heard.

Judge Coughlan heard that Karl Grant had been already disqualified when he was stopped by gardai three times for driving without insurance.

Grant, with an address at Belfry Square, Citywest, pleaded guilty to having no insurance and no driving licence at Belfry Square on March 7, 2013, at Citywest Shopping Centre, Citywest, on April 17, 2013, and at Alderwood Road, Tallaght, on March 16, 2013.

Garda Michelle McGuinness told the court that she stopped Grant on March 7 last. She said Grant later failed to produce his driving licence and insurance certificate at Tallaght Garda Station. The court also heard that Grant was stopped on March 16 and April 17.

Garda McGuinness said Grant had two previous for no insurance.

Judge Coughlan noted that Grant now had five for no insurance.

Grant's solicitor, Michael Hennessy, asked the judge not to impose a custodial sentence. He said Grant is working.

Judge Coughlan sentenced Grant to five months jail, suspended for two years and imposed a 40 year disqualification for the no insurance on March 7 and took the remaining matters into consideration.

In the third case, Alan McCabe, aged 24, with an address at Allenton Avenue, Tallaght, pleaded guilty to having no insurance and no driving licence at Old Court Road in Firhouse on March 20, 2013.

Garda Declan O'Sullivan told Judge John Coughlan in Tallaght Court that he stopped McCabe on the above date. He said McCabe later failed to produce his driving licence and insurance in Tallaght Garda Station.

He said McCabe had 22 previous convictions including for driving without insurance.

McCabe's solicitor, Michael Hennessy, asked Judge Coughlan not to impose a custodial sentence.

He said McCabe had just bought the car.

Judge Coughlan sentenced McCabe to four months imprisonment, suspended for two years and disqualified him from driving for 40 years.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/judge-john-coughlan-puts-three-drivers-off-the-road-for-40-years-each-because-of-no-insurance-29711624.html

Pro Hoc Vice

pampers1 wrote: »

Really? A solicitor?? I couldnt afford a solicitor unfortuneately. Has anyone been in this situation before? Thanks a mil for the reply.

How much will a solicitor cost? Have you asked one? The punishment for no insurance is a ban, there is a possibility under the legislation in certain circumstances not to get a ban, but to go into that would be in breach of the forum charter about giving advice.

If driving is important to you I would at least canvas the idea of a solicitor. Also expect to have to appeal the DC decision. Its a sad fact of life motoring s expensive, but it always amazes me that people can afford to purchase a car, pay for fuel, (usually tax, insurance and NCT) but won't invest in keeping the licence.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

slimjimmc

You say it was a "genuine emergency" but the judge might have different opinion on that. A solicitor who knows the judges might better gauge how a judge would view your emergency and perhaps advise if it's likely to backfire on you.

behan29

I was in court 2 years ago with a similar issue. Get a solicitor. It cost me €250. The solicitor told me that I would be off the road for 2 years and get a fine. Thankfully my case was struck out. Have you contacted your insurance company, they can actually be very helpful, ie that you have a clean licence and have never not had insurance. I saw a judge on my day in court give a man a fine who had several convictions for no insurane and no tax. Best of luck.

Bepolite

40 years is that a misprint? I suppose you can get it back after half :P

On a serious note these types of bans are completely counter productive. If he wanted to lock them up he should have given them a couple of weeks rather than imposing daft bans.

chops018

Chris___ wrote: »

Lets hope this guy isn't presiding when your due in court



http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/judge-john-coughlan-puts-three-drivers-off-the-road-for-40-years-each-because-of-no-insurance-29711624.html

That is absolutely ludicrous, and completely disproportionate to the offence(s).

Ugo Monye spacecraft experience

Rightwing wrote: »

Plead your case, that's all you can. Probably won't believe you, and put you off the road for 2 years and a small fine.

OP ignore this horse****

Two years off the road for no insurance? What are you basing that on?

Unless you have a string of previous road offences he won't be put off the road at all, never mind for two years

You will get a big fine though, somewhere in the region of 500 bean

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

Pro Hoc Vice

Ugo Monye spacecraft experience wrote: »

OP ignore this horse****

Two years off the road for no insurance? What are you basing that on?

Unless you have a string of previous road offences he won't be put off the road at all, never mind for two years

You will get a big fine though, somewhere in the region of 500 bean

100% incorrect, a first conviction for no insurance is a one year ban unless you can persuade the court that there is a special reason not to be banned. A second offense carries a minimum of 2 years off the road.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/travel_and_recreation/motoring_1/driving_offences/driving_offences.html

"In the case of a first offence of driving without insurance, the court may decide in special cases not to impose a period of disqualification or to impose a period of disqualification of less than a year.
Since 1 June 2003, where the courts in Ireland decide not to impose a disqualification, drivers convicted of a first offence of driving without insurance will incur 5 penalty points on their licence record in addition to any other penalty imposed by the court.
If you commit a second offence for driving without insurance, you will be automatically disqualified from driving. You should also note, that where a member of An Garda Síochána (Irish police force) believes that a vehicle registered in Ireland (or outside Ireland) is being used in a public place without insurance, the vehicle may be impounded."


http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/travel_and_recreation/motoring_1/motor_tax_and_insurance/motor_insurance.html

Ugo Monye spacecraft experience

infosys wrote: »

100% incorrect, a first conviction for no insurance is a one year ban unless you can persuade the court that there is a special reason not to be banned. A second offense carries a minimum of 2 years off the road.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/travel_and_recreation/motoring_1/driving_offences/driving_offences.html

"In the case of a first offence of driving without insurance, the court may decide in special cases not to impose a period of disqualification or to impose a period of disqualification of less than a year.
Since 1 June 2003, where the courts in Ireland decide not to impose a disqualification, drivers convicted of a first offence of driving without insurance will incur 5 penalty points on their licence record in addition to any other penalty imposed by the court.
If you commit a second offence for driving without insurance, you will be automatically disqualified from driving. You should also note, that where a member of An Garda Síochána (Irish police force) believes that a vehicle registered in Ireland (or outside Ireland) is being used in a public place without insurance, the vehicle may be impounded."


http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/travel_and_recreation/motoring_1/motor_tax_and_insurance/motor_insurance.html

Persuading the court not to ban you is what happens more often than not in these cases, unless there's a string of previous road offences

Special cases aren't in anyway rare. OP has no previous offences. I've seen enough cases of driving without insurance to know he more than likely won't be put off the road, and certainly not for two years

Pro Hoc Vice

Ugo Monye spacecraft experience wrote: »

Persuading the court not to ban you is what happens more often than not in these cases, unless there's a string of previous road offences

Special cases aren't in anyway rare. OP has no previous offences. I've seen enough cases of driving without insurance to know he more than likely won't be put off the road, and certainly not for two years

My experience is the DC only gives especial reasons in limited circumstances, the CC in recent years on appeal are also becoming more restrictive. But I do agree if correctly presented then a ban is unlikely on a first offense.

Ugo Monye spacecraft experience

infosys wrote: »

My experience is the DC only gives especial reasons in limited circumstances, the CC in recent years on appeal are also becoming more restrictive. But I do agree if correctly presented then a ban is unlikely on a first offense.

Spent a good bit of time in DC due to an my job a year or so ago and saw a number of these cases come up. Might just be that judge but for the most part common sense is used (which sadly for the op, will mean a big fine and a warning)

Of course then you have the guy banned for 40 years for no insurance!

brian_t

Ugo Monye spacecraft experience wrote: »

Spent a good bit of time in DC due to an my job a year or so ago and saw a number of these cases come up. Might just be that judge but for the most part common sense is used (which sadly for the op, will mean a big fine and a warning)

Just out of curiosity (remembering what the OP said in their post) - in any of these cases did the driver represent themselves and not have their own solicitor.

Santa Cruz

pampers1 wrote: »

I am due in court for driving without insurance back in february. At the time we were selling our car and had bought a new one 1 week later. I hadnt intended to drive it, but had an emergency that particular day. My question is, has anyone been in court for this and what was the penalty etc. this is my first offence and it was a genuine emegency. Will I just explain this to the judge and hope for the best?

I would advise to have a very good check of your current insurance policy. It may be the situation that under certain circumstances that you would have third party cover for use of a different car. If in doubt check with your insurance company

Ugo Monye spacecraft experience

brian_t wrote: »

Just out of curiosity (remembering what the OP said in their post) - in any of these cases did the driver represent themselves and not have their own solicitor.

no, not from what i can remember. Wouldn't advise it either

pampers1

Thanks for the replies. I will keep you updated. And yes I intend to represent myself. Although will probably have a change of heart nearer the time.

sodalicious

This is my experience:

I was caught driver without insurance a couple of years ago. Genuine mistake. Completely forgot to renew it, had moved house in between, reminder letters were sent to old residence. It was my first offence. The nerves nearly killed me going in to the court. I got a fine of a thousand euro on the button and had to pay the solicitor a hundred euro. Fine had to be paid in two months to the court. I got no endorsements or points on my licence thank god. What my solicitor advised me to do (which i did) was show up with him on the day, dressed nice (as if for a business meeting) the judge saw me there as the solicitor pointed me out. I looked a nervous wreck (which i was) but I was in the middle of people who were in court for fighting, stealing, domestic violence (there was actually people in there in tracksuits or PJ legs (don't do that)

I may have been lucky with the judge on the day, but if it is your first offence, you turn up, present yourself well with a solicitor, hopefully you will be fine.

I actually joined this to answer your question. I hope it helps you, if you are as nervous as i was, i feel for you!

timmy4u2

Certain emergencies may be a good defence under the Road Traffic Act .
The Judge is not obliged to disqualify you or imprison you for a first offence.
Talk to the Judge, if you have a very good emergency reason tell him; if not do not p**s him off and put your your hands up and plead.
My opinion.