Sexual frustration driving me insane

outofideas

Ok. I think I’ve basically snapped. I’ve reached my wits’ end. It’s now over two years since I last had any kind of sexual encounter at all. And I am at a complete loss to know why. My friends are at a loss to know why. I’m a normal, outgoing, sociable guy – not amazing looking but not the worst either. I have a good life, social circle etc…but not one woman has showed even the slightest interest in me for years. I don’t know why, nobody can explain it to me (even my close friends, the ones who say the hard stuff and who’d tell me if I needed to lose weight or whatever), and I’ve now snapped into some weird headspace.

I’m basically knocked for six. I feel unattractive, uninteresting…I’m in my late 30s and I basically feel like I’m cracking up. No sex, no intimacy, no warmth, not even hugs…I’m not designed to live with this kind of isolation and it’s just too hard. I’m the proverbial last single guy in my circle of attached/married friends. Dating sites, hookup sites, social groups, meetups…I’ve tried them all and met some lovely people and even made friends with them…but it just doesn’t go any farther. I don’t know what I’m doing wrong and I don’t know what to do about it. My female friends give me hugs to make me feel better and my male friends tell me to go to a prostitute…neither of which is in any way helpful whatsoever. And I can no longer talk to them about this because it’s frustrating and saddening them too because there’s nothing they can do or say and I’m tired bringing them down too. “Hang on in there, you’ll meet somebody” and variations on that theme are not really helpful because while they’re well meant, they don’t really mean anything. Because maybe I WON’T meet somebody. I haven’t for the last two years and it doesn’t look like changing any time soon.

I’m not even sure why I’m posting here. Maybe I just need to rant. I don’t feel like there’s anything I can do about this and I don’t even see what anybody can suggest…although I guess that’s why I’m posting. Maybe somebody can suggest something I haven’t tried or thought of. Maybe somebody can think outside the box. I’m sure I’m far from being the first person who’s been in this situation, maybe somebody can share with me how they got out of it?

miamee

outofideas wrote: »

Ok. I think I’ve basically snapped. I’ve reached my wits’ end. It’s now over two years since I last had any kind of sexual encounter at all. And I am at a complete loss to know why. My friends are at a loss to know why. I’m a normal, outgoing, sociable guy – not amazing looking but not the worst either. I have a good life, social circle etc…but not one woman has showed even the slightest interest in me for years. I don’t know why, nobody can explain it to me (even my close friends, the ones who say the hard stuff and who’d tell me if I needed to lose weight or whatever), and I’ve now snapped into some weird headspace.

I’m basically knocked for six. I feel unattractive, uninteresting…I’m in my late 30s and I basically feel like I’m cracking up. No sex, no intimacy, no warmth, not even hugs…I’m not designed to live with this kind of isolation and it’s just too hard. I’m the proverbial last single guy in my circle of attached/married friends. Dating sites, hookup sites, social groups, meetups…I’ve tried them all and met some lovely people and even made friends with them…but it just doesn’t go any farther. I don’t know what I’m doing wrong and I don’t know what to do about it. My female friends give me hugs to make me feel better and my male friends tell me to go to a prostitute…neither of which is in any way helpful whatsoever. And I can no longer talk to them about this because it’s frustrating and saddening them too because there’s nothing they can do or say and I’m tired bringing them down too. “Hang on in there, you’ll meet somebody” and variations on that theme are not really helpful because while they’re well meant, they don’t really mean anything. Because maybe I WON’T meet somebody. I haven’t for the last two years and it doesn’t look like changing any time soon.

I’m not even sure why I’m posting here. Maybe I just need to rant. I don’t feel like there’s anything I can do about this and I don’t even see what anybody can suggest…although I guess that’s why I’m posting. Maybe somebody can suggest something I haven’t tried or thought of. Maybe somebody can think outside the box. I’m sure I’m far from being the first person who’s been in this situation, maybe somebody can share with me how they got out of it?

See the bit I have highlighted? I came face to face with that thought and fact over the past year. It was scary to think that maybe I will never meet anyone. It was scary to think 'this is it'. However. I have been single for a long time and it hasn't killed me yet, so although it might not have been 'the plan', it's not the end of the world. Realising this lifted a huge weight from my shoulders.

Your post seems to be mostly about lack of sexual contact though rather than someone special at the moment. However, from what you have posted I don't think you are the type who wants sexual contact with any old randomer? Maybe I picked that up wrong, in which case I am sure there are plenty of bars you could go to to pick someone up for a ONS.

However, the special somebody situation is not going to happen overnight. Whatever you are doing thus far is not working so you need to do something different. I know you said you have tried lots of things but for how long? Did you really, genuinely give them a good shot; long enough to meet someone or build friendships or relationships?

I'm a huge advocate for online dating (see my sig :P) and would advise trying that again. When you like someone, ask them out. Make sure they know that you like them, don't expect them to just know and don't leave anything to chance.

You sound like you have a large and good bunch of friends which means you must be a likable, fun, decent person - some girl(s) out there will be delighted to go out with you. Just give them the opportunity!

beks101

You sound very passive. As if it's up to women or 'fate' to sort out your problems for you.

Have you expressed any interest in a woman in the last two years? When's the last time you actively pursued a woman and asked her out? What about those online women, WHY didn't it go any further than friends, if you met them through dating/hookup sites? Did you flirt with them, initiate physical contact, express your intentions, move in for a kiss? Make it clear you want to be more than friends?

You sound as if you're stuck in the trappings of your own mind, which has decided that you'll never meet anyone and will be FOREVERALONE and it's become a bit of a self fulfilling prophecy. I read something once that explains this better:"be mindful of your self-talk. It's a conversation with the universe"

If you want something, you have to 1. BELIEVE that you deserve it and 2. be proactive, be a man on a mission, create opportunities, fight for it, be unwilling to stop until you get it. That applies to life in general and also dating.

Right now it sounds like you're sulking over the fact that women aren't throwing themselves at you and you're just lying back and accepting your 'fate'.

outofideas

beks101 wrote: »

You sound very passive. As if it's up to women or 'fate' to sort out your problems for you.

Have you expressed any interest in a woman in the last two years? When's the last time you actively pursued a woman and asked her out? What about those online women, WHY didn't it go any further than friends, if you met them through dating/hookup sites? Did you flirt with them, initiate physical contact, express your intentions, move in for a kiss? Make it clear you want to be more than friends?

You sound as if you're stuck in the trappings of your own mind, which has decided that you'll never meet anyone and will be FOREVERALONE and it's become a bit of a self fulfilling prophecy. I read something once that explains this better:"be mindful of your self-talk. It's a conversation with the universe"

If you want something, you have to 1. BELIEVE that you deserve it and 2. be proactive, be a man on a mission, create opportunities, fight for it, be unwilling to stop until you get it. That applies to life in general and also dating.

Right now it sounds like you're sulking over the fact that women aren't throwing themselves at you and you're just lying back and accepting your 'fate'.

I guess it might have come across like that but that's not an accurate assessment of where I'm at. When I say I feel like I'm out of options I literally mean that I've tried everything, including all the things you've suggested. I don't have a victim mentality at all but when enough women have said no to you (and no matter how nicely they do it, it's still a no), it's hard not to eventually start wondering what's going wrong. This isn't a lack of confidence thing at all, it's a what-on-earth-do-they-not-see-in-me thing...which I don't mean to sound arrogant at all, it's simply that I do believe that I have a lot to offer. Like you say, I DO believe I deserve it, and I DO initiate things...it's just that I keep running into a wall.

For example; a couple of weeks ago I'd been meeting up with a girl a number of times, going out for meals and drinks, chatting, flirting - eventually when I suggested moving things further she wasn't interested. The last girl I went out with, which was over two years ago, was looking for a husband and effectively tolerated the sex part (which was gotten over with as quickly as possible) so she could have a life companion (this is all stuff that came out later). There was no real intimacy, no holding hands when we were out, And I have more examples in between but I think you get the gist. So I'm neither passive, nor sulking, nor expecting anybody to throw themselves at me.

miamee wrote: »

Your post seems to be mostly about lack of sexual contact though rather than someone special at the moment. However, from what you have posted I don't think you are the type who wants sexual contact with any old randomer? Maybe I picked that up wrong, in which case I am sure there are plenty of bars you could go to to pick someone up for a ONS.

Yes you're right. The one night stand thing or NSA thing isn't really something I'm terribly interested in...however at this stage I'd take anything as a form of intimacy. Frankly I'm at this stage thinking of hiring a prostitute just to have somebody to hold for an hour! Even if it's fake it would be nice for that short amount of time! I don't know if that contradicts what I said earlier about sexual contact...my mind isn't really stringing things together right now so if I sound like I'm contradicting myself, I probably am.

miamee wrote: »

You sound like you have a large and good bunch of friends which means you must be a likable, fun, decent person

Thank you. I do my best to be, and I think I get it right most of the time. Which kind of brings me back to square one.

scarymoon1

I've often seen posted here that if your actively looking and seeking its off putting to people, so maybe your too keen and seem desperate, it's off putting. (I'm just repeating what's been told to me on here ) so just forget about finding a partner, if it's meant to be it will be. Chillax!!

beks101

outofideas wrote: »

I guess it might have come across like that but that's not an accurate assessment of where I'm at. When I say I feel like I'm out of options I literally mean that I've tried everything, including all the things you've suggested. I don't have a victim mentality at all but when enough women have said no to you (and no matter how nicely they do it, it's still a no), it's hard not to eventually start wondering what's going wrong. This isn't a lack of confidence thing at all, it's a what-on-earth-do-they-not-see-in-me thing...which I don't mean to sound arrogant at all, it's simply that I do believe that I have a lot to offer. Like you say, I DO believe I deserve it, and I DO initiate things...it's just that I keep running into a wall.

Ah OK. So you're out there. My apologies for picking you up wrong, your initial post just smacked of resignation to me, which can be an incredibly pervasive quality in someone, particularly when it comes to dating. Any negative thoughts that may be affecting your body language can be very off-putting.

Perhaps it's in your approach. With this latest girl, you said you "suggested taking things further" - how exactly did that work? I know if I'm dating someone, no formal conversation or "suggestion" needs to occur, things will just either evolve organically through our body language and physical contact, or they won't. If a guy is sort of pussyfooting around me, playing it safe, being overly "careful", and then springs a conversation on me about "moving things further", I'd probably be a bit freaked out tbh. Don't be afraid of being physically forward with someone you're dating and attracted to - that's the 'roadtest' that will determine if the attraction is mutual.

Do you have any female friends that you'd feel comfortable having a conversation with about your approach to dating? I know it's a slightly terrifying thing to do, and there's always the risk that she'll water down any feedback for fear of upsetting, but really, if you can get an honest female perspective from someone that's seen you in action, it would be the best aid you could get in this entire situation.

outofideas

beks101 wrote: »

Perhaps it's in your approach. With this latest girl, you said you "suggested taking things further" - how exactly did that work? I know if I'm dating someone, no formal conversation or "suggestion" needs to occur, things will just either evolve organically through our body language and physical contact, or they won't. If a guy is sort of pussyfooting around me, playing it safe, being overly "careful", and then springs a conversation on me about "moving things further", I'd probably be a bit freaked out tbh. Don't be afraid of being physically forward with someone you're dating and attracted to - that's the 'roadtest' that will determine if the attraction is mutual.

It was pretty much as you suggested...I didn't want to leave it too long, and there had been a lot of contact, tactile stuff like hugging and sitting against each other etc so when the time seemed right, I mentioned moving things forward. It was as natural as I could make it but she just wasn't interested. We're still friends but I think it would be a bit weird to try to ask her what she didn't like about me so I could build on that next time around. (That sounds a bit glib but I don't mean it that way, I just can't think of a better way to phrase it)

beks101 wrote: »

Do you have any female friends that you'd feel comfortable having a conversation with about your approach to dating? I know it's a slightly terrifying thing to do, and there's always the risk that she'll water down any feedback for fear of upsetting, but really, if you can get an honest female perspective from someone that's seen you in action, it would be the best aid you could get in this entire situation.

Most of my really close friends are female. And yes, I've had that conversation a few times. It usually ends up bringing them down because they can't think of a single reason why things aren't working out for me...and these are close enough that they WOULD say "You need to lose weight or dress better" or whatever. I suppose it's kind of a backhanded compliment that there's nothing that they can suggest...but again, it doesn't advance the situation any.

Thanks for taking the time to give me this feedback btw. I appreciate it.

miamee

outofideas wrote: »

It was pretty much as you suggested...I didn't want to leave it too long, and there had been a lot of contact, tactile stuff like hugging and sitting against each other etc so when the time seemed right, I mentioned moving things forward. It was as natural as I could make it but she just wasn't interested. We're still friends but I think it would be a bit weird to try to ask her what she didn't like about me so I could build on that next time around. (That sounds a bit glib but I don't mean it that way, I just can't think of a better way to phrase it)



Most of my really close friends are female. And yes, I've had that conversation a few times. It usually ends up bringing them down because they can't think of a single reason why things aren't working out for me...and these are close enough that they WOULD say "You need to lose weight or dress better" or whatever. I suppose it's kind of a backhanded compliment that there's nothing that they can suggest...but again, it doesn't advance the situation any.

Thanks for taking the time to give me this feedback btw. I appreciate it.

Did you ever try holding their hand or kissing them? Anything that suggested you saw them as more than just a 'friend'. You already told us you hug your female friends and I assume sitting beside them is not a big deal...so what was different with these women that you dated? Maybe this is where you are going wrong, you are not taking the bull by the horns and making a first move? Or any move?
To be honest, if I like someone and we've been on a couple of dates, I will make the first move but some women just never will and wait for the man to take the initiative. If you have to ask if you can 'take things further' just for a first kiss, they possibly feel like the moment is ruined by you asking can you kiss them instead of just going for it.

outofideas

miamee wrote: »

To be honest, if I like someone and we've been on a couple of dates, I will make the first move but some women just never will and wait for the man to take the initiative. If you have to ask if you can 'take things further' just for a first kiss, they possibly feel like the moment is ruined by you asking can you kiss them instead of just going for it.

I see your point but I didn't quite go about it as awkwardly as it sounds...and as it transpires it doesn't really matter what way I went about it, as the end result would have been the same...and potentially a lot more awkward if I'd tried to just kiss her! We're still friends, that's how it's staying, and that's a good thing.

But it doesn't really help me with brought me here in the first place.

beks101

i agree with Miamee, "tactile stuff like hugging and sitting against each other" is innocent friendzone stuff, sure I'll hug and sit against my best friend, my sisters, jesus I'd do it with a fair few colleagues during a work night out, totally benign body language that is common among women.

If I'm sitting across from a guy on a date and he's signalling his interest in me, it's clear as night and day and not open to interpretation - he's going out of his way to touch my hand/arm/leg, there's lots of eye contact and lingering smiles, playful conversation and sexual innuendo, teasing, hand holding, licking lips, and always always a bold move in for a kiss (and not a peck on the cheek either)

The body language is more aggressive than innocuous by nature and I guess it does require a certain confidence/experience, but more often 'taking the bull by the horns' will pay off tenfold and 'playing it safe'/being overly measured and 'respectful' will just lead you further down the path you're on.

It's obviously very hard to tell without knowing you, but just throwing it out there as food for thought - these kinds of behaviours have always played a big, big part in harnessing attraction for me - can't speak for all women, but I think a majority of us subconsciously take in a number of factors like this, as well as appearance, sense of humour, intelligence etc, when it comes to attraction.

username123

You sound like a male friend of mine, and he is a great guy, but it's as clear to me as the nose on his face where he goes wrong.

He is naturally friendly and has good manners and he treats all women the same way, politely and with respect. Which is great, but he ends up in the friend zone ALL the time because he dithers and is "afraid to ruin the friendship". Or "waits for the right time", which usually means never. He never ever just takes the risk and goes for the snog with someone he doesn't know very well, mostly because he is constantly afraid he is misreading the body language and the girl will be offended or regret it later. I've seen women draped on him, and him denying that they is interested. It's almost like he has a blind spot on when a woman is interested versus when she is not and from too many years of being told no, because he waited til he was in the friend zone to ask someone out.

Just the stuff in your post about hugs and sitting against each other resonated with me, I'd view that as friend zone stuff too.

For me the cheeky fella who did come back after I turned him down asking what was wrong with him that I wouldn't go out with him was the one I ended up marrying.

GalwayGuy2

The body language is more aggressive than innocuous by nature and I guess it does require a certain confidence/experience, but more often 'taking the bull by the horns' will pay off tenfold and 'playing it safe'/being overly measured and 'respectful' will just lead you further down the path you're on.

I found this post, and usernames, quite interesting. There probably is behavior that labels you as a 'friend' and behaviors that labels you as a 'Hot mamma, I'd do things to him' sort of guy. I guess it's a bit hard to see a timid man as someone you want to be with.

Tbh, I think a bit of cheeky (not-crude or graphic) flirting can't go wrong. But, IMO, there's a difference in being a little cold at the begining, and just not wanting you to flirt with them. So, pay attention to the woman's body language.

dd972

beks101 wrote: »

You sound very passive. As if it's up to women or 'fate' to sort out your problems for you.

Have you expressed any interest in a woman in the last two years? When's the last time you actively pursued a woman and asked her out? What about those online women, WHY didn't it go any further than friends, if you met them through dating/hookup sites? Did you flirt with them, initiate physical contact, express your intentions, move in for a kiss? Make it clear you want to be more than friends?

You sound as if you're stuck in the trappings of your own mind, which has decided that you'll never meet anyone and will be FOREVERALONE and it's become a bit of a self fulfilling prophecy. I read something once that explains this better:"be mindful of your self-talk. It's a conversation with the universe"

If you want something, you have to 1. BELIEVE that you deserve it and 2. be proactive, be a man on a mission, create opportunities, fight for it, be unwilling to stop until you get it. That applies to life in general and also dating.

Right now it sounds like you're sulking over the fact that women aren't throwing themselves at you and you're just lying back and accepting your 'fate'.

I get all this 100% and it's sound advice which will work for some, however with all this pep talk about people having to put themselves ''out there'', joining dating websites and traipsing around pubs, clubs and singles nights, it's still a joke to see Johnny and Mary hook up and flop out into smug, relaxed, comfortable and sloppy coupledom when they've put no apparent effort or sweat into making it happen.

I'm of the opinion that there's people who simply aren't natural co-habitors or marriage material apart from that they're perfectly 'normal' in all other aspects of their lives. Not trying to pull you down further OP, but factor it in that maybe you won't meet anybody, will anyone have died or come to any harm if you don't?

outofideas

OP here again, sorry I couldn't stay with it but work called.

It's interesting that the conversation has largely diverted itself to what usually happens when I try talking to somebody about this...it turns to how to meet somebody, get involved with somebody, get into a relationship...and it's not about that at all. I'm not particularly looking for a relationship right now (although if one came along I wouldn't run from it either)...I'm in a brighter mood than I was earlier on but it's still about the same thing. The complete sexual frustration. The idea that I've gone past the point in my life where a one night stand is in any way meaningful or interesting but it might end up being that - probably in exchange for money - that gets me out of this headspace. It's now over two years since I had ANY sort of sexual interaction with anyone. And it's starting to creep into my head in unpleasant ways.

Oh I don't mean anything subversive or nasty or anything like that, I want to be absolutely clear about that...but it's starting to affect what I do, my motivations for doing things, the amount of time I'm now starting to spend looking at sexual websites, adult contacts...seeing women as sexual objects because I don't have a healthy sexual outlet. I really really don't want to be that guy. And yet what was said earlier about being friendzoned...that totally struck a chord with me. I hear it over and over...and yes, it's nice and it's flattering and complementary that women value me as a friend and don't want to ruin that...but I just can't get why just one doesn't look at me and think "Hmmm I wouldn't mind a bit of that" (or whatever way women think that kind of thing, apologies for my inaccurate rendering of female lust lol)...

It's frustrating. It's frustrating now even typing about it but at least I'm getting feedback so that's something.

beks101

OP, you explicitly said the NSA / one night stand thing did nothing for you in an earlier post, so I think most people who replied including myself have been working off the assumption that you wanted something more meaningful I.E a relationship.

If you're not necessarily looking for a relationship, but not happy to go out and have a bit of casual sex with a randomer, and aren't exactly keen on picking up a hooker...what other possible solution is there to your frustration other than continuing down the sex sites etc route you seem to be taking?

And it's not flattering to be friendzoned, it's obviously a massive source of frustration for you and you need to get into the headspace where it absolutely is not something you will respect, tolerate or accept from a woman you want more from. Next time you find yourself there, turn around and walk away - you don't need another female friend to add to the list and the only way out of the 'zone is to express your intentions as was outlined in many responses above
(direct body language and full-on flirting) and if you don't get the result you want, move on.

Your self-perception as always the "friend" will do you no favours.

Kold

You could always sleep with a brass. Get it out of your system and take the edge off it so you're looking at regular woman with less of an impetus on one thing.

Mammanabammana

beks101 wrote: »

OP, you explicitly said the NSA / one night stand thing did nothing for you in an earlier post, so I think most people who replied including myself have been working off the assumption that you wanted something more meaningful I.E a relationship.

Yep. I also said that I knew I was probably contradicting myself and I didn't really know what I was thinking. I didn't sit and formulate an exact format of what I wanted to say, I just put down what's going on with me. That doesn't mean I'm any less appreciative of what people have been saying. It just means that I'm all over the place with this and since I can't work it out in my own head I'm bouncing it out here to see if people can relate and suggest stuff. And they can, and have. I'm not posting a "here's the problem, what's the solution?" post, it's a "here's my situation, sorry if it's not totally clear, any suggestions?" post.

beks101 wrote: »

And it's not flattering to be friendzoned, it's obviously a massive source of frustration for you and you need to get into the headspace where it absolutely is not something you will respect, tolerate or accept from a woman you want more from. Next time you find yourself there, turn around and walk away - you don't need another female friend to add to the list and the only way out of the 'zone is to express your intentions as was outlined in many responses above
(direct body language and full-on flirting) and if you don't get the result you want, move on.

Your self-perception as always the "friend" will do you no favours.

This. Makes sense. It seems harsh but I've never actually thought of it...maybe it's the way forward. I also know there are sexually grey areas between NSA/ONS and full on relationship-based intimacy.

Kold wrote: »

You could always sleep with a brass. Get it out of your system and take the edge off it so you're looking at regular woman with less of an impetus on one thing.

Or this.

At least it's more to be thinking about.

username123

Stop being friends with women. Become a bit more predatorial in your dealings with new women on the scene.

And take risks. It's a numbers game really, try it on with enough people and someone will say yes.

Czarcasm

Mammanabammana wrote: »

This. Makes sense. It seems harsh but I've never actually thought of it...maybe it's the way forward. I also know there are sexually grey areas between NSA/ONS and full on relationship-based intimacy.

You've never actually thought of it OP because you can't see for yourself that you're being zoned left, right and centre. This is why as honest as you think your female friends are being with you, they'll still spare your feelings, because they don't want it to be awkward for themselves by having to tell you that "look, nice guy and all, but that's about it- nice. No spark, no passion, no chemistry!". You really are your own worst enemy, and as beks said - if they're not floating your boat, or vice versa, don't accept "let's be friends", you're a nice guy, but you're not 13 any more.

Or this.

At least it's more to be thinking about.

Visiting a sex worker OP won't make a blind bit of difference to how you're actually feeling and thinking right now. All it will do give you some temporary physical relief and a lighter wallet. I don't think you really want to go down that road anyway, that's probably the desperation and sexual frustration talking at this stage.

So OP y'know that money that you were going to pay to go see a sex worker? Perhaps you could make an appointment with a private therapist to talk about CBT, Cognitive Behavioural Therapy, which will help you sort out a lot of the mess in your head, and help you start thinking more clearly about what you really want. The sessions will also help you with your self-confidence and learning how to be more assertive and in control of situations.

The next time you meet a girl then, hopefully you'll have the confidence to close the deal rather than walk yourself into the friendzone again.

ongarboy

I don't advocate paying for sex either but without sounding too radical, how about OP just going to a nightclub for a ONS or NSA mutual encounter? I'm not trying to sound blunt but there will be plenty of women (as there are men) at these places that while may not be high on the marks out of 10 looks scale or fantasy one nighters but who will fulfill the sexual and physical intimacy void OP so desperately want's to get rid of. You will not get the friend zone rejections because such factors don't even come into play when it's just about random hook ups. You barely have to know each other's names to score if it's an end of night encounter.

There are a few over 30s clubs (in Dublin anyway) where OP may find women around his own age or even older who will be up for ONS. Also, such encounters can and have unintentionally lead to more meaningful relationships down the line (just don't be thinking or wishing for such during such initial hook ups). I'm not advocating this as something to do night after night as it eventually does become hollow but just to get OP out of his sexual frustration rut, it might help and he may pick up some new skills on the art of flirting with women through trial and error. It may give him a new found confidence and perspective and rid himself of subconscious and repellent projections he is unwittingly emitting to potential partners so that when he does start looking for women for real relationships further down the line, the current sexual frustration he feels will not be present.

The Diabolical Monocle

Go to a prostitute - just get it on her chest.

lol - no don't.

But hey, at least no unplanned pregnancies.

Taltos

The Diabolical Monocle - welcome to PI/RI.
Please read our charter here before posting again.

We have little tolerance for messing about and if you cannot give legal & constructive advice we ask you not to post. Posting in the manner above will quickly result in you losing all posting rights to this forum.

Cheers
Taltos

outofideas

Thanks for the input, people. Plenty of stuff for me to mull over, which was the point of posting here in the first place. Maybe I AM too nice about the friendzoning thing...that's something that has been said to me before. I'm not sure about the therapist but it's certainly something I'll look into. I don't lack confidence or assertiveness...I guess it's just that I don't know how to play this game any more.

I also need to find places to meet people. I don't drink and like I said, late 30s, so clubs and pubs aren't really options - plus it removes the streamlining effect of alcohol (plus any benefit I may gain from the wearing of beer goggles )...I was told (by a girl, which is an important point) to start going to clubs for the last hour as sober guys tend to be sought after by girls at that hour...but I dunno, sober me seeking drunken girl at 2am seems a bit rapey and creeperish.

Still...something to think about.

Czarcasm

outofideas wrote: »

Thanks for the input, people. Plenty of stuff for me to mull over, which was the point of posting here in the first place. Maybe I AM too nice about the friendzoning thing...that's something that has been said to me before. I'm not sure about the therapist but it's certainly something I'll look into. I don't lack confidence or assertiveness...I guess it's just that I don't know how to play this game any more.

Erm, I don't mean to sound funny OP but in one breath you're saying you don't lack confidence, and the next you're saying you don't know how to "play this game" any more? I know it's often referred to as "the dating game" and maybe that's what you meant, but there really are no hard and fast rules nor theories about strategies, etc. It's not really a game you can "play" or even bluff your way through it. I'm not going to give you cliches either about "just be yourself" etc, because you have to be a more positive version of yourself. That's going to take some effort to overcome how you're feeling internally right now about the whole thing, but it's not an impossible task.

I also need to find places to meet people. I don't drink and like I said, late 30s, so clubs and pubs aren't really options - plus it removes the streamlining effect of alcohol (plus any benefit I may gain from the wearing of beer goggles )...I was told (by a girl, which is an important point) to start going to clubs for the last hour as sober guys tend to be sought after by girls at that hour...but I dunno, sober me seeking drunken girl at 2am seems a bit rapey and creeperish.

Still...something to think about.

At least you're clued in enough to realise your mate was giving you terrible advice! I mean, I really have to wonder what planet... actually now I think of it, she probably mentioned it like some last ditch idea that was so off the wall you wouldn't possibly entertain it, because you probably told her you'd tried everything already.

Please don't seriously include this as something to think about OP. Maybe instead just cool the jets on your determination to break your dry spell and try and work on changing your general outlook instead of being so focussed on a five minute fumble between the sheets.

Call Me Jimmy

Yes I think it's a thin line between 'playing the game' (absolutely detest that kind of thinking/talk) - where you are basically a robot using a configuration of unnatural ways to 'unlock' a woman - and just being yourself but more forward.

My assumption is that it isn't made obvious to the women right away that YOU fancy THEM. The way you smile or look into the eyes of a woman can be subtly but drastically different if it's someone you just like and someone you really fancy the look of. I find facial expressions and knowing looks are the best way to put the boat out to really determine if they like ye. If you are being fully yourself, really in the moment I don't see how you aren't picking up on either a flat-out rejection or getting something more.

(I don't think any man in pursuit of woman seriously can naturally just be 'nice', even in women I think the idea of their being a bit of an edge is the difference for me).

That's just my perspective, steer clear from anything that isn't you but if your friends have not made of point of you being indirect in your pursuits then it's hard to believe anyone here can help you except yourself. I feel you may be missing something from a critical point of view about yourself. There is also a question of the women you are going for but that is a smaller question because different strokes an all that.

Cheekiness is the only thing I have in my armory, but it's fun being like that because it's very youthful and exciting and is a good gauge for both people involved. Without that extra bit of something, conversations with women would stay very platonic I'd imagine.

outofideas

Czarcasm wrote: »

Erm, I don't mean to sound funny OP but in one breath you're saying you don't lack confidence, and the next you're saying you don't know how to "play this game" any more?

But I don't. How to move from just being friends to any kind of sexual interaction...how to begin initiating interest...how to make a woman interested in me in the way I mean...how to even just make myself into the kind of guy a woman just wants to be with...I don't know how to play that game. It can't be about confidence or self-assurance or assertiveness cos I have all those things.

Czarcasm wrote: »

Please don't seriously include this as something to think about OP. Maybe instead just cool the jets on your determination to break your dry spell and try and work on changing your general outlook instead of being so focussed on a five minute fumble between the sheets.

I should have been clearer, what I meant was the whole thread had given me something to think about, not that I was going to give that particular idea any thought!

Call Me Jimmy

outofideas wrote: »

But I don't. How to move from just being friends to any kind of sexual interaction...how to begin initiating interest...how to make a woman interested in me in the way I mean...how to even just make myself into the kind of guy a woman just wants to be with...I don't know how to play that game.

Okay I think I got it. You seem to want or expect one single event of sign that either you have to do or you have to pick up on from the woman that is a green light and then everything goes to the next level in one moment and then you'd go for it completely.

My take is that it is a constant thing of pushing the boat out inch by inch throughout the conversation. So you might say something very innocuous (but that is something that she wouldn't get offended by or drop her pants for either), and see if she says something more. If she responds positively (it's all very subtle) then you turn it up a TINY notch and say something geared towards the risque (but not quite risque) and see what type of things she says back. I don't mean outright sexual stuff, stuff you could get away with saying 'i'm just talking here hah'. More positive feedback, raise it a tiny notch again. It's a continuous thing like that. It won't usually be a single yes or no response that you build up to for two hours. That is asking for trouble. It's an organic process imo which you steer a bit (cheekiness helps). Don't forget they might be doing some steering of their own so if they do you gotta take it up with them.


Just my 2 cents man, I don't know you but from what you said earlier about the talk of 'moving things forward' it seems like maybe you try to just get along and then wait for a single moment where it's all or nothing, which really shows that you might not be enjoying the whole experience and actually having a more 'charged' and indulgent time with them.

Call Me Jimmy

And say things you want to say a bit more rather than things that you think they want to hear.

jamesr123

porn is great when experiencing a dry spell. I'm not saying watch it 50 times a day but, it defo helps me out.. As for sex and women just for get about it. I desperately look for a gf and never found one. The minute I forgot about it a lovely gf appeared.