ATH Knockout match: Shagnasti vs Gerrybbadd

Bounty Hunter

The first match up has set a fairly high standard for these two to follow in this one, the match that will decide who will face the winner of that first match in our 1st quarter-final for this year.

Simplified version of the rules:

I will post a topic and you have to post your response including why you made that choice within a given time limit (before the next match is scheduled to begin), take care while making your responses however as the other contestant can counter your arguement i.e pointing out possible flaws in what youve said.

*you can only counter an arguement two times so make sure your point is worth making. If someone's defense of their arguement isnt good it will count against them.

*You can use the same answer as your opponent if you wish i.e you agree with their choice however its hard to win a debate when your making the same points someone has already made

see the OP of the main thread for further details or if any examples are needed check out previous years competitions.

Question 2: If you were to turn someone already on the WWE payroll into a manager for someone, who would you choose and who would you have them manage?

after your first post: why would your choice be better than your oponents?

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g'luck and have at it folks!

a poll will be added after both competitors have responded but seing as this is match one and they may not know they are up already don't expect them to post too quickly

gerrybbadd

I have thought long & hard about this one, and 2 names keep coming back to me. There are plenty of guys in the WWE at the moment who could do with a management influence to help elevate them. So I got to thinking - who is the biggest under achiever in the WWE at the moment?

Alberto Del Rio.

Here's a guy that has it all, but it seems hasn't a clue how to connect with the audience, and translate all of that talent into true success. To date, ADR has seemed as nothing more than a higher mid card guy, and seems destined to remain there. So, who to put with him?

It has to be... John Bradshaw Layfield.

Now, I would leave JBL on the commentary team, as well as take ADR on as a client. You could build their union slowly, with JBL talking ADR up as a guy that has it all, but has failed to utilise his best attributes. This could go on for some time, with JBL becoming more vocal weekly, and getting more annoyed each time.

Eventually, JBL could be seen entering ADR's locker room in a segment on Raw. Cole & King would quiz him on his return to the announce desk, and JBL would say that he had some business to attend to with ADR, that was none of their business.

Later on, ADR comes out for a match, and crushes his opponent (think Ziggler for the WHC), and when the match is over, he could say he had lost some of that fire in his eyes, that spark that he initially had when he first entered the WWE. Then he would say thanks to JBL, leave the mic in the centre of the ring, walking out. Camera would then pan to Cole & King, jaws open, with JBL having a somewhat serious (but trying to stifle a smile) look on his face.

The next week, ADR comes out to his old, heel music, in a car.... with bullhorns on the hood. Both he and JBL step out, to reveal their union. JBL reveals that he has taken ADR under his wing, as they are both cut from the same cloth. He was once a Wrestling God, but that is the past. It's time for a new Wrestling God to emerge, and JBL has identified who this will be - ADR.

This works on a lot of levels, as ADR would have a mouthpiece that he badly needs. JBL would be tireless in his promotion of ADR, and could continue to talk him up on the commentary team. All ADR needs to concentrate on is putting in vicious performances each and every week. JBL will be talking him up as a serious threat, and ADR will be backing this up with his in ring performances.

ShagNastii

Gerrybbadd

If I was to turn a talent into a manager it wouldn't be anything too radical. It might be deemed uninspired but I would certainly turn William Regal into a manager. It would have as much to do with his "could have been" in terms of his tenure in the main event of WWE as to why I picked the Blackpool native. Regal is a true great and when it comes to villainous characters he should be the mould.

Nearly fiver years ago, Regal received the biggest push of his storied career when he was general manager of Raw. He was crown king of the ring and it looked like his run at the uppercard was set in track. As always he was able to draw massive heat by interrupting matches and often shutting off the lights completely. Generally being the smug pompous a$$hole he has always been.

Of course this run came to a shuddering stop with a wellness violation and as stated above it will be chalked down as one of wrestling's "what could've beens?".

He needs to get this run (albeit as a manager). He has so much going for him and this would rub off no end on the superstar I selected he would managed. Regal is a genuine wrestling talent. A lot of fans would LOVE to see him in and around the top spot. Regal brings a level of wrestling credibility to things which has worked perfectly with the examples of DB and Antonio Casero. He has the history, he has the toughness and he has a dastardliness the fans buy big style.

I would place him with Wade Barrett.

"Oh that's original!!" I hear you guys shout. I know, I know the Brits with Brits has been done many many times before. I agree, but it was been wholly half-assed and almost a default setting. Pump it up into the main event and it could become something special.

Wade is another pure believable talent. Dipping his toes in the main-event when he spearheaded the Nexus proves he has it in him. Many would argue the fact he didn't land the title during his fued with Cena to be a huge miscall by the WWE. His mike skills are certainly highend and he can go toe to toe match-wise with the best of them. He also (well I get the vibe) still wouldn't ultimate be class as "a guy". He still has a newcomer feel to him. A manager and mentor would still fit well. So how would it get done?

Regal has spent the guts of the last past year honing his commentating skills on WWE NXT, where he has exceedingly flourished. He has somewhat lost his "villain" tag and he is slowly but surely morphing into "nice old veteran" Regal. We can't be 'aving this!!!!:D

Throw him on the desk on either Raw or Smackdown for a few weeks/months. Let him continue the "nice old veteran" Regal just to lull the crowd into his niceties and make them forget he's a bit of a p*ick. Give Barrett a bit of momentum towards getting a title and when it comes to the crux of the feud. Get the three Brits from NXT (Grey, Neville and Burch) to interfere and win Barrett the title. "What the hell is this?". Enter William Regal--the dastardly villain and mastermind of the whole thing. He is no longer the king, he is the kingpin and he has a pack of perfectly tailored gangsters to do his bidding.

They (WWE) have been pussy footing around the whole gangster thug Barrett without doing it any justice. Now he has his "old hand" and his crew to make it legit. Think Nexus Version.2 but this time only a bit more dangerous and a lot better spoken. A Reservoir dogs look with Lock Stock attitude. As led by the true gangster himself Wade Barrett and sinisterly managed by auld Brick Top himself William Regal.

gerrybbadd

I can't see the United Kindom angle working, or being beneficial for Wade. One of the main things that is going against this is, there are already factions in the WWE, we have the Corporation, The Wyatts, The Shield (i know, already in the Corporation), and Zeb's Real Americans.

The danger here is Wade and crew would get swallowed up in the mix quite quickly. Wade is a guy that should be much higher than he is currently, and agreed, he would have made a big impact had he beaten Cena for the title. However, since then, the only thing he has done of note is a great feud wth Randy Orton over on Smackdown.

Regal is a legend, there is no doubt about that, but he has never broken through that glass ceiling in the WWE, and although he was pushed, winning the KOTR etc, he never really seemed destined for the top - even for a WHC reign.

I can't see any association with Regal resulting in promotion up the card for Barrett. Here's 2 mid card guys, that never really achieved what many thought they would. And surrounding Barrett with the NXT guys (while this would be good for them), would only serve to make Barrett look weak, as if he can only survive and thrive in the WWE as part of a faction (Nexus, Corre, then the Brits).

Barrett really needs to carve his own niche for himself in the WWE. He does have a likeability and legitimacy about him, but to date, he has failed to translate this in his in ring work, and connection with the audience.

It is a good idea, and something I would like to see myself, but ultimately, in a WWE with so many faction style groups already established, this idea cannot work, and wouldn't get over with the audience.

ShagNastii

Gerrybbadd

I think it is unfair to write Regal and Barrett as guys who never achieved what they should have or could have. Regal's case might be different but their shortcomings had nothing to do with their inability or lack of skill. Regal's trip to the main event was cut short due to his off screen stupidity. Wade never got that title not because he didn't deserve it. It was due to booking decisions at the time.

The mentions of "nothing more than midcarders" are unheralded. There are very few that would doubt Barrett or Regal if they were thrown back into the main event mix. I've highlighted their proven skills on mike and in ring.

That's a thing with my suggestion, this faction of Brit gangsters would be fresh. Seeing Regal play leader and general would be something exciting. Whether it's ADR saying I'm rich or whether it's JBL saying Del Rio is rich. It has all been done before.

We've seen Alberto Del Rio the money man and heard so so much about his "destiny". Cutting and pasting this again with (-Mexican hating-) JBL would be boring. Del Rio was making serious waves as a face and it should have remained that way.

I take your point about the excessive amount of fractions. I guess I'd intend my guys to run roughshot over Smackdown. I would be hard to place Barrett around the Raw title picture because it would be hard to see how the corporation and the Brits would fued. You could make them face and work on the history between Orton and Barrett or HHH and Regal.

You are probably over stated in the amount of stables. The corporation is clearly one. I think the Shield and Wyatt wouldn't be fullblown stables plus The Shield are surely soon to wind down.

gerrybbadd

To counter your argument about it being unfair to say that Regal and Wade are underachievers - it may have been unfair, but it is also true. And the truth hurts (or may set you free, if you ask R Truth). I had said they were nothing more than mid carders, again, because this is also true. Regal never reached the upper echelons of WCW, and the same happened in WWE/F. Barrett seems destined for the same fate.

You state in your argument that this kind of faction would be a fresh idea. I have to disagree. For the video gamers amongst us, this idea would seem quite stale, as a similar storyline was used in WWE 12. Regal, Barrett, Sheamus & Drew McIntyre came together, under the name The United Kingdom, and ran roughshod over the WWE. Now, I'm in now way accusing you of stealing an idea Shagnasti. It's just the idea is very similar to something that has already been done.

And you say that ADR was making serious waves as a face - again, I disagree. He did not have a good turn as a face at all, and became stale and boring. The crowd reactions are all the evidence that is needed here.

I still stand by my assumption that JBL & ADR are gold together. There is so much potential here. If you wanted to go down the comedy route with it, you could have JBL & ADR acting the Pr*ck, coming out shaking hands with the Universe, then JBL slyly passing ADR the antibacterial handwash.

Or, the serious route, with ADR being the ass kicker, and JBL being the tireless promoter on the mic.

Even when the storyline would run it's course, the breakdown in relations between the two would be class. It would be built slow, with JBL becoming critical of ADRs work in the ring, despite ADR delivering the goods. This could continue for weeks, months, getting worse and worse, before it would finally blow up, with ADR kicking the high hell out of JBL. This would result in ADR getting over as a face then, properly over this time.

ShagNastii

Gerrybbadd

I am aware of the united kingdom angle from wwe 11/12. It is a perfect case of the half assed unamerican─esque angle that has been lumped onto regal and others before. That is where the duo would have to tweak their gimmick slightly. The gangster/geezer spin on things would make it different. It sounds naff but ill mention the guy richie movies. Make all involved that slight bit darker. Plus putting a group in the main event instantly changes the picture and makes them infinately more credible. I hate to reference both the nexus and the shield they were put right into the uppercard and striaght away looked like a million dollars.

And even if you are correct about their previous midcard status wouldnt it be more interesting to see them get the batton and run. Unlike the richman duo. What could JBL and ADR do in the main event that they havent already done.

Plus JBL has not got that mentoring in him that Regal has coming out if his ears.

Bounty Hunter

Gerrybbadd

we had a huge turn out to vote in the first ATH match up with over around 35 votes cast. Honestly dont expect that many again (prove me wrong) but if you havent voted on this match up yet, polls close tonight just after 11pm.


Before then I will probably have the next match posted (will try to at least let the first match up drift off the first page before posting anymore after that though).

gerrybbadd

Win or lose - I enjoyed this. It was a pleasure jousting with you Shagnastii!:)

ShagNastii

Gerrybbadd

Ditto. Good luck, great choice in ADR and JBL. First time doing ATH here.


If you had the time you could answer the question a hundred times over, and everyone would be better than the next.

Tis very unbecoming but vote for the Brits. You know you want to.


http://replygif.net/1285

campo

Gerrybbadd

Great battle lads my vote went in but being honest it was very close and the only reason I voted for who I did was the storyline made more sense in my head ..

I won't say who I voted for as I do not want to give a unfair advantage

beakerjoe

This was my first time reading such a thread. I was pleasantly surprised and i enjoyed both competitors posts. Both very creative.

Bounty Hunter

Gerrybbadd

It wasn't earlier but now it's much closer - 1 vote separates the 2 at this moment so as with the last one literally 1 vote can make a difference now

gerrybbadd

ShagNastii wrote: »

Ditto. Good luck, great choice in ADR and JBL. First time doing ATH here.


If you had the time you could answer the question a hundred times over, and everyone would be better than the next.

Tis very unbecoming but vote for the Brits. You know you want to.


http://replygif.net/1285

Bitta Mick Foley style shameless pandering there... I love it!

campo

Gerrybbadd

gerrybbadd wrote: »

Bitta Mick Foley style shameless pandering there... I love it!

Now that votes are finished I voted for shag only because I could not see JBL & ADR working together , ok they have same entrance but JBL working with a Mexican wrestler goes against his gimmick I felt

Bounty Hunter

Gerrybbadd

Congrats Shagnasti, comiserations Gerrybbadd, two really good answers again but now we know the first quater-final will be thebostoncrab vs Shagnasti