Passive aggressive behaviour towards me from carer

LegacyUser

I need to decide on a good way to proceed on this and nip this in the bud as fast as I can as I am a bit put out by it.

We are a young enough family and have installed 24/7 care for our parent for the last few years. We have been successful in this due to each of us, to varying degrees of course, taking turns to oversee things. We don't use an agency and have private carers working for us and it has worked like magic over the last few years and have great people working for us.

Sadly there is a bit of a situation now which I find a little bit rich and insufferable. I am not happy to just ignore it.
One of my siblings hired a carer a good while back to take over from another carer we had and I had little contact with this person over the course of that time, bar the odd call or meeting them in a changeover, etc. as this was the time my sibling was in charge of things.

As I am now once again at the forefront of things and managing the entire set-up. I have been more in contact with this carer. She is quite elderly and I have been nothing but respectful and nice to her in every conversation I have had with her and have told her several times how much we appreciate her work for our parent.

I made a call to her recently just to be make sure I had all the right hours and pay determined for her, and even though it turned out I was right, and I knew I was, she repeatedly said to me 'You're wrong' when I read out hours and/or the pay. I had to go over things many times. She is very sharp so it was not a case of her being slow or not picking up what I was saying. In any case, I have no problem with a person saying that I might be wrong if expressed respectfully but her manner was actually abrupt and rude and I had made the call to be helpful and make sure she was getting the proper pay. I don't understand her attitude. I had to stay calm with her and kept the call very short but I really resent this treatment.

There is a rift in the family but it does not affect the care of our parent which is a priority for us, but I do believe that the sibling who hired her, and who is also the sibling I have fallen out with, has been talking about me behind my back and she has taken sides as she does not know me.

It's very disappointing. I have been nothing but nice to her and she constantly praises this sibling in almost every call I make to her, even though i make no reference to them whatsoever.

I will have more contact with her now going forward and find it hard to stomach this attitude given I have been nothing but respectful and nice to her.

Matteroffact

Not everyone is nice and you have come across a woman who is not nice. Don't take it personally. You did nothing wrong. If it was obvious that you were right why could she not see this? If she discovered that you were right later on did she not apologize for her mistake? The bottom line though is that there are people out there who just never come across nice to anyone. It is just their way. You are not like that so you don't understand it. I can appreciate how you feel because I have come across such people myself in my travels and while I used to think it was something I did I now know that it is entirely bad manners on their part. Don't worry about this anymore. Hopefully you won't come across it again.

LegacyUser

Thanks a lot for that. Do you think I can trust her with my parent?

Yeah, it's possible she is just hard and a bit nasty in general with people she just might not like, though it's not the type of behaviour I am used to, or would expect, from a carer. And I have never had this issue with anyone else caring for our parent.

She always says how she would do anything for our parent, and mentioned how she had been offered another job but turned it down to stay with us, but I'm wondering whether this is the case at all and if she is treating him indifferently also? Her pay is very good and she in fact turns down any offers for money towards petrol, etc.

I am guessing she has more empathy and respect towards an older person though so I hope she is good with our parent but I now have doubts and don't actually want to have much contact with her but it's going to be unavoidable and I don't want to be rude back to her as it might affect how she deals with my parent, or she might at some stage cite me as a reason to leave or something.. you never know..

Matteroffact

There is no harm in keeping an eye on this Carer. I have had some experience with bad Carers........Carers who only show up for 10 minutes when they they should be there for an hour, Carers who turn up late and Carers who don't turn up at all but blamed my mother for not answering the door which I had proof that that was not the case. These were agency Carers. It might be a good idea to do spot checks and listen to your parent on what they think of this Carer. You could be right in that your sibling could have given her a slanted view of you and she might just be taking the high road as a consequence, which is wrong because she should take you as she finds you. However, spot checks should prove a lot.

Stavro Mueller

If you asked your parent questions about this carer would they be able to answer them?

washiskin

I think you should put this professional relationship on that very footing - professional. As you rightly say your parent is the priority and she seems to be devoted to looking after them so perhaps introducing a system of her keeping her hours on an accessible sheet to stop any minor aggravation vis. hours would help.
Now that you are in charge of the co-ordination it might be helpful to have a chat about how things will not be the same as when your sibling was running things - it might sound a bit draconian but she needs her cards marked to be fair to everyone involved. If you start afresh and iron out any wrinkles now it may run much more smoothly for you.

Matteroffact is right in suggesting the occasional spot check - for a good while we suspected our own mother was a bit afraid of one of her former carers who would occasionally berate us over the phone if something wasn't to her liking in my Mum's house. Needless to say she was caught out & was removed straight away. Cymbaline's suggestion of consulting your parent is also a good thing.

LegacyUser

dancingstopped wrote: »

Thanks a lot for that. Do you think I can trust her with my parent?

Yeah, it's possible she is just hard and a bit nasty in general with people she just might not like, though it's not the type of behaviour I am used to, or would expect, from a carer. And I have never had this issue with anyone else caring for our parent.

She always says how she would do anything for our parent, and mentioned how she had been offered another job but turned it down to stay with us, but I'm wondering whether this is the case at all and if she is treating him indifferently also? Her pay is very good and she in fact turns down any offers for money towards petrol, etc.

I am guessing she has more empathy and respect towards an older person though so I hope she is good with our parent but I now have doubts and don't actually want to have much contact with her but it's going to be unavoidable and I don't want to be rude back to her as it might affect how she deals with my parent, or she might at some stage cite me as a reason to leave or something.. you never know..

The only thing you seem to have against her is she disagreed with you on how much she was to be paid. If there's all this changeover and a rift between sibling A and sibling B is it possible she did more hours than you know about? I think it's unfair the way you are saying she's hard and nasty, that she might not be trustworthy when all you have is this one conversation with her that has upset you. Did she explain why she believed you had calculated her pay wrong?

LegacyUser

Thanks again everyone.

I'm going to get hidden cameras in for this person's hours just to be sure. I hope it's a case that she was just being narky with me and isn't like that with our parent but this way I can be sure.

@careorcareless: She herself had made the mistake, and just hadn't listened when I read out what hours I had down for her. She was just convinced she was right. Whatever about that, there is no need to repeatedly say 'you're wrong' to someone who has been nothing but nice to her.

It is also the other comments about my sibling which are endless. That's why I suspect she wants to provoke me and it hasn't worked for her as I won't rise to any of that bull. I will see how next while goes.

Maybe she just came across badly but didn't mean to! Time will tell anyway

MouseTail

dancingstopped wrote: »

Thanks again everyone.

I'm going to get hidden cameras in for this person's hours just to be sure.

Whatever you do, don't do this. It is illegal, If carmeras are to be placed in a persons place of work, the employee must be made aware of them.

alie

Do an unannounced spot check, no cameras as poster above said, a good carer should not get involved with sibling issues , her job is to look after your mam, have you applied to the HSE for care?

LegacyUser

dancingstopped wrote: »

Thanks again everyone.

I'm going to get hidden cameras in for this person's hours just to be sure. I hope it's a case that she was just being narky with me and isn't like that with our parent but this way I can be sure.

@careorcareless: She herself had made the mistake, and just hadn't listened when I read out what hours I had down for her. She was just convinced she was right. Whatever about that, there is no need to repeatedly say 'you're wrong' to someone who has been nothing but nice to her.

It is also the other comments about my sibling which are endless. That's why I suspect she wants to provoke me and it hasn't worked for her as I won't rise to any of that bull. I will see how next while goes.

Maybe she just came across badly but didn't mean to! Time will tell anyway

What comments about your siblings? Because she compliments them? Not everyone is interested in getting involved in your sibling rivalry. You say your "parents care is your priority" but right not you seem more hellbent on proving this woman to be a nasty piece of work all because she says nice things about your sibling?

Big Bag of Chips

dancingstopped wrote: »

It is also the other comments about my sibling which are endless. That's why I suspect she wants to provoke me and it hasn't worked for her as I won't rise to any of that bull. I will see how next while goes.

I think you are thinking far too deeply on this. You obviously got off on the wrong foot with her, and as a result you now take everything she says as a dig at you.

The truth is, she doesn't know you. She doesn't know your family. She barely knows your sister. I'd guess she knows very little (if anything) about your falling out with your sister, and I'd guess she talks to you about her, because 'it's just something to talk about'.

You've had a falling out with your sister. That means that anything she does will make you suspicious or just plain annoyed. She was the one who organised this particular carer, so already this woman was going to be starting off at a disadvantage with you, purely because it was your sister who organised it. Subconsciously (or even consciously) you want this to not work out, so that your sister was 'wrong' in hiring her.

I can't imagine that this woman is the slightest bit interested in your falling out. She barely knows you sister, but knows her a bit better than she knows you. You are obviously annoyed at your sister, and she's not your favourite person in the world at the moment... But not everyone has to feel the same about them. And maybe this woman has only seen the nice side... And thinks she is "making conversation" by talking to you about it?

Obviously you should go with your gut instinct when it comes to carers for your dad, and if you feel something is 'off' then of course you should be on your guard and keep a very close eye on things.

If all you are basing your dislike on is the fact that your sibling organised her, and she talks highly of your sibling, then maybe you should honestly consider if it's just 'sour grapes' on your part.

Some people have a "gruffer" manner than others. It doesn't make them mean, cruel people though....

Edit: I accept I'm assuming "sister" for sibling, but it doesn't change the advice!

Also... The call that started all this you say you rang to "check" her hours and pay with her, but when you read it out, she was telling you, you were wrong, and you knew you weren't. So why bother with the phonecall. Maybe she honestly did think you were wrong? But that phonecall caused a stand off where you both were unwilling to compromise. Maybe the best thing to do, if you were in fact "checking" with her, was to take her list of dates/times/pay etc and tell her you would compare it with yours and see if there were discrepancies. And then be able to back up your version?

As it was you rang her to tell her, not check with her! All the while being nothing but polite and mannerly. Maybe she could take that as you being passive aggressive towards her?? It's all subjective, you see.

Sometimes people react to another person's manner... Maybe you just both misunderstood each other, and now there's an 'atmosphere'?

LegacyUser

<Mod Snip: No need to quote entire post. It just becomes cumbersome for posters to scroll through. It's bad enough having to get through a post that long, once!>

+1

OP you still never said whether the carer explained why she thought you had her hours wrong. I've never had a conversation with an employer that's underpaid me that just went "Your wrong, your wrong, your wrong"? that doesn't make sense. Surely she tried to explain where the missed hours are? Again if your sister organised her, perhaps she did work more hours than you are aware of. If she is refusing to take petrol money, maybe (i'm not saying its not possible) she isn't trying to fleece you for extra money.

LegacyUser

To be honest, OP it sounds like you are massively overreacting.

This woman is elderly and was plainly caught on the hop when you rang her about her hours/pay, and did not understand what you were saying and tbh it sounded like she got a bit upset. And I'm sure she was a bit pissed off. You hot off the phone fairly lively and I've no doubt she was left thinking "WTF??!"

And tbh, if she was convinced you were wrong (and it sounded like she was) then she had a right to tell you so. Perhaps those were not the hours/pay she agreed at the start with your sister - or thought she had agreed. What was she supposed to do? Think "I'm sure he's wrong but sure I'll let it go - it's only my pay" You say she's hired privately - there's no agency to protect her.

But because of that you're now considering recording her??! Come on.

And because she likes your sibling (who must be quite nice to her) and has the audacity to say nice things about her to you? You assume with no evidence that the two of them are having nice cosy bitching sessions about you? Oh please. As if any carer of five minutes experience would get drawn into a family feud.

I have a LOT of experience with carers - they all have different personalities and some you click with more than others. But from the other side it has to be said that sometimes they get employers who they find difficult. I do not think it is easy being a carer - people are quite quick to pounce on you.

You have detailed no reason at all why you think this woman is failing at her job - but now she is suspected of it. Just because you find her a bit narky.

She is doing a difficult heavy job at this hour of her life for not much money. Give her a break.

LegacyUser

I've made allowances for her being quite elderly herself but she applied for the job so I'm not going to make too much allowances for that and it certainly does not excuse her overall behaviour towards me. I am the daughter of the person she looks after for our family, I have been friendly and nice to her, and there is a certain way to behave with people in general which she is not at all bothered about. Seriously not good enough.

I observed her more over the weekend and I have a better idea of her now. She is doing a competent job with our parent from what I can see but she is not going as far as other carers. Her style of caring is to leave our parent at it, so she is not trying to stimulate them mentally to improve their condition which is a key part in caring for them, and also that way she is sure our parent won't ever react badly to her.

But that is not enough. She is kind of cruising along I think and likes that she doesn't have to do too much talking as she is definitely not the chatty or talking kind.

I'm a bit put out by this and it's doing my head in. I want our carers to do more than just leave our parent at it!

Also when my parent didn't respond when I was leaving (they are often in their own little world) she had a smile on her face. Disgusting.

My first impressions of her were right. I really dislike her now despite best efforts.

LegacyUser

Careorcareless wrote: »

<Mod Snip: No need to quote entire post. It just becomes cumbersome for posters to scroll through. It's bad enough having to get through a post that long, once!>

+1

OP you still never said whether the carer explained why she thought you had her hours wrong. I've never had a conversation with an employer that's underpaid me that just went "Your wrong, your wrong, your wrong"? that doesn't make sense. Surely she tried to explain where the missed hours are? Again if your sister organised her, perhaps she did work more hours than you are aware of. If she is refusing to take petrol money, maybe (i'm not saying its not possible) she isn't trying to fleece you for extra money.

Just to knock this one on the head, my issue is not about the money so I'm not sure why you brought that up here. It was how she spoke and her behaviour. As regards the call, it was she who had made the mistake as she had counted up the hours wrong, but thought I had, hence her 'You're wrong, you're wrong, you're wrong'. It's not about her fleecing or not fleecing us, that is not the point here, and never was.

The reason I cited this, is due to her reaction and how she spoke to me, despite my just trying to be helpful and I was really only just calling her to confirm the hours and pay and sign off on it.

I saw some other worrying behaviour from her over the weekend some of which I've just posted about. I'm very worried overall.

Please if anyone posts I really need to be kept relevant and not made out like I am over-reacting here. I'm not.

Big Bag of Chips

dancingstopped wrote: »

Please if anyone posts I really need to be kept relevant and not made out like I am over-reacting here. I'm not.

Just because people are telling you what you don't want to hear, doesn't mean their advice is not relevant.

Nobody here knows you, or this woman. Nobody here has seen her care for your parent. We are only advising you based on what you posted - and what you posted didn't make it look like she did anything all that bad, except disagree with you on something. So, to some people, it came across as if you over reacted a bit.

You mentioned you don't want her leaving citing you as the reason for it.. I think this has more to do with your falling out with your sibling than it has to do with her! If you have to get rid of her, because you feel she is not caring properly for your dad - then in the battle with your sibling, you've won this one. They were wrong to hire her, and you had to come in and sort it out. Whereas if she leaves "citing you as the reason", as you say yourself - well then it's your fault, in the eyes of your sibling, and something that can further the row.

I don't know what "relevant" advice you are looking for, as you have not asked for any advice in your last couple of posts. You've just "updated" how unsuitable you think she is. Do you want people to tell you you are right, not over-reacting and absolutely must get rid of her?

LegacyUser

dancingstopped wrote: »

Just to knock this one on the head, my issue is not about the money so I'm not sure why you brought that up here. It was how she spoke and her behaviour. As regards the call, it was she who had made the mistake as she had counted up the hours wrong, but thought I had, hence her 'You're wrong, you're wrong, you're wrong'. It's not about her fleecing or not fleecing us, that is not the point here, and never was.

.

Eh, her issue was about the money, right? Which is why she spoke to you like this? You can't separate the two. I mean you wouldn't have just given her extra money for peace sake? So it is about the money. Why else would you bother disagreeing with her if money wasn't an issue.

Are you sure she wasn't just smiling at something else? This still comes across as sour grapes with your sibling more than anything else OP.

deisemum

dancingstopped wrote: »

I observed her more over the weekend and I have a better idea of her now. She is doing a competent job with our parent from what I can see but she is not going as far as other carers. Her style of caring is to leave our parent at it, so she is not trying to stimulate them mentally to improve their condition which is a key part in caring for them, and also that way she is sure our parent won't ever react badly to her.

But that is not enough. She is kind of cruising along I think and likes that she doesn't have to do too much talking as she is definitely not the chatty or talking kind.

Also when my parent didn't respond when I was leaving (they are often in their own little world) she had a smile on her face. Disgusting.

My first impressions of her were right. I really dislike her now despite best efforts.

As much as you say you were nice to her most people can see through that veneer when someone really dislikes them and she probably knows how you really feel about her. A lot of people behave a bit differently if they know they're being observed even more so if they feel they're disliked or there's been a clash and aren't yet comfortable with someone new in charge.

Whether she's a good carer or not none of us here know but from what you've posted you're letting your disagreement with your sister colour your view of this carer and that you're not going to be rest until you find more negative things about her care towards your parent and magnify them out of proportion.

MouseTail

You are dealing with employment law here, tread very very carefully. You do not have sufficient grounds to dismiss this carer.

The sensible, mature thing to do here is to have a family meeting and discuss your concerns, and to hear your siblings out. The current set up is not working as the family rift is impacting on the care plan for your parent.

Big Bag of Chips

dancingstopped, I think what is ironic, and if a woman's job wasn't at stake it would actually be funny, is that you in fact are being incredibly passive aggressive towards her!

You have repeated many many many times how you have been "nothing but nice" to her. You go to great lengths to explain how mannerly you are to her, and how respectful you've been. But all the time using language about her that shows that underneath you don't actually mean any of it!

A situation has arise that you want to "nip in the bud" you find it "rich and insufferable". You say you are making allowances for her age, but "it certainly does not excuse her overall behaviour towards me" which is "seriously not good enough". The incident where she smiled, when your parent didn't respond to you - you describe as "disgusting" (pretty strong word). Maybe she smiled, because throughout the course of her time working there, she was getting the same reaction and was beginning to wonder was it just her? When she saw you getting that reaction (or non reaction) she might have smiled, realising that it's not just her. You don't like her, and are determined to find the bad in everything she does, all the time being nice to her face... That's passive aggressive behaviour. If you think you have genuine cause to address something with her, then be an adult and do it directly. None of this checking up on her, observing her, trying to find something she's doing wrong.

Have any of your other family members noticed anything off about her? Maybe you should all sit down and you can air your concerns. Maybe they are genuine, and you are absolutely right. Maybe the others haven't noticed, but when you bring it to their attention they can keep an eye on it. Even though you are "now once again at the forefront of things and managing the entire set-up" you should not take a unilateral decision on this. There might just be a personality clash between you and her, that in no way affects her performance of her duties towards your dad.

But, I think the reality is you don't like her. and you don't like her because of your rift with your sibling. And because of that rift, this woman could be the most attentive, caring and "above and beyond the call of duty" carer, your dad ever had, and you'd find fault, because you'd feel it wasn't genuine, or it was all for show.

"She is doing a competent job with our parent from what I can see..." That's all that matters. She is doing a competent job. You just don't like her because you think she and your sibling are somehow conspiring against you. You are making it personal, rather than keeping it professional. Her perceived behaviour towards you is irrelevant. She is doing a competent job. That's it. This is her job - not a hobby. You can't get rid of her just because you think she should be nicer to you, and not so nice to your sibling.

LegacyUser

First of all, I came on here to ask for advice as to how to deal with her. I didn't say I want to get rid of her. I just said that I have newfound doubts about her in general and certainly, this has nothing to do with my sibling. We have other carers that my sibling hired and they are absolutely fantastic. This carer is the first I have had any problem with. She has just tried to provoke me on several occasions and I didn't rise to it.

She is competent in general ( I want to give her credit where it is due here) but she is not putting herself out like other carers do to mentally stimulate our parent and that is another key issue in this as it is a big part of the job. I don't want my parent sitting there for hours not having someone talk much or stimulate them.

I am doing spotchecks now but it won't tell the whole story and I can't get hidden cameras as that is against the law.

Big Bag of Chips

If there are duties of her job which you feel she is not fulfilling, then the ONLY thing you can do is sit down with her and go through it. If you're not comfortable doing that, either because of your own feelings towards her, or because you feel she might turn on you, or whatever, then get one of your siblings to address it with her.

Part of being a manager is taking on tasks that might not always be easy. You are managing the set up at the moment, so its up to you to handle it. Basically, the only advice anyone can offer you is arrange to talk through the job description with her. She may not be fully aware of all duties included in it, and it is only fair to draw her attention to something you think she is not doing, but should be doing.

LegacyUser

I absolutely agree with you and I have already tried to do that. when I took over things I thanked her for everything she had been doing and said that there was so much to the job and in her reply she said that the the main thing was to keep our parent 'safe'. I agreed then but said that it was also important to mentally engage them as much as possible, otherwise they will deteriorate much faster, and she didn't agree with me, or say that she does that.

I mentioned it again then a few weeks ago and said how I'd had a great weekend with my parent and that I had got so much out of them in terms of conversation and in terms of sparking their brain, etc. and again she blanked me, and I know by her that her approach is that my parent is beyond saving now mentally wise and that it is about caring for him.

I really don't accept this as the other carers chat to our parent and engage him more than she does. She is taking it easier than the others and even though it's not relevant, we actually are paying very well and not those bargain basement rates you often hear about.

Like I said I just have a few concerns about her that she has brought on herself.

How do I speak to her in an effective way to get her to do mental stimulation?
Shall I just call her again and bring it up?
What's the best way to do this?

Big Bag of Chips

You stop dropping hints and tell hee directly that that is what you want her to do.

You have been trying to tell her in an indirect way, hoping she will take the hint. Obviously she's not taking the hint.

Is there a contract in place, with a job description? Is it included in the job description that mental stimulation is part of the care? If the others are doing extra work outside of the job description, then she is not actually doing anything wrong by not doing the same. She's just sticking to her job description.

You need to be direct, and say what you mean. No more "I think" or "I found". Tell her "I want you to.....".

LegacyUser

Great, that's sound advice I think. Yes, the job description has that on it and she probably does do it to a certain extent, but you must remember that some people have it naturally in them and don't need to be told and/or reminded to keep it up. Nobody ever checks on her so I fear she has got lazy about it. And as I said, we respect her and we are a nice family to deal with and don't deserve to see any attitude.

I'll be more direct and specific when I speak with her again.

Thanks for the advice.

Big Bag of Chips

Something else to consider is maybe having a bit of "downtime" when she's around might be good for your dad in another sense. If he is constantly being chatted to and stimulated by the family and other carers.. maybe he actually enjoys having a bit of quiet time!

I know I'd hate to have people constantly prattling at me

But... I don't know the specifics of your dad's condition, obviously..so that's just a personal opinion.

LegacyUser

Yep, that's a valid point as well for sure and that's okay if she is doing short shifts but sometimes she can be there for a couple of days in one go which is too much mental rest!

LegacyUser

dancingstopped wrote: »

. And as I said, we respect her and we are a nice family to deal with and don't deserve to see any attitude.

Thanks for the advice.

And this woman from what you have said yourself is doing a competent job and not an easy one like that. She doesn't deserve to be spoken about like a bold teenager. I'm not doubting your a nice family, but it can't be all sunshine and roses if you and your sibling don't speak and are trying to point score, play games etc.

Tramps Like Us

What's obvious is that your real problem is with your sibling not the carer.

The nice things about your sister are in all livelihood not provocation, but rather making conversation, trying to be nice etc

She was a bit snippy with you on the phone, she made a mistake.

Give her a break for gods sake.

LegacyUser

Careorcareless wrote: »

I'm not doubting your a nice family, but it can't be all sunshine and roses if you and your sibling don't speak and are trying to point score, play games etc.

Nope. You are jumping to the wrong conclusions with nothing to back them up. I never bring up my sibling to her nor do they me from what I know. It is her who has mentioned my sibling to me... And I have already said here twice that I did not rise to it, or respond in any way. I have way more on my plate than to be bothered with that sort of stuff.

Also, just a note to you careorcareless. You just seem to be very one-sided on this and you shouldn't really be making comments based on no evidence as this is a difficult issue for me and caring for our parent is a really tough job and I don't appreciate people making unfound and untrue comments and conclusions. Ask if you are not sure about something and I will answer it truthfully.

Caring for someone who is ill is not easy, none of us have any interest in making it any harder for our carers, why would we? They do a vital and hard job for us. And I know how hard it is.

In any case I've given this a lot of thought and have tried to make friends with this carer -as in, sincere friends, and the bit of headway I've made has made me realise that it's most likely a case of this carer being used to a set routine and probably sees me as the person disrupting it as I've had to implement changes and is just taking it out on me. And who knows what they are going through in their own lives.

Not a problem for me. I will ask nothing more of this carer than they want or can do, as always. And I am remaining professional and friendly and have no grudge against them. They have done a lot for my family and I want to keep this relationship as good as possible so that everyone is happy.

taytobreath

Hi. I have been following your issue with the last few days.
I think you should probably leave this person go, for the reason because you two guys are clashing together and especially because there is a person here that cant defend them self.
You are not helping your parent by falling out with this carer as I am sure he /she is probably a good carer, but you are now the 1st in contact with the carer. so in the long term just let her/him go.

sorry for the vagueness

LegacyUser

taytobreath wrote: »

Hi. I have been following your issue with the last few days.
I think you should probably leave this person go, for the reason because you two guys are clashing together and especially because there is a person here that cant defend them self.
You are not helping your parent by falling out with this carer so in the long term just let her go.

Thanks for your response. I think I've made progress in last couple of days and have set up the hours so that she will be doing the same hours every week. If she still isn't happy then it will be a case of her telling me she wants to leave but I've bent over backwards now to help her and can do no more.

LegacyUser

Nope. You are jumping to the wrong conclusions with nothing to back them up.

I suggest you read back through your posts, you've mentioned the sibling rivalry many times. Your first post suggested you were concerned your sibling had said something, then you thought that they were bitching about you, then you were afraid to sack the carer in case it looked like your fault in your siblings eyes. You seem more concerned about what she thinks of you, you mention this neutral relationship with your sibling for your parents sake, but you haven't mentioned communicating with her once on this issue.

LegacyUser

Careorcareless wrote: »

Nope. You are jumping to the wrong conclusions with nothing to back them up.

I suggest you read back through your posts, you've mentioned the sibling rivalry many times. Your first post suggested you were concerned your sibling had said something, then you thought that they were bitching about you, then you were afraid to sack the carer in case it looked like your fault in your siblings eyes. You seem more concerned about what she thinks of you, you mention this neutral relationship with your sibling for your parents sake, but you haven't mentioned communicating with her once on this issue.

You are still missing the point. I don't need to communicate any sibling rivalry to her, that is not her concern. I only mentioned in the first post that my sibling may have said something as I was trying to figure out why she was being negative towards me. It was mere speculation. I have no clue whether they did or not. They probably didn't. I was just trying to work out why she was like that and I think it's just a case of her routine being disturbed and she is put out by it.

You're not helping me in this issue or shining any new light, you are going on about a dead issue. I don't want to engage with you any more on this. I have enough trouble.

LegacyUser

dancingstopped wrote: »

You are still missing the point. I don't need to communicate any sibling rivalry to her, that is not her concern. I only mentioned in the first post that my sibling may have said something as I was trying to figure out why she was being negative towards me. It was mere speculation. I have no clue whether they did or not. They probably didn't. I was just trying to work out why she was like that and I think it's just a case of her routine being disturbed and she is put out by it.

You're not helping me in this issue or shining any new light, you are going on about a dead issue. I don't want to engage with you any more on this. I have enough trouble.

I didn't say anything about communicating any sort of rivalry to anyone? I said why have you not communicated with your sibling about these issues with the carer? You mentioned her "provoking" you with comments about your sister and other such comment in a few threads. You did also mention that you didn't want the carer been let go as something you'd be held responsible for. That's my point. You say your parent is your priority, then why would you let what people think stand in the way of doing what's right by them? If in fact she is terrorist you've portrayed. You say you and your sibling have a neutral relationship for the sake of your parent, but from the very outset it's clear that's not entirely true or you wouldn't have concerns that she's "bitching" about you to the carer. Or has your sibling engaged in this behaviour before? It's not a dead issue your perception is skewed because of your rivalry with your sister, read your own comments, this is going to have a negative effect on the situation in one form or another, as falling out with family and carers will impact on your parent. You and your sibling are probably lovely caring people in your individual rights, obviously if your going to great lengths to mind your parent, but saying we're a nice family and don't deserve this attitude is a bit condescending and you can't say how people that are working for you feel, the carer i'm sure is aware that there is rivalry so this could make things uncomfortable for her.

alie

Just wondered did you speak to the carer herself?

Matteroffact

I perfectly understand your anxiety, as I have had experience with Carers myself. I know you want what's best for your parent, as I did too and it is very off putting to have to have any suspicions at all. You know what a good Carer should and shouldn't do and it would worry me if I was spoken to like you were. I can see that you are a very caring and sensitive person and I hope this all works out for you.

LegacyUser

Thanks for that, this is a really trying time and definitely it has nothing to do with the sibling rift. I flagged that up at the beginning just to wonder if that could be the issue.

I've got to the bottom of it now though and there are a few things at play here. Firstly she was used to her routine and had been getting exactly the hours she wanted and not ever asked to do any more, so that suited her and she was happy, naturally.

The whole programme changed and she was being kept on due to her being seemingly flexible, but of course it turns out that she is not flexible and wants to stick to the hours she wants to do, only.

What's happened really is that she has treated me very poorly as a result of being asked to temporarily do more (I never deserved that, I would say if I thought I did) and she has literally said what hours she will do, and she won't do any more than that.

To be honest, I was still being nice and said that she could do the hours that she wanted, but I'm looking at things and it's not right. She is putting the burden on the other carers instead and on us, as we need to get someone else to cover a couple of short shifts as to avoid putting too much on the other carer. And unlike everyone else she does not care about all of the others doing the same job as she is and is being very selfish.

My initial impressions were correct. She had a nice handy number, she was taking it all easy and in her stride, and I am the baddie who disturbed it on her, so hence her poor treatment of me.

That she is laying down the law as regards hours is actually unacceptable and I am going to tell her that she will have to do the other (very short) shifts to make it fair on everyone, and if she can't, then I will have to get someone else altogether.

We are talking part-time hours here.

dellas1979

dancingstopped wrote: »

being asked to temporarily do more

Hold on a second here...you say you asked the carer to work longer hours. So, because she cant (or wont - thats her perogative), she has a handy number and is also being disrespectful (towards you and other carers)?

Sounds like you didnt ask her at all. More expected she did. Asking involves someone making a choice. She answered your question. But not to what you wanted to hear.

And now you are on the backfoot. And Im sure that carer is fully aware of this.

The bottom line, the hours for the job have changed. If she isnt available for longer hours and you need someone for longer hours, you will need to get rid and hire someone who is available to do the job.

LegacyUser

dellas1979 wrote: »

Hold on a second here...you say you asked the carer to work longer hours. So, because she cant (or wont - thats her perogative), she has a handy number and is also being disrespectful (towards you and other carers)?

Sounds like you didnt ask her at all. More expected she did. Asking involves someone making a choice. She answered your question. But not to what you wanted to hear.

And now you are on the backfoot. And Im sure that carer is fully aware of this.

The bottom line, the hours for the job have changed. If she isnt available for longer hours and you need someone for longer hours, you will need to get rid and hire someone who is available to do the job.

We are not talking about much of a difference from what she had been doing. It's a few hours only. And it fits in well with her shift as it's a continuation of it.

And you would think, that if she was aware I was on the backfoot, etc. that she might help out somewhat as helping me is helping my parent, the other carers and my family. She's not caring for me.

I'm leaving this thread for now as I've had some good advice here and have learned a lot in the process of this.

Thanks to everyone for their feedback, even if I didn't agree!

LegacyUser

Sadly Fentdog I can't communicate with her anymore in any effective way.

I will just have to get cover for the shift she won't do and figure out a long-term strategy.

The Princess Bride

OP-I don't envy you or your family the planning and hard work that goes into you organising care for your parent.
You mentioned in your original post,that you've not used an agency.
The disadvantage to this,is that you at some point,can come across an employee who isn't happy with their hours.
With an agency,they handle these issues,or any problems.

I feel that having read through all of your posts,the trust is gone,and no matter what happens from here on in,you will never be comfortable with this carer again.

Perhaps you are right,perhaps she thought she had a "cushy" number and then-in her eyes-you come along and rock the boat by suggesting more interaction /changing hours.

Try and arrange a meeting with all siblings to discuss a better plan of action,ensure a list of activities for your Father is documented and implemented by all staff.

If you can inform this carer that you as a family have made these changes,rather than just you,things might improve.Alas,I doubt it.

Best of luck, and take care of yourself.

Chara1001

I agree with The Princess Bride Op,

There's no trust here -only suspicion, and when it regards such a responsible and important job, trust is paramount. Whoever is right or wrong- i think you should let her go also as its perfectly clear you're never going to be comfortable.