Re-apply for planning permission

WhichCar

Hi,

Just wondering if anybody could give me advice on this one.

I have an offer of an A3 zoned site. One of the criteria for this is that I must have a housing need. I have a very small house (seriously it's tiny) and can't afford to upgrade (it's in negative equity). I was thinking of:

1) Applying for planning on the A3 site while keeping my house. If I get the planning permission, I could then sell my house and use what's left after the mortgage is paid off to build a house.

2) If I get denied planning by Cork County Council, I could then sell my house and re-apply. I would will then be without a house and should have a better chance of getting my planning application approved 2nd time round.

I don't want to sell my house and then get denied planning because then I'd be without a house and using all my 'house-building' money on rent.

Does anyone know if there's any time limit on how often you can apply for planning with Cork County Council. I seem to remember someone saying that the same person can't apply for planning on the same site for 5 years after an application has been denied, but not sure if this is the case or not.

Thanks for any advice!

BryanF

WhichCar wrote: »

Does anyone know if there's any time limit on how often you can apply for planning with Cork County Council.

you can apply as often as you want

though it looks like you'll struggle to show housing need

newbie2013

The planning decisions are strange imo because I have seen people get approved planning for another home while selling their own yet seen others get refused who really have a housing need.

Imo, I'd say go for it because you just never know. Keep us posted on how you get on.

Im in a bit of a similar situation myself, I have my eye in a lovely site very close to my house but im wondering will I get planning again for another house if I sell the one im in now. I'd be afraid of taking a chance and the planners refusing me and me having the money then having to panic buy incase I spend most of it. I've heard on the grapevine that planners dislike one selling a house and asking for planning so close to where your last house, wether this is true or not, I wouldn't know.

WhichCar

Thanks Bryan F and Newbie 2013,

I'm meeting with an engineer this week so unless he says anything like I can't apply more than once every x amount of months, I think I'll try applying and see how I get on.

Out of interest Newbie 2013 is the site you're looking at A3 zoned?

archtech

It would be best to seek a pre planning meeting first. You may be able to build a case to support an application for a new dwelling on a new site.

With all due respect I can't see how selling a 'tiny' house that's in negative equity will raise sufficient funds to buy a plot of land and build a new house on it is cheaper than just extending, I don't expect you would have much change out of 300k by the time site, professional fees building costs and development contributions are all accounted for.

wexie

WhichCar wrote: »

Hi,

Just wondering if anybody could give me advice on this one.

I have an offer of an A3 zoned site. One of the criteria for this is that I must have a housing need. I have a very small house (seriously it's tiny) and can't afford to upgrade (it's in negative equity). I was thinking of:

1) Applying for planning on the A3 site while keeping my house. If I get the planning permission, I could then sell my house and use what's left after the mortgage is paid off to build a house.

Would negative equity not mean that there would be mortgage left over after all the money is gone rather than money left over after the mortgage is gone?

WhichCar

Thanks ArchTech and Wexie.

Ok, looks like I misunderstood what the term negative equity means! Essentially the house is worth about 2/3 - 3/4 what I paid for it. However, I didn't borrow 100% of what I paid for it. So when I sell it I hope to have the bones of 100k (after paying off the mortgage).

I'll be given a site, so am thinking that 100k should build me a decent 100 sq/ft house?

WhichCar

I mean *1000 sq/ft

newbie2013

WhichCar wrote: »

Thanks Bryan F and Newbie 2013,

I'm meeting with an engineer this week so unless he says anything like I can't apply more than once every x amount of months, I think I'll try applying and see how I get on.

Out of interest Newbie 2013 is the site you're looking at A3 zoned?

No and I dont even know what an A3 zoned site is to be honest.

BryanF

WhichCar wrote: »

I'm meeting with an engineer this week so unless he says anything like I can't apply more than once every x amount of months, I think I'll try applying and see how I get on.

A3 zoned

in Cork County -chances are slim to none, if your honest about your housing need that is

archtech wrote: »

It would be best to seek a pre planning meeting first.

+1

WhichCar

Thanks guys, I'll try and arrange a pre-planning meeting so and take it from there.

Thanks again for the advice - much appreciated.

UrbanFret

WhichCar wrote: »

Thanks ArchTech and Wexie.

Ok, looks like I misunderstood what the term negative equity means! Essentially the house is worth about 2/3 - 3/4 what I paid for it. However, I didn't borrow 100% of what I paid for it. So when I sell it I hope to have the bones of 100k (after paying off the mortgage).

I'll be given a site, so am thinking that 100k should build me a decent 100 sq/ft house?

You will do well to finish it for that, there's so many hidden costs that you wouldn't have budgeted for. Of course if you are able to do some of the work yourself or have family who will lend a hand then sure you can do it. I've spent the last couple of years at a 1900 sq ft house, called in every favour I was ever owed and believe me there were plenty. I'll finish in around 3 months (yes the end is in sight). Final costs finished approx €130,000. I could not have done it any cheaper unless I didn't adhere to regs and no way my architect was gonna let me do that! Anyway good luck with it!;)

WhichCar

Congrats UrbanFret!

That's a nice size house at a very good price. Whereabouts in the country are you building?

I'm sure there's loads of things I haven't taken into consideration. I believe I have to pay the county council 10k just for the pleasure of building.... Then there'll be water, septic tank, electricity. Is there any tips you can give me?

UrbanFret

WhichCar wrote: »

Congrats UrbanFret!

That's a nice size house at a very good price. Whereabouts in the country are you building?

I'm sure there's loads of things I haven't taken into consideration. I believe I have to pay the county council 10k just for the pleasure of building.... Then there'll be water, septic tank, electricity. Is there any tips you can give me?

Cavan. Water connection is another couple of grand on top of the Development contribution, Electricity reasonable enough at €1850 if i recall correctly, Septic tank(well its a waste treatment system) €2500 certified and commisioned (good deal), however there's the piping, distribution chamber and perculation area on top of that or as in my case a polishing filter. If you're going the self build route I wouldn't dare chance it without insurance, almost €1000 for two years or until the house is occupied. Artchitect to certify the build and compliance with regs cost me €1500( he didn't draw the plans ( a friend did those for me which saved quite a bit). I stuck with local trades who have been tried and trusted over the years. In the long run it's better, however having said that i would have nothing against going for people i didn't know . I'm close to the border which is also a help. Lot's of insulation is the way forward(costly but a big saver in the long run). My roofer insisted on scandanavian timber( much less moisture than native). Best advice I could give you is don't set unrealistic targets, take your time, get 3 quotes for everything and have an odd good session because there's times it will get to you. Best of luck any way, hope all works well for you.

WhichCar

Thanks for all the info and good advice (esp. re sessions!)

I met with an engineer today who told me I'd be looking at at least €150/sq.ft to build it to the building regs standards. Seems a bit excessive, I thought €100/sq.ft was reasonable for Cork.

UrbanFret

WhichCar wrote: »

Thanks for all the info and good advice (esp. re sessions!)

I met with an engineer today who told me I'd be looking at at least €150/sq.ft to build it to the building regs standards. Seems a bit excessive, I thought €100/sq.ft was reasonable for Cork.

Your figure is the more realistic of the two don't let him convince you otherwise.;)
I'll come in at €130,000 finished. The garden will need to be landscaped but that will happen further down the road. Again I can drive a digger so that will save quite a bit when the time comes. I think you may have to put solar panels in under the latest regs, I didn't but my planning was granted in 2008.

WhichCar

Thanks!

You know, these forums are a great sounding board for ideas and questions I'd probably have made some costly mistakes without everyone's advice.

Thanks again

BryanF

UrbanFret id like to commend you on your house and frugal spend.

UrbanFret wrote: »

Your figure is the morerealisticof the two don't let him convince you otherwise.;)

realistic? where is the realism here? WhichCars 150sqft v 100sqft would lead us to believe that his/her home will designed & constructed for them, buy others, to a turn key standard.
don't you think that the unfinished cost (in a way still an estimate) that you provided is skewed by the free labour and exclusions that WhichCars 'ball park' 150sqftper m2 figure covers?

• I'll come in at €130,000 finished.
• Cavan.
• Septic tank(well its a waste treatment system) €2500 certified and commisioned (good deal), however there's the piping, distribution chamber and perculation area on top of that or as in my case a polishing filter.
• he didn't draw the plans ( a friend did those for me which saved quite a bit).

• garden will need to be landscaped but that will happen further down the road. Agai

• I can drive a digger so that will save quite a bit when the time comes.

• put solar panels in under the latest regs, I didn't but my planning was granted in 2008.

• I've spent the last couple of years at a 1900 sq ft house, called in every favour I was ever owed and believe me there were plenty. I'll finish in around 3 months
• I've spent the last couple of years at a 1900 sq ft house,
• called in every favour I was ever owed and believe me there were plenty.[/U]

urbanfret can we assume between your self -build management, your free labour, cheap friends labour, favours you called, the fact you can drive a digger, and carryout construction related activities suggests you were able to save money and do deals that others may not + the fact that your building to a less onerous set of part L regs ?

im just trying to balance your situation with the typical guy that comes on here expecting a builder, architect, Qs ,eng to build him a house for €70per msq:( when in reality 'for a turn key' to may be twice that: apples and oranges

UrbanFret

Yes I certainly saved money by being able to do deals that others may not. But that isn't to say that others cannot at least get some sort of help from friends and family. I had little choice as not one bank would lend me tuppence, despite having a pefect credit history with my own bank and no debt anywhere. You are quite correct, if someone hands the plans to a builder and asks them to complete to a turn key finish then of course the €150/sq.ft will be nearer the mark. If you are prepared to put the effort in yourself then the rewards can be great, although it can be an incredibly stressful journey, one which I daresay I would never take on again.;)