Frivolous Feedback/DispRes threads

Quixoticelixer

Every now and then there are threads started here which to be honest are nothing but a waste of time from a poster with a chip on their shoulder for whatever reason. Be that bringing up a personal gripe with another user/moderator or taking out their frustration at being unable to accept that they were wrong in something they said did.

A lot of the time, they try to be "subtle" about it, by omitting key information to try and cloud the context of what they are talking about. Particularly in Dispute Resolution where users very often make a claim only for it to turn out that they are leaving out about 95% of the story.

Another example is of a recent thread here where an allegation of abuse was made against a moderator which upon investigation proved to be unfounded by an Admin.

There are plenty more examples of threads which can be viewed as frivolous, I'd rather not give a load of specific examples, as I don't wish this to be viewed as personal against particular posters. On that note; this may seem a direct response to the GTAV thread currently running, it is not my intention to directly target that or any other thread, I am trying to highlight a general issue here.

I believe Feedback and HelpDesk to be two of the most formal areas of boards and that they should be treated as such, and that time wasting should be discouraged to the point that heavy sanctions should be handed out for time wasting, as Admins/mods have enough duties on their hands as it is. I also believe that Dispute Resolution appeals should be made on the basis that any attempt to mislead the process will be met by an increase in the sanction that is being disputed. Plenty of time wasters over there, "I was banned for this seemingly innocuous post" only for it to turn out that that poster had a shocking history or was banned for a string of uncivil posts, and so on.

I know it is important that users have an outlet to air their grievances but I believe a certain level of etiquette should be expected on the "Sys" area's of the site.

That's just my 2c on the matter, I don't really expect anything from this thread, but no harm putting it out there.

funt cucker

I have already said I'll go and update the GTAV thread after watching an hour of gameplay on youtube, I am doing this ATM. I'm not time wasting with that thread, there were other threads locked in the GTA forum about this. So why not ask the question in feedback?

The responses I got from some posters have pointed me in the right direction. All I have looked at about GTAV have been articles and videos posted on the net. It seems feedback has done it's job with the input from other posters on boards.

It is a frivoulous and time-wasting thread when you make an ill-informed opinion on something and then try and force it on the rest of us. Apologies, but this is the case.

I agree with what the OP has said. There are often times when threads are posted here unnecessarily, but the moderating team are pretty excellent when it comes to these areas.

funt cucker

Deleted User wrote: »

It is a frivoulous and time-wasting thread when you make an ill-informed opinion on something and then try and force it on the rest of us. Apologies, but this is the case.

I agree with what the OP has said. There are often times when threads are posted here unnecessarily, but the moderating team are pretty excellent when it comes to these areas.

As I have pointed out, yes I may have been ill informed, but I'm not time wasting, currently watching GTAV gameplay and it's not as bad as I thought, if it was not for the thread I started, I would have not had vital input from certain posters, again Feedback has done it's job for me.


Funt.

The reason it annoys me so much is that gamers are often treated extremely badly and have had dozens of witch-hunts against us. Look at Fidelma Healey Eames trying to put chips in our consoles that shut off after an hour of gameplay, or politicians in America wanting gamers to sign a registry (just like sex offenders!), games being banned in certain countries, and many many more cases. The majority of these have been completely ill-informed and forced upon us.

Let people make up their own minds. If you don't like something, then fine, but that doesn't mean the rest of us have to do it too.

funt cucker

Deleted User wrote: »

The reason it annoys me so much is that gamers are often treated extremely badly and have had dozens of witch-hunts against us. Look at Fidelma Healey Eames trying to put chips in our consoles that shut off after an hour of gameplay, or politicians in America wanting gamers to sign a registry (just like sex offenders!), games being banned in certain countries, and many many more cases. The majority of these have been completely ill-informed and forced upon us.

Let people make up their own minds. If you don't like something, then fine, but that doesn't mean the rest of us have to do it too.

I don't usually have a lot of time on my hands with work etc.. so I listen to what people are talking about in the canteen, I read the odd article on the net, so yes I was probably ill informed. I have watched about 20 mins of gameplay, not a game for children, but not as bad as I thought it was going to be.

Definitely not worth privatising a forum over, I'm going to ask for the other thread to be closed, thanks for your input:)

Quixoticelixer

Just to get back to why I started this in the first place, another thread has been started in DR by someone claiming to be banned for "this one comment" despite posting a moderator instruction that makes it clear that it was not for an isolated comment, and that it was for (to quote the Mod note directly); "the latest in a long line of charter breaches".

You'd often see people criticise the DR process as it tends to side with moderators original decisions, but the fact is the reason this happens is because so many of the dispute claims are so frivolous in the first place. The DR process works excellently well for cases that are presented well, respectfully and in situations where there is a grey area that requires a neutral perspective.

Overheal

speaking of omitted information OP, is this about a Grand Theft Auto thread? Im absolutely confused.

Quixoticelixer

Overheal wrote: »

speaking of omitted information OP, is this about a Grand Theft Auto thread? Im absolutely confused.

Hi, I'm not omitting anything, I covered that in my original post

Quixoticelixer wrote: »

... I don't wish this to be viewed as personal against particular posters. On that note; this may seem a direct response to the GTAV thread currently running, it is not my intention to directly target that or any other thread, I am trying to highlight a general issue here....

GreeBo

I would think that once identified as "not feedback" they should be deleted and the OP told to follow the correct procedure.
Allowing users with an issue to accuse people of things and then leaving the thread there for all to see doesnt seem like a good idea to me. Surely that just encourages people to mis-use the forum?

Steve

^^ mostly, non feedback threads are closed here when identified.

On the flip-side, in this forum, mods can refute allegations publicly made against them whereas if the official procedure is used they cannot, so for all the complainers about the 'system', it is biased against mods in that regard.

GreeBo

Steve wrote: »

^^ mostly, non feedback threads are closed here when identified.

On the flip-side, in this forum, mods can refute allegations publicly made against them whereas if the official procedure is used they cannot, so for all the complainers about the 'system', it is biased against mods in that regard.

closed still leaves the allegations in public though.

responding relies on them even knowing the thread exists...which they easily might not.

I think a mod/cmod/admin shouldn't really be engaging in public battles with a user, is that ready appropriate?
how does that make it biased, both sides can post equally right?

OilBeefHooked2

I'd argue the whole DRP is a complete joke and only serves to prolong the inevitable, i.e no mods decision is ever going to be contradicted or overturned, because cmods, admins etc are not going to ever even slap the wrist of their mods, even when they are clearly in the wrong, and why would they.
They don't want to upset the apple cart and they also know how thankless a task it can be to mod sometimes, and don't want to run the risk of losing them, thus in turn giving certain unsrucpolus minded mods "carte blanche" safe in the knowledge that they cannot or will not ever be reprimanded.
So yes OP I agree they are frivolous and utterly pointless, so lets just get rid of the whole DRP.

Insect Overlord

david-k wrote: »

I'd argue the whole DRP is a complete joke and only serves to prolong the inevitable, i.e no mods decision is ever going to be contradicted or overturned, because cmods, admins etc are not going to ever even slap the wrist of their mods, even when they are clearly in the wrong, and why would they.
They don't want to upset the apple cart and they also know how thankless a task it can be to mod sometimes, and don't want to run the risk of losing them, thus in turn giving certain unsrucpolus minded mods "carte blanche" safe in the knowledge that they cannot or will not ever be reprimanded.
So yes OP I agree they are frivolous and utterly pointless, so lets just get rid of the whole DRP.

Not a single word of this is true.

Czarcasm

david-k wrote: »

I'd argue the whole DRP is a complete joke and only serves to prolong the inevitable, i.e no mods decision is ever going to be contradicted or overturned, because cmods, admins etc are not going to ever even slap the wrist of their mods, even when they are clearly in the wrong, and why would they.
They don't want to upset the apple cart and they also know how thankless a task it can be to mod sometimes, and don't want to run the risk of losing them, thus in turn giving certain unsrucpolus minded mods "carte blanche" safe in the knowledge that they cannot or will not ever be reprimanded.
So yes OP I agree they are frivolous and utterly pointless, so lets just get rid of the whole DRP.

David I would urge you to have a look round the DRP forum some more, that and Help Desk and Prison. There are numerous examples of Moderator decisions being overturned on appeal in DRP, Admin decisions being overturned on appeal in Prison, and I believe the Help Desk forum is where to go for issues with Moderator decisions not involving an infraction.

Feedback I was always given the impression was for site-wide feedback or how for example a forum was being run or specific issues within that forum, but more and more I'm seeing posters confusing Feedback with the DRP or Help Desk forums.

But to counter the main thrust of your argument - Moderators are not immune from sanctions, and just because you're just not aware of them doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

OilBeefHooked2

Insect Overlord wrote: »

Not a single word of this is true.

Well you would say that wouldn't you.

OilBeefHooked2

Czarcasm wrote: »

David I would urge you to have a look round the DRP forum some more, that and Help Desk and Prison. There are numerous examples of Moderator decisions being overturned on appeal in DRP, Admin decisions being overturned on appeal in Prison, and I believe the Help Desk forum is where to go for issues with Moderator decisions not involving an infraction.

Feedback I was always given the impression was for site-wide feedback or how for example a forum was being run or specific issues within that forum, but more and more I'm seeing posters confusing Feedback with the DRP or Help Desk forums.

But to counter the main thrust of your argument - Moderators are not immune from sanctions, and just because you're just not aware of them doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

Cheers thanks for that, I'll have a look around and perhaps change my opinion.

Steve

GreeBo wrote: »

closed still leaves the allegations in public though.

Yes and that's another issue.

responding relies on them even knowing the thread exists...which they easily might not.

I think a mod/cmod/admin shouldn't really be engaging in public battles with a user, is that ready appropriate?
how does that make it biased, both sides can post equally right?

Mods have no right to reply to a DRP thread. They must be explicitly given permission from an admin or invited to do so by a cmod.
That's fair enough in terms of controlling the flow of an ongoing mod /user spat but I think that a mod should be allowed at least to state their reasoning for an action - especially in the likes of the 'power trip mod banned me for nothing' threads.

Dades

david-k wrote: »

Cheers thanks for that, I'll have a look around and perhaps change my opinion.

I closed a thread earlier that saw a ban rescinded after a mix up had been sorted out. Just sayin'.

darced

This post has been deleted.

GreeBo

darced wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

If its not a mistake why would it be overturned?
Why would it take balls if its right for it to be overturned.

I think too many people think they were wrongly carded, the reality is probably less than 1% are. Just because *you* dont agree with it doesnt make it an incorrect card.

darced

This post has been deleted.

GreeBo

darced wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

sorry chief but it does happen, all the time.
not everything pertaining to a DRP happens in the thread, cards are overturned if they are wrongly handed out.
your definition of heavy handed is of course subjective...

Friend Computer

People can only go by what's publicly viewable so the understanding needs to go both ways here. I'd normally side with the mods and admins in these threads but it's a line that's fast becoming trite.

GreeBo

Friend Computer wrote: »

People can only go by what's publicly viewable so the understanding needs to go both ways here. I'd normally side with the mods and admins in these threads but it's a line that's fast becoming trite.

the resolution is public, why should any private conversations about it be?

OilBeefHooked2

RopeDrink wrote: »

Completely false.



Why wouldn't they?
Mistakes happen - Nobody is immune - Sometimes they need to be highlighted to be noticed and being noticed means it can be checked out thoroughly and worked on.

If I had made an error I would EXPECT this site, through it's own daily mechanics, to eventually highlight it, inform me of it and look into it - A slap on the wrist is expected and welcomed, allowing me to take greater notice of what I'm asked to do and to do it better... And it DOES happen... Quite often.



What a horrible assumption you're throwing out there... I've seen some pretty harsh reprimands in my time over years - Not associated with me but enough to know that Boards, in the best interest of Boards, isn't going to sit by and wave away any issues that crop up in terms of Moderators doing harm to the website in one way or another, beit through tiny little error causing a bit of unease and a need for a tap on the wrist, or actual intent of destruction entirely (And yes, there have been one or two of that severity).

Open your eyes and take another look :pac:

Dades wrote: »

I closed a thread earlier that saw a ban rescinded after a mix up had been sorted out. Just sayin'.

Both of those are refreshing to hear.
I've incorrectly assumed the "system" doesn't work, my apoligies.
I've been on boards since 2005 and have never had occasion until recently to use the DRP, and TBH intially I have found it to be a bit of a minefield, although with further research it's becoming clearer, so perhaps it does work and I take it all back what I said earlier:pac::pac:.

Friend Computer

GreeBo wrote: »

the resolution is public, why should any private conversations about it be?

I'm not saying they should, I'm saying that you can't chide users for not having access to information that only mods and admins do.

EDIT: I'm just going to hold my hands up and apologise. I thought you were getting a little pissy in that post last night but obviously was wrong, so I'm sorry.

MadsL

darced wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

I had a ban lifted, shortened, upheld then lengthened again and then upheld.

We also went through three different reasons for it.

It may be a record. :pac:

darced

This post has been deleted.