Where to start when buying upgrade parts?

thenashlegend

As above, I'm relatively new to cycling, I've clocked up about 400Km in the last few weeks since I bought the bike. I got it at a good price with a view to upgrading a few parts over the winter for next year. I'm not in any rush with them but I figured I could pick up a few parts here and there and have them ready to fit next spring.

It's a Bianchi Via Nirone with entry level Shimano shifters and derailleurs and from what I can make out "RC" calipers? I'd like to get to Shimano 105 standard if I could at all or what would people recommend? From what I've been told I'll have to invest in new wheels to allow me to use a Shimano cassette?

Is it a case of Shimano being the best parts or do they just have a good marketing team?

I don't intend getting into competitive racing, it's just for fitness and a few charity runs next year but I would like to have some decent parts on it.

Any help would be appreciated!

funkyjebus

No need to change the wheels once you don't change from Shimano / Sram as they are all compatible. Do you know what speed you bike is currently?

el tel

There is nothing wrong the parts on your bike. It sounds perfect for your needs, unless you just fancy some changes for changes sake.

thenashlegend

Thanks for the quick reply! See I don't think I've got Shimano hubs at the minute, another member on here said I'd need a BBB cassette to make the change as my current setup wasn't Shimano compatible? I don't know the actual figures off the top of my head apart from it being an 8 speed double.

thenashlegend

el tel wrote: »

There is nothing wrong the parts on your bike. It sounds perfect for your needs, unless you just fancy some changes for changes sake.

It's not as such changing for the sake of it but I feel they're a bit clunky and not as smooth as other bikes I've tried. I should say I bought the bike second hand so it's possible they had some wear originally.

According to different sites, a 10spd cassette would be a good upgrade but of course one thing leads to another and that's where I'm stuck at the moment. What would be the best place to start?

bigeasy

What wheels have you got , the original wheels on via nirone, are a little on the heavy side

thenashlegend

bigeasy wrote: »

What wheels have you got , the original wheels on via nirone, are a little on the heavy side

I'm not near the bike at the minute, I know there are two different wheels though. The previous owner damaged one of them so a replacement was put on.

Any recommendations on a new set?

07Lapierre

My advise is to upgrade parts as they wear out or break.

Otherwise your just wasting money.

Lawr

I don't understand what is wrong with wasting money, but I agree that replacing parts as they wear with upgrades is a good idea. However, there some logistical problems there. If your chain goes and you want to upgrade to a ten speed cassette, you are going to have to acquire ten-speed brifters if you want to use the whole cassette. This may also necessitate a new rear derailleur.

There are aesthetic, mechanical and weight considerations to be had, also, if you are so inclined. I have been mostly interested in upgrading because I hate rust. Top-end parts are all aluminum, titanium, carbon and, occasionally, stainless. They often look nicer and tend to be lighter. I have an aluminum frame with carbon stays and fork, with an alloy steering tube. When you strip the bike down, it's pretty light. I have replaced all the tiagra and non-specified parts with Dura Ace and dropped four pounds off the weight of the bike. My next acquisition is wheels. If I can get wheels in the 1200 gram range, I could drop another pound or two off this bike. My last acquisition will be a carbon frame. A local shop (Limerick) is making their own carbon frames. A 1200 gram frame will probably make the bike as light as I'm ever going to make it. After that, I'll have to work harder on replacing my heavy parts with lighter, rust-proofed parts.

It will take me a year to save the money for the wheels I have in mind and another for the frame, but slowly acquiring the bike I want is not wasting money. Smoking fags, which is what I did 30 years before I began to cycle, was wasting money. Modifying my bike is just motivating me to keep on keeping on.

Cee-Jay-Cee

thenashlegend wrote: »

It's a Bianchi Via Nirone with entry level Shimano shifters and derailleurs and from what I can make out "RC" calipers?

thenashlegend wrote: »

Thanks for the quick reply! See I don't think I've got Shimano hubs at the minute, another member on here said I'd need a BBB cassette to make the change as my current setup wasn't Shimano compatible? I don't know the actual figures off the top of my head apart from it being an 8 speed double.

If you have shimano shifters then its more than likely that your rear hub is shimano compatible.

I dont understand why the member told you that you need a BBB cassette. BBB simply make shimano/SRAM or campag compatible cassettes, theres no such thing as a groupset or rear derailleur that will only work with a BBB cassette.

If you plan on keeping the bike then upgrade the wheels first and then change the cassette with more hill/climb friendly ratios if need be.

thenashlegend

Thanks for all the detailed replies, is there any way I could figure out what cassette would be compatible with the back before I purchase?

As someone already mentioned it can open a can of worms once you buy one part, next thing you need a new chain and derailleur!

I had only considered buying a part every few weeks or keeping an eye out for bargains here and there. But I'd really need to know where I'm going with it before I buy.

Lumen

thenashlegend wrote: »

I had only considered buying a part every few weeks or keeping an eye out for bargains here and there. But I'd really need to know where I'm going with it before I buy.

You're going to end up in a paupers grave, in a coffin manufactured by Ax Lightness.

diomed

You can change all parts at once by buying a new bike.

Cee-Jay-Cee

thenashlegend wrote: »

Thanks for all the detailed replies, is there any way I could figure out what cassette would be compatible with the back before I purchase?

Like I already said its most likely (99.99%) that you have a shano rear hub and therefore a shimano 8sod cassette. You don't need to figure out anything. You have to decide what you want to upgrade, if your upgrading the groupset then you will be changing the cassette too. Your wheel will most l

dave_o_brien

So the problem is that the parts are a bit clunky and not as smooth as other bikes you've tried...

New cables, brake pads and a track pump for the win. The first two should preferably be installed by someone who knows what they're doing.

thenashlegend

diomed wrote: »

You can change all parts at once by buying a new bike.

That's very helpful thanks :rolleyes: If I could afford a new bike I wouldn't be asking for advice on parts. There's nothing wrong with my current frame, I just think the gear changes are a bit rough.

Surely it makes more sense to spend 2-300 on some new parts than almost a grand on a new bike!

quozl

If the gear changes are a bit rough then it's possible that your bike just needs a servicing or a new chain.

Gear cables - and housings - can make more of a difference than the derailleur if they're in a poor state.

Additionally if your derailleur isn't quite indexed properly then changes can be clunky as you don't have quite enough tension to get an immediate shift up but instead get the chain running against the new sprocket for a while until it eventually gets dragged up.

Things like that may explain what you're experiencing.

The problem with new parts is that it's expensive to buy a new group-set without getting it on a bike! There's a huge discount when it comes on a bike. That said, I got a 10 speed Tiagra set from Merlin Cycles for 300e a couple of months ago. That would be a big upgrade IMO. It's back up to 340 euro now though but maybe it'll go down again. So something like that or a new wheelset - some Mavic Aksiums for about 190 euro.

Or wait for 2nd hand group-set to appear on adverts or here and get that.

Moving from 8 speed to 10 speed is a fair improvement IMO as I like the smaller gaps between gears and/or extra low gears for hills but the shifts will be just as clunky if everything isn't setup correctly.

Best value is to buy a new bike. It's an unfortunate fact. I built my road-bike purely because I wanted to do the building myself but even REALLY scouring for bargains and getting 2nd hand wheels and saddles I doubt I saved more than 100e and I had to do the building myself. And needed the tools, which ate half that 100 euro

07Lapierre

Lawr wrote: »

I don't understand what is wrong with wasting money, but I agree that replacing parts as they wear with upgrades is a good idea. However, there some logistical problems there. If your chain goes and you want to upgrade to a ten speed cassette, you are going to have to acquire ten-speed brifters if you want to use the whole cassette. This may also necessitate a new rear derailleur.

There are aesthetic, mechanical and weight considerations to be had, also, if you are so inclined. I have been mostly interested in upgrading because I hate rust. Top-end parts are all aluminum, titanium, carbon and, occasionally, stainless. They often look nicer and tend to be lighter. I have an aluminum frame with carbon stays and fork, with an alloy steering tube. When you strip the bike down, it's pretty light. I have replaced all the tiagra and non-specified parts with Dura Ace and dropped four pounds off the weight of the bike. My next acquisition is wheels. If I can get wheels in the 1200 gram range, I could drop another pound or two off this bike. My last acquisition will be a carbon frame. A local shop (Limerick) is making their own carbon frames. A 1200 gram frame will probably make the bike as light as I'm ever going to make it. After that, I'll have to work harder on replacing my heavy parts with lighter, rust-proofed parts.

It will take me a year to save the money for the wheels I have in mind and another for the frame, but slowly acquiring the bike I want is not wasting money. Smoking fags, which is what I did 30 years before I began to cycle, was wasting money. Modifying my bike is just motivating me to keep on keeping on.

I agree with everything you say...unless your on a budget. Once you start upgrading, its hard to stop until you have replaced everything OR run out of money!

07Lapierre

quozl wrote: »

If the gear changes are a bit rough then it's possible that your bike just needs a servicing or a new chain.

Gear cables - and housings - can make more of a difference than the derailleur if they're in a poor state.

Additionally if your derailleur isn't quite indexed properly then changes can be clunky as you don't have quite enough tension to get an immediate shift up but instead get the chain running against the new sprocket for a while until it eventually gets dragged up.

Things like that may explain what you're experiencing.

The problem with new parts is that it's expensive to buy a new group-set without getting it on a bike! There's a huge discount when it comes on a bike. That said, I got a 10 speed Tiagra set from Merlin Cycles for 300e a couple of months ago. That would be a big upgrade IMO. It's back up to 340 euro now though but maybe it'll go down again. So something like that or a new wheelset - some Mavic Aksiums for about 190 euro.

Or wait for 2nd hand group-set to appear on adverts or here and get that.

Moving from 8 speed to 10 speed is a fair improvement IMO as I like the smaller gaps between gears and/or extra low gears for hills but the shifts will be just as clunky if everything isn't setup correctly.

Best value is to buy a new bike. It's an unfortunate fact. I built my road-bike purely because I wanted to do the building myself but even REALLY scouring for bargains and getting 2nd hand wheels and saddles I doubt I saved more than 100e and I had to do the building myself. And needed the tools, which ate half that 100 euro

+1. its a 2nd hand bike. To me it sounds like this bike just needs a new chain, 8 speed cassette and adjust the gears. Its amazing how good a bike feels when fitted with a new chain! New cables, brake blocks won't do any harm either.

ford2600

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/ie/en/sram-pc870-8-speed-chain/rp-prod20608


http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/ie/en/sram-pg850-8-speed-road-cassette/rp-prod17901


http://www.parktool.com/blog/repair-help

You'll need a chain tool, chain whip and shimano lockring tool to do.

Enjoy

quozl

If you don't have the tools then rothar.ie let you rent space/tools in their work-shops for a fiver an hour. They don't do the work for you but they're sound and they'll answer questions.

sham58107

el tel wrote: »

There is nothing wrong the parts on your bike. It sounds perfect for your needs, unless you just fancy some changes for changes sake.

Agreed, you never said gears were hard to shift or brakes were bad so why do anything with them?
you could probably start with new wheelset as if you intend to upgrade to 10 speed most new wheels will not take 8 anymore,then that means new cassette and new shifters.
Also you need to check spacing to see if frame will take 10 speed.
I would just enjoy and replace as you need to ie after wear and tear,or start with small things, pedals, bars, tyres, saddle.
Good luck and enjoy.

joxerjohn

As they say you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear !

Thenashledgend, IMO, should try and get the best out of what you currently have, learn a bit more about the bikes shortcomings and how to fix/adjust them and then look to buy a new bike that meets all your needs (the silk purse) once you have acquired the necessary knowledge and experience. This will probably you take 6 to 12 months, so keep your powder dry for now on upgrades and concentrate on maintenance items instead such as was suggested in previous mails in the thread.

Good luck !

quozl

If you don't have clip-less pedals - the ones that shoes with special cleats click into - then that's a good place to spend money that's burning a hole in your pocket.

Takes a little getting used to but they're a joy to use after that and you can bring them and the shoes across to any future bike you buy

at1withmyself

I remember when I was younger and getting into bikes, I was constantly tinkering with them and buying bits and pieces when I could afford with the money from my paper round. In most cases a lot of the purchases where 'unnecessary' but it was always fun. Everything form suspension stems to deep section rims and mixing and matching everything from the old sis to dura ace or xtr parts on my bikes. Upgrading is fun!

You ask where to start well the most important points on the bike are the Frame / Fork and wheels so if your happy with the frame and fork then get some nice wheels as you can use a spacer (if required) to run your 8 speed. Someone posted a pair of Mavic wheels in the bargain basement thread for 149.00 which sound like good value. This are a good basic wheel, look good and its nice to have a matching pair on the bike.

Next up you should look at some nice cables such as Shimano XTR / Dura ace gear and brake cables, get some good handlebar tape and a new chain if required along with a thorough cleaning of the drivetrain.

So now you have a good frame / fork & wheels and a good working bike look at the contact points like handlebar, stem, saddle, pedals & tires etc.. Its more important in my opinion to be comfortable on the bike rather then having Dura Ace gears (this took me many years to discover!!).

When the above is complete you should then begin looking at the groupset as during all the time above you may have already had to replace some of the groupset due to wear & tear. For the groupset the Tiagra one would be a good stepping stone to get to 10 speed. Its a big jump so best to buy complete groupset, thinking about it you would need the Shifters / Chain & Cassette at minimum just to change to 10 speed. Without checking I imagine these 3 components separately can cost close to full groupset price.

All this is based on you been able to do some of the work, there are many great deals on tool kits on CRC and Wiggle with loads of help on you tube and Park Tools website so its easy enough to get the basics complete.

Not one of my bikes is ever 'finished' and I'm still changing parts constantly as I enjoy building them as much as riding them

thenashlegend

Thanks again for all the great replies here, out of all the boards I think the cycling group have been the most helpful!

I have the clip-less pedals that someone has mentioned already as they came on the bike when I bought it.

I think some people might have got the wrong idea when I said second hand, it's not in bad shape by any means. The frame looks as new, it just doesn't feel 100% mechanically even though I had it fully checked over after I bought it.

Are tiagra parts a good investment right now or would they need upgrading again in the future if I happened to progress further?

I've seen 105 parts for sale here and there but they were an older version, 5600 if I remember correctly? 5700 being the newer edition?

quozl

thenashlegend wrote: »

Are tiagra parts a good investment right now or would they need upgrading again in the future if I happened to progress further?

IMO Tiagra are the best value set out there now. They're the cheapest 10 speed Shimano range. 105 and Ultegra are lighter but I'm doubtful that when setup correctly those would shift noticably better. The lighter more expensive ones are also - from what I read - more fragile and wear out quicker. You will often see people using Tiagra cassettes for example even with 105 groupsets.

It'll be years before 11 speed comes into a similar price-range so you don't have to worry about the Tiagra stuff obsoleting before it wears out. Which is the problem with SORA - which has moved to integrated shifters but is still 9 speed and locks you into 9 speed unless you throw the whole set out.

thenashlegend

Might be worth looking into so, for some reason I hadn't pinned Tiagra parts as something I'd upgrade to. The current one seems to be a 4600? Will there be a newer version coming out anytime soon or will this one be around for the next while?