Why The UCD Campus Smoking Ban Won't Work

UCDCritic

MANPOWER

Have you notice the area in front of the Arts cafe which was recently designated a no smoking area?

Have you notice everyone smoking there?

I went to complain about this the other day to campus services and was told because of a lack of manpower they couldn't enforce the no smoking rule.

They also made the excuse of we put a sign up, and there is a speaker there. Which no one can hear because of everyone talking.

So essentially they are useless.

To the point, why will the campus ban on smoking not work? Because they can't enforce it.

Raphael

I dunno, they do a reasonable job of policing the drinking ban. Or at the very least they drive it out of sight, which is good enough for me. Sounds to me like Campus services just don't want to rock the boat with regards the front of Arts, but with an campuswide ban , it's be on security to deal with it.

I seriously doubt you'd get people lighting up in front of the arts building if a campus wide ban came in, unless it was as some kind of protest. Sure, they'll just go behind the bikesheds, but that achieves the same goal as them leaving campus.

Kiltennel

A campus wide ban can never work. There isn't sufficient man power meaning it wont be enforced. If they want to confine smoking the smartest solution will be to offer smoking areas which are off to the side of buildings which are also sheltered. Even then though it will still need to be enforced as otherwise people will just smoke as normal.

If they can't enforce a smoking ban in an area the size of the arts entrance I have no idea how they plan to enforce it on an entire campus.

Raphael

It's not a matter of can't, it's a matter of won't. They could easily enforce the ban in the arts entrance if they bothered enough.

A campus wide ban can be enforced, as I said they do a fair enough job with public drinking. Because it's done by security. And while they can't really have security sitting in front of the arts block going "Oi, you, go smoke somewhere else", they can have them treat someone they see smoking the same as someone they see drinking - "Finish that up or toss it, or we'll escort you off campus".

Dr Strange

It's not only a problem at the arts building. Health Sciences also has a large proportion of smokers right outside the doors beside the 'no smoking' signs. The smoke gets into the building and on certain days you can smell it all the way up to the third floor in the building. Having to walk through groups of students/staff puffing away at the entrance/exit is intolerable. It's quite ironic, really, it being the 'Health Sciences Centre'. I would fully support a strict enforcement around all buildings. The problem with enforcing it at the moment is mainly that there are no sanctions in place. How do you punish transgression? There has to be a set of rules and known penalties such as fines or recording of the student card number etc.

Frank Grimes

UCDCritic wrote: »

MANPOWER

Have you notice the area in front of the Arts cafe which was recently designated a no smoking area?

Have you notice everyone smoking there?

I went to complain about this the other day to campus services and was told because of a lack of manpower they couldn't enforce the no smoking rule.

They also made the excuse of we put a sign up, and there is a speaker there. Which no one can hear because of everyone talking.

So essentially they are useless.

To the point, why will the campus ban on smoking not work? Because they can't enforce it.

There was someone (from services I think) telling people who were smoking to move away from the front of the building a few minutes ago as I was walking in.

OneOfThem Stumbled

I'm not a smoker and I can see that there's nowhere for smokers to go. Why they don't build some cheap (but aesthetically ok) wooden shelter at the side of health sci (either where carpark used to be or behind dermatology) and side of Arts (either near the decking or between arts and library) is beyond me.

Incidentally where can we vote on this? Those two referenda were supposed to be going on yesterday, but there was no sign of a place to vote. Is it online or something?

ironclaw

Kiltennel wrote: »

A campus wide ban can never work. There isn't sufficient man power meaning it wont be enforced. If they want to confine smoking the smartest solution will be to offer smoking areas which are off to the side of buildings which are also sheltered. Even then though it will still need to be enforced as otherwise people will just smoke as normal..

Why should it have to be enforced at all? Sign on the way in saying 'Smoke Free Campus' and people should have the cop and respect for others that its the wish of the campus authorities for it to be a smoke free place. UCD is private property and shouldn't to deal with people who don't agree with their policies. If you don't like it, don't come to UCD.

It works in the Mater Hospital (amongst others) and countless private industries. Every company I've worked for has had a smoke free campus policy and in all instances the smokers respected that. Smoking is a choice not a right.

Nothing personal against smokers but to say it 'can't be enforced' is laughable because their shouldn't be a need to enforced it at all. We're all adults here.

OneOfThem Stumbled

ironclaw wrote: »

Why should it have to be enforced at all? Sign on the way in saying 'Smoke Free Campus' and people should have the cop and respect for others that its the wish of the campus authorities for it to be a smoke free place. UCD is private property and shouldn't to deal with people who don't agree with their policies. If you don't like it, don't come to UCD.

This.

I don't know at what point we came to consider a national university to be a company, or public servants to be company employees or "authorities". All the staff of UCD are paid for by the state. It is an institution set to serve the people of the state.

What ever happened to the spirit of 1968? When I came to UCD Ruth Dudley Edwards addressed the new students and told them to "be obnoxious" like their forebears. Seems we lost that during the Celtic Tiger.

You say "we are all adults here" but one can't help but feel that such a sentiment is disingenuous when you believe that there are, and indeed should be, authorities and subordinates.

ironclaw

OneOfThem Stumbled wrote: »

This.

I don't know at what point we came to consider a national university to be a company, or public servants to be company employees or "authorities". All the staff of UCD are paid for by the state. It is an institution set to serve the people of the state.

What ever happened to the spirit of 1968? When I came to UCD Ruth Dudley Edwards addressed the new students and told them to "be obnoxious" like their forebears. Seems we lost that during the Celtic Tiger.

You say "we are all adults here" but one can't help but feel that such a sentiment is disingenuous when you believe that there are, and indeed should be, authorities and subordinates.

Pay your fee's and accept the terms and conditions of your tenure in UCD. If you don't like it, no one is forcing you to be there. Pretty much like any activity in life. You chose to be there and by being there you abide by the rules. Sure you could go on, why accept the laws of the land? Why follow speed limits?

Are you telling me if your work contract stated the campus was smoke-free you'd have a problem with that authority? :rolleyes:

OneOfThem Stumbled

ironclaw wrote: »

Pay your fees and accept the terms and conditions of your tenure in UCD. If you don't like it, no one is forcing you to be there. Pretty much like any activity in life. You chose to be there and by being there you abide by the rules. Sure you could go on, why accept the laws of the land? Why follow speed limits?

Are you telling me if your work contract stated the campus was smoke-free you'd have a problem with that authority? :rolleyes:

I really don't know why you are conflating private enterprise and public education. They aren't analogous.

Or indeed national law and rules thought up by a company manager. Your argument is entirely baseless.

Insofar that a public institution like UCD has the authority to set its own rules, these rules are designed to promote education and research, and ensure that the taxes that go towards such bodies are well spent. Companies set rules in order to try and increase their profits.

In fact the reason behind the creation of UCD in the first place disaffirms your assertion in its ambition to confront the status quo, whereby a third level institute such as TCD had had the authority to monopolise education within Dublin along a sectarian divide.

shannone

They could do what they do in Canada, well British Columbia anyways....no smoking within a 7m radius of the entrance to a building.....you never have to walk through clouds of smoke!

Del2005

shannone wrote: »

They could do what they do in Canada, well British Columbia anyways....no smoking within a 7m radius of the entrance to a building.....you never have to walk through clouds of smoke!

That's part of the smoking ban, just like most of our laws it was never enforced. Try having a smoke are a bus stop in the UK, in London you won't be smoking for long.

Niles

UCDCritic wrote: »

MANPOWER

Have you notice the area in front of the Arts cafe which was recently designated a no smoking area?

It's actually been designated as a no smoking area for years, just was blatantly disregarded. Notice that the HSE have issued them with a letter more recently though.