Is Jon Jones over-rated?

nino1

I realise that sounds ridiculous as he is obvious a phenomenal fighter.
I mean over-rated when it comes to people calling him unbeatable and the greatest of all time. I think he is definitely beatable and that Machida could possibly beat him in a rematch.

If you discount the last two fights where he fought natural middle-weights the only fighters of very high calibre he has fought are
Shogun (blows hot and very cold at times)
Evans
and Machida (Machida won first round and rocked him)

Tubbs4

nino1 wrote: »

I realise that sounds ridiculous as he is obvious a phenomenal fighter.
I mean over-rated when it comes to people calling him unbeatable and the greatest of all time. I think he is definitely beatable and that Machida could possibly beat him in a rematch.

If you discount the last two fights where he fought natural middle-weights the only fighters of very high calibre he has fought are
Shogun (blows hot and very cold at times)
Evans
and Machida (Machida won first round and rocked him)

I have to watch the Machida fight again but I don't think he rocked him. He caught him with a good punch only.
As much as I don't rate him personally he be one of the best and is getting better as he goes as still new to mma to others he won.

Everyboby is beatable but on his day it would be hard.

pauldoo

I dont think hes overrated at all. Hes a top quality fighter, on top of that he has a massive size advantage-he seems like a top heavyweight fighting at LHW

Machida got a few punches off and backed Jones up, otherwise he has destroyed everyone he has faced, people really cling onto the Machida fight, forgetting he went on to choke him out in pretty brutal fashion.

I always thought he comes accross as a bit of a dick, but he deserves all the credit he gets.I expect him to destroy AG this weekend

themandan6611

spice burger I just had was, jones is not

scudzilla

Over-rated - No

Unlikeable - Definitely

El Guapo!

He's not over-rated. He's an extremely good fighter and very tough to beat.
He's not unbeatable though. Nobody is. I reckon he'll be around for a very long time though.

bur

If you discount size and athleticism then sure, he's probably not as technically gifted as is made out. Though he's still at an elite level. But you can't really discount those things when it comes to judging a fighters overall ability. So no, not overrated.

Mellor

Over-rated: No. Absolutely not. For every person that thinks unbeatable, there's an "online-expert" who can see an exploitable weakness. Both are extreme views, neither are correct.

Ubeatable: Nope. Nobody is. The armbar verses Vitor is essentially proof of this.

pauldoo wrote: »

I dont think hes overrated at all. Hes a top quality fighter, on top of that he has a massive size advantage-he seems like a top heavyweight fighting at LHW

The idea that he has size advantage is a bit of a myth tbh, probably comes from the lack he is quite lanky looking. He has a clear reach advantage*. But he isn't a particularly large LHW.



*His reach advantage is definitely overstate this weekend. No way AG's reach is 76.5" - check out presser photos side by side. There's been a couple of inaccuracies in the tape stats over the year. It's prob in his advantage not to correct this.

Be like Nutella

I think the freakiest thing about Jones is his power. I think his ability to rag doll you from any position at all is his most dangerous aspect. He has done a huge amount of olympic lift type training for years which has developed incredible explosive strength for a lanky fighter... far and beyond what he gets credit for. He moves guys around like they're kids. If he has his hands on you he can put you wherever he wants and that usually involves some air time ! I fully expect his power will be the most evident gap between the two on Sat night.

He seems to be missing one punch KO ability but the jury's out on that one as his chosen style isn't conducive to throwing proverbial bombs. I personally want to see a raw vicious warrior Jones on Saturday who is willing to risk it all to completely wreck Gustafsson to put an exclamation mark on his dominance in the division and carve his name into the history books as the undisputed scariest LHW of all time. He could wrestle his way to a win, he could parry-strike his way to a win but a massive KO in the first round would put all doubts to rest and all threads like this one to bed.

welkin

No he's underrated if anything.

The dude is a complete freak of nature.

Morph the Cat

OP clearly doesn't know what overrated means.

threeball

welkin wrote: »

No he's underrated if anything.

The dude is a complete freak of nature.

I still think Chuck would have given him huge problems in his prime. His incredible punching power and ability to deliver it in retreat. His ability to avoid the takedown and his fearlessness in the exchange would have made for a bad night for Jones imo. It'd be great to see another fighter in his mould come along again soon.

d_jordan

He's not overrated if you judge him on a realistic scale but I think thats a weird term when it comes to sports in general anyway

His style & reach puts everyone he's fighting on the back foot and they just seem to cease up and let him tee of on them.

In my opinion you need someone that goes into a fight with him aggressive and is prepared to take some shots on the outside while putting jones on the backfoot.
His striking style is great when he is the one controlling the distance and pace but it is very hard for someone with his style to fight moving backwards.
Then again if the striking is not going his way and someone is taking control on the feet he has great takedowns

Be like Nutella

Chucks overhand right... right through your guard was good enough to put anyone down. I reckon Big Rigs mini H-bomb is about the closest thing around right now... he could knock out a heavy weight with that arm of his. GSP V Big Rig is gona be awesome! Jones wouldn't stand and trade with 'the best' Chuck no way .. he'd take him down any chance he got. It's a testament to Chuck that he'd be in the top 3 right now at 205 if peak Chuck Lidell was around now ! Imagine the match ups... he was only deadly.. one of the best ever...you'd have to put him top 10 ever.

weemcd

threeball wrote: »

I still think Chuck would have given him huge problems in his prime. His incredible punching power and ability to deliver it in retreat. His ability to avoid the takedown and his fearlessness in the exchange would have made for a bad night for Jones imo. It'd be great to see another fighter in his mould come along again soon.

Agree with this 100% Chuck feared nobody in the standup, fought anyone and everyone too, one of the most impressive CV's out there.

Prime Chuck vs Jones, and Prime Shogun vs Prime Anderson would be my two all time dream fights.

Be like Nutella

2005 Fedor vs HW 2015 Jones
HW 2015 Jones v Cain
HW 2015 Jones v JDS
Jones v 2011 Silva at 205
GSP V Silva at 178 lbs catch weight

mmmm.... mythical-matchmaking

Be like Nutella

http://www.sherdog.com/news/news/UFC-165-Weighin-Video-56385

Compu Global Hyper Meganet

Nobody's unbeatable. Got to admit that I'm more of a boxing fan than MMA, so can someone explain to me why Anderson Silva can't/won't fight Jones? Or is that on the cards down the line?

El Guapo!

Compu Global Hyper Meganet wrote: »

Nobody's unbeatable. Got to admit that I'm more of a boxing fan than MMA, so can someone explain to me why Anderson Silva can't/won't fight Jones? Or is that on the cards down the line?

They're in different weight classes. There is talk of a superfight between them at a catchweight, but neither have committed to it yet.
It may happen at some stage though.

stealinhorses

I think there is absolutely no way you can call a guy who cleaned out a whole division overrated. He strangled Machida unconscious and threw his lifeless body to the ground like a rag doll, he threw an Olympics alternate wrestler in Sonnen around like a 2 year old child. He tapped the legendary Rampage Jackson, made Shogun look an amateur, survived Belfort's armbar and then submitted Vitor himself. He is awkward, annoying and lacks a "real" charisma, but he is in no way overrated.

Ray Mond

Not one bit over rated !!! He is the most Dominant LHW champ ever , I think he'll Prob go on to be the most dominant UFC champ. His size and strength is unbelievable . He just man handles his opponent like they are weight classes below him. His striking is up there with the best . He is probably the most complete fighter in the UFC. I don't like his personality but he'll Prob go on to be the best ever.

SRFC

Could be the floyd mayweather of the ufc in marketing terms if he really wanted ie commanding crazy fee's.

Dtp1979

Bring back chuck!!

welkin

Chuck is from a different generation.

In fairness I don't think he'd hold a candle to Bones.

MMA is a totally different ball game to when him and Tito Ortiz were the daddies.

Mellor

welkin wrote: »

Chuck is from a different generation.

In fairness I don't think he'd hold a candle to Bones.

MMA is a totally different ball game to when him and Tito Ortiz were the daddies.

Exactly.
Jones hasn't broken Titos record yet, but nobody considers Tito's run to be even remotely close to Jones'

Dtp1979

Chuck is from a different generation alright but he's the type of fighter needed to take on jones

welkin

Don't think Glover has a snowballs against Bones but Cormier is he can make 205 sounds interesting.

Like Bones ragbdolls people remember Cormier ragdolled a catch wrestling vet like Barnett

Be like Nutella

Glover has a punchers chance if he takes a leaf from Chucks book who trained with him for years. Still a 4-1 underdog.

Cormier at 205 is an unknown.. he'll look like a midget against Jones. Jones will still be the stronger guy in that fight. He'll turn Cormier off the fence for fun.

Realistically these are the 2 remaining credible fights at 205 lbs for Jones IF he wins tonight.

There's an argument for Davis ...maybe ...but nobody gives him a real chance. Powerful take downs is literally all he would bring to the table.. against the best take down defender in the game.

How the hell could he not vacate the belt once he's done with Gust, Glover and Davis? Has to

No way they'd try and sell a Jones Mousasi fight or a Jones Belfort rematch or Hendo. Takin the p1ss if they do that.

2 more wins after tonight and he's done... game completed enter name into high scores JJJ

Dermighty

nino1 wrote: »

I realise that sounds ridiculous as he is obvious a phenomenal fighter.
I mean over-rated when it comes to people calling him unbeatable and the greatest of all time. I think he is definitely beatable and that Machida could possibly beat him in a rematch.

If you discount the last two fights where he fought natural middle-weights the only fighters of very high calibre he has fought are
Shogun (blows hot and very cold at times)
Evans
and Machida (Machida won first round and rocked him)

No

Clive

Yes, he is overrated by some. People would have you believe he's the second coming.

Is he a great fighter? Yes
Is he a dominant and deserving champion? Yes
Is he the greatest LHW of all time? You could argue that.
Is he the number one pound for pound at the moment? No
Is he the greatest of all time? No

Most of his wins are over blown up middleweights and LHW is a weak division at the moment. Fair play to him he can only beat the people put in front of him, but some people go OTT in my opinion.

welkin

Yup, over-rated!

Takedowns easily stuffed. Kicks looks terribly awkward, no boxing!

welkin

Must say i didn't give Glover a hope in hell against Bones but after seeing that fight I'm not sure.

Glover has excellent boxing, is huge, and has brilliant grappling.

Of there's no rematch with Gus I probably wouldn't bet against Glover.

And remember Bones is LUCKY - Machida was doing f well until he got cut and blood went into his eyes and he couldn't see. If Chael lasted another 30 secs he would have won with that toe of Jones. And the doctor wanted to stop the fight last night after r04 and inexplicity Jones "begged" him and he let the fight continue.

His luck will run out soon enough....

Be like Nutella

Glover is the sh1t but nah can't see him confusing Jones enough with his movement the way Gus did. Glover needs to be in really close, closer than most fighters to hit you... Jones will keep him outside and frustrate him as he does everybody but Gus.

Gus is the only question mark out there IMO. I'd love to see Glover v Gus to see how Gus does.

Davei141

welkin wrote: »

And remember Bones is LUCKY - Machida was doing f well until he got cut and blood went into his eyes and he couldn't see. If Chael lasted another 30 secs he would have won with that toe of Jones. And the doctor wanted to stop the fight last night after r04 and inexplicity Jones "begged" him and he let the fight continue.

His luck will run out soon enough....

Did you type that post with a straight face? Awful stuff.

stealinhorses

welkin wrote: »

Must say i didn't give Glover a hope in hell against Bones but after seeing that fight I'm not sure.

Glover has excellent boxing, is huge, and has brilliant grappling.

Of there's no rematch with Gus I probably wouldn't bet against Glover.

And remember Bones is LUCKY - Machida was doing f well until he got cut and blood went into his eyes and he couldn't see. If Chael lasted another 30 secs he would have won with that toe of Jones. And the doctor wanted to stop the fight last night after r04 and inexplicity Jones "begged" him and he let the fight continue.

His luck will run out soon enough....

You obviously lost a lot of money on Jones fights in the past, I can taste the bitterness leaking out of my monitor

As for Glover, I think it will be a quick wrap for Bones. Texeira is too slow and relies on landing that knockout blow to put away his opponents. Ryan Bader showed that Glover is just too slow. I see the fight going similar to Jones vs Rampage.
The only time he was really lucky was the toe thing. Escaping a locked armbar is willpower more than luck and not bleeding too much for a fight to be stopped isn't luck at all, just part of the sport. You could say the same thing about Gustafsson - he only did well against Jones because he was lucky enough not to get a fight-ending cut in the first round. By this definition, Machida was "unlucky" to wander straight into a standing guillotine :rolleyes:

mailburner

Jones was made to look human by gus and it was great to see him
having to dig deep for probably the first time in his career


I think phil davis might be his biggest test but davis won't engage
like gus did so for that reason I see jones/davis playing out exactly
like jones/evans

I think glover is too slow but jones probably won't get hit harder
by anyone else right now should he land and go head hunting like
chuck would have

I'm thinking it might be glover, davis and possibly gus again
after that there's nothing really

darced

This post has been deleted.

redbuck

I think if Texeira rushes Jones for the first round we could possibly see him KO Jones. I suspect following his last fight Jones might be reconsidering a potential move to Heavyweight I don't think he could hang with Cain and I think any big heavyweight who tags him at all could mean lights out for Jones.