Condominiums

ManofStraw

Can anyone explain the lack of condominium's in Ireland, I was wondering about this as they seem to be so popular in the States but I have never come across any here. Does anyone know if there any provisions that allows you to build them/ apply for planning permission in Ireland ? Have any ever been attempted in Ireland ?

Marcusm

Isn't that how must apartment buildings are sold in Ireland? Purchaser gets title to individual units and use of common areas which is the condo standard (as opposed to co-ops where the apartment title is not freely transferable, ie permission of co-OP board required).

ManofStraw

Marcusm wrote: »

Isn't that how must apartment buildings are sold in Ireland? Purchaser gets title to individual units and use of common areas which is the condo standard (as opposed to co-ops where the apartment title is not freely transferable, ie permission of co-OP board required).

In condominium's you get the title to the individual unit, but only the airspace within the unit eg you own the layer of paint on the wall but not the wall. All floors, walls ect are treated as common elements and are jointly owned by everyone in the condominium. The common areas are also jointly owned by everyone in the condominium and fees are paid usually on the basis of the size of your unit. Its a minor difference but it makes a big difference as you cant make changes to the floor, knock down an interior wall ect without the permission of the condo board. This is the mandatory appointing of a board in each condo who take over responsibilities like disputes, deciding what fees to charge ect

seamus

ManofStraw wrote: »

In condominium's you get the title to the individual unit, but only the airspace within the unit eg you own the layer of paint on the wall but not the wall. All floors, walls ect are treated as common elements and are jointly owned by everyone in the condominium. The common areas are also jointly owned by everyone in the condominium and fees are paid usually on the basis of the size of your unit. Its a minor difference but it makes a big difference as you cant make changes to the floor, knock down an interior wall ect without the permission of the condo board. This is the mandatory appointing of a board in each condo who take over responsibilities like disputes, deciding what fees to charge ect

This is effectively how most leasehold apartments in Ireland operate, perhaps just subtly different. An owner would be allowed remove an internal wall but only provided that it was not structurally significant.
As the floor would comprise a major structural part of the building you wouldn't be allowed touch that either (e.g. Fit a new stairs in a new place).
That's effectively moot though because any structural modification will have to be approved by the management company's insurer before you can proceed. So in essence you're not free to change the walls or the floor without approval.

Likewise anything outside your apartment is a common area to which you have a shared right of use and you pay a management fee for.

ManofStraw

seamus wrote: »

This is effectively how most leasehold apartments in Ireland operate, perhaps just subtly different. An owner would be allowed remove an internal wall but only provided that it was not structurally significant.
As the floor would comprise a major structural part of the building you wouldn't be allowed touch that either (e.g. Fit a new stairs in a new place).
That's effectively moot though because any structural modification will have to be approved by the management company's insurer before you can proceed. So in essence you're not free to change the walls or the floor without approval.

Likewise anything outside your apartment is a common area to which you have a shared right of use and you pay a management fee for.

It is true that many leasehold apartments work very similarly but condo's don't strictly have to be apartment style buildings (towers) and that is where differences come into play. I was more so wondering have condo's ever been attempted in Ireland/UK as a model or is there even provision for them to come in as a model.

Bepolite

You're talking about the Freehold of the cube of space that the apartment belongs to I'm assuming?

Nothing to stop it happening in Ireland, perhaps bar the MUD Act, flying freehold are allowed. You'd find it almost impossible to insure. In England and Wales the situation is the same; mostly leasehold. In Scotland apartments are owned freehold (it's called something slightly different) but again you will only get insurance with some companies.

I actually owned an apartment in Scotland, when it works it works very well - My charge was £30 a year for a lad to mow the lawns. When it goes wrong it's terrible. I rented in Perth and my Landlord was hit for £15,000 in repairs. (Not by me I hasten to add!)

Peregrinus

Condominium is a specific legal form of co-ownership of property which exists in most US states, and some Canadian provinces. Often an apartment building, or a unit in an apartment building, is referred to as a condominium, but strictly speaking condomimium is not the buidling, but the nature of the owner's interest in it - condominium is an alternative to leasehold, for instance.

They don't have condominium ownership anywhere but in North America, but very similar legal forms have been created in Australia (strata title), in England (commonhold) and no doubt elsewhere.

It's considered particularly suitable for reconciling the sometimes competing interests of co-owners of a residential building, and it developed in the US because the US had large numbers of people living in apartments before most other countries did. A somewhat similar structure is created here through a corporate owner of a building granting leases to individual occupants, with the individual occupants being shareholders in the corporate owner.

Since 2004 in England they've had the option of the leasehold structure that we have, or of commonhold. Commonhold is not very popular, though; the huge majority of English apartments are held through leasehold structures, even those developed since 2004.