Entitled to Job-seekers Allowance if doing a Masters in the evening

SweetPotatoes

Hi,

I am considering studying for a Masters Degree which starts the week after next. I have been accepted but do not think I can afford it if I am not entitled to Job-seeker's allowance whilst doing it. I will be attending tutorials in the evenings and studying at night and weekends which I would be doing if in full time employment also. In fact a lot of people doing this masters in the evening will be in full time employment.

The question is if I am still seeking work during the day and am available for work as well as studying for a masters in the evening am I still entitled to my benefits?

Annasopra

Yes - see this

http://www.welfare.ie/en/Pages/Back-to-Education---Part-Time-Education-Option.aspx

SweetPotatoes

mango salsa wrote: »

Yes - see this

http://www.welfare.ie/en/Pages/Back-to-Education---Part-Time-Education-Option.aspx

Thanks Mango. The only thing is this refers to part-time study evening or morning classes. I will be studying for a full time masters but all the tutorials are in the late evenings.

Duration Full time 1 year (evening classes) is on the course description.

eastbono

You need to contact your sw office. In my opinion if the masters is totally at night and some weekends then you should still be eligible for jobseekers allowance. I hate this expression but going forward you need to be able to show that you are available and looking for full time work e.g. keep all email applications etc. You need to get a letter from the course provider stating that its night time only and weekends. I know people who have worked full time and did a Masters at night and weekends. Are you currently in receipt of jsa.

SweetPotatoes

eastbono wrote: »

You need to contact your sw office. In my opinion if the masters is totally at night and some weekends then you should still be eligible for jobseekers allowance. I hate this expression but going forward you need to be able to show that you are available and looking for full time work e.g. keep all email applications etc. You need to get a letter from the course provider stating that its night time only and weekends. I know people who have worked full time and did a Masters at night and weekends. Are you currently in receipt of jsa.

Yes, I am in receipt of JSA at the moment.

eastbono

SweetPotatoes wrote: »

Yes, I am in receipt of JSA at the moment.

Well then if the course is solely night time and weekend this should not effect your payment but its best to call in sw office with a letter from the course provider with this information as sw will be notified that you have started a course of education once you register and its best to have everything sorted out beforehand and everything in you file so there will not be any interruption to your payment.

SweetPotatoes

eastbono wrote: »

Well then if the course is solely night time and weekend this should not effect your payment but its best to call in sw office with a letter from the course provider with this information as sw will be notified that you have started a course of education once you register and its best to have everything sorted out beforehand and everything in you file so there will not be any interruption to your payment.

Thanks. That is useful information. I told the SW some time ago that I was planning to do a Master's but did not know they were notified by the college anyway.

eastbono

SW get a list of ppsn of people who have registered for college and a cross match is done on the system which throws up people who are registered for college and in receipt of sw payments without having applied for back to education. It might be best to confirm with you local office that you are doing the masters so that they can note it on your claim.

SweetPotatoes

eastbono wrote: »

SW get a list of ppsn of people who have registered for college and a cross match is done on the system which throws up people who are registered for college and in receipt of sw payments without having applied for back to education. It might be best to confirm with you local office that you are doing the masters so that they can note it on your claim.

Yes, I will do that and explain how the full time master's course is conducted on 3 evenings per week whilst I am looking for work during the day.

Cheers,

SweetPotatoes

SweetPotatoes wrote: »

Thanks. That is useful information. I told the SW some time ago that I was planning to do a Master's but did not know they were notified by the college anyway.

Well, I did all that but they are stopping my Jobseekers allowance anyway. I explained that the master's study takes place on 3 evenings a week and I forwarded on a letter from the college explaining that this is so as well as some independent study and research also being expected (which I could do on the other evenings and weekends similar to people who are working and doing this masters). But they are simply going by the fact the masters is full time and that means I am not available and looking for work (which is not true). The fact the course is designated full time is an anomaly in my opinion. I will not be in college all day (only evenings). I will appeal of course but find this decision to be a disgrace. I would be better off not trying to further myself and make myself more employable and simply to continue to draw my allowance and let myself go down the tubes.

eastbono

I am sorry to hear that this has happened. You definetly need to appeal this. Did the letter from the college state that it was full time? You need to get a more detailed letter from the college outlining that all attendance is at night to support your appeal and also proof that you continue to look for full time work e.g. emails to jobs and replies and also if you are registered with recruitment agencies print off these details as well. Please let me know how you get on. You could apply for supplementary welfare allowance while you are awaiting this appeal again if applying for this be sure and bring very detailed supporting evidence that the course is night time based and proof of your continuing work efforts.

cee_jay

Unfortunately, even though the course may be evenings only, as the institution has classified the course as full time, the decision is correct and the guidelines correctly followed. Does the course come in under the Springboard initiative?

SweetPotatoes

eastbono wrote: »

I am sorry to hear that this has happened. You definetly need to appeal this. Did the letter from the college state that it was full time? You need to get a more detailed letter from the college outlining that all attendance is at night to support your appeal and also proof that you continue to look for full time work e.g. emails to jobs and replies and also if you are registered with recruitment agencies print off these details as well. Please let me know how you get on. You could apply for supplementary welfare allowance while you are awaiting this appeal again if applying for this be sure and bring very detailed supporting evidence that the course is night time based and proof of your continuing work efforts.

Yes, the letter from the college stated the amount of tutorial hours (9) and that they are all in the evenings. I have made this all clear to them but to no avail. Job seeking does go on and I have plenty of evidence of this. I feel it is the boat for me as soon as I get this masters finished. I am totally disillusioned with Ireland now. I will be another one of Ireland's exports again soon. I guess that is the only road for those of us who want to better ourselves.

SweetPotatoes

cee_jay wrote: »

Unfortunately, even though the course may be evenings only, as the institution has classified the course as full time, the decision is correct and the guidelines correctly followed. Does the course come in under the Springboard initiative?

I could have done a full time masters by distance learning from a foreign university and continued to receive jobseekers allowance. As I said, full time is an anomaly. A lot of people studying masters are working as I hoped to be too by now. This was simply an arbitrary decision against me. I can see now why the dole ques are full of people not bothering their ass. It is the best way to be in Ireland at the moment. Those of us who give a sh!t end up on the boat out of here to survive.

leo2a6

Funny how a master with tutorials in evenings is refused because classified full time and some part time classified master requiring 2 half days or 1 full day attendance are accepted...

longhalloween

leo2a6 wrote: »

Funny how a master with tutorials in evenings is refused because classified full time and some part time classified master requiring 2 half days or 1 full day attendance are accepted...

If it said it was a part time course with exactly the same hours he would have gotten the JSA.

The social welfare only see black and white and full time courses aren't eligible.

MouseTail

longhalloween wrote: »

If it said it was a part time course with exactly the same hours he would have gotten the JSA.

The social welfare only see black and white and full time courses aren't eligible.

In fairness, regardless of when contact hours are, it is incredibly difficult to do a masters in one year whilst working full time. I cant see you winning an appeal.

SweetPotatoes

MouseTail wrote: »

In fairness, regardless of when contact hours are, it is incredibly difficult to do a masters in one year whilst working full time. I cant see you winning an appeal.

There are plenty of people in full time work taking the same masters as me. As to how well we all do is a different point. Who says they or I are looking for a first. Simply passing in order to have an LL.M is often all people want.

SweetPotatoes

leo2a6 wrote: »

Funny how a master with tutorials in evenings is refused because classified full time and some part time classified master requiring 2 half days or 1 full day attendance are accepted...

longhalloween wrote: »

If it said it was a part time course with exactly the same hours he would have gotten the JSA.

The social welfare only see black and white and full time courses aren't eligible.

MouseTail wrote: »

In fairness, regardless of when contact hours are, it is incredibly difficult to do a masters in one year whilst working full time. I cant see you winning an appeal.

I have done a part time degree that had more hours per week being required. The course being designated full-time is an anomaly. It can be done by attending most of the tutorials which take up a maximum of 9 hours per week and an additional couple of hours on the other evenings as well as a weekend day is enough to pass the masters. Of course if I was seeking a first then I would want to spend much more time on it.

A full time course like one does at FAS or when taking a full time degree after leaving cert does mean attending college through out the day but a masters like this even though full-time is designed to accomodate working people. I will be formulating a very good appeal and they have not heard the last of this.

MouseTail

Regardless of when contact hours are, it is full time as it is one year. Part time masters are at least two years.

Contact hours are the least of the work needed for a masters.

Comparing it to a level 5 or 6 is not relevant. You won't win an appeal. This masters is full time. The uni says so, HETAC says so, DSP says so.

SweetPotatoes

MouseTail wrote: »

Regardless of when contact hours are, it is full time as it is one year. Part time masters are at least two years.

Contact hours are the least of the work needed for a masters.

Comparing it to a level 5 or 6 is not relevant. You won't win an appeal. This masters is full time. The uni says so, HETAC says so, DSP says so.

Do you work for the Department of Social Protection? Trying to cut off an appeal? Interfering with the right of appeal of a citizen? Or are you setting up an online court of your own and distributing your own rulings? I'll exercise my rights if you do not mind.

MouseTail

SweetPotatoes wrote: »

Do you work for the Department of Social Protection? Trying to cut off an appeal? Interfering with the right of appeal of a citizen? Or are you setting up an online court of your own and distributing your own rulings? I'll exercise my rights if you do not mind.

No, I dont work for DSP, nor am I interfering with your rights by answering a post on an online forum.

I am simply explaining DSP rationale. This is a full time course.

SweetPotatoes

MouseTail wrote: »

No, I dont work for DSP, nor am I interfering with your rights by answering a post on an online forum.

I am simply explaining DSP rationale. This is a full time course.

And I am challenging DSP rationale. Nothing is ever black and white.

leo2a6

I think that even if the master is classified part-time, they can still refuse it...

Engine No.9

Is there no eligibility for Back To Education Allowance here???

leo2a6

Not for a master unless Postgraduate Diploma in Education

Annasopra

pajopearl wrote: »

Is there no eligibility for Back To Education Allowance here???

Not for a masters no

Kristopherus

SweetPotatoes wrote: »

And I am challenging DSP rationale. Nothing is ever black and white.

Go for it. I was driving this morning(Sat) and heard Moanie Joanie on the radio spouting on about how her Dept will focus on the younger generation in the new year, with further training & education options being rolled out next year:rolleyes:. I would suggest that in the interim she could have a good look at the anomalies that are rife in her Dept.:mad:

Tigger

SweetPotatoes wrote: »

Do you work for the Department of Social Protection? Trying to cut off an appeal? Interfering with the right of appeal of a citizen? Or are you setting up an online court of your own and distributing your own rulings? I'll exercise my rights if you do not mind.

Old film title but reality bites

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.