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Part-Time Programming?

  • 29-08-2013 12:59am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 11 hogiewan


    Wondering if such jobs exist? I'm a CS student in year 3 of 4, who has a year's experience as a PHP programmer. I'm fluent in Java, PHP, HTML, MYSQL and am wondering if its unheard of to get a job in the evening weekends to fit around college?


Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 576 ✭✭✭ ifah


    try profiling yourself on eLance or one of the other freelance websites ....


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,940 ✭✭✭ Ray Palmer


    hogiewan wrote: »
    Wondering if such jobs exist? I'm a CS student in year 3 of 4, who has a year's experience as a PHP programmer. I'm fluent in Java, PHP, HTML, MYSQL and am wondering if its unheard of to get a job in the evening weekends to fit around college?

    It is possible but I would doubt anybody who said they were fluent in programing languages. I know programmers with years of experience in Java and they wouldn't call themselves fluent. It is kind of like saying you are fluent in maths.
    You may have knowledge of them but without years of experience you can't really say you could even handle following a spec for a relatively simple component.
    I think you may have to consider what you say about your skills more carefully.

    It tends to be the kind of work you would get by approaching a company rather than them advertising the role. If you have friends in companies ask them to ask their bosses.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11 hogiewan


    I don't mean to overstate my case, I'm not saying I know every possible facet of these languages!! Fluency in any language simply means one can express themselves concisely and understand people trying to do the same without having to look up every sentence!! I mean I'm fluent in English too, that's not to say there aren't words or phrases or grammatical idioms I've never heard!!


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,940 ✭✭✭ Ray Palmer


    hogiewan wrote: »
    I don't mean to overstate my case, I'm not saying I know every possible facet of these languages!! Fluency in any language simply means one can express themselves concisely and understand people trying to do the same without having to look up every sentence!! I mean I'm fluent in English too, that's not to say there aren't words or phrases or grammatical idioms I've never heard!!

    You might think that what it means but nobody else working in IT will agree with you when talking about programing languages. You just simply don't say it as it doesn't hold true. This is advice ignore it if you want but people will laugh at even the suggestion of it.

    You aren't overstating you are make a statement that is at best naïve at worst arrogant. Not something employer forgive in a competitive market.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11 hogiewan


    I like to split hairs as much as the next man but, by definition, fluency is:

    "able to speak or write a particular language easily and accurately"

    That's from the Oxford Dictionary. Maybe its an industry homonym (meaning total mastery) that I've yet to encounter, but then again neither has this guy:

    "Even working all hours of the day, the time to fluency for a language is on the order of weeks, independent of other scary new-workplace factors."
    (http://blog.cdleary.com/2009/11/thoughts-on-programming-language-fluency/)

    It seems to me that it is equally plausible that the term is loosely defined and can be interpreted just as I intended, but you didn't want to miss an opportunity to be smug and self satisfied.

    In short, as much as I enjoyed being condescended during both of your posts, your only on topic comment was a single pearl along the lines of "Have you tried asking your mates," which was juice hardly worth the squeeze.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,686 ✭✭✭ RealistSpy


    hogiewan wrote: »
    I like to split hairs as much as the next man but, by definition, fluency is:

    "able to speak or write a particular language easily and accurately"

    That's from the Oxford Dictionary. Maybe its an industry homonym (meaning total mastery) that I've yet to encounter, but then again neither has this guy:

    "Even working all hours of the day, the time to fluency for a language is on the order of weeks, independent of other scary new-workplace factors."
    (http://blog.cdleary.com/2009/11/thoughts-on-programming-language-fluency/)

    It seems to me that it is equally plausible that the term is loosely defined and can be interpreted just as I intended, but you didn't want to miss an opportunity to be smug and self satisfied.

    In short, as much as I enjoyed being condescended during both of your posts, your only on topic comment was a single pearl along the lines of "Have you tried asking your mates," which was juice hardly worth the squeeze.

    No offence but this is not the attitude you need to have to get your a programming job. I have been with many programmers would call themselves fluent and can even program a simple bubble sort. Even worse they have no portfolio to show. As a programmer, you never stop learning and you are never fluent, competent maybe but not fluent.

    To answer your question it is very very unlikely to get a part time job as a programmer.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,940 ✭✭✭ Ray Palmer


    hogiewan wrote: »
    I like to split hairs as much as the next man but, by definition, fluency is:

    "able to speak or write a particular language easily and accurately"

    That's from the Oxford Dictionary. Maybe its an industry homonym (meaning total mastery) that I've yet to encounter, but then again neither has this guy:

    "Even working all hours of the day, the time to fluency for a language is on the order of weeks, independent of other scary new-workplace factors."
    (http://blog.cdleary.com/2009/11/thoughts-on-programming-language-fluency/)

    It seems to me that it is equally plausible that the term is loosely defined and can be interpreted just as I intended, but you didn't want to miss an opportunity to be smug and self satisfied.

    In short, as much as I enjoyed being condescended during both of your posts, your only on topic comment was a single pearl along the lines of "Have you tried asking your mates," which was juice hardly worth the squeeze.


    Good luck getting a job in IT with that attitude. You are telling somebody with many years experience above you that you know better. I said your comments were naïve or arrogant I now know it is arrogant.

    To use an definition from a dictionary to make a claim on a technical language completely misses the point. Who the hell is Chris Leary? Blogs are so difficult to set up:rolleyes:

    If you think what I said equates to ask your mates then you missed the point again. You are looking for something special that requires special treatment which has to be asked for. You need a friend to specifically ask their boss for you.

    I just now wonder how you react if in an interview they questioned you on claims of being fluent and they have my opinion and not yours.

    You know I may have helped you if I spotted a opportunity that suited you.:mad:


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,077 ✭✭✭ Tails142


    I would use the word proficient rather than fluent


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,940 ✭✭✭ Ray Palmer


    Tails142 wrote: »
    I would use the word proficient rather than fluent
    Do you think a 3rd year computer studies student is proficient? I am assuming they are just entering 3rd year too.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 239 ✭✭ Woofstuff


    Ray Palmer wrote: »
    Do you think a 3rd year computer studies student is proficient? I am assuming they are just entering 3rd year too.

    What is the word you would suggest to use? Capable? Not a great buzz word for the CV:pac:


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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,940 ✭✭✭ Ray Palmer


    Woofstuff wrote: »
    What is the word you would suggest to use? Capable? Not a great buzz word for the CV:pac:
    Something accurate maybe. Experience with, programing knowledge of etc...

    I would expect 2 years experience with a language in a working environment as describable as "proficient".


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 9,684 Mod ✭✭✭✭ stevenmu


    IMHO it's pretty common for candidates to say they are "fluent" in a language. Most people I know understand that what they mean is that they are claiming to be good at it. And that's fine to do, because employers don't really care what you claim you are good at, it's expected that people will make lofty claims about their abilities, they care what you can demonstrate through experience, and possibly a portfolio.

    As for the original question, it's unusual to get part time programming work. Generally it open happens when someone has worked at a company for a period of time and wants to reduce their hours. Sometimes companies do have a need for someone to work a limited amount of time a week to maintain some specific system, but they'd generally look for a contractor with that speciality. You could try agencies and see if they had anything that fit, but your best bet is probably freelance sites like above.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 909 ✭✭✭ camel jockey


    hogiewan wrote: »
    I like to split hairs as much as the next man but, by definition, fluency is:

    "able to speak or write a particular language easily and accurately"

    That's from the Oxford Dictionary. Maybe its an industry homonym (meaning total mastery) that I've yet to encounter, but then again neither has this guy:

    "Even working all hours of the day, the time to fluency for a language is on the order of weeks, independent of other scary new-workplace factors."
    (http://blog.cdleary.com/2009/11/thoughts-on-programming-language-fluency/)

    It seems to me that it is equally plausible that the term is loosely defined and can be interpreted just as I intended, but you didn't want to miss an opportunity to be smug and self satisfied.

    In short, as much as I enjoyed being condescended during both of your posts, your only on topic comment was a single pearl along the lines of "Have you tried asking your mates," which was juice hardly worth the squeeze.

    Cop on. You are a student with a few simple college projects under your belt. Claiming fluency in java is an insult to those of us who have been software developers for years and actually have real world experience.


  • Registered Users Posts: 43 Duffleboxie


    Oh, what joy it brings me to type this comment. Not one for being petty but my goodness have you guys earned your commupence. For programmers with "years of real-world experience" (an extra 8 years now at this stage) I would love to know how your mundane lives of gaming, attempting to find the 'cheapest glasses' and worrying about 'what people might say about your clothes' is going for you?

    I happen to have recently discovered the OP's account and I am in disbelief at the condescending nature you all responded to a young student asking a simple question. He has surpassed you all. The OP is now in the top 2% of earners in Ireland and the UK after selling his multi-million euro tech company to a billion-dollar tech company which he now owns over 20% shares in, and is just about to make his 3rd multi-million euro exit, all under the age of 35.

    It is with immense pride and great pleasure that I thank you for your antagonistic replies in 2013 and in contributing to the wrath which only served to make my future husband a smarter, more resilient and better man than any of you could ever conceive. From rags to riches (and hes's sexy too), he continues to help all those who helped him on the way up. Perhaps take a second to pause and think about that before you post some other unhelpful "up your own hole" trite on boards, after yet another exciting day at your 9 to 5.

    So pleased to have found this. Might frame it. x

    Post edited by Duffleboxie on


  • Registered Users Posts: 43 Duffleboxie



    and Ps. He was fluent, he was just being humble.

    Post edited by Duffleboxie on


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,556 ✭✭✭✭ Donald Trump




  • Registered Users Posts: 2,634 ✭✭✭ ec18


    clearly they are still living rent free in his massive brain if he mentioned this thread to you :P



  • Registered Users Posts: 800 ✭✭✭ a fat guy


    The only time I've seen part time work happening was in a small company where the part timer was a student who'd proven themselves useful during an internship at said company. I think he got Mickley mouse work when he wasn't in college, worked there fulltimes over several summer (I think he did an internship by himself after his first college year? that got him in the door for later on anyway) and eventually was delivering features by himself at the end of college.

    As for the estimation of your skill level, employers know that students are a liability for quite some time to take on. They'll know roughly how good you are based on your interview because there's a tonne of stuff you can't possibly learn outside of employment. And I'm not talking about soft skills, I'm talking about problems that you can't replicate to solve for training purposes because it's such a vast set of systems that workplaces always have. Some of the responses here might seem harsh, but consider it a heads up as you really don't want to be the arrogant first-time employee that gets fired for having a bad attitude. That'll feel a whole lot worse (and have repercussions beyond your confidence) than being given an involuntary attitude check on here.

    Also for the sake of showing my own perspective, I have almost six years industry experience with most of it in Java and wouldn't call myself fluent or an expert in it.


    Edit: also a little advice - read Effective Java 3 and Java Concurrency in Practice in order to get some idea of how complex Java can get. Books like Head First Java, Head First Design Patterns and stuff like that are better for cementing your fundamentals while you're in college, but EF3 and JCIP will hopefully give you a wider grasp on the landscape.

    Also the OCA exams used to be decent to have before getting a job, but honestly after a few years nobody gives a **** about certificates. And they combined the OCA and OCP so now it's more difficult to just get an up to date Java cert. I mean they'll help but I honestly couldn't be arsed because Oracle are a shithead company and I'd prefer to just work on my own stuff.



  • Registered Users Posts: 769 ✭✭✭ pillphil




  • Registered Users Posts: 800 ✭✭✭ a fat guy


    Fecking thread necromancers again!

    It would be interesting to hear from the OP again though, I'd imagine their opinion has changed since.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,842 ✭✭✭ fvp4


    The responses weren’t great alright. Just because the guy used fluent?



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,126 ✭✭✭ Ubbquittious


    It is hard to get a part time programming job because software companies like to go into crunch time and make people work 16 hours a day in order to meet deadlines. Then when they see how much work is getting done in crunch mode they quickly land another project on top of their developers to "make hay while the sun shines" and before you know it everyone is burnt out but the CEO has made enough money to spend the rest of his days sunning himself in the Bahamas

    Stellantis: All the sh1t brands under one roof



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,299 ✭✭✭ Snotty


    This is too funny, some student asks a question, phrasing it badly, gets called out on it to a brutal extend (in true boards.ie fashion) 8 years later the student is still butt hurt on it and responds to tell us all how wrong we were and how he's sitting in his penthouse with soooo much coke and hookers to make us jealous :)

    Brilliant



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