Should I taper for shorter races during a marathon program?

sub3wannabe

Hi, I was looking for advice on the pro's and cons of tapering for say a 10k race in week 9 of a marathon program.

I am trying to go sub 3 in DCM this year and am following a tough 110k+ weekly program to try and achieve this. I however made a spontaneous decision there last week to run in the greatpinkrun 10k as I thought trying to go sub 40 running along side one of my idols Sonia O Sullivan was to good an opportunity to pass up.

Issue is if I train according to my program I know come Saturday I am going to be very heavy legged and won't be at my optimum for the 10k. I am considering tapering by dropping a tough lactate threshold session on Thursday.

My main priority is to get sub 3 in October but sub 40 is a strong secondary objective id like to achieve. Guess what I want to know is, would dropping a key session like a LT significantly affect my chances of sub3 or could I get away with it.

Thanks!

Krusty_Clown

Sounds like you are following a P&D plan. I would think that the 10k at race pace would be a perfectly good substitute for your LT session (while not fullfilling exactly the same goals). In fact, in the P&D plans, there are occasional tune-up races, where you might have a couple of easy days beforehand (and a long run the subsequent day). By the way, if sub-3 is a goal, then cracking 40 mins for 10k should be pretty achievable.

sub3wannabe

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

Sounds like you are following a P&D plan. I would think that the 10k at race pace would be a perfectly good substitute for your LT session (while not fullfilling exactly the same goals). In fact, in the P&D plans, there are occasional tune-up races, where you might have a couple of easy days beforehand (and a long run the subsequent day). By the way, if sub-3 is a goal, then cracking 40 mins for 10k should be pretty achievable.

That's put my mind at rest somewhat Krusty, thanks. A speedy 10k isn't a bad substitute for an LT session when you think about it.

Should I do my LSR on Sunday as normal would you think or maybe move it to Monday?, that's what I was thinking of doing.

Krusty_Clown

sub3wannabe wrote: »

That's put my mind at rest somewhat Krusty, thanks. A speedy 10k isn't a bad substitute for an LT session when you think about it.

Should I do my LSR on Sunday as normal would you think or maybe move it to Monday?, that's what I was thinking of doing.

Is it actually a P&D plan you are following? If so, there are tune-up races which you are supposed to follow with a long run. You could substitute the 10k/long run for one of these tune-up races.

I've done the tune-up race/long run double whammy a few times, and it's a pretty tough combination (and I reckon does increase your potential for injury), but it also meets the expected goal, which is to get you doing a long run when the body is pretty depleted and you're feeling very tired. Best thing to do is assess the day after the race, and see if you are physically capable of doing a long run without creating a risk of injury, or postponing it until you can do it without that risk.

hypersonic

would 10km race pace not be a good bit higher than LT pace?

Krusty_Clown

hypersonic wrote: »

would 10km race pace not be a good bit higher than LT pace?

If by 'higher' you mean 'faster', then yes. As I said, it has slightly different goals, but will provide benefit. Lonely is the marathon training program that doesn't have tune up races.

TFBubendorfer

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

Lonely is the marathon training program that doesn't have tune up races.

Very profound for that time of morning!

thewolf_ie

I didn't taper on half marathon or 10 mile races so far while training for DCM 2013. I might not run the day before or switch rest days etc.

pico84

sub 40 at this stage with a sub 3 aim in October should be very achievable.
It shouldn't be the kind of run that will take too much out of you if you're at a sub 3 level of fitness so the taper shouldnt be necessary

sub3wannabe

pico84 wrote: »

sub 40 at this stage with a sub 3 aim in October should be very achievable.
It shouldn't be the kind of run that will take too much out of you if you're at a sub 3 level of fitness so the taper shouldn't be necessary

It's not the aftermath I'm worried about it's the tiredness from the proposed LT on Thursday. For some reason I'm always very stiff and sore after these, I think its because I never did much speed training for past marathons and thus am a bit behind on this aspect of my athleticism.

I know sub 40 in theory should be a walk in the park. (McMillan Calculator) says I should be running 38:xx but am still a bit apprehensive!

Thanks for all the advice though.

Krusty_Clown

sub3wannabe wrote: »

I know sub 40 in theory should be a walk in the park. (McMillan Calculator) says I should be running 38:xx but am still a bit apprehensive!

It shouldn't be a walk in the park, but it should be achievable. Remember, you're training for a marathon, not for a 10k, so whether you get your sub 40 or not, is largely irrelevant. Eyes on the prize.

pico84

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

It shouldn't be a walk in the park, but it should be achievable. Remember, you're training for a marathon, not for a 10k, so whether you get your sub 40 or not, is largely irrelevant. Eyes on the prize.

Big time the sub 40 is nice for a big of confidence but as krusty said the marathon is the goal at the end of the day

sub3wannabe

pico84 wrote: »

Big time the sub 40 is nice for a big of confidence but as krusty said the marathon is the goal at the end of the day

You're both right. I have nothing to lose really!