Traffic Calming Plans

Heroditas

Came off the outer ring road yesterday and was driving through the roundabouts at Griffeen Aroad/Griffeen Way/Castle Road and noticed some markings painted in blue lines on the road.
Looks like they are considering narrowing the lanes on the roundabout to one lane in each direction and make the roundabouts more awkward to navigate, thus reducing speed.
I only saw this at those two roundabouts. Anyone notice it on any other roundabouts in the area?

stoneill

I noticed the markings last night - I was wondering if it was part of the cycleway extension.

Heroditas

stoneill wrote: »

I noticed the markings last night - I was wondering if it was part of the cycleway extension.

I think it is actually.
I drove by there again during the week and it certainly didn't look like they were reducing the width of the junctions.
It would be crazy if they did, that whole area is bad enough in the morning with the school traffic without making it more congested.

Fresh Pots

Maybe it's traffic lights there putting in, although I really don't see the need if that is what they're doing.

Lyn256

Traffic lights - seemingly!

Heroditas

Lyn256 wrote: »

Traffic lights - seemingly!

Oh FFS, just what we need!

rgfuller

26th August 2013 - South Dublin County Council is carrying out works on two roundabouts at Griffeen Avenue leading to Willsbrook Road in Lucan. These works will provide new pedestrian crossings at these two roundabouts. The works should take approx 9 weeks.

The Contractors working hours are 7.30am to 5.30pm with works restrictions in place between the hours of 7.00am to 10.00am and 4.00pm to 7.00pm and there is an approved Traffic Management plan in place.

http://www.sdublincoco.ie/index.aspx?pageid=939&pid=27080

Heroditas

Nine frikkin weeks?! You'd swear they were building a flyover!

josh59

rgfuller wrote: »

26th August 2013 - South Dublin County Council is carrying out works on two roundabouts at Griffeen Avenue leading to Willsbrook Road in Lucan. These works will provide new pedestrian crossings at these two roundabouts. The works should take approx 9 weeks.

The Contractors working hours are 7.30am to 5.30pm with works restrictions in place between the hours of 7.00am to 10.00am and 4.00pm to 7.00pm and there is an approved Traffic Management plan in place.

http://www.sdublincoco.ie/index.aspx?pageid=939&pid=27080

What clever clogs gave the go ahead to start these works the very week the children went back to school. There was plenty of opportunity I would have thought to carry them out during the quite summer period.

This morning at around 10 to 8 there as a mini digger driving down the road from the compound they have near the roundabout at Fforester towards the leisure centre causing great disruption.

average_runner

josh59 wrote: »

What clever clogs gave the go ahead to start these works the very week the children went back to school. There was plenty of opportunity I would have thought to carry them out during the quite summer period.

This morning at around 10 to 8 there as a mini digger driving down the road from the compound they have near the roundabout at Fforester towards the leisure centre causing great disruption.

You expect the Council people to have brains or common sense?

Heroditas

The Griffeen Way/Castle Road roundabout is a disaster now.
Work is still underway but they've definitely narrowed the lanes and it's actually quite tight for a car to navigate the roundabout now.
It's now comparable to the roundabout at TEK Dairies in Monkstown or the roundabout at the bottom of Avondale Road in Dalkey.

Also seems a bit pointless because the LUAS (if it ever arrives) is due to navigate that route so why waste money on the junction when it'll have to be dug up again?
Frustrating

Fresh Pots

Heroditas wrote: »

Also seems a bit pointless because the LUAS (if it ever arrives) is due to navigate that route so why waste money on the junction when it'll have to be dug up again?
Frustrating

That have to keep themselves looking busy!

hmmm

Heroditas wrote: »

The Griffeen Way/Castle Road roundabout is a disaster now.

Buses are having difficulty getting around it now - my bus whacks of it every time.

The one further up the road is like something off an F1 track, it is a gentle slope in turning into a almost a right angle coming off of it. I'm genuinely worried that someone will roll or crash into the pavement.

In saying all that, motorists are still doing their best to race along and blare their horn at any pedestrians with the temerity to try and cross the road. A speedbump would have been a better idea I think.

Sad Professor

Cars used to go around there way too fast, so something needed to be done.

They need to hurry it up though. I cycle and can’t cross over to the other bike lane because the the path is blocked, forcing me to go out and stay on the road which is risky during school run.

Heroditas

Sad Professor wrote: »

Cars used to go around there way too fast, so something needed to be done.

They need to hurry it up though. I cycle and can’t cross over to the other bike lane because the the path is blocked, forcing me to go out and stay on the road which is risky during school run.

A ramp or two would have sufficed. It's not as if there's a scarcity of them in the area anyway.

Also, during the school run, the traffic is at its slowest due to the sheer volumes.
Took me 25mins to get from Elmbrook to the top of Castle Road last Thursday morning.

unkel

hmmm wrote: »

Buses are having difficulty getting around it now - my bus whacks of it every time.

I well believe you. I have a big car and I have to slow right down to navigate it. If a bus can't get around it without hitting a kerb, it is a design FAIL

Are these things not put in some sort of computer model when they are designed? Do they not have to be signed off for planning permission? Do they not have to be signed off by a qualified surveyor or something when the work is finished?

The mind boggles...

josh59

I went to work on my motorbike the past 3 mornings - the road around the works is £$%^&*() lethal for two wheels due to the amount of gravel and other stuff lying on the road.

And this evening coming home they had a cement mixer semi blocking the road with some eejit in a hi viz directing traffic around it with vague hand signals.

Sad Professor

The works seem to be proving confusing to motorists as well, so you need to be extra careful. I’ve seen cars stopping as if they don’t know where to go. And someone I know saw a woman driving the wrong way around the second roundabout (near the leisure centre) one of the mornings. Had another car been coming they would have collided head on.

stoneill

I enquired with SDCC about their timing of these works, this was their reply:

The timing of the works is purely a funtcion of the funding stream availability. The Scheme must be completed within the year and funding is only available following a detailed analysis and design. In this particular case, funding became available in the Autumn after the schools had started, unfortunately. The works will be completed in approximately six weeks from now.

Pherekydes

stoneill wrote: »

I enquired with SDCC about their timing of these works, this was their reply:

The timing of the works is purely a funtcion of the funding stream availability. The Scheme must be completed within the year and funding is only available following a detailed analysis and design. In this particular case, funding became available in the Autumn after the schools had started, unfortunately. The works will be completed in approximately six weeks from now.

They did a detailed analysis and design? The mind boggles. Who did it? The 1st class at the local gaelscoil?

I went through it this morning, and the entry is quite narrow. It should be fun to see large delivery lorries, buses and bin lorries negotiating it.

In the early rush hour, you could still get around it, even if the traffic was backed up from the Penny Hill jn, because there were 2 lanes around it. Now, I can see cars dropping off kids at the two schools being stuck in Esker Meadows for a while.

josh59

This mess continues - my wife scraped the side of her car on a jutting out sign the other day. Looking at how narrow the finished job is going to be I fail to see how some larger cars etc are going to fit through

Heroditas

josh59 wrote: »

This mess continues - my wife scraped the side of her car on a jutting out sign the other day. Looking at how narrow the finished job is going to be I fail to see how some larger cars etc are going to fit through

I wouldn't be in the least bit surprised if they're trying to force traffic to take the more circuitous route along Elmbrook Avenue, Esker Lane, the Glebe, Esker Manor and then up Griffeen Road out into the ORR at Balgaddy.
Can the 239 even navigate that roundabout at Castle Road now? I don't see how it can do it safely.

average_runner

josh59 wrote: »

This mess continues - my wife scraped the side of her car on a jutting out sign the other day. Looking at how narrow the finished job is going to be I fail to see how some larger cars etc are going to fit through

I thought it was very narrow too, but the buses and bin trucks find it no problem.

average_runner

Heroditas wrote: »

I wouldn't be in the least bit surprised if they're trying to force traffic to take the more circuitous route along Elmbrook Avenue, Esker Lane, the Glebe, Esker Manor and then up Griffeen Road out into the ORR at Balgaddy.
Can the 239 even navigate that roundabout at Castle Road now? I don't see how it can do it safely.

Yeah the buses and bin trucks seem to be grand on it from I what i seen. I dont like the whole structure and hope they aren't going to change the one by Di bella also.

Apparently the reasoning for the change was to slow down the speed of traffic because of the schools

Miss Lockhart

Every bus I'm on goes up on the kerb to get around. Saw a coach practically stuck making several attempts to get around the one on Castle Road to go down to the schools.

I was told by a contact in the planning office that it was to improve safety for cyclists following some incidents.

Thoroughly fed up with it all now.

unkel

Bin trucks have an incredibly tight turning circle (have a look at what they can do in estates ). I'm not surprised they have no problems with the new setup. That said, I'd be surprised if a standard Dublin bus can make it without touching the kerbs (I haven't observed any myself)

Heroditas

average_runner wrote: »

Yeah the buses and bin trucks seem to be grand on it from I what i seen. I dont like the whole structure and hope they aren't going to change the one by Di bella also.

Apparently the reasoning for the change was to slow down the speed of traffic because of the schools

The ironic thing was that it's probably safest during the school opening and closing hours because of the sheer volumes of traffic causing all the cars to crawl along.

Capt'n Midnight

Sad Professor wrote: »

Cars used to go around there way too fast, so something needed to be done.

They need to hurry it up though. I cycle and can’t cross over to the other bike lane because the the path is blocked, forcing me to go out and stay on the road which is risky during school run.

TBH accidents happen at junctions

you are probably safer staying on the road where you are a first class road user and have right of way over traffic on minor roads than being on the minor road / path and having to yield to that traffic.


Would it not have been simpler to put up a speed camera there for a few weeks to hammer home the message to the minority that take the píss and punish then with points than put up a permanent solution. Better still if the camera could also do people for not indicating :mad:

Other options would have been to obstruct the view at the junction to force drivers to slow down that way.

Sad Professor

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

TBH accidents happen at junctions

you are probably safer staying on the road where you are a first class road user and have right of way over traffic on minor roads than being on the minor road / path and having to yield to that traffic.

I didn't realise until recently that the mandatory bike lane law had been repealed. So since that post I've been using the road. Much safer, not to mention faster. Except at school run time when you'd need wings to safely navigate the traffic around there.

average_runner

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

TBH accidents happen at junctions

you are probably safer staying on the road where you are a first class road user and have right of way over traffic on minor roads than being on the minor road / path and having to yield to that traffic.


Would it not have been simpler to put up a speed camera there for a few weeks to hammer home the message to the minority that take the píss and punish then with points than put up a permanent solution. Better still if the camera could also do people for not indicating :mad:

Other options would have been to obstruct the view at the junction to force drivers to slow down that way.

They put speed ramps up on Griffeen rd up from Di Bella.
So what do people do, go on the wrong side of the road to avoid them:rolleyes:

unkel

average_runner wrote: »

They put speed ramps up on Griffeen rd up from Di Bella.
So what do people do, go on the wrong side of the road to avoid them:rolleyes:

And the rest. I encourage anyone to go have a look for themselves. It is unbelievable.

Zebra crossing, road made narrower, big flashing warning lights, road markings and speed ramps

And still many people do not stop / completely fail to realise people are crossing the zebra (and have right of way)

If I weren't more careful, I would have been killed about 10 times already on that zebra crossing

Sad Professor

They left the road in a terrible state on Friday.

I thought this was supposed to take 9 weeks?

Heroditas

Sad Professor wrote: »

They left the road in a terrible state on Friday.

I thought this was supposed to take 9 weeks?

9 weeks of work spread out over 6 months. :P

unkel

The state of the roundabouts is brutal.

Miss Lockhart

Middle of rush hour 8.15 this morning was apparently the perfect time to drive one of those roller/compactor machines at snail's pace around the roundabout on Castle Road. Took over 10 mins just to get around. The mind boggles.

josh59

Apparently they are due to finish this by 9th November - but as they dont work on Saturdays they'll probably drag another week out of it.

stoneill

I heard that the works started without correct permissions and have been suspended.

josh59

stoneill wrote: »

I heard that the works started without correct permissions and have been suspended.

Wouldn't surprise me it's total chaos and will be as well when they are finished - have you seem how close the zebra crossings are relative to the roundabouts - I predict massive tailbacks in the area at rush hour.

tomred1

josh59 wrote: »

Wouldn't surprise me it's total chaos and will be as well when they are finished - have you seem how close the zebra crossings are relative to the roundabouts - I predict massive tailbacks in the area at rush hour.

Yes ,with the crossings so near the roundabout, cars will have to stop, which will leave them blocking the roundabout. I can't see the logic in the works at all.

josh59

Lorry blocking 1/2 the road this morning - pretty dodgy trying to get out of Castle Riada Ave when you cant see what's coming down the road.

hmmm

I noticed this on fixyourstreet

Thank you for your correspondence and we note your concerns. The changes you referred to to the roundabouts are being carried out to improve conditions for vulnerable road users, and as part of an overall new shared cycle lane to be constructed along the existing footpath between Griffeen and Liffey Valley. It is necessary to improve the roundabouts for cyclists and pedestrians in particular, by slowing down traffic and introducing new crossing points closer to the desire line.

When completed the roundabouts will not have any appreciable effect on traffic using them, other than slowing down approaching and exiting traffic. The roundabouts are designed for buses and bin trucks.

The main problem with traffic in the area stems from the capacity issues at the junction of Willsbrook Road and the Outer Ring Road. This junction will be examined as part of a larger Scheme to provide a cycle track between Griffeen Roundabout and Liffey Valley along the Willsbrook Road.

Pherekydes

I see they've placed concrete pavements across the bus lane on the Newcastle Rd., outside Westbury. There was an issue with traffic using the bus lane to queue-skip, causing a hazard at the entrance to Westbury (indicating left, as if to go in to Westbury, instead going straight on), but to close off the bus lane completely is an idiotic piece of road engineering vandalism.

They seem determined to turn Lucan into one big gridlocked car park.

Sad Professor

Shared cycle paths don't work. Even when they are segregated, as along the Fonthill road, pedestrians walk, jog, push buggies in them and refuse to move. Even if the thinking is that they are used mostly by young kids and their parents, it's a bad idea.

The one running down in front of the houses on Griffeen Way is like a gauntlet. Cars coming out of drives on one side, cars parked on the other side, and pedestrians walking in-between. You'd have to have a death wish to cycle on it.

Heroditas

Again, I'd love to know how they intend to fit the LUAS through both those roundabouts if it ever gets the go-ahead.

Due to the wheel base of buses and bin lorries, I really feel there is a risk to pedestrians when the vehicles are negotiating the roundabouts. The lanes are so narrow that despite the wheels being able to navigate the junctions, the rest of the vehicle can overhang the footpath and hit a pedestrian.

"Not have any appreciable effect" - I want some of those drugs.

average_runner

Sad Professor wrote: »

Shared cycle paths don't work. Even when they are segregated, as along the Fonthill road, pedestrians walk, jog, push buggies in them and refuse to move. Even if the thinking is that they are used mostly by young kids and their parents, it's a bad idea.

The one running down in front of the houses on Griffeen Way is like a gauntlet. Cars coming out of drives on one side, cars parked on the other side, and pedestrians walking in-between. You'd have to have a death wish to cycle on it.

You have a death wish to walk on the footpath on griffeen. Twice I got taken out of it by a bike.

average_runner

Heroditas wrote: »

Again, I'd love to know how they intend to fit the LUAS through both those roundabouts if it ever gets the go-ahead.

Due to the wheel base of buses and bin lorries, I really feel there is a risk to pedestrians when the vehicles are negotiating the roundabouts. The lanes are so narrow that despite the wheels being able to navigate the junctions, the rest of the vehicle can overhang the footpath and hit a pedestrian.

"Not have any appreciable effect" - I want some of those drugs.

Luas. Ha ha. No chance.
Actually dont want it as be slower than the bus like it is in tallaght

Snake Plisken

Pherekydes wrote: »

I see they've placed concrete pavements across the bus lane on the Newcastle Rd., outside Westbury. There was an issue with traffic using the bus lane to queue-skip, causing a hazard at the entrance to Westbury (indicating left, as if to go in to Westbury, instead going straight on), but to close off the bus lane completely is an idiotic piece of road engineering vandalism.

They seem determined to turn Lucan into one big gridlocked car park.

Yes we will see the full idiotic plan in place in the morning as I see they have finished construction, Lot of people use the buslane to get into superquinn car park to drop kids off for the schools, this will now lead to major gridlock on this road in the mornings! What a bunch of Morons in SDCC!

average_runner

Snake Plisken wrote: »

Yes we will see the full idiotic plan in place in the morning as I see they have finished construction, Lot of people use the buslane to get into superquinn car park to drop kids off for the schools, this will now lead to major gridlock on this road in the mornings! What a bunch of Morons in SDCC!

It wasn't the ideal solution for sure. I would of prefer if they had did it closer to the roundabout at Superquinn. As the number of people that use that bus lane and then cut on the inside of cars turning left at the roundabout into superquinn is crazy and dangerous. This part needs to be address, either put a camera to catch them or stop it from happening

unkel

Pherekydes wrote: »

I see they've placed concrete pavements across the bus lane on the Newcastle Rd., outside Westbury. There was an issue with traffic using the bus lane to queue-skip, causing a hazard at the entrance to Westbury (indicating left, as if to go in to Westbury, instead going straight on), but to close off the bus lane completely is an idiotic piece of road engineering vandalism.

Wasn't really sure what you meant until I saw it myself a few days ago. They've just blocked up the bus lane. Madness :mad:

So buses now have to merge from the bus lane into the driving lane?

And the numerous people (myself included) taking the bus lane to take left turn into the estate or into Superquinn (so making life for everybody else easier too) can't do it any more?

If there was a problem with cars using the bus lane just to gain time and later sneaking back into the driving lane (I'm not convinced there was such a problem), would a quick phone call from the Big Man in the council to the local Garda Super (to ask for a few hours of policing the spot) not have sufficed?

Does someone have the name / phone number / email of who was responsible for this decision? We should en masse demand an explanation.

Pherekydes

unkel wrote: »

Wasn't really sure what you meant until I saw it myself a few days ago. They've just blocked up the bus lane. Madness :mad:

So buses now have to merge from the bus lane into the driving lane?

And the numerous people (myself included) taking the bus lane to take left turn into the estate or into Superquinn (so making life for everybody else easier too) can't do it any more?

If there was a problem with cars using the bus lane just to gain time and later sneaking back into the driving lane (I'm not convinced there was such a problem), would a quick phone call from the Big Man in the council to the local Garda Super (to ask for a few hours of policing the spot) not have sufficed?

Does someone have the name / phone number / email of who was responsible for this decision? We should en masse demand an explanation.

There was an issue with cars using the lane to bypass standing traffic and turn into SQ. Many indicated left as if to go into the estate but carried on straight past, creating a hazard. The Gardaí policed the corner a few times, but it had little effect. The bus lane is pretty much unusable now. A better idea would have been to open the bus lane to all traffic. The bus lane is fairly pointless along there.