BSA r10 MKII - Info

Smudge08

Hi lads, just wondering has anyone on here got any info on the Bsa r10 markii? Would it be a good choice in terms of accuracy and reliability?

Also Is it much of an ordeal to get your hands on one? Would I have to go to my local rfd and source it through him? I'm a complete newbie and just wondering what the whole process involves?

Thanks in advance.

1shot16

Smudge08 wrote: »

Hi lads, just wondering has anyone on here got any info on the Bsa r10 markii? Would it be a good choice in terms of accuracy and reliability?

Also Is it much of an ordeal to get your hands on one? Would I have to go to my local rfd and source it through him? I'm a complete newbie and just wondering what the whole process involves?

Thanks in advance.

Same licence as rifle
Safe is needed

The mark 1 isnt as reliably have heard people having problems with it so dont go with a mark1

There is a limited edition mark 2 have a look at it very nice!

Info and details are here :

http://clarkesgunshop.co.uk/new-gun-range/air-rifles-pre-charged/bsa-r10-mk2

Smudge08

Thanks for the reply. I've seen this limited edition before, it's very nice.

So if I wanted to purchase this air rifle from the uk would I have to go to a local dealer here and get him to order it for me? I get the serial no. pay my deposit and apply for the license and wait? Does anyone know any dealers that would this on a regular basis here in Ireland?

extremetaz

Smudge08 wrote: »

Thanks for the reply. I've seen this limited edition before, it's very nice.

So if I wanted to purchase this air rifle from the uk would I have to go to a local dealer here and get him to order it for me? I get the serial no. pay my deposit and apply for the license and wait? Does anyone know any dealers that would this on a regular basis here in Ireland?

Don't know anyone dealing in the BSA's but Lakeland Guns outside Mullingar deal in Daystate and Weihrauch - both of which I'd rate as better quality rifles.

Smudge08

Thanks for that, I have looked at them both aswell on lakelands website, it's hard to know which would suit best. What pcp rifle would you recommend? .177 or .22? I'd be using it mainly for target shooting but maybe the odd bit of vermin aswell.

Also what sort of distances could I hope to be hitting accurately with these air rifles?

Thanks.

extremetaz

Go for a .22 cal - better wind resistance, no overpenetration, and if you go for something in the 20-25J muzzle energy bracket then there's no unsurmountable difference in trajectory.

Assuming top shelf ammo (JSB, Crossman, Daystate, H&N, RWS, Diana)
Effective range for paper shooting will be anything out to 100 meters on 2" target assuming no wind.

Effective range on live quarry will be significantly less - expect 45meters max for gauranteed results if you know your ballistics inside out, 30m max if you just want to point and shoot.

I shoot Weihrauch HW100's myself and wouldn't be particularly inclined to use anything else, there are others on here with the Daystates and I think there's someone with an Air Arms as well. Not sure of any BSA's but I do know they're about - Ian out in Aim & Swing in Mountnugent MAY have a few of them although I hear his air stock is depleted these days.

1shot16

extremetaz wrote: »

Assuming top shelf ammo (JSB, Crossman, Daystate, H&N, RWS, Diana)

Put diana in my hw97k pure dirty JSBS are the best 1c groups u cant go wrong.Dealers dont stock them here so make sure to apply for 1000-2000 rounds because you can only import whats on ur licence!Explain why you need that much aswell and pellets only come in tin of 500.

Griffen and Hawe Athy might have a BSA R10 have a few gas air rifles last time i was in there!

Smudge08

Brilliant, thanks for such a detailed reply. I'm a newbie so all info is much appreciated. I have just watched a few reviews of the Weihrauch HW 100s, looks like a quality piece of kit. Were you able to get it here in Ireland? Ill give
Aim and Swing a call so and see what their current stock is like.

I was originally thinking of going down the line of getting a cz 22 or similar but I think an air rifle is more suited to what I need for the moment anyway.

Thanks again.

Smudge08

Thanks for the info about the amount of ammo i should apply for. I'm not too far from athy so Ill give him a call an see what his stock is like also.

extremetaz

Smudge08 wrote: »

...the Weihrauch HW 100s, looks like a quality piece of kit. Were you able to get it here in Ireland? Ill give
Aim and Swing a call so and see what their current stock is like.

Lakeland will be a better bet for the Weihrauchs - they have a good stock on hand, so yes, they can be gotten in Ireland.

Smudge08

Great thanks, ill give lakelands a shout tomorrow so. Just a quick question about the application form, I just printed one off there to have a read and not sure what to fill where it says "Reason why this type of firearm is required"

Would you recommend joining a club for target shooting? The membership fees seem fairly expensive.

If I just wanted to shoot vermin should I just tick the "other" box on the form and get permission from local farmers to shoot on their land?

I thought I read somewhere before that its not permitted to shoot small birds etc with an air rifle in Ireland? I could be mistaken though.

1shot16

Smudge08 wrote: »

Would you recommend joining a club for target shooting? The membership fees seem fairly expensive.

If I just wanted to shoot vermin should I just tick the "other" box on the form and get permission from local farmers to shoot on their land?

I thought I read somewhere before that its not permitted to shoot small birds etc with an air rifle in Ireland? I could be mistaken though.

No need just 2 landowners will do,

As for vermin i was told to put down rabbits and rats to be on the safe side of things!

A gas air rifle would have more than enough power to take down magpies crows and pigeons!My hw97k drops them stone dead with a shot to the head or heart and lungs!I believe you can under derogation and during season could be wrong!

Smudge08

That's great, thanks for all the info lads much appreciated.

extremetaz

Smudge08 wrote: »

... "Reason why this type of firearm is required"

Would you recommend joining a club for target shooting? The membership fees seem fairly expensive.

If I just wanted to shoot vermin should I just tick the "other" box on the form and get permission from local farmers to shoot on their land?

If you declare target shooting as your reason for requiring the rifle then you will have to be a member of a range which is certified for the rifle type (in the case of air, any rifle range will be fine).

If you declare pest control as the reason for requirement, then you will have to furnish evidence of lands upon which the rifle is to be used - ie: permissions. For air, you only require a couple of acres and rabbits & rats would be the standard quarry.

Smudge08 wrote: »

I thought I read somewhere before that its not permitted to shoot small birds etc with an air rifle in Ireland? I could be mistaken though.

The broadstroke of the law is that you may not shoot ANY bird with ANYTHING unless under derogation.

This means that unless the bird has been specifically identified as either "Game" or "Pest", you may not shoot it at all!

As I understand it, pests include common corvids (magpies, "true" crows [rooks, jackdaws, greys/hoods, raven]) and pigeons, but only where they are actually causing a problem - ie: over crops, near feedstores, causing injury to livestock.

Where the law you mentioned above comes into play is with regard to "Game" birds - pheasent, duck, etc... these may not be shot with anything but a shotgun (and an unsuppressed one at that), and only during specified months of the year.

If a bird is not explicitly classified as either Game or Pest, then it MAY NOT BE SHOT at all (excepting special licence - which is highly unlikely)!

1shot16 wrote: »

A gas air rifle would have more than enough power to take down magpies crows and pigeons!My hw97k drops them stone dead with a shot to the head or heart and lungs!I believe you can under derogation and during season could be wrong!

Where air rifle is concerned, it's pest only so it's derogation only, there's no "season" for pests - and as mentioned "Game" is off limits.

Any air rifle with better than 15J muzzle energy will drop any of the above with a headshot from as far away as you can reliably hit a 50c coin. For the boiler room shots mentioned, you'd want to be north of 20J to be sure of it (the '97 is likely around the 25J mark). The wings and the breastplate (side on and facing shots) are tough to get through and the potential to leave the bird wounded but mobile is pretty high unless the projectile has plenty of energy to push on through and finish the job.

Finally, and on a personal note regarding birds, contrary to common perception, many birds are actually fiercely intelligent creatures - and this is particularly true of Corvidea - and although they are classed as pests, they're in a completely different league to the likes of Rabbits and Pigeons, they are contemplative creatures with problem solving intelligent. Though many will, I personally don't shoot them indiscriminately - they deserve more respect than that despite their aesthetic. That said, they don't have any natural predators in Ireland, so population control is necessary, but a shotgun and a hide are far more appropriate tools for the job than an air rifle.

Smudge08

Thanks very much taz, you cleared up alot of issues I was having there with that reply.

Just with regards to your weihrauch, roughly how many shots do you get before you need to top up on air? I've read on forums in the uk people referring to it as an ugly air rifle, but I think the Hw100s is great looking rifle!

extremetaz

Smudge08 wrote: »

Just with regards to your weihrauch, roughly how many shots do you get before you need to top up on air? I've read on forums in the uk people referring to it as an ugly air rifle, but I think the Hw100s is great looking rifle!

Depends on the power output, for the .22 FAC (30J - the long barrelled one) it's about 28 shots, which is two full magazines. Detune it a little (down to ~22-25J) and you can get that up to 3 mags pretty easy as well as giving yourself a few extra fringe benefits in the ammo options department.

For the K variant (shorter barrel), the muzzle energy is ~16J and you'll get 3-4 mags out of that one despite the smaller tank.

The latter is reputedly more accurate but I've not shot the .22 FAC so I can't confirm or deny that - it's certainly true though that you don't want your pellets going much faster than about 900ft/s as they become unstable and accuracy is lost, so ammo choice would be paramount in the former.

Smudge08

Which would be a better option,the long or shorter barrel? Do you find it gets a bit annoying having to refill after just 28 shots or is this something that can be done pretty quick? I rang lakelands this evening and he said he has both weihrauch and daystate rifles in stock so I'm going to try call out to him in the next few days for a look.

extremetaz

It's personal preference really.

I have the .177 FAC, which is the long model, and I love it despite its weight - the only advantage of which is the extra stability it provides when you're settling on target.

The auld boy though, has the .22 KT, which is the shortest version of the '100, and it is a vastly nicer gun to walk with as it's also far lighter and far better balanced so it neither tires you as much nor requires any extra manouvering in cover. Consequently it's also significantly quicker to get on target in any position, although it's not quite as steady when you're on.

There's no noticable difference in accuracy either - if you know your ballistics and you choose the right ammo, then they each group as well as the other, and the .22 is a vastly more effective round on bunnies.

Filling every two mags is only an issue when you're shooting paper - if you're in the field it'd be a rare day that you'd use more than half of one mag, let along two (unless you've a serious rat problem or something). On that note though, my .177 is detuned a little so I get 4 mags from it, and the karbine give that as well as standard - and 4 mags is plenty for anything.

It's worth investing in a 7L 300bar dive tank all the same. Means that if you're doing a long day on paper and putting a few hundred rounds downrange, then refilling is a 10 second job - dive tank setup doesn't cost much more than a hill pump to begin with either. We have both, but the pump is very rarely used.

Smudge08

That's great so thanks again for another detailed reply. I called into Lakelands today and had a good look around,lovely place. I held the Weihrauch HW100s,was very impressed with how it felt,really solid and could just feel that it was very good quality. I wasn't expecting it to be as heavy but that actually made me like it even more,just felt right. He had a webley there as well but it just didn't have the same feel as the weihrauch! He is getting some Daystate stock in soon so I might wait until then before I make up my mind for sure! Is there any scopes in particular that you would recommend? Also where do you fill the 7L tank when it's empty?

recipio

The BSA R-10 has a great barrel but reliability seems to be a problem. Ask about servicing any PCP before you buy - they nearly all need a service at some stage and if you have to send it back to the UK its a pain as they won't return it to you without an export licence.
If you want plenty of 30ft/lb shots you really need to go for a 400cc bottle ( which you can get for the R-10 ) or a Daystate.
You can fill a diving tank at a scuba diving shop but they need have the right hose connections and won't fill carbon fibre tanks.

1shot16

recipio wrote: »

The BSA R-10 has a great barrel but reliability seems to be a problem. Ask about servicing any PCP before you buy - they nearly all need a service at some stage and if you have to send it back to the UK its a pain as they won't return it to you without an export licence.
If you want plenty of 30ft/lb shots you really need to go for a 400cc bottle ( which you can get for the R-10 ) or a Daystate.
You can fill a diving tank at a scuba diving shop but they need have the right hose connections and won't fill carbon fibre tanks.

I was also told a bottle would be 100 euro then a top up could be 70 euro by a welder thats y i went spring tbh

recipio

1shot16 wrote: »

I was also told a bottle would be 100 euro then a top up could be 70 euro by a welder thats y i went spring tbh

Eh........you realize we are talking about a scuba tank ? If you can get one for 100 euro, fine but it needs to be in date - they also need safety checks every 5 years or so and its stamped on the bottle.
Your welder would need a pump get to 200 bar - about 3000 pounds/sq/inch - and costs about £5 in the UK. I've only seen them in scuba shops but let me know if I'm wrong.!

1shot16

recipio wrote: »

Eh........you realize we are talking about a scuba tank ? If you can get one for 100 euro, fine but it needs to be in date - they also need safety checks every 5 years or so and its stamped on the bottle.
Your welder would need a pump get to 200 bar - about 3000 pounds/sq/inch - and costs about £5 in the UK. I've only seen them in scuba shops but let me know if I'm wrong.!

Hes on about welder bottles for weldin he gets them filled ...sed ya just need a regulator on em which is cheap and it should run fine

recipio

1shot16 wrote: »

Hes on about welder bottles for weldin he gets them filled ...sed ya just need a regulator on em which is cheap and it should run fine

The world is full of bad advice. He is telling you he will fit a scuba dive regulator to a welder bottle and fill it with compressed air ? No wonder he is asking 70 euro ! - most shooters use a 7 litre bottle filled to 300 BAR.
Please don't mess with compressed air - it can kill you.
Try and get a copy of the August edition of ' Airgun Shooter ' - it has a good article on scuba tanks for airguns.

Smudge08

Thanks for the info, I never even thought about needing to get them serviced! Bit of a pain having to send it back to the uk anytime there is an issue with the rifle. It's the only thing that's really making me think twice about going for a pcp over a 22lr. I would hate if after a few months I was regretting purchasing a pcp because it was spending more time in the uk instead of out in the fields or down the range.

recipio

Smudge08 wrote: »

Thanks for the info, I never even thought about needing to get them serviced! Bit of a pain having to send it back to the uk anytime there is an issue with the rifle. It's the only thing that's really making me think twice about going for a pcp over a 22lr. I would hate if after a few months I was regretting purchasing a pcp because it was spending more time in the uk instead of out in the fields or down the range.

I owned a few PCPs when I lived in the UK . The best advice I can give you is to buy new and never mess with them.They should be good for 5-10 years without a hitch. However, your dealer will almost certainly have to return them to the UK if they spring a leak.
They are great guns around a farm and you can take shots into trees unlike a 22lr. I would rate the HW100 and the Air Arms 410 as the best overall guns in cylinder format, and the Daystate range in 'Buddy bottle ( 400/500 cc ) format.
The best of both worlds is something like a Daystate Airwolf which has an electronic trigger giving a huge shot count - but costs £1300+ !

murph226

I have a new .22 HW100KT waiting for me in an RFD, I might let it go if anyone is genuinely interested in it.

I am waiting for the license, should have it in a week or two.

Its coming with new mounts and I have a new Hawke 4-16X50 Sidewinder at home to go on it aswell as a Harris bipod, the bipod was used on another rifle but is mint.

I am not pushed on selling it, just doing a lot more cycling lately and it probably won't get much use, having said that when it comes I do plan on trying it out and may hold onto it too, I certainly won't be entertaining any lowball offers.

recipio

murph226 wrote: »

I have a new .22 HW100KT waiting for me in an RFD, I might let it go if anyone is genuinely interested in it.

I am waiting for the license, should have it in a week or two.

Its coming with new mounts and I have a new Hawke 4-16X50 Sidewinder at home to go on it aswell as a Harris bipod, the bipod was used on another rifle but is mint.

I am not pushed on selling it, just doing a lot more cycling lately and it probably won't get much use, having said that when it comes I do plan on trying it out and may hold onto it too, I certainly won't be entertaining any lowball offers.

Is it standard 12 ft/lb or higher ?

murph226

Its the FAC version which is 35 joule afaik, which is around 25 ft lbs.

Wouldn't all air rifles sold here be full power seeing as you need a firearms license for them?

recipio

murph226 wrote: »

Its the FAC version which is 35 joule afaik, which is around 25 ft lbs.

Wouldn't all air rifles sold here be full power seeing as you need a firearms license for them?

Thanks.
the RFD will need to specify that on ordering - power levels vary all over Europe.We of course are the most restrictive in terms of having to get a licence for each one, but that's another storey.

Smudge08

Hope you don't mind me asking murph but where did you purchase the hw100kt? I'm struggling to find rfd's that have a good selection of pcp rifles that I could call in and have a look at. I was in lakelands on Friday and he has weihrauchs, webleys and daystate. Just wondering if you know of any other places I could call to?

1shot16

U try griffen and hawe?

Smudge08

I tried ringing Griffen Hawe on Friday evening to see what sort of stock he had but I didn't get an answer, would it be worth calling over there? I'll try ring again tomorrow

1shot16

Id say so i seen a few gas ones the last time!He has hundreds on guns!

KE_MAN

Smudge08 wrote: »

I tried ringing Griffen Hawe on Friday evening to see what sort of stock he had but I didn't get an answer, would it be worth calling over there? I'll try ring again tomorrow

Would recommend (from experience) you shop around dealers before you make a purchase. I was looking at BSA R10 MKii earlier this year put went for Air Arms 410s instead. For BSA there was a difference €365 among dealer prices ! Try the following also:

http://www.normanharpur.com/

http://tannyokyguns.com/index.html

Smudge08

Thanks for the advice. How do you find your air arms 410s? I was looking at them also. Do you find that there's much to do in terms of maintenance? Would a pcp like this be easier to licence over a 22lr or is it all the same?

extremetaz

murph226 wrote: »

Wouldn't all air rifles sold here be full power seeing as you need a firearms license for them?

Nope - in fact a lot of them are shipped over set to 12ft.lb regardless of box spec because it makes the paperwork easier - so it's very important to verify that the rifle is delivering the stated power.

1shot16 wrote: »

top up could be 70 euro by a welder thats y i went spring tbh

Load of crap - 300bar fill at Lambay diving will cost you a fiver!

Smudge08 wrote: »

Is there any scopes in particular that you would recommend?

I use hawke, but for the ranges in question anything will work. Adjustable parallax (either front or side focus, and preferably the latter) is advantageous for target work, but absolutely necessary for fieldwork.

I use the Vartmint SF at the moment and am delighted with it. Great all-rounder.

KE_MAN

Smudge08 wrote: »

Thanks for the advice. How do you find your air arms 410s? I was looking at them also. Do you find that there's much to do in terms of maintenance? Would a pcp like this be easier to licence over a 22lr or is it all the same?

I like the handling of the Air Arms stock. Was going to go for Weihrauch H100 T until i got to handle it in the flesh. Another entry level budget PCP is the Webley Raider 10. Good quality gun at a good price and has recently been reviewed by Terry Doe in Air Gunner magazine.

Have not got my gun long enough to comment on maintenance. Maybe some of the more experienced Air Gunners here can chip in their own experience.

I would recommend you consided a good quality PCP like the Air Arms S410 or Weihrauch H100. Licencing is all the same. Your first application will take a bit longer to process.

Smudge08

Just in relation to getting a scuba bottle, is it ok to just pick one up off a site like divegear.ie or do I need any special valves etc. does it have to be certified or just in good working order? Also what ltr tank would be the most popular among pcp rifles users? Thanks in advance

extremetaz

Smudge08 wrote: »

Just in relation to getting a scuba bottle, is it ok to just pick one up off a site like divegear.ie or do I need any special valves etc. does it have to be certified or just in good working order? Also what ltr tank would be the most popular among pcp rifles users? Thanks in advance

7L 300bar give you the best bang per buck as regards number of rifle fills available from a single fill of the tank vs. the cost of the tank.

Will require a test every 5 years which costs €30 and takes an hour or so - *personally* I wouldn't be terribly worried about buying one second hand out of cert. There's f*ck all goes wrong with them unless they're visibly damaged and getting them recertified is easy out, just drop it in to Lambay diving and they'll sort it all out for you.

All 300bar tanks have the same fitting on them and it's the right fitting for mouting the regulator that comes with the HW's