Thought for Food

Going forward...

Well, feed. Specifically dairy feed. What are you guys feeding, planning to feed this autumn in light of meal/milk price. Where's the value etc?

Milked out

I'll continue feeding meal in to the autumn as I have no quota issues, currently feeding about 3 kg but the aftergrass is just after coming on stream and I will be drying off autumn calving cows this week so I will reassess then at the end of the week. I find my cows will respond well to meal but the price is slow to drop yet. this seems to have a bit of handy info on it http://www.teagasc.ie/newsletters/farmingtips/2009/dairy-20090825.asp

mahoney_j

Milked out wrote: »

I'll continue feeding meal in to the autumn as I have no quota issues, currently feeding about 3 kg but the aftergrass is just after coming on stream and I will be drying off autumn calving cows this week so I will reassess then at the end of the week. I find my cows will respond well to meal but the price is slow to drop yet. this seems to have a bit of handy info on it http://www.teagasc.ie/newsletters/farmingtips/2009/dairy-20090825.asp

Feeding Hi maize 16% nut now and will continue with it till drying off.feedibg 3.5 kg daily and higher yielders getting 4.5 kg.cows milking extremely well at 25.64 Ltrs 3.57 protein and 4.03 fat.will be between 5 and 8 % over quota come next march I reckon.will stick st current nos till mid sept and then cull some high cell counters and empty s after scan.nut costing roughly 310 at moment but big price drop conning in sept or do in told.quota holding me back from milking more cows ,pity as I've a cover per cow of 340 at moment and growth is flying.neasured over 70 for last week

TEAT SQUEEZER

the mills are still locked into 2012/early 2013 costs ....no rush here to pre buy ... the harvest price will only mean one thing imo , a drop in prices into lat aut /winter so i think the longer u can wait the better... have heard proteins will remain stubbornly high... anyone got better info?

Timmaay

mahoney_j wrote: »

Feeding Hi maize 16% nut now and will continue with it till drying off

You get that made up for your cows, or is it an off the shelf nut? Feeding most the spring/late lactation ladies 2kg per day, and high yeilders up to 6kg, of a glanbia 14% summer nut, set us back 295 last load. Under quota so will feed on, yeilds flying it at the minute, now that the cows are back on fresh grass, especially the late calvers. Silage stocks are abit short, I'm toying with the idea of buying in say 100t on maize in nov, and storing it in a pit out in the field, beside the yard, and feed alongside the silage in the feeding passage, with the sheargrab. Neighbour grows his own maize every yr, and says it really helps keep condition on the cows, and solids up at the tail end of the year. He is all spring milk, I think I'd have even more to gain, with a good few may/june calvers, alongside the autumn ladies. Maize can supposely be bought for about 55e/ton locally, and I've heard it costs at least 45/ton to grow, so buying in seems to be decent value. I could just forget about that idea and just feed nuts in the parlour, I probably need to work out the price per ufl. Also a big problem we had last jan/feb were too many cows taking a big hit in bcs, parlour fed nuts seemed to only drive on milk production at the expense of bcs, I'd be hoping the maize would have them calving down abit more fleshy.

mahoney_j

Timmaay wrote: »

You get that made up for your cows, or is it an off the shelf nut? Feeding most the spring/late lactation ladies 2kg per day, and high yeilders up to 6kg, of a glanbia 14% summer nut, set us back 295 last load. Under quota so will feed on, yeilds flying it at the minute, now that the cows are back on fresh grass, especially the late calvers. Silage stocks are abit short, I'm toying with the idea of buying in say 100t on maize in nov, and storing it in a pit out in the field, beside the yard, and feed alongside the silage in the feeding passage, with the sheargrab. Neighbour grows his own maize every yr, and says it really helps keep condition on the cows, and solids up at the tail end of the year. He is all spring milk, I think I'd have even more to gain, with a good few may/june calvers, alongside the autumn ladies. Maize can supposely be bought for about 55e/ton locally, and I've heard it costs at least 45/ton to grow, so buying in seems to be decent value. I could just forget about that idea and just feed nuts in the parlour, I probably need to work out the price per ufl. Also a big problem we had last jan/feb were too many cows taking a big hit in bcs, parlour fed nuts seemed to only drive on milk production at the expense of bcs, I'd be hoping the maize would have them calving down abit more fleshy.

No special Tim its a standard mill mix for high yielding cows.contains 35% maize and find it excellent for keeping condition on cows and also keeps butterfat up in may June time.cant beat maize as a feed its pure energy.would love to grow or buy some here but land would be tied up too long and anyone growing it only dose do for themselves..try and get silage as good and dry as possible though and this is definitely a help

Milked out

Timmaay wrote: »

You get that made up for your cows, or is it an off the shelf nut? Feeding most the spring/late lactation ladies 2kg per day, and high yeilders up to 6kg, of a glanbia 14% summer nut, set us back 295 last load. Under quota so will feed on, yeilds flying it at the minute, now that the cows are back on fresh grass, especially the late calvers. Silage stocks are abit short, I'm toying with the idea of buying in say 100t on maize in nov, and storing it in a pit out in the field, beside the yard, and feed alongside the silage in the feeding passage, with the sheargrab. Neighbour grows his own maize every yr, and says it really helps keep condition on the cows, and solids up at the tail end of the year. He is all spring milk, I think I'd have even more to gain, with a good few may/june calvers, alongside the autumn ladies. Maize can supposely be bought for about 55e/ton locally, and I've heard it costs at least 45/ton to grow, so buying in seems to be decent value. I could just forget about that idea and just feed nuts in the parlour, I probably need to work out the price per ufl. Also a big problem we had last jan/feb were too many cows taking a big hit in bcs, parlour fed nuts seemed to only drive on milk production at the expense of bcs, I'd be hoping the maize would have them calving down abit more fleshy.

We feed high proportion of maize silage here and find it great for winter milking cows, keeps on condition very well. However when the amount of maize fed increases part of the cost with it is balancing the diet. I've contracted extra maize this year and may consider baling some of it giving the way the crop is turning out to use as a buffer in the spring/ autumn and keep the pit more manageable

mahoney_j

Milked out wrote: »

We feed high proportion of maize silage here and find it great for winter milking cows, keeps on condition very well. However when the amount of maize fed increases part of the cost with it is balancing the diet. I've contracted extra maize this year and may consider baling some of it giving the way the crop is turning out to use as a buffer in the spring/ autumn and keep the pit more manageable

Maize bales did I hear u say??.if so is it done through conventional baler after harvesting.this is something that would interest me if I could lay my hands on it

Going forward...

No, Orkel baler I think he means. Stationary baler with a hopper fed by a loader. The rest of the operation is the same as always.

Agbag is another option. Don't know about availability. Aren't Samco making them now?

For the guys looking to buy maize silage, Bob keeps telling us how cheap grain maize is, would that be a better option? Even grain treated off the combine now?

Milked out

Going forward... wrote: »

No, Orkel baler I think he means. Stationary baler with a hopper fed by a loader. The rest of the operation is the same as always.

Agbag is another option. Don't know about availability. Aren't Samco making them now?

For the guys looking to buy maize silage, Bob keeps telling us how cheap grain maize is, would that be a better option? Even grain treated off the combine now?

Yeah thats the one I'd say, I haven't spoken to anyone about it yet just assessing the options. I've used the agbag before, but i used it in order to empty the pit and store what was left of the previous years crop. It tended to mulch the maize a bit but that was prob because the maize was coming from a pit and not fresh. i fed it throughout the year and the cows ate it fine but if you aren't feeding out of it everyday the front of it would go off a bit, but then there would be much less waste than if you were taking a small amount from a pit. Also the bag needed one long stretch of firm ground which i don't really have. Was thinking the bales would be a bit more flexible in terms of storage and feeding, obviously must price it first tho.

Going forward...

Bales of maize are something like 1.2 tonnes I think. Makes them ideal for feeding in warm weather. Vermin control is crucial.

Milked out

Going forward... wrote: »

Bales of maize are something like 1.2 tonnes I think. Makes them ideal for feeding in warm weather. Vermin control is crucial.

Yeah the rats love the maize alright, would have to stick to a good routine on control with the bales. They're a fair weight alright, have heard of them being delivered to farmers with smaller machinery and not being able to lift the bale. Would the weight effect how they could be stacked?

Going back on topic anyone using a good ration which can drive milk and maintain condition in spring calving cows on autumn grass, mahoney_j What mill is supplying the nut you're using?? they are milking well on it in fairness to you

mahoney_j

Milked out wrote: »

Yeah the rats love the maize alright, would have to stick to a good routine on control with the bales. They're a fair weight alright, have heard of them being delivered to farmers with smaller machinery and not being able to lift the bale. Would the weight effect how they could be stacked?

Going back on topic anyone using a good ration which can drive milk and maintain condition in spring calving cows on autumn grass, mahoney_j What mill is supplying the nut you're using?? they are milking well on it in fairness to you

Roches feeds in limerick.its called dairy super 16.can be got in an 18 as well but with grass as plentifull and good as it is now there is no need for an 18% nut.i add an acid buff and bio plex mineral pack to it through may June and July .acid buff great to counteract lush grass and low butterfats

Mulumpy

mahoney_j wrote: »

Roches feeds in limerick.its called dairy super 16.can be got in an 18 as well but with grass as plentifull and good as it is now there is no need for an 18% nut.i add an acid buff and bio plex mineral pack to it through may June and July .acid buff great to counteract lush grass and low butterfats

How do Roches fair in price to some of local competitors

delaval

mahoney_j wrote: »

Roches feeds in limerick.its called dairy super 16.can be got in an 18 as well but with grass as plentifull and good as it is now there is no need for an 18% nut.i add an acid buff and bio plex mineral pack to it through may June and July .acid buff great to counteract lush grass and low butterfats

What were your fats in June and July?

mahoney_j

Mulumpy wrote: »

How do Roches fair in price to some of local competitors

For me it depends on how you spec the nut as regards ingredients.maize is always my first i grident of choice followed by wheat or barley then your proteins which is nearly always soya and then you have your fillers like palm kernel .or wheat feed which I never like to see in a nut .quality always excellent and price very competitive .nurritonist always on other end of phone and is most helpfull

mahoney_j

delaval wrote: »

What were your fats in June and July?

Between 3.75 and 3.9.very happy with that as cows were yielding on average around 32 Ltrs plus.currently fats at 4.09 and yields a shade under 25.5

delaval

mahoney_j wrote: »

Between 3.75 and 3.9.very happy with that as cows were yielding on average around 32 Ltrs plus.currently fats at 4.09 and yields a shade under 25.5

Really struggled to keep solids above 7.5% in July with protein as low as 3.4.

They are back to 8% now with good quality and plentiful grass. 1 kg meal 14% and milking 20litres

Milked out

delaval wrote: »

Really struggled to keep solids above 7.5% in July with protein as low as 3.4.

They are back to 8% now with good quality and plentiful grass. 1 kg meal 14% and milking 20litres

I had the same problem in July but had to feed silage and extra meal to get through the poor growth, yields held through that period with the extra feeding but solids suffered alright. They're coming back up again now, running at 4.05bf and 3.6p, now just to keep em going

stanflt

Winter feed for fresh calvers will consist of
1/2 kg straw
7 kg/dm maize
8 kg/dm 78dmd silage 42% dm 16.8% prot

1.5 kg dm brewers grains
1kg beet pulp
1 kg soya
1 kg maize meal

And then feed to yield in parlour with cow getting between 5-9 kg 16% he dairy nut

jersey101

stanflt wrote: »

Winter feed for fresh calvers will consist of
1/2 kg straw
7 kg/dm maize
8 kg/dm 78dmd silage 42% dm 16.8% prot

1.5 kg dm brewers grains
1kg beet pulp
1 kg soya
1 kg maize meal

And then feed to yield in parlour with cow getting between 5-9 kg 16% he dairy nut

Lord that is complicated. I only give silage,2-3kg meal in parlour and brewers grain and straw works perfectly

stanflt

jersey101 wrote: »

Lord that is complicated. I only give silage,2-3kg meal in parlour and brewers grain and straw works perfectly

What kinda yield do you deliver per cow per year on your co-op performance report

jersey101

stanflt wrote: »

What kinda yield do you deliver per cow per year on your co-op performance report

says 16 but its wrong, i never used to put data in when cows were dried off or any thing, i get around 22l a day off that mix, its good for my type of herd

stanflt

jersey101 wrote: »

says 16 but its wrong, i never used to put data in when cows were dried off or any thing, i get around 22l a day off that mix, its good for my type of herd

That doesn't matter that's only a guide- if you look at your section- milk output total cows which is to the left of that it will give you your avg milk delivered per cow

Timmaay

That glanbia figure doesn't tell the full story in terms of if your winter diet is up to scratch, ours is butal low, but thats because we recycle too many cows, and culls use to get fattened up on the outfarm which was fairly cheap rented land. Aim to record all dryoff dates in ICBF, that will tell you exactly whats still milking in the parlour, and then you can improve the estimate in terms of exclude some in very late lactation etc. I'd more go on individual yeilds, if you have two very similar cows, in terms of milk, potential one who calves in spring and say knocks out 30L, and one who calves in autumn but only knocks out 25L and looses conditions like anything, you will know your winter diet needs work!

Jersey, are your autumn calvers all HOs? Biggest thing with a winter diet is that the cows don't get underfed to the point they loose excessive body condition, I'd be far more concerned about that than reduced yields. The diet for the winter ladies is even more basic again here, just parlour nuts and silage.

Timmaay

stanflt wrote: »

That doesn't matter that's only a guide- if you look at your section- milk output total cows which is to the left of that it will give you your avg milk delivered per cow

Yeh thats once your dryoff dates are put into icbf.

stanflt

Timmaay wrote: »

Yeh thats once your dryoff dates are put into icbf.

Dry off dates don't matter- if the cow is alive and on your farm she needs to be producing milk- if she's dry or milking she is still a cow with potential to make serious money

jersey101

stanflt wrote: »

That doesn't matter that's only a guide- if you look at your section- milk output total cows which is to the left of that it will give you your avg milk delivered per cow

oh sorry. Last time i looked it was 5,800l. ill look later ill know better

TEAT SQUEEZER

stanflt wrote: »

Winter feed for fresh calvers will consist of
1/2 kg straw
7 kg/dm maize
8 kg/dm 78dmd silage 42% dm 16.8% prot

1.5 kg dm brewers grains
1kg beet pulp
1 kg soya
1 kg maize meal

And then feed to yield in parlour with cow getting between 5-9 kg 16% he dairy nut

why not up the "meal" in the TMR and feed less in parlour ie: 0-4 kgs

stanflt

TEAT SQUEEZER wrote: »

why not up the "meal" in the TMR and feed less in parlour ie: 0-4 kgs

No point feeding cows that don't need feeding
If she's not doing over 30 litres a day the Tmr will be enough with 1-2 kg in parlour

TEAT SQUEEZER

stanflt wrote: »

No point feeding cows that don't need feeding
If she's not doing over 30 litres a day the Tmr will be enough with 1-2 kg in parlour

totally agree , i thought 5kgs was your base ... do u stick to an overall protein% of 16 in the diet even with such milking ability in ure cows?..

jersey101

Timmaay wrote: »

That glanbia figure doesn't tell the full story in terms of if your winter diet is up to scratch, ours is butal low, but thats because we recycle too many cows, and culls use to get fattened up on the outfarm which was fairly cheap rented land. Aim to record all dryoff dates in ICBF, that will tell you exactly whats still milking in the parlour, and then you can improve the estimate in terms of exclude some in very late lactation etc. I'd more go on individual yeilds, if you have two very similar cows, in terms of milk, potential one who calves in spring and say knocks out 30L, and one who calves in autumn but only knocks out 25L and looses conditions like anything, you will know your winter diet needs work!

Jersey, are your autumn calvers all HOs? Biggest thing with a winter diet is that the cows don't get underfed to the point they loose excessive body condition, I'd be far more concerned about that than reduced yields. The diet for the winter ladies is even more basic again here, just parlour nuts and silage.

a mixture of everything here, jerseys, crosses and HO,S

Timmaay

stanflt wrote: »

Dry off dates don't matter- if the cow is alive and on the farm she needs to be producing milk- if she's dry or milking she is still a cow with potential to make serious money

Ah yeh I know fully where your coming from here, and that is the bottom line, I'm more talking about the cows diet and how much milk she is knocking out, those average figures wont tell you that, I'll admit before I used to look at them average figures and thought my cows were not milky enough!, which was the totally wrong opinion, plenty giving out 7/8000L per 305days, but a combination of a poor CI, and inadequate winter feeding was/is the main cause of the poor average figures, alongside dry cull cows that were being fattened on the off farm, which in fairness are basically out of the system.

stanflt

TEAT SQUEEZER wrote: »

totally agree , i thought 5kgs was your base ... do u stick to an overall protein% of 16 in the diet even with such milking ability in ure cows?..

Yeah I never go over 16%
Try not to let them lose weight even when their pushing out 50 litre a day

Going forward...

Timmaay wrote: »

Ah yeh I know fully where your coming from here, and that is the bottom line, I'm more talking about the cows diet and how much milk she is knocking out, those average figures wont tell you that, I'll admit before I used to look at them average figures and thought my cows were not milky enough!, which was the totally wrong opinion, plenty giving out 7/8000L per 305days, but a combination of a poor CI, and inadequate winter feeding was/is the main cause of the poor average figures, alongside dry cull cows that were being fattened on the off farm, which in fairness are basically out of the system.

Well said. Doesn't give the full story and that figure is of no consequence here in discussing how many litres a diet is giving anyway.

How many litres is your diet going to give, Stanflt? that average co-op figure?

Jersey101 is getting a decent return on that simple, cheap diet imo.

stanflt

Going forward... wrote: »

Well said. Doesn't give the full story and that figure is of no consequence here in discussing how many litres a diet is giving anyway.

How many litres is your diet going to give, Stanflt? that average co-op figure?

Jersey101 is getting a decent return on that simple, cheap diet imo.

The diet with an avg of 5kg in parlour will produce an avg of 45 litres in fresh calvers with a fat % of 4.25 and 3.65peotein

Formulated for pdie and pdin

mahoney_j

jersey101 wrote: »

Lord that is complicated. I only give silage,2-3kg meal in parlour and brewers grain and straw works perfectly

Not really comparing like with like there. Not that complicated a diet but a very good one.love to be able to get brewers grains but very hard to get it.that mix/diet well capable of delivering over 40 Ltrs a day to a well bred Holstein like stans.

mf240

Anybody use straight distillers as part of there ration. Can be competitive some years and seems to feed better than it appears on paper.

Timmaay

Neighbour had the chance to buy some brewers grain afew weeks ago, I think he said it was 140/ton,and just too expensive. And to think 10/15 yrs ago we use to get it for almost nothing ha, when there would be an oversupply of it.

stanflt

Timmaay wrote: »

Neighbour had the chance to buy some brewers grain afew weeks ago, I think he said it was 140/ton,and just too expensive. And to think 10/15 yrs ago we use to get it for almost nothing ha, when there would be an oversupply of it.

At 140 it wasn't brewers
Been pitting this summer for less than 40

jersey101

mahoney_j wrote: »

Not really comparing like with like there. Not that complicated a diet but a very good one.love to be able to get brewers grains but very hard to get it.that mix/diet well capable of delivering over 40 Ltrs a day to a well bred Holstein like stans.

id feed the brewers to the dry ones aswell gets the condition up on them farly well

bob charles

jersey101 wrote: »

Lord that is complicated. I only give silage,2-3kg meal in parlour and brewers grain and straw works perfectly

I all fairness how complicated is it, presume the soya,pulp and maize is premixed so he only has 4 ingredients to load into feeder each day. Doesnt sound too complicated to me to get a balanced diet. Is your starch figure not going to be a bit low?

jersey101

bob charles wrote: »

I all fairness how complicated is it, presume the soya,pulp and maize is premixed so he only has 4 ingredients to load into feeder each day. Doesnt sound too complicated to me to get a balanced diet. Is your starch figure not going to be a bit low?

the diet they get from the feeder would be but we mix pur own meal here and we use alot of barley in it along with beat pulp and soya

Timmaay

stanflt wrote: »

At 140 it wasn't brewers
Been pitting this summer for less than 40

Sorry meant Trafford gold, got mixed up there!

Milked out

On the winter diets did any of ye put in extra/different storage facilities in order to take advantage of any feed prices or to reduce the cost of overall diet?? we generally feed maize, grass silage, a bit of straw, and depending on silage analysis a 24% prot. balancer compound all in the feeder. have no feeders in the parlour at the moment