Upgrade with possible new build in mind

pillphil

So I have a computer a friend gave me, it's made of spare parts from his old computers. I'd like to get a graphics card for it to play some games (Shogun 2, Dayz, fallout).
I'll need a new power source as well.

I'll want to play Rome 2 and I want a Rift, Will I need a new Pc for them?


Intel core 2 quad cpu q6600 @2.4ghz
P5B mobo, don't know which one
graphics card raedon x300/x550/1050
64bit Windows
4 gb ram
The case has a CD drive, so it's old

So, can I buy a GPU and PSU with building a new PC after in mind?

BloodBath

You can yes. What's your budget?

CS Hasuki

Decent throwaway

pillphil

I didn't have a particular budget in mind. What do I need to spend?

BloodBath

The 3 games you listed are sadly pretty cpu limited. All 3 only use 2 cpu cores afaik. If the board supports overclocking then you should overclock that q6600. they are good cpus for overclocking. You should be able to get it to at least 3ghz, maybe 3.2 or higher with a decent cooler and airflow.

What resolution will you be playing at?

Something like this would be a decent card with that cpu.

This psu should do the trick as well.

If you can overclock then you want a decent cpu cooler. This is probably the best budget one.

bladesofglory

BloodBath wrote: »

The 3 games you listed are sadly pretty cpu limited. All 3 only use 2 cpu cores afaik. If the board supports overclocking then you should overclock that q6600. they are good cpus for overclocking. You should be able to get it to at least 3ghz, maybe 3.2 or higher with a decent cooler and airflow.

What resolution will you be playing at?

Something like this would be a decent card with that cpu.

This psu should do the trick as well.

If you can overclock then you want a decent cpu cooler. This is probably the best budget one.

I wouldn't really bother with the overclocking, in real world usage he is unlikely to see any benefit.

BloodBath

Bull****. Getting 40% higher clocks on that q6600 would give him massive gains in cpu limited games like rome 2.

Recurve360

bladesofglory wrote: »

I wouldn't really bother with the overclocking, in real world usage he is unlikely to see any benefit.

Oc'ing from 2.4ghz to 3.1 will actually see a nice difference on an older quad core actually

bladesofglory

BloodBath wrote: »

Bull****. Getting 40% higher clocks on that q6600 would give him massive gains in cpu limited games like rome 2.

2.4ghz - 3Ghz isnt 50% gain, only place your gonna notice something is bench marking.

BloodBath

I said 40%. If the board is half decent he could get 3.3-3.5ghz or so.

You are totally wrong anyway. He could be looking at 30%+ higher frame rates.

bladesofglory

BloodBath wrote: »

I said 40%. If the board is half decent he could get 3.3-3.5ghz or so.

You are totally wrong anyway. He could be looking at 30%+ higher frame rates.

haha, OK if you believe so.

and tell me what do you overclock?

BloodBath

I don't believe so. I know so. I can back it up with about 1000 benchmarks if you want. Hows 1 to start off?

I have been overclocking many parts for many years. At the moment. a 3570k and 7970.

Here's shogun 2 benchmarks. Look at the difference in frame rate between the stock 3570k and the 5ghz 3570k and tell me overclocks won't make a difference. Shogun 2 uses 2 cpu cores like rome 2 will and pretty much the same engine that rome 2 will use.

http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/cpus/2012/05/01/intel-core-i5-3570k-cpu-review/6

More cpu tests.

http://forum.overclock3d.net/showthread.php?t=44507

bladesofglory

BloodBath wrote: »

I don't believe so. I know so. I can back it up with about 1000 benchmarks if you want. Hows 1 to start off?

I have been overclocking many parts for many years. At the moment. a 3570k and 7970.

Here's shogun 2 benchmarks. Look at the difference in frame rate between the stock 3570k and the 5ghz 3570k and tell me overclocks won't make a difference. Shogun 2 uses 2 cpu cores like rome 2 will and pretty much the same engine that rome 2 will use.

http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/cpus/2012/05/01/intel-core-i5-3570k-cpu-review/6

Know my friend overclocking .6 and overclocking in-excess of 1.5ghz is a different kettle of fish altogether.

Come on know, thats not accounting for temps increases along with stability issues if the board isn't up to it.

BloodBath

Sigh. Why am I even discussing this with you.

Take it as a percentage of the cpu power. A 3570k going from 3.4ghz to 5ghz is about a 50% overclock.

Taking a q6600 from 2.4 to 3.6ghz would be around a 50% overclock.

Therefore the overall percentage increase in frame rates would be around the same which was around 30% in that benchmark.

5ghz and 3.6ghz are high clocks for both cpu's really only obtainable with water. Around 4.6 and 3.4 or so are more likely targets on air.

bladesofglory

BloodBath wrote: »

Sigh. Why am I even discussing this with you.

Take it as a percentage of the cpu power. A 3570k going from 3.4ghz to 5ghz is about a 50% overclock.

Taking a q6600 from 2.4 to 3.6ghz would be around a 50% overclock.

Therefore the overall percentage increase in frame rates would be around the same.

Point,,,,,, This chap isn't going from 2.4 to 5ghz, and if he is whats he cooling it with? Hope and dreams. I dont believe you ever had even a chip running @ 5ghz or understand the level of heat generated at the point.

FYI, Your method of Fps doesn't apply to all CpUs or results.

BloodBath

Omg I couldn't spell it out any clearer for you and you still don't get it.

He would get around 25% higher frame rates with an overclock therefore your assumption is wrong. It can be backed up by benchmarks from every big website there is. You don't know what you are talking about.

It's not my method. It's basic common sense.

bladesofglory

BloodBath wrote: »

Omg I couldn't spell it out any clearer for you and you still don't get it.

He would get around 25% higher frame rates with an overclock therefore your assumption is wrong. It can be backed up by benchmarks from every big website there is. You don't know what you are talking about.

It's not my method. It's basic common sense.

I actually do know what Im talking about do you know why??? As my employer currently is the market leader. So yes I believe I do know.

and please read the below!!!

This chap isn't going from 2.4 to 5ghz, and if he is whats he cooling it with? Hope and dreams. I dont believe you ever had even a chip running @ 5ghz or understand the level of heat generated at the point.

BloodBath

Oh look shogun 2 benchmarks with a q6600 at stock and with a small easy to obtain 3ghz overclock.

Want to make yourself look like a bigger fool? Keep talking.

http://hothardware.com/printarticle.aspx?articleid=1986

bladesofglory

BloodBath wrote: »

Oh look shogun 2 benchmarks with a q6600 at stock and with a small easy to obtain 3ghz overclock.

Want to make yourself look like a bigger fool? Keep talking.

http://hothardware.com/printarticle.aspx?articleid=1986

17 Percent. That really is breaking borderline results. Some games can be as little as 7% depends. Or in fact no gain at all.

BloodBath

That's at 3gz. 3.4ghz isn't hard to achieve on air. I think I've already refuted your claim that it would make no difference outside of synthetic benchmarks. Anything else?

bladesofglory

BloodBath wrote: »

That's at 3gz. 3.4ghz isn't hard to achieve on air. I think I've already refuted your claim that it would make no difference outside of synthetic benchmarks. Anything else?

well technically all you showed was benchmark regard FPS, which depending on Gpu based games will have no effect. Then again you dont know what result he will be getting with his gpu and cpu combined could be good, or bad.

BloodBath

The games he pointed out are pretty cpu dependant and will get decent gains from an overclock as I pointed out in 1 of my first posts. I know gpu heavy games will see little benefit.

bladesofglory

BloodBath wrote: »

The games he pointed out are pretty cpu dependant and will get decent gains from an overclock as I pointed out in 1 of my first posts. I know gpu heavy games will see little benefit.

So whats ur chip running at? frequency wise and temps?

pillphil

I think this is the cooler I have.



http://store.antec.com/Product/cooling-cpu_cooler/performance-max-cpu-cooler/0-761345-77090-3.aspx

How do you compare coolers?

BloodBath

So whats ur chip running at? frequency wise and temps?

4.5ghz averaging around 70c load with a cm 212 evo. I had it at 4.6 but wasn't happy with the extra voltage and temps. I have my case fans turned down and prefer to keep a balance of noise/performance. IBT takes it higher but i'm not worried about that.

Your cooler doesn't look awful and you could most likely get a decent overclock with it. Decent case airflow would help a lot as well.

bladesofglory

BloodBath wrote: »

4.5ghz averaging around 70c load with a cm 212 evo. I had it at 4.6 but wasn't happy with the extra voltage and temps. I have my case fans turned down and prefer to keep a balance of noise/performance. IBT takes it higher but i'm not worried about that.

Your cooler doesn't look awful and you could most likely get a decent overclock with it. Decent case airflow would help a lot as well.

What the full spec for your build at the moment? CpU, Ram etc are you running 3 screens?

bmm

2.4ghz + 25% = 3ghz

pillphil

I'm pretty sure the mobo's just the basic p5b, seems to support overclocking
http://www.asus.com/Motherboards/P5B/

AI NOS™
Boost performance when you need it the most!
Applications such as 3D games and video editing demand a huge chunk of system resource. Inject "nitrous oxide" into your CPU! The patented AI NOS™ (Non-delay Overclocking System) technology intelligently detects system load and automatically boosts performance for the most demanding tasks. Unlike other dynamic overclocking techniques, AI NOS™ reacts much faster to satisfy your unending need for speeds .

Precision Tweaker
Achieve system maximum performance!
It offers ways to raise system performance inch-by-inch and step-by-step to achieve maximum performance! This is about getting the most out of your machine and taking pride in your customized computer.
vDIMM - Take control of how much power is going into the memory modules. P5B gives you 2-step voltage control to the DIMM.
vCore - Find out "exactly" how much power your CPU needs. Fine-tune it with 0.0125 volts at a time!
SFS (Stepless Frequency Selection) allows
- FSB tuning from 100MHz up to 400MHz at 1MHz increment
- Memory tuning from 533MHz up to 1066MHz at 1MHz increment
- PCI Express frequency tuning from 100MHz up to 150MHz at 1MHz increment

C.P.R. (CPU Parameter Recall)
Protect your BIOS data when overclocking.
When the system hangs due to overclocking failure, there is no need to open the case to clear CMOS data. Just simply restart the system, the BIOS would show the previous setting and then users can amend the CPU setting again.

Is the cooler you suggested an improvement on the one I have?

The RAM I have is
2 X 1GB Crucial Ballistix bl12864aa106a.8fe5 1066Mhz and
1 x 2GB kingston hyperx khx85002k2/4g 99u5316-066.a00lf

There's a fan at the front and at the back.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/F-T-C-ROTARY-DC-FAN-BRUSHLESS-FD08025B1L-BALL-BEARING-DC-12V-0-09A-/151098633694

There's room for another one beside each.

Or did you mean internal airflow?

BloodBath

bladesofglory wrote: »

What the full spec for your build at the moment? CpU, Ram etc are you running 3 screens?

Thermaltake Chaser MK-1 case.
3570k @4.5ghz with a cm 212 evo
Asrock Z77 pro4
8gb G-skill ripjaw 1600mhz ram (4x2gb)
Sapphire 7970 @ 1150/6000
64gb OCZ Agility 3 ssd
Several hdd's totaling 3tb

No I'm not running 3 screens. I play mainly on a 1080p 50" inch plasma. I wouldn't do that with a single 7970. I'd much prefer a single 1440p 27" screen anyway which i plan on getting along with a second 7970 but I'm happy enough for now. I'm not gaming anywhere near enough to justify it.

BloodBath

That board looks very basic. I wouldn't chance overclocking on it at all. The vrms and northbridge would probably explode.

So rule that and the cooler upgrade out if that is the actual board. You might get away with a very small overclock.

You could just go with the card and psu for now and see how you get on. If it starts to struggle you could always sell those parts and do a board and cpu upgrade. An fx 6300 and board +8gb ram is only about €200.

pillphil

Exploding sounds about right, I seem to recall it cost a tenner.
I'll get the psu and card then, I'll probably wait until the rift is released and then build something to suit it.

Cheers

TerrorFirmer

Even if you can't overclock, just adding a new card should see you through most games for now perfectly well. What power supply do you have? Worst case scenario, add a 7850/7870 and a new power supply and for up to or no more than 200 you have a machine capable of handling those games you've mentioned extremely well. The 7790 is a good card too but I think the Q6600 can still benefit from a better card, plus you can always keep whatever card you get for your next build, as either a single card if you opt for a fast one now or Crossfire if you choose a mid range one. I think the board will be fine as well for a moderate overclock, ignore the bizarre advise here as to the apparently pointlessness of OC'ing the Q6600, in games like you've mentioned you'll want every little bit extra you can when things get crazy on screen!

Monotype

bladesofglory wrote: »

So whats ur chip running at? frequency wise and temps?

bladesofglory wrote: »

What the full spec for your build at the moment? CpU, Ram etc are you running 3 screens?

What's that got to do with anything? To see who's got the bigger E-peen?


@OP - How well do you want to run these games? I mean they'll probably run fine with a decent graphics card but you might lose some frames and need to tweak the settings in comparison to a new build. It would chew through fallout and other games easily enough. I think the two stage upgrade would be the way to go, if you don't want to be spending too much money - upgrade the GPU and PSU and if that's not working out, then upgrade the rest.
Have a few searches online and see how people got on with overclocking on that motherboard; that'll usually tell you how good it is for overclocking. Also keep your eyes open for early RMAs for people overclocking too!